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Oilers and Gagner working on extension: [UPD: Elected Arbitration]

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02-26-2013, 08:59 PM
  #76
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Gagner's agent might think he has the advantage this year, but one thing that might come as a surprise is that a good portion of the league will be looking to unload a ton of salary. If one of those teams is willing to trade a center that is more suited to what the Oilers need then Gagner could just price himself out of Edmonton.

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02-26-2013, 09:26 PM
  #77
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My head is gonna explode if Gagner is still with the team next season.

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02-26-2013, 09:45 PM
  #78
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My head is gonna explode if Gagner is still with the team next season.
From...natural causes?

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02-26-2013, 10:11 PM
  #79
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I like Sam Gagner, but IMO he is not part of this core. Management has made it quite clear that he isn't by only signing one year "show me" deals. He will be gone by the draft I am sure of it. Did it not get leaked that they were shopping him at the draft in a potential deal with PHX. He is doing his part for management to drive up his price by putting up decent numbers and as soon as a deal comes along to fill a hole or a package deal comes along he is as good as gone.

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02-26-2013, 10:32 PM
  #80
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Would it be terrible to do a 5 @ 5.25? I would think the first 2 years at that is easily swallowed. The next 3 @ 5.25 isn't too bad either and he could be traded for someone to fill team needs. Or of course, he becomes all we want and more in which case we keep him.

Only if he terribly regressed (not saying that's impossible) would that contract be overly difficult to move. Especially since, if the other kids progress as we all hope, they will make Gagner look better than he currently does (is?) which could make him a hot commodity in a couple years time.

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02-26-2013, 10:36 PM
  #81
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I agree that Gagner is probably gone especially since the Oilers will be in sell mode at the deadline and his value has never been higher.

It's a damn shame too. Just another example of poor asset management from Tambi. If he had traded Hemsky last year we could probably afford to keep Gagner on the salary cap.

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02-26-2013, 10:40 PM
  #82
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I wouldn't be comfortable giving him any more than 4m per. His agent is going to have a lot of bargaining power though... I'm a little worried to be honest.
Pretty much my sentiments as well. I'd be hesitant to give him more than $4 million at this point but his agent will likely be looking for $0.5-$1 million more when looking at guys like Hemsky. One thing is for certain management needs to **** or get off the pot with this player.

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02-26-2013, 10:44 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
I agree that Gagner is probably gone especially since the Oilers will be in sell mode at the deadline and his value has never been higher.

It's a damn shame too. Just another example of poor asset management from Tambi. If he had traded Hemsky last year we could probably afford to keep Gagner on the salary cap.
Hate to say it but IMO Hemsky is gone at the deadline too. Just have a feeling that it was the plan all along.

I don't mind if both these guys get moved in hockey trades, but I might lose all faith if they are moved for picks/prospects.

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02-26-2013, 10:52 PM
  #84
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With ottawa's current "problem" with their goalies, what would you guys think of some sort of package trade with them

Bishop + ???

For

Gagner + ???

Khabi's played well but his days are numbered, and while Dubnyk has also played well, I think Bishop would usurp dub in short order. For Ottawa, they get some of the offence they need (excluding spezza and of course that particular dman)

Not sure who the ??? would be really. To be honest, even in a straight trade I'm not entirely sure which team wins/loses this trade.

Edit: upon further consideration, I think we lose the trade (straight up) but if we could win the ??? Portion I would like this.


Last edited by DareDoiler: 02-26-2013 at 10:58 PM.
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02-26-2013, 10:52 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by dixs35 View Post
Hate to say it but IMO Hemsky is gone at the deadline too. Just have a feeling that it was the plan all along.

I don't mind if both these guys get moved in hockey trades, but I might lose all faith if they are moved for picks/prospects.
Trading either for anything less that high end prospects if we are looking at picks/prospects would be a bad call IMO. I'd prefer to move one or both in hockey trades, IMO we've acquired enough picks for now and unless we can get more of them for spare parts it doesn't make much sense to trade either for picks unless the picks are trying to "even out' the trade.

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02-26-2013, 10:59 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DareDoiler View Post
With ottawa's current "problem" with their goalies, what would you guys think of some sort of package trade with them

Bishop + ???

For

Gagner + ???

