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Do you fire Laviolette? (Philadelphia Daily News article dated March 12, 2013)

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02-26-2013, 01:59 PM
  #726
flyershockey
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Originally Posted by FlyersFan61290 View Post
That's a terrible argument. You tweak/adapt your system to get results with what you have. This isn't the blue jackets or flames, there are plenty of quality players that just aren't performing. And I absolutely blame the terrible starts on Laviolette cause this has been a problem since he was coach. When Richards was here and the team played like crap (not this bad but not a full 60 most games either) people were saying how we wasn't a good captain or that there was a problem in the locker room with Pronger or a relationship problem with the coach. Since the problem started (when Lavy was hired) the majority of the team has changed. Who is left? Hartnell, G, Briere, Kimmo, Coburn and Mez. You really think one of them is the problem or it just so happens that the guys who wouldn't come out hard where eventually shipped out or let go were replaced with guys who don't play a full 60/are unmotivated most nights? Laviolette is the common denominator
So you're completely willing to dismiss Homer's inability to build a team for his coach based on the premise that Lavy should just be able to tweak his system? Bull****. Lavy's system was a proven winner in Carolina and he's had success in both Long Island and Philadelphia. If he was given the pieces to succeed on the defense in particular, I guarantee this team wouldn't be looking at missing the playoffs.

I'm not even a Lavy defender most of the time, but this dude just takes way too much **** based on things that are completely out of his control.

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02-26-2013, 02:18 PM
  #727
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Originally Posted by flyershockey View Post
Lavy's system was a proven winner in Carolina and he's had success in both Long Island and Philadelphia. If he was given the pieces to succeed on the defense in particular, I guarantee this team wouldn't be looking at missing the playoffs.
Lavy also never made the playoffs again in Carolina after he won the cup. He, as well as all coaches, have a shelf life. Holmgren does deserve blame for not building a team that fits what the coach wants to play. No question. But Lavy also deserves blame for some of the play on the ice. He can control forwards back checking. He can control them shooting the puck to Brodeur over and over again. He can change the way to attack the Rangers and Devils. I don't think Lavy is the whole reason that this team is terrible and I don't think it's entirely on the roster. I blame both. Lavy is the ony change that can be made right now.

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02-26-2013, 02:24 PM
  #728
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
Lavy also never made the playoffs again in Carolina after he won the cup. He, as well as all coaches, have a shelf life. Holmgren does deserve blame for not building a team that fits what the coach wants to play. No question. But Lavy also deserves blame for some of the play on the ice. He can control forwards back checking. He can control them shooting the puck to Brodeur over and over again. He can change the way to attack the Rangers and Devils. I don't think Lavy is the whole reason that this team is terrible and I don't think it's entirely on the roster. I blame both. Lavy is the ony change that can be made right now.
Certainly. There's plenty of blame to go around, and yes, some of it falls on Lavy's shoulders. A lot of it is also completely out of his hands. There just seems to be a consensus from a lot of people around here that Lavy has completely butchered this thing.

I'm not even saying they shouldn't fire him. Eventually, all coaches lose their effectiveness, let alone an extremely intense individual like Laviolette.

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02-27-2013, 07:45 AM
  #729
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Originally Posted by flyershockey View Post
Certainly. There's plenty of blame to go around, and yes, some of it falls on Lavy's shoulders. A lot of it is also completely out of his hands. There just seems to be a consensus from a lot of people around here that Lavy has completely butchered this thing.

I'm not even saying they shouldn't fire him. Eventually, all coaches lose their effectiveness, let alone an extremely intense individual like Laviolette.
Yeah it may be Homers fault that they don't have the players on defense to be legitimate contenders but to be about half way through the season and not even be at 500 is ridiculous. Have have a good enough team make the playoffs. It's the coaches job to get them playing well enough to get there. Who ever said I don't blame Paul? He absolutely deserves some of the blame but not for the team being under 500. That is just ridiculous

Lavy's system has a very short shelf life as Psuhockey put it, we've seen evidence of that with every team he has coached. That time has passed for Laviolette and the Flyers imo. Not to mention when he actually won he had a goalie on a hot streak (in other words it wasn't just the system but the incredible play of their goaltender that got them a cup).

