HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > Colorado Avalanche
Notices

Ryan O'Reilly : Money-Money-Money-Money...Mo-ney!! Thread #6

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-26-2013, 12:05 PM
  #926
thedoctor
                    
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,639
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
Making the playoffs in 13-14 is absolutely needed if Sherman wants to keep his job. Not having ROR or the assets he would bring in would potentially cause this team to miss the playoffs yet again.

Poile had a lot better team and was in the playoffs every single year that Rads was gone. Still making the playoffs really helps keep your job. Lets just say that the Avs don't trade him and ROR sits out next season as well. If the Avs finish in the bottom 5 both years, do you really expect that Sherman will have a job?
I don't think this team needs to make the playoffs in '13-'14 for Sherman to keep his job. He should have to, but that's not how this place runs.

If this team placed bottom 5 this year and next, yes, THAT would get Sherman fired. But that's a different discussion. Just missing the playoffs next year? Doubtful.

thedoctor is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:07 PM
  #927
Avs
Bozak + 2nd
 
Avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Illinois
Country: United States
Posts: 2,936
vCash: 50
This is going to end up being like the lockout all over again. We are all going to go to sleep with the mindset we have now of 'these talks aren't going anywhere; neither side is going to budge; this is going to take forever to solve', and then wake up the next morning and find out that they came to some sort of deal out of nowhere that no one saw coming.

Avs is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:08 PM
  #928
Av-merican
@Av_merican
 
Av-merican's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: The Frozen Wasteland
Country: Scotland
Posts: 10,723
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs View Post
This is going to end up being like the lockout all over again. We are all going to go to sleep with the mindset we have now of 'these talks aren't going anywhere; neither side is going to budge; this is going to take forever to solve', and then wake up the next morning and find out that they came to some sort of deal out of nowhere that no one saw coming.
Man, that'd be like Christmas morning. I'm not getting my hopes up though.

Av-merican is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:08 PM
  #929
The Mars Volchenkov
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Colorado
Country: United States
Posts: 37,137
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to The Mars Volchenkov
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
I don't think so, just that the Jets were given an idea on O'Reilly's contract demands. It's important to remember that there are upwards of 10-12 teams legitimately interested. No end in sight yet...
The 10-12 teams part makes me happy, means we may get some good pieces back. But I'm ready for this to be over soon.

I wonder if they're waiting on re-alignment to be figured out? From the sounds of it, you would only play the teams outside of your division twice a year, so you could increase the amount of teams you're willing to deal with.

The Mars Volchenkov is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:08 PM
  #930
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,486
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedoctor View Post
I don't think this team needs to make the playoffs in '13-'14 for Sherman to keep his job. He should have to, but that's not how this place runs.

If this team placed bottom 5 this year and next, yes, THAT would get Sherman fired. But that's a different discussion. Just missing the playoffs next year? Doubtful.
Probably an irrelevant argument, but I see no way that Sherman keeps his job. Not getting into the playoffs for 4 straight years would directly lead to Sakic being the GM of this team. If we don't make the playoffs next year, we will see who is right in the situation (I have already written off this season).

henchman24 is online now  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:15 PM
  #931
Avs
Bozak + 2nd
 
Avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Illinois
Country: United States
Posts: 2,936
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
I don't see many 55 point, 21 year old, 3rd line centremen around the league, but that might just be me...
As much as I love O'Reilly, I'm not completely sold that he will be a consistent 50+ points guy.

Avs is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:25 PM
  #932
TwoPadStack
Gross Misconduct
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,311
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs View Post
As much as I love O'Reilly, I'm not completely sold that he will be a consistent 50+ points guy.
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.

TwoPadStack is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:31 PM
  #933
RockLobster
Moderator
Beatles Guru
 
RockLobster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas
Country: Germany
Posts: 11,746
vCash: 905
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
I think it's safe to say that there are plenty of fans here who believe that 50 points, if given the ice time of a Top-2 Center, will be his minimum.

Hell, I believe that he's only truly scratched the surface of what he can accomplish offensively, and his defensive game has only gotten better as well.

__________________


Thought I'd been in love before, but in my heart I wanted more. Seems like all I really was doing was waiting for you - John Lennon/The Beatles
RockLobster is online now  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:32 PM
  #934
Duchene2MacKinnon
BELIEVE
 
Duchene2MacKinnon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,379
vCash: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
Funny enough fans felt that way the second this whole contract issue came up. If I was a betting man I would say if you asked them say last April about ROR they would be saying he's untouchable. It's really sad how fast fans turn on a player they loved just a few months ago.

Duchene2MacKinnon is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:33 PM
  #935
Huis Clos*
Creamy Hamstrings
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ballarado
Country: United States
Posts: 6,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
You win Cups with lots of different type of players. I can give you a long list of players with Selke votes that have never won a cup.