Khabi's played well but his days are numbered, and while Dubnyk has also played well, I think Bishop would usurp dub in short order. For Ottawa, they get some of the offence they need (excluding spezza and of course that particular dman)
If we're going to trade Gagner it would be a bad use of assets to trade for an iffy goaltender. What I'm looking for is a package of Gagner + Hemsky/Paajarvi that would entice another team to unload the center we need, like a signed Getzlaf. Or even Gagner for Brandon Sutter.

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02-26-2013, 11:16 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Trading either for anything less that high end prospects if we are looking at picks/prospects would be a bad call IMO. I'd prefer to move one or both in hockey trades, IMO we've acquired enough picks for now and unless we can get more of them for spare parts it doesn't make much sense to trade either for picks unless the picks are trying to "even out' the trade.
I think thats the case as well, but you never know. I even past trading them for high end prospects. I want actual NHL players. I just want to see management make a big hockey trade. Move some of our prospect cache for proven NHL talent even if you overpay in prospect capital. I've been a victim of the shiney toy syndrome for too long. Management has identified the core in the big 5 its time to cull the heard. Trade some of the multiple square pegs for a couple of round ones you need.

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02-26-2013, 11:18 PM
  #88
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why Brandon Sutter?

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02-26-2013, 11:20 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by dixs35 View Post
I think thats the case as well, but you never know. I even past trading them for high end prospects. I want actual NHL players. I just want to see management make a big hockey trade. Move some of our prospect cache for proven NHL talent even if you overpay in prospect capital. I've been a victim of the shiney toy syndrome for too long. Management has identified the core in the big 5 its time to cull the heard. Trade some of the multiple square pegs for a couple of round ones you need.
Agreed, also figure which of your role players you plan on keeping going forward.

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02-26-2013, 11:41 PM
  #90
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If Gags wants to be a part of this thing he is going to have to sign a cap friendly contract. After Tambi signed Eberle for a little too much $, others like Gags and Smid are going to have to take less.

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02-26-2013, 11:42 PM
  #91
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3 years 12 mil.
This..

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02-27-2013, 12:04 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
I agree that Gagner is probably gone especially since the Oilers will be in sell mode at the deadline and his value has never been higher.

It's a damn shame too. Just another example of poor asset management from Tambi. If he had traded Hemsky last year we could probably afford to keep Gagner on the salary cap.
Ugh, if we move Gagner for picks we will literally be the Florida Panthers.

I'm so torn as to whether he's worth it or not, though. Tough call.

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02-27-2013, 12:57 AM
  #93
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4mill Max for 4 or 5 years

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02-27-2013, 01:13 AM
  #94
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At Sams age and with his resume specificly his veteran status, this will be Sams biggest career move, he will be negotiating for possibly his career beynd here, and must be aware of this, the Oilers are. Both sides are in good positions, the Oilers can give him a loaded contract that will set him for 4-6 years and then they can sit and watch how things turn out here, if we begin to win and Sam is the catalyst he seems to be right now, then both sides win, if we keep losing and want to trade him we can do it any time we choose on a dime and as long as we pull the trigger fast while he is producing points we wont have a hard time unloading his resume.

Both sides are smart and i say we see 2 years at 6mil or 5+ years at 4.5mil

Both are winning deals, one is short and heavy and one is long and easy to unload.

I am not sure the Oilers understand exactly how deeply Gagner has evolved into the leadership role and although they have groomed him and should have expected this to happen they have been taken totally off guard, if they refuse to aknowledge how important Sam is to the team and lose him they may see a serious void develop. Same with MPS, he has evolved and they cannot erase this fact, while others are devolving or holding their own these two and a few others are still growing.

We can talk bigger players and whatever but the truth is that this players has been totally homegrown and is one of the torchberers of this Franchise. He is still showing UPWARD evolution and this is unavoidable , it has to be aknowledged, and it must be added as a footnote that he played on pretty vanilla teams for most of his career here

The size debate is not valid anymore, Sam deals with contact and focuses on maintaining superior positioning on recovery to regain puck possesion, this is a decieving style to analyse, players like this need to be allowed to pursue the puck for takebacks and are hampered by set play responsibilitys that force them to lose the puck and stop pursuit.


If the Oilers give Sam the tools he needs to manifest sucess and points he will consistantly provide those numbers irregardless of linemates. They are in a bind and are way behind and the Devil might want his due, ha ha ha ha, if Sam gets a sympathetic dynamic to develop he will finish the year leading the team in points and we will make the playoffs. As Sam goes so the Oilers go. If someone took a template of Sams line and put it over our 1st line and filled in the empty spaces we would start to win consistantly.