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02-27-2013, 07:50 AM
  #730
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
Lavy also never made the playoffs again in Carolina after he won the cup. He, as well as all coaches, have a shelf life. Holmgren does deserve blame for not building a team that fits what the coach wants to play. No question. But Lavy also deserves blame for some of the play on the ice. He can control forwards back checking. He can control them shooting the puck to Brodeur over and over again. He can change the way to attack the Rangers and Devils. I don't think Lavy is the whole reason that this team is terrible and I don't think it's entirely on the roster. I blame both. Lavy is the ony change that can be made right now.

That's not entirely fair to Lavy. Some, but not entirely. The Hurricanes only made the playoffs once since winning the Cup (which was the year Lavy got fired), and 5 times in 18 years since Jim Rutherford became the GM, or one more time than the Florida Panthers in their whole existence. You tell me what's been more of the problem.

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02-27-2013, 08:12 AM
  #731
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That's not entirely fair to Lavy. Some, but not entirely. The Hurricanes only made the playoffs once since winning the Cup (which was the year Lavy got fired), and 5 times in 18 years since Jim Rutherford became the GM. You tell me what's been more of the problem.
No doubt that Carolina has other issues that it is not just on the coach. I think Lavy is a good coach and his record dictates that. I also think that emotional, fire and brimstone guys have a short shelf life for hockey teams. I watch the Flyers and they look like a team that has tuned out their coach. I see teh getting outworked and a lot of mental mistakes, and not just the young guys which you can expect. Do I think the Flyers are talented enough to win the cup? NO. I do think though that they have more or equal talent as Toronto, Montreal, New Jersey, and the team that Ottawa is currently icing. All four of those teams are ahead of the Flyers and in the case of Toronto, Montreal, and New Jersey, have beat the the Flyers pretty convincingly. That is a sign of coaching IMO.

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02-27-2013, 08:23 AM
  #732
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
No doubt that Carolina has other issues that it is not just on the coach. I think Lavy is a good coach and his record dictates that. I also think that emotional, fire and brimstone guys have a short shelf life for hockey teams. I watch the Flyers and they look like a team that has tuned out their coach. I see teh getting outworked and a lot of mental mistakes, and not just the young guys which you can expect. Do I think the Flyers are talented enough to win the cup? NO. I do think though that they have more or equal talent as Toronto, Montreal, New Jersey, and the team that Ottawa is currently icing. All four of those teams are ahead of the Flyers and in the case of Toronto, Montreal, and New Jersey, have beat the the Flyers pretty convincingly. That is a sign of coaching IMO.
It's too small of a sample size to definitively say those teams are better than the Flyers. They all have coaches I wouldn't mind having (except Montreal), but I don't think most people (including teams' own fans) really think those teams are as good as they are. I don't doubt that we're near the end with Lavy. Frankly, I hope he does just well enough to get fired after the season so we can do a real coaching search.

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02-27-2013, 09:08 AM
  #733
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Was watching CSN sportsnite last night...they had a segment on whether Lavi's message was still getting through to the team and whether some were on board and some weren't due to the inconsistent play. There were some red flags from the comments IMO. Lavi said he hopes his message is still getting through but he didn't really seem to say it convincingly. Briere's words were measured and he said "they have to listen to his message." Anyway...can't recall all the details exactly but I didn't get a warm and fuzzy. Inconsistent play and lack of energy with what is at stake seems to imply there are some underlying issues with Lavi's message getting through. His system requires a lot of work with skating etc.....starting off games slow and falling behind which is a carry over from last year seems to imply they are not all that up for it until they are backed in a corner and then out of pride they seem to notch it up with most of the time falling short as most teams in this league do when down after the second period. Moreover, they keep saying they have to play 60 mins..it's a broken record.

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02-27-2013, 09:49 AM
  #734
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(Said in my worst Reggie Dunlop voice) Torts?

A couple of more losses like the one last night and I think John Tortorella will be available to punch out Panacchio.

