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NHL revised realignment with 4 conferences & wild cards

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Old
02-27-2013, 10:24 AM
  #176
BiPolar Caps
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Originally Posted by RattleYourSabre View Post
The NHL has to be smart about this. They HAVE to figure in future expansion/relocation into this or its not worth doing yet.

The two divisions with seven teams are the divisions that would likely receive expansion teams. In this case it would be the midwest and the pacific.

Pacific:Anaheim, Calgary, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Jose, Vancouver

Mid-West: Chicago, Colorado, Dallas, Minnesota, Nashville, St. Louis, Winnipeg

Central: Boston, Buffalo, Detroit, Florida, Montreal, Ottawa, Tampa Bay,
Toronto

Atlantic: Carolina, Columbus, New Jersey, New York Islanders, New York Rangers, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Washington

By this set up, the east couldn't receive an expansion team, which would rule out Quebec or Toronto II or even Hartford for expansion. A team like Florida to Quebec would make sense to move, however.

So now we're left with two western conference expansion teams. And of course the Phoenix situation. If Phoenix moves to Seattle, Seattle is out for expansion. So now we still need to find two teams in the mountain/pacific time zones.

Any ideas?
At some point we know the goal is to expand to 32 teams. Like most here, I'm envisioning Phoenix relocating to Seattle and Florida to Quebec. Thus with those markets out of the expansion equation, Markham, Ontario appears to be one of the stronger candidates for an expansion team. Just spitballing here, but thinking of other potential areas to support a NHL expansion team, I'm thinking Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Sandwiched in between Minnesota and Chicago and having some strong College hockey teams in that state, I would think that the demographics might support a team. But it would still get screwey when it would come realignment, as I could see Detroit then coming back with Markham/Ontario taking their place in that Division and then with the introduction of say a Milwaukee team into the Central Division as well, you would need two teams going from Central to the Pacific NW such as Colorado and who else?

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02-27-2013, 10:26 AM
  #177
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Originally Posted by Stephen23 View Post
No way NHL removes the potential Pens-Caps from the same division. This is why the NHL chose to send the 2 Florida teams to the North East instead of the more sensible Washington/Carolina.
Also, you do realize that Washington is geographically closer to Pittsburgh/Philadelphia, New Jersey and New York then it is to Carolina.

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02-27-2013, 10:26 AM
  #178
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I absolutely hate that they added this ridiculous wildcard stipulation. Screw the PA. They really do ruin everything. Not to mention the wildcard does absolutely nothing to address the "unfairness" of unbalanced conferences.

If they aren't doing divisional playoffs, just scrap the whole idea. It's pointless.

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02-27-2013, 10:31 AM
  #179
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Originally Posted by Ref9 View Post
Also, you do realize that Washington is geographically closer to Pittsburgh/Philadelphia, New Jersey and New York then it is to Carolina.
Yes, but Washington and Carolina are also closer to the likes of Toronto and Boston than the two Florida teams are. And Toronto and Boston are further for the two Florida teams than New York and Philadelphia for example.

There is no winning, because they want to keep every team in the Atlantic together while adding Washington to the mix. It would hurt if they moved the Rangers and the Devils to the North East, thus splitting up the Islanders-Rangers rivalry and also the rivalry with the other Atlantic teams/Rivalries.

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02-27-2013, 10:34 AM
  #180
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I've found it funny that Boston isn't in the Atlantic, and they're the furthest east of any team in the league.

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02-27-2013, 10:37 AM
  #181
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Originally Posted by ZajacsShakes View Post
I've found it funny that Boston isn't in the Atlantic, and they're the furthest east of any team in the league.
Boston-Montreal. That's why. Although i'm sure the Rangers-Bruins and Flyers-Bruins would be an instant divisional rivalry.

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02-27-2013, 10:41 AM
  #182
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Originally Posted by Stephen23 View Post
Boston-Montreal. That's why. Although i'm sure the Rangers-Bruins and Flyers-Bruins would be an instant divisional rivalry.
What does that matter? They will only play Montreal 1 time more than any other team per season and there's hardly any chance either team plays in the playoffs due to the stupid wildcard.