If the Oil want to trade Gagner the easy money rides on St.Louis actually overpaying to get Sam, they are playing a system that is very compatable to Sams game now, they have evolved like Sam has. He could step into their system as if he spent his entire career there. Doug Weight had an epiphany during the playoffs last year while he was commentating games, he had a system awareness revelation as he watched the Kings keep winning the same way repeatedly a way he faintly recognised, a way he had inside data on already but hadnt yet verified. The Hawks would also be competeing for Sam as he is an instant system fit there as well. LA would actually probably have a shot at repeating if they could land his as well, he fits there perfectly. None of these fits consider Sams size, they all consider the systems the teams use and how Sam sees the ice and would fit in.

The Oilers dont have the guts to admit they underestimated Samwise and had already erected a glass ceiling over him, one he shattered this year and grew straight through. Sam should with an eye on the long term future be wearing the A over everyone else except Laddy, we cant give it to the vets who will be moving on soon and the core is to young, Sam is the perfect fit. If i were Gagner i would make them pay for not putting an A on my resume, make em pay bigtime , like 6 mill a year and dig in for that number. The Oilers have tried to hide Sam and his evolution in the weeds as they put out other contractual fires, but they are out of the weeds now and have to make a tough choice, to commit or not commit long term.

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02-27-2013, 01:17 AM
  #95
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02-27-2013, 01:22 AM
  #96
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I'd be comfortable signing Gagner long term if he finishes the year in the top 3 in Oiler scoring and the team is fighting for a playoff spot in the last ten games (which I guess isn't that far away now). Especially if RNH doesn't find his offense this year.

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02-27-2013, 01:38 AM
  #97
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New Age Hockey System
Hm. I'm very curious about this. Could you explain it to me? Spare no words.

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02-27-2013, 01:50 AM
  #98
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Solid 2C's I think we COULD get for a package centered around Gags:
ROR, M.Richards, Zajac, Couturier, Pavelski, Backstrom (a 1b - add Ebs and get a winger back).

It's going to be hard to pry a good 2C from these teams because of the premium the place upon the position (most important forward position aside from 1C). The only exception is ROR - and if I were the Oilers I'd be very aggressive in trying to acquire him.

1) I'd threaten COL with an offer-sheet if they don't do ROR-for-Gags straight-up, and if that doesn't fly for them I'd throw them the offer-sheet and fore-go the 1st + 3rd for ROR at 4.5x3yrs. Trade Gags+ for a 1RW to play with ROR, trade Eberle+ for a top-pairing defenseman, and trade Hemsky for a 1st rounder. Sign a Clowe-type in the off-season, and you have the following. The +'s I mention are guys like MPS, Hartikainen, Smyth, and Petrell - guys whose contributions can easily be replaced with off-season UFA signings and waiver pickups (Higgins, Lapierre, Dupuis, etc). Add a Horcoff buy-out:

Clowe-RNH-Yakupov
Hall-ROR-(1RW - B. Ryan?)
Higgins-Lapierre-Jones
Eager-Belanger-Petrell


ROR-Lapierre will make us much more difficult to play against.

And keep in mind you have a top-pairing defenseman from the Eberle trade - someone like Bogosian, Mcdonaugh, Staal, Girardi:

McDonaugh-J.Schultz
Smid-Petry (elevated offensive role for Petry with secondary minutes)
Klefbom-N.Schultz
Fistric


Not bad.

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02-27-2013, 02:11 AM
  #99
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Originally Posted by President Van Buren View Post
Hm. I'm very curious about this. Could you explain it to me? Spare no words.
Advertising isnt allowed on the forums and although the NewAge Hockey System hasnt generated a dime , ever, and has never been officially utilised by any team anywhere from a profit standpoint it cannot be discussed it here. I have been warned already. Please use your search engine to find previous posts on the subject if you have interest in it.


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02-27-2013, 02:25 AM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by President Van Buren View Post
Hm. I'm very curious about this. Could you explain it to me? Spare no words.
Read BadMedicine's post right above mine, if that doesn't quench your thirst for knowledge on the subject then feel free to PM BadMedicine and speak to him via PM about it.

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