In all idiocy, Rags and Flyers should just switch coaches

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02-27-2013, 10:28 AM
  #735
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Originally Posted by MrKurri'soupkitchen View Post
(Said in my worst Reggie Dunlop voice) Torts?

A couple of more losses like the one last night and I think John Tortorella will be available to punch out Panacchio.

In all idiocy, Rags and Flyers should just switch coaches
id be game for that..

i think it would be interesting to witness as a experiment..

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02-27-2013, 12:19 PM
  #736
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Originally Posted by MrKurri'soupkitchen View Post
(Said in my worst Reggie Dunlop voice) Torts?

A couple of more losses like the one last night and I think John Tortorella will be available to punch out Panacchio.

In all idiocy, Rags and Flyers should just switch coaches
haha. the vids of Torts just verbally abusing Larry Brooks is amazing.
Timmy would probably run and hide after Torts verbally gave it to him.

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02-27-2013, 12:33 PM
  #737
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haha. the vids of Torts just verbally abusing Larry Brooks is amazing.
Timmy would probably run and hide after Torts verbally gave it to him.
i would pay to see this

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02-27-2013, 01:46 PM
  #738
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Question is: If you fire Lavy who do you replace him with? Lindy Ruff?

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02-27-2013, 03:31 PM
  #739
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I wouldn't fire Lavvy based on this season. Too many aberrations. However if we look like this 20 games into next year, well yeah.

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02-27-2013, 04:01 PM
  #740
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Rinaldo has been fine in his role. he does his job. he hits everything, gets under peoples skin and can draw penalties.
Im not exactly one of his biggest supporters either.
I could have written this. I am not a big fan of his because I don't like a lot of penalties he takes but when he reels in his temper he's effective. He has earned his spot on the team.

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02-27-2013, 04:03 PM
  #741
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Torts and Lavi are easily my favorite two coaches in the NHL to be perfectly honest.

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02-27-2013, 04:15 PM
  #742
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When Torts was hired I remember screaming that we should have done it first, but at least Lavi was still available. Took a few months but they finally did it. I think the last few years would have been significantly less successful without him.

Torts for Lavi would be awesome!

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03-07-2013, 03:17 PM
  #743
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Per Eklund for what it's worth..

To be honest it's kind of a no brainer. The Flyers I suspect are interested and should be if they are practicing due diligence despite my personal dislike for Ruff who I don't think is professionally incompetent..just dislike his face and the years he tortured us in Buffalo until they started sucking..


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There are more than a few teams who have expressed interest in Lindy Ruff and word on the street is the temptation of signing Ruff may accelerate a coaching change at one of the bigger market NHL teams. There are just too many out there who see Ruff as one of the top coaches in the game.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklun...g-More/1/49799

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03-07-2013, 03:20 PM
  #744
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
Per Eklund for what it's worth..

To be honest it's kind of a no brainer. The Flyers I suspect are interested and should be if they are practicing due diligence despite my personal dislike for Ruff who I don't think is professionally incompetent..just dislike his face and the years he tortured us in Buffalo until they started sucking..
I expect a strong game tonight against the Pens because they Flyers play against their style of hockey well, but the stretch coming up could mean the end for Lavy depending on how the team responds.

Ruff would be a good pick up.

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03-07-2013, 04:17 PM
  #745
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I always hated Linda Soft.

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03-07-2013, 04:57 PM
  #746
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I hate Ruff too but I think I could get used to him if he became the coach. I still want to give Laviolette one more season though.

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03-07-2013, 05:02 PM
  #747
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I would love Ruff behind the Flyers bench. I think Lavi is an excellent coach, but coaches do grow stale, and I think his time may have come.

That said, we havent sucked enough to justify his firing, so letting him go now would be controversial, but I think the opportunity to hire Ruff would be enough to justify it in my books.

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03-07-2013, 07:41 PM
  #748
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03-07-2013, 08:03 PM
  #749
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What kind of system does Ruff even have?

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03-07-2013, 08:10 PM
  #750
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after that period, yes

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