So who cares what division both teams are in? It makes almost zero difference.

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02-27-2013, 10:44 AM
  #183
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Originally Posted by Cdizzle View Post
They travel less...so it's fair to make it more difficult to make the playoffs? Does not make sense, sorry
Agreed. IMO travel time and number of teams to compete with for a playoff spot are not comparable. Find another way to address the problem. It would be like spotting West teams a goal anytime they play East teams to 'compensate' for the extra travel.

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02-27-2013, 10:48 AM
  #184
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Originally Posted by Prairie Habs View Post
Ideally in the next couple years we will have:

Eastern: loses detroit, adds quebec
Atlantic: stays the same
Central: adds detroit
Pacific: adds seattle

No need for a crossover, just straight divisional playoffs.
Illitch would scream bloody murder. Given that a lot of the unnecessary complexity to the new system is to find a way to appease Detroit (IMO), I don't think that would fly.

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02-27-2013, 10:51 AM
  #185
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Originally Posted by G Dawg View Post
What does that matter? They will only play Montreal 1 time more than any other team per season and there's hardly any chance either team plays in the playoffs due to the stupid wildcard.

So who cares what division both teams are in? It makes almost zero difference.
No. In the Atlantic they would only play Montreal twice.

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02-27-2013, 11:00 AM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Johnyrocket View Post
What does everyone think?

Summary:
4 conferences/divisions
Detroit & Columbus play in the east
Divisional/conference playoffs with final 4 reseeded
Top 3 teams each division/conference make POs
4th seed in each conference reserved for a wild card with a possible wild card round

Edit: I read reports that wild card will be either strictly points based where teams "cross over" or a single game playoff for the final seed. I like crossing over bc any team can play any team, even divisional rivals in the SCF.

http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/89...ue-4-divisions

Personally... I love it!!!
The fact that it's unbalanced make it totally unfair.

NHL is a bunch of idiots.

just like the division winner getting 3rd seed even though some are bubble teams.

Above all else it need to be fair. Even number of teams in each conference. No special seeding because you are from a ****** division.

It sucks.

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02-27-2013, 11:31 AM
  #187
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I don't get how the wild card balances the conference mismatch. Can someone explain please? It still seems like 8/14 make it on one side and 8/16 on the other.

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02-27-2013, 12:18 PM
  #188
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I am thoroughly enjoying the crying coming from the East concerning Detroit/Columbus/Nashville.

Detroit's situation is "no big deal" for the owners and fans of teams not named the Red Wings.

The Red Wings have been good soldiers...no, the most exemplary, decorated soldiers for the NHL's expansion of the 90s. They carried the torch, bore the burden and dare I say, kicked some serious ass along the way for the NHL.

While Boston was a mediocre to terrible, while NYR went from SC to crap in 3 years, while Pittsburgh was only slightly above average (and then really took a nosedive in the 00s), etc, Detroit carried the water for the entire league west of the Pennsylvania border.

Colorado deserves special mention here, as well.

Detroit never belonged in the West, but they did it and rarely complained only to really lobby for the move in earnest after the lockout in 05.

Detroit is absolutely affected monetarily by being a ETZ team in the Western conference. Viewership plummets for any game after 8pm start time. Tonight and tomorrow, both games start at 10pm+. We, as fans, go through this **** all the time.

Did I mention playoffs, by the ****ing way? Look at Detroit's recent playoff opponents. PHX first round, SJ second round. Eat, peet and repeat ad nauseum. You do realize the only reprieve Detroit fans and telecasts get is when and ONLY when they play CBUS or make it to the Cup finals.

Screw you, those who dont care or dont see or care to understand. Good, your team is good now, today, at this very moment. But I can bet, unless you are a fan of NJ, some time in the past 23 years your team absolutely sucked while the Wings did not. The Wings have been a ratings giant (in the US) for 20+ years for the NHL. Right here, right now, that may or may not be the case when compared to Chicago, Pittsburgh, etc. There are now more viable franchises to carry that water outside of Detroit and thats a great thing.