Huis Clos* is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:33 PM
  #936
CalderKing21
Darth Calder
 
CalderKing21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Birmingham, AL
Country: United States
Posts: 1,889
vCash: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
Letting a #2C just rot and not play for multiple years is throwing away a valuable asset that could just cost Sherman his job in the end. Plus, if ROR was forced to sign a deal like that just to end it, he might not be the happiest camper in the locker room. I'm not saying he would be a cancer, but that possibility would surely be there.
there is no way he would hold out past this year. he tried to use the KHL for leverage and that didn't work. then you get hurt which further damages your case and you still haven't signed a offer sheet or anything that helps you.

part of the issue was wanting more money if it ate into his UFA years. he has to play to get to those UFA years and the longer he sits the further away he gets from them, thus costing him more money.

CalderKing21 is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:36 PM
  #937
Huis Clos*
Creamy Hamstrings
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ballarado
Country: United States
Posts: 6,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronaldo View Post
Funny enough fans felt that way the second this whole contract issue came up. If I was a betting man I would say if you asked them say last April about ROR they would be saying he's untouchable. It's really sad how fast fans turn on a player they loved just a few months ago.
Having questions about his game suddenly means turning on him? Just because twopadstack believes O'Reilly is destined to be a perenniel 50 point top six center doesn't make it so. I'm sure more than one GM feel that way too.

Huis Clos* is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:37 PM
  #938
CalderKing21
Darth Calder
 
CalderKing21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Birmingham, AL
Country: United States
Posts: 1,889
vCash: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
it's not the 50 pts that's the issue. almost every one believes he will be a 50 pt guy. but to be the type of player to justify his demands he needs to be a 70+ pt guy or at least a 20 goal 40 assist guy.
if he was 20-40 with his defense then he'd be worth the money.

problem is he hasn't reached that level yet and it's a risk to pay him like that. not because he'll suddenly stop working. but grit only takes you so far until you have to improve rapidly and excel at the level of a potential superstar.
that's the type of contract he's asking for and he's only flashed that potential once out of three seasons.

CalderKing21 is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:39 PM
  #939
Avs
Bozak + 2nd
 
Avs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Illinois
Country: United States
Posts: 2,936
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
By no means am I saying he won't be a 50 point guy, just I'm not completely sold on it yet. He had 1 season of 50+, but looked damn good doing it. A big part of it was injuries, in which he REALLY stepped up and showed what he can do. But if we were to have a completely healthy team, which seems a little far fetched, I don't know if he could consistently put up those numbers.

I completely believe that he has the skill to do it, but I'm not sure if he would get the chance to do it with this team again. Also, the future of Stastny plays a big role in this, of course.

Avs is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:41 PM
  #940
Duchene2MacKinnon
BELIEVE
 
Duchene2MacKinnon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,379
vCash: 250
Quote:
Originally Posted by hek View Post
Having questions about his game suddenly means turning on him? Just because twopadstack believes O'Reilly is destined to be a perenniel 50 point top six center doesn't make it so. I'm sure more than one GM feel that way too.
I was more talking about people calling him greedy, selfish and wanting him to rot. Just because Shermy doesn't think he's a perennial 50 point top 6 centre doesn't make it so.

Where were these questions last year when ROR was tearing it up? Many people here wanted to get rid of Duchene because O'Reilly proved him self as a legit top 2 centre.

Duchene2MacKinnon is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:43 PM
  #941
Bender
TheHockeyProspector
 
Bender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,936
vCash: 7658
"I just think they donít really want to move him unless itís a home-run offer," said one Eastern Conference GM. "Thatís their prerogative, really."

Been saying this all along and I don't see any other logical way for them to proceed.

Come draft day though, when picks are available should be a good time to get it done.

Bender is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:44 PM
  #942
Freudian
Patty likes beef
 
Freudian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Sweden
Posts: 28,688
vCash: 50
If Avalanche didn't like O'Reilly as a player, they wouldn't have offered him $7M over two years.

They don't like him enough to have him re-write the contracting principles of the organization and neither do I.

Freudian is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:47 PM
  #943
Jeff_Dyck_#1
Est. MMII
 
Jeff_Dyck_#1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: HF since 1998
Country: Serbia
Posts: 531
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedoctor View Post
Just let him rot.

Jeff_Dyck_#1 is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:48 PM
  #944
The Kingslayer
Registered User
 
The Kingslayer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Yuck horse piss!
Country: Cambodia
Posts: 21,679
vCash: 291
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
The problem with this is.... We dont want a Stanley Cup. We dont wanna spend for one thats for certain. Heart and soul guy's arent welcmoned here. We dont need a guy like ROR we are just not interested in winning. Nothing in his first 3 years leads me to believe that he will top off at 55 points. Remember he had 55 points on one of the worse teams for the vast majority of last season. Stats dont tell the story when it comes to ROR. All you have to do is watch him play this game. I am beyond pissed at Sherman. Go sell Beenie babies and get away from my hockey team and take that fat **** lacroix with you too.


