HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Notices

Oilers and Gagner working on extension: [UPD: Elected Arbitration]

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-27-2013, 02:41 AM
  #101
Gamefreak
Bee.
 
Gamefreak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,502
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Read BadMedicine's post right above mine, if that doesn't quench your thirst for knowledge on the subject then feel free to PM BadMedicine and speak to him via PM about it.
Sounds promising! And I think 3 years/13.5M or 4 years/18M for Samwise would be reasonable.

Gamefreak is offline  
Old
02-27-2013, 03:25 AM
  #102
The Nuge
Farewell Smytty
 
The Nuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,806
vCash: 1026
I don't get how people want him gone. I'm firmly in the keep him until he gets forced out camp. Right now, he's a PPG 23 year old and has been arguably our best player. Offer him 4.5 for 5 years. If his production tails off in the future, that's still an easily moveable contract

The Nuge is online now  
Old
02-27-2013, 03:36 AM
  #103
The Perfect Human*
Bow Down to Lidas
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,674
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Nuge View Post
I don't get how people want him gone. I'm firmly in the keep him until he gets forced out camp. Right now, he's a PPG 23 year old and has been arguably our best player. Offer him 4.5 for 5 years. If his production tails off in the future, that's still an easily moveable contract
Curious, but would you offer ROR the same? In case we do go for an offer-sheet, would you be open to 4.75x3-4 years?

The Perfect Human* is offline  
Old
02-27-2013, 04:37 AM
  #104
The Nuge
Farewell Smytty
 
The Nuge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Vancouver, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,806
vCash: 1026
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Curious, but would you offer ROR the same? In case we do go for an offer-sheet, would you be open to 4.75x3-4 years?
I'd be pretty hesitant. ROR is arguably the better overall player, but his offense isn't close to Gagner, and I'm not 100% sure he'll repeat last season. He's 1 year younger, much less proven, less of a team player, and a whopping 1 inch, and 6 lbs heavier. IMO, ROR screams Horcoff

The Nuge is online now  
Old
02-27-2013, 08:05 AM
  #105
Broilers
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Edmonton
Country: Finland
Posts: 976
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
Nugent-Hopkins' offensive struggles and Gagner's impressive start have put us in a bad position. I really like Gagner's guts and character but I don't think that we can afford to give him 5 million plus with RNH poised to cash in (thus far undeservedly) this summer or next.
May be we can give RNH just 2 year deal for less money. Cap will increase and we can keep both.

I do not really want find Oilers in the situation that we need to start trade away young veterans because of money issue. Atlanta and Islanders are warning examples how things can end up.

I have one exception Ryan O'Reilly. He seems to be available. He is a bit bigger and as good as Gagner.

Broilers is offline  
Old
02-27-2013, 08:59 AM
  #106
joestevens29
Registered User
 
joestevens29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 23,990
vCash: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by NMK View Post
These players average 4.13m/year.
Only 2 out of these 9 players have better stats than him
Based on two players having better stats than him at an average salary of 4.13m/year, he deserves 5.23m/ year.
If you were to base on offense only then maybe. But if it came down to which player you would take as a whole I don't know that gagner is ranked#3.

joestevens29 is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 03:32 PM
  #107
McArthur
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Hockey Heart Land
Country: Canada
Posts: 902
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMofOilers View Post
4 x 4.25 M cant see why we would pay him Kessler money as a #2 center. So just a notch below.
It would be nice to get him on the same contract hemsky used to be on. Just hopefully less injuries.

McArthur is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 03:43 PM
  #108
oilinblood
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,955
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugie Boy View Post
I would take him to arbitration and then see what he can do next season before handing out 5+ million to him
solid management. we hold his rights.

oilinblood is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 03:48 PM
  #109
oilinblood
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,955
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamefreak View Post
Sounds promising! And I think /3 years/13.5M or 4 years/18M for Samwise would be reasonable.
i think those are reasonable offers based on what he brings, what he lacks, and the inconsistency shown in the body of work. or he can sign for 1 year and take his chances at being able to do it again and get a bigger payoff.

i wouldnt be giving 5-6m for a good half season (horcoff anyone)

Just a little history --- Horcoff was near ppg in 06, nearing ppg in 07 when he got hurt (all star game appearance too), won draws at a 54% clip, was sniping goals and scoring on shootouts to get us points, and had solid 2 way game where he could check opposing lines. He was a beast for draws.
Sam Gagner just makes plays and plays hard, lacks 2 way game, lacks FO,

Im not saying to get Sam Gagner out of town but i am saying to remember Horc.

oilinblood is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 10:30 AM
  #110
Broilers
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Edmonton
Country: Finland
Posts: 976
vCash: 500
Ryan O'Reilly

Calgary sent offer sheet to Ryan O'Reilly. Colorado matched it. It is worth 5M cap hit. That is really setting the price for Gagner. It is very difficult squeeze hinm under 5M. If Tambo manages to get him in 4,75 I will be surprised by joy.