But dont forget who carried it alone, for 15 years, all by themselves (Detroit and Colorado) for well over half the US teams in the league.

I hope this alignment goes through and you all continue to cry.

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02-27-2013, 12:22 PM
  #189
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Originally Posted by DarkReign View Post
I am thoroughly enjoying the crying coming from the East concerning Detroit/Columbus/Nashville.

Detroit's situation is "no big deal" for the owners and fans of teams not named the Red Wings.

The Red Wings have been good soldiers...no, the most exemplary, decorated soldiers for the NHL's expansion of the 90s. They carried the torch, bore the burden and dare I say, kicked some serious ass along the way for the NHL.

While Boston was a mediocre to terrible, while NYR went from SC to crap in 3 years, while Pittsburgh was only slightly above average (and then really took a nosedive in the 00s), etc, Detroit carried the water for the entire league west of the Pennsylvania border.

Colorado deserves special mention here, as well.

Detroit never belonged in the West, but they did it and rarely complained only to really lobby for the move in earnest after the lockout in 05.

Detroit is absolutely affected monetarily by being a ETZ team in the Western conference. Viewership plummets for any game after 8pm start time. Tonight and tomorrow, both games start at 10pm+. We, as fans, go through this **** all the time.

Did I mention playoffs, by the ****ing way? Look at Detroit's recent playoff opponents. PHX first round, SJ second round. Eat, peet and repeat ad nauseum. You do realize the only reprieve Detroit fans and telecasts get is when and ONLY when they play CBUS or make it to the Cup finals.

Screw you, those who dont care or dont see or care to understand. Good, your team is good now, today, at this very moment. But I can bet, unless you are a fan of NJ, some time in the past 23 years your team absolutely sucked while the Wings did not. The Wings have been a ratings giant (in the US) for 20+ years for the NHL. Right here, right now, that may or may not be the case when compared to Chicago, Pittsburgh, etc. There are now more viable franchises to carry that water outside of Detroit and thats a great thing.

But dont forget who carried it alone, for 15 years, all by themselves (Detroit and Colorado) for well over half the US teams in the league.

I hope this alignment goes through and you all continue to cry.
Bravo, sir!

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Old
02-27-2013, 12:28 PM
  #190
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Originally Posted by Jedgi View Post
I don't get how the wild card balances the conference mismatch. Can someone explain please? It still seems like 8/14 make it on one side and 8/16 on the other.
Exactly right. The odds of making it in the West are 0.57, while the odds of making it in the East are 0.50. The only way to do it fairly, IMHO, is to have 15 teams in each conference and get rid of the divisions. There is no need or point to the divisions. They just complicate things. Unfortunately, that means Detroit has to stay in the West and travel more.

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02-27-2013, 12:29 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by DarkReign View Post
I am thoroughly enjoying the crying coming from the East concerning Detroit/Columbus/Nashville.

Detroit's situation is "no big deal" for the owners and fans of teams not named the Red Wings.

The Red Wings have been good soldiers...no, the most exemplary, decorated soldiers for the NHL's expansion of the 90s. They carried the torch, bore the burden and dare I say, kicked some serious ass along the way for the NHL.

While Boston was a mediocre to terrible, while NYR went from SC to crap in 3 years, while Pittsburgh was only slightly above average (and then really took a nosedive in the 00s), etc, Detroit carried the water for the entire league west of the Pennsylvania border.

Colorado deserves special mention here, as well.

Detroit never belonged in the West, but they did it and rarely complained only to really lobby for the move in earnest after the lockout in 05.

Detroit is absolutely affected monetarily by being a ETZ team in the Western conference. Viewership plummets for any game after 8pm start time. Tonight and tomorrow, both games start at 10pm+. We, as fans, go through this **** all the time.

Did I mention playoffs, by the ****ing way? Look at Detroit's recent playoff opponents. PHX first round, SJ second round. Eat, peet and repeat ad nauseum. You do realize the only reprieve Detroit fans and telecasts get is when and ONLY when they play CBUS or make it to the Cup finals.