Last edited by Bubba Thudd: 02-26-2013 at 12:54 PM. Reason: edited out libelous statement
The Kingslayer is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:53 PM
  #945
volaju
Registered User
 
volaju's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 953
vCash: 500
What's really funny is how much guys around here were speculating O'Reilly would get paid (hint: $4-5M). Amazingly, after Duchene signed his "prove-it" contract and O'Reilly wanted to negotiate for more, $3.5M became an "overpayment" that ROR should be so thankful to be offered!

volaju is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:54 PM
  #946
Huis Clos*
Creamy Hamstrings
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ballarado
Country: United States
Posts: 6,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by volaju View Post
What's really funny is how much guys around here were speculating O'Reilly would get paid (hint: $4-5M). Amazingly, after Duchene signed his "prove-it" contract and O'Reilly wanted to negotiate for more, $3.5M became an "overpayment" that ROR should be so thankful to be offered!
I guess we can go around and around on this, but there isn't a single comparable out there that anyone can point to that shows the deal the Avs have offered is anything but fair.

Huis Clos* is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:56 PM
  #947
Bender
TheHockeyProspector
 
Bender's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,936
vCash: 7658
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedoctor View Post
I disagree. You're burning a year of RFA for a meaningless season. If he's not signed by the trade deadline, I don't think anything will happen until next summer. Sherman isn't dumb enough to let O'Reilly hook the hook like that. I think, at least.
Nah, he'll be dealt by the draft. The Avs won't allow this to go on beyond that point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TwoPadStack View Post
It seems like the organization and fans, unfortunately, feel the same way. Outsiders watch O'Reilly and fall in love with him, yet those closest to the situation continue to think he's a fluke. That's fine, he has been called a fluke and an overachiever at every level he's played. "Too weak." "Skating isn't good enough." "No shot." All he does is exceed expectations.

I am sure many teams will love having the 50 point, perennial Selke candidate guy down the middle for them. You win Stanley Cups with players like Ryan O'Reilly.
Yeah, I think people pigeon-holing RoR as a 3C or even 2C is completely shortsighted. (geez...talk about absolutely forgetting what this guy brought for 3 years) He just turned 22 years old and was able to put up 55 points in his very first opportunity with significant power play time playing with Landeskog and a combination of Hejduk/Winnik and Downie. You stick this kid between Ladd and Wheeler and he'll improve on that total, I'm quite certain of that.

I personally don't think that 1C is out of the question for him and I don't know why it seems so far fetched for anyone. He's still very young and is going to keep getting better.

Let's not allow the current contract situation to tarnish what this kid can do as a player.

Bender is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 12:57 PM
  #948
Huis Clos*
Creamy Hamstrings
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ballarado
Country: United States
Posts: 6,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronaldo View Post
I was more talking about people calling him greedy, selfish and wanting him to rot. Just because Shermy doesn't think he's a perennial 50 point top 6 centre doesn't make it so.

Where were these questions last year when ROR was tearing it up? Many people here wanted to get rid of Duchene because O'Reilly proved him self as a legit top 2 centre.
So no one really knows what O'Reilly's career arc will be? Crazy.

Huis Clos* is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 01:00 PM
  #949
Huis Clos*
Creamy Hamstrings
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ballarado
Country: United States
Posts: 6,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bender View Post
I personally don't think that 1C is out of the question for him and I don't know why it seems so far fetched for anyone. He's still very young and is going to keep getting better.
He's never been a prolific scorer at any level.

Huis Clos* is offline  
Old
02-26-2013, 01:05 PM
  #950
henchman24
#ImagineAvs
 
henchman24's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,486
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bender View Post
Nah, he'll be dealt by the draft. The Avs won't allow this to go on beyond that point.



Yeah, I think people pigeon-holing RoR as a 3C or even 2C is completely shortsighted. (geez...talk about absolutely forgetting what this guy brought for 3 years) He just turned 22 years old and was able to put up 55 points in his very first opportunity with significant power play time playing with Landeskog and a combination of Hejduk/Winnik and Downie. You stick this kid between Ladd and Wheeler and he'll improve on that total, I'm quite certain of that.

I personally don't think that 1C is out of the question for him and I don't know why it seems so far fetched for anyone. He's still very young and is going to keep getting better.

Let's not allow the current contract situation to tarnish what this kid can do as a player.
I don't see true #1 capabilities in ROR. Maybe a #1 on a bad team, but on a good team he is an elite #2. Think Patrice Bergeron. A 55-60point center that will be elite defensively. That is a hell of a player, and one you really want on your team.

henchman24 is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:45 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.