Broilers is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 02:14 PM
  #111
AlowlyOilersfan
Comrade
 
AlowlyOilersfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,643
vCash: 177
4(give or take .25) x 4 or 5 years would be ideal. I would like to see what he can do when he hits his prime years.

AlowlyOilersfan is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 07:04 PM
  #112
coolwasabi
Registered User
 
coolwasabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,002
vCash: 500
Cap Hit: $3.6M to $4.0M imo.
Term: at least 3 years would be nice..

Some players that make near $4M:
- Joe Pavelski ($4.0M)
- Jordan Staal ($4.0M, tho admittedly with a huge term)
- Travis Zajac ($3.9M)
- TJ Oshie ($4.2M)
- David Perron ($3.8M)
- Mike Fisher ($4.2M)


If he keeps up his point-per-game pace this season, it will be interesting if he gets overpaid (i.e. near $5M per)

coolwasabi is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 07:06 PM
  #113
Sloth Slothersons*
They cut my beard
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Planet Earth
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,219
vCash: 500
Hopefully no more than 4.5 million

Sloth Slothersons* is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 07:07 PM
  #114
coolwasabi
Registered User
 
coolwasabi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Broilers View Post
Calgary sent offer sheet to Ryan O'Reilly. Colorado matched it. It is worth 5M cap hit. That is really setting the price for Gagner.
Ryan O'Reilly and Sam Gagner are VERY different players.
And a contract extension is VERY different from an offer sheet (from a desperate team).

Remember that the Avs were holding firm on a 2 x $3.5M year deal.

coolwasabi is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 06:56 AM
  #115
Broilers
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Edmonton
Country: Finland
Posts: 976
vCash: 500
Gagner is still scoring

Gagner has been able to maintain his scoring even there is a small slide downwards. I read confusing article by Lowetide

http://oilersnation.com/2013/4/9/confusion

Let's reason together. What will happen to Sam. I am leaning to keep him next five years. At this point he is better than RNH IMO. He is actually our 1st line center. He might be a very good 2nd liner when we finally enter to real contention for the CUP which I EXPECT TO HAPPEN AT 2014-15

Broilers is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 07:16 AM
  #116
Hemsky4PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Billeting Ales
Posts: 6,464
vCash: 500
No issues with a 4 year deal at 4.5 per. He would get 5 million as a UFA in a few years.

Give him a no trade that kicks in when he hits UFA age, final two years.

Compare value to production with Hemsky and Horcoff and it isn't close.

Hemsky4PM is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 10:20 AM
  #117
Koto
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2011
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,253
vCash: 500
I see a lot of posts indicating what people want to give him, what they think is fair, what they think he should take, what they think fits our cap budget going forward...but the thing is they are ideal situations.


I think people need to simplify the thought process. I tend to agree with the OP

Gagner will be wanting 5x5+, and if he doesn't get it will go to arbitration and be ufa in a year.

I think there is 0 chance he takes another bridge contract, or takes a long term deal under 5M.


So this should be made into a poll question:

Would you rather...

A) Sign him to 5x5 Now

B) 1 year deal

keep in mind B) leads him into UFA where he could end up earning something more along the lines of Zajacs contract 6x8.

Koto is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 10:42 AM
  #118
zeus3007*
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Red Deer, Alberta
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by longtimeoilfan View Post
With Hall, Eberle, and one can assume Nugent-Hopkins, Yakupov, and the young Schultz all getting or expected to get substantial contracts, 5x5 is not affordable. IF that is what Gagner will be looking for, I wish him luck on getting it on whatever team he is traded to - and, for the record, I do like Gagner. "Accept it"... I will be quite disappointed/frustrated if Tambellini even offers it.

Admittedly, I am 'one of those' that don't see Gagner as the 2nd line center that this team needs. A good player no doubt, but not the player the team needs. He is kind of like the Batman at the end of the 2nd movie, "he's the [player Edmonton] deserves, but not the one it needs..." This is my opinion - and citing his points or his heart is not going to change my mind, because I agree that he is putting up the points and he has a lot of heart.
5X5 is affordable. It may not be the right value (I think its a touch high), but its affordable. The cap roll back won't affect salaries for long, it'll be heading up again starting the year after next, and we have tons of room so far next year. Its also tradeable, and pretty fair with market value (look at what Grabovski got, and I'd rank Gagner ahead of him by a fair margin). Its also tradeable in a few years when we need to move it, as we can't this summer unless we get a better center back.