Screw you, those who dont care or dont see or care to understand. Good, your team is good now, today, at this very moment. But I can bet, unless you are a fan of NJ, some time in the past 23 years your team absolutely sucked while the Wings did not. The Wings have been a ratings giant (in the US) for 20+ years for the NHL. Right here, right now, that may or may not be the case when compared to Chicago, Pittsburgh, etc. There are now more viable franchises to carry that water outside of Detroit and thats a great thing.

But dont forget who carried it alone, for 15 years, all by themselves (Detroit and Colorado) for well over half the US teams in the league.

I hope this alignment goes through and you all continue to cry.
Sorry your team is strong enough to bear the burden. Sorry your team has been good enough all these years that they are a draw. Sorry that Columbus is not an original 6 team with that history of winning. Sorry I don't think having an unfair playoff system is not worth Detroit not being inconvenienced any more. I hope if alignment goes through Detroit is a team that's screwed the first year. Hope its worth it then

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02-27-2013, 12:29 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by T-Funk View Post
Terrible reasoning there.
If geography doesn't matter, I think Chicago should get in the East. Much more exciting team than Detroit anyways.
You reading comprehension leaves a lot to be desired. Perhaps you should understand the meaning of words before you question reasoning.

Speaking of sound reasoning. Aligning team teams based on which team us exciting over the course if twenty or so games is fantastic logic.

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02-27-2013, 12:32 PM
  #193
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Originally Posted by Roomtemperature View Post
Sorry your team is strong enough to bear the burden. Sorry your team has been good enough all these years that they are a draw. Sorry that Columbus is not an original 6 team with that history of winning. Sorry I don't think having an unfair playoff system is not worth Detroit not being inconvenienced any more. I hope if alignment goes through Detroit is a team that's screwed the first year. Hope its worth it then
Cool then let's move your team to a western conference to help even things up.

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02-27-2013, 12:35 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Cool then let's move your team to a western conference to help even things up.
So you have no argument so you make a ridiculous statement.

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02-27-2013, 12:39 PM
  #195
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So you have no argument so you make a ridiculous statement.
How is it ridiculous? We're both in the same time zone if it's good enough for us it's good enough for you? Or are you interested in waving the fairness flag if it doesn't inconvenience you?

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02-27-2013, 12:41 PM
  #196
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
How is it ridiculous? We're both in the same time zone if it's good enough for us it's good enough for you? Or are you interested in waving the fairness flag if it doesn't inconvenience you?
Because there is no possibility of it. Yes it sucks but someone has to do it or we make the whole playoff system unfair. The Red Wings is not bigger then a fair playoff system.

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02-27-2013, 12:49 PM
  #197
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Because there is no possibility of it. Yes it sucks but someone has to do it or we make the whole playoff system unfair. The Red Wings is not bigger then a fair playoff system.
Why isn't there a possibility of it? I don't see why not. If we can have a heavy travel schedule and late games so can you. The devils aren't bigger than a fair playoff system.

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02-27-2013, 12:55 PM
  #198
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Originally Posted by Syckle78 View Post
Why isn't there a possibility of it? I don't see why not. If we can have a heavy travel schedule and late games so can you. The devils aren't bigger than a fair playoff system.
Okay so your team is so close to the Central time zone. What if we just petition the US to move the time zone over a bit and you can be in the Central therefore fine in the west

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02-27-2013, 01:10 PM
  #199
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I don't see the NHL wanting to split up the Florida teams. Maybe swap Tampa with Carolina?
It's so glaringly obvious. If Pittsburgh can't be separated from the Atlantic group, or the current Atlantic group can't be split up in any way, then the League should just keep Columbus with Detroit and also put Carolina into the new Central Division, and the Florida teams into the Atlantic Division. This is an adjustment to this realignment proposal which is screaming out to be done; hopefully the PA will ask for it before they sign off on this.

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02-27-2013, 01:13 PM
  #200
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Okay so your team is so close to the Central time zone. What if we just petition the US to move the time zone over a bit and you can be in the Central therefore fine in the west
So what you are saying is that you'll do anything possible to avoid it being your team and you that's inconvenienced. Glad we cleared that up.

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