Last edited by zeus3007*: 04-10-2013 at 10:49 AM.
zeus3007* is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 10:49 AM
  #119
zeus3007*
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Red Deer, Alberta
Posts: 13,228
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolwasabi View Post
Cap Hit: $3.6M to $4.0M imo.
Term: at least 3 years would be nice..

Some players that make near $4M:
- Joe Pavelski ($4.0M)
- Jordan Staal ($4.0M, tho admittedly with a huge term)
- Travis Zajac ($3.9M)
- TJ Oshie ($4.2M)
- David Perron ($3.8M)
- Mike Fisher ($4.2M)


If he keeps up his point-per-game pace this season, it will be interesting if he gets overpaid (i.e. near $5M per)
Most of those deals are either bridge contracts, or contracts signed a few years ago. And Zajac's extension brought him up to 5.875, you can't use his last contract as the benchmark for him. Guys like David Krejci make 5.2 million, and that's a pretty fair comparable to Gagner.

I think 5 is on the high side of things, but it won't be much lower either.

zeus3007* is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 11:42 AM
  #120
Everest
Registered User
 
Everest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Country: Russian Federation
Posts: 10,277
vCash: 500
Its really hard to envision a short term improvement if we decide to move on without Gagner...but...

I think it might be worth the half-step backwards, if we opt out on a long term commitment to him and look elsewhere to find a more suitable 2nd line centre. We might not find a perfect fit right away. I realize this.

Bottom line is...I think we've seen what we look like WITH Gagner.

Do we like it?

Everest is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 11:50 AM
  #121
Meanashell11
Registered User
 
Meanashell11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: connecticut
Posts: 2,076
vCash: 500
Yeah, I like it. I also think finding a replcement without taking a massive step backwards or paying up huge is nigh on impossible. I think Gags will sign a friendly contract, I can see 5x4.5 quite easily. He's 23, he knows he has another chance at free agency when he is completely in his prime and has a chance to play with the rest of the kids in the meantime. I think that is very attractive.

gags has never done anything to my knowledge that would make me think he is in it to max his pay, he has always been a team first player and I think he looks at that Hall contract and says he has bought in, I will too.

Meanashell11 is online now  
Old
04-10-2013, 11:53 AM
  #122
Beerfish
Registered User
 
Beerfish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 10,235
vCash: 500
All I know is that I hope to god our front office has a real plan for our 2nd line center position. If they sign Gagner to a multi year deal then we can 100% totally put aside the notion that we need a big center in our top two lines. (Though we all know that it will rear it's head the moment Gagner has a bad game or two.)

Beerfish is online now  
Old
04-10-2013, 12:06 PM
  #123
nabob
Hall for captain
 
nabob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: HF boards
Country: Canada
Posts: 8,973
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meanashell11 View Post
Yeah, I like it. I also think finding a replcement without taking a massive step backwards or paying up huge is nigh on impossible. I think Gags will sign a friendly contract, I can see 5x4.5 quite easily. He's 23, he knows he has another chance at free agency when he is completely in his prime and has a chance to play with the rest of the kids in the meantime. I think that is very attractive.

gags has never done anything to my knowledge that would make me think he is in it to max his pay, he has always been a team first player and I think he looks at that Hall contract and says he has bought in, I will too.
He is a hockey player. They are all in it to max their pay.

nabob is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 12:36 PM
  #124
darkwave09
Registered User
 
darkwave09's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 129
vCash: 497
I want 4yr-16m
Samwise probobaly wants 6yr-33m
Tambo might give him 5yr-23m

darkwave09 is offline  
Old
04-10-2013, 01:21 PM
  #125
joestevens29
Registered User
 
joestevens29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 23,990
vCash: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerfish View Post
All I know is that I hope to god our front office has a real plan for our 2nd line center position. If they sign Gagner to a multi year deal then we can 100% totally put aside the notion that we need a big center in our top two lines. (Though we all know that it will rear it's head the moment Gagner has a bad game or two.)
Maybe all it means is they are making the safe smart move. Just because we sign Gagner to a 4 or 5 year deal doesn't mean he is on this team for the next 4 or 5 years.

joestevens29 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:31 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.