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Simon Gagne traded to Philly for a conditional 3rd/4th rounder

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Old
02-27-2013, 02:02 PM
  #176
sweatypickle
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Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
He wasn't traded during the season. Who is revising history?

You want to know why Lubo was traded? Here are his stats the season before he signed his deal with one year remaining on his existing contract and then his stats after he signed the deal, but prior to the new contract and NTC kicking in.

2006-07 GP-69 G-18 A-40 Pts-58 PIMs-26 +/- +1
2007-08 GP-82 G-8 A-33 Pts-41 PIMs-34 +/- -18

Lubo was a turnover machine during the 2007-08 season.



Sorry, but it had everything to do with poor performance. Ask Dean or anyone else in the organization you can trust.

I remember Dean taking heat from some agents, but he made the right move for the organization. Visnovsky should thank him for giving him a contract that no team would have given him after the 2007-08 debacle.
whatever the case it's arguably the most important trade he made for the organization...

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02-27-2013, 02:04 PM
  #177
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Didn't DL also make the final decision to do a full rebuild right around when Vis was traded? If I remember correctly, he does not look back at that trade with any pride, but something done out of necessity.
Pretty much. He wanted the much younger guys Greene and Stoll over Visnovsky.

Greene gave the Kings something they hadn't had in a young defenseman since they traded Gleason away, and that needed to be fixed.

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02-27-2013, 02:17 PM
  #178
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Didn't DL also make the final decision to do a full rebuild right around when Vis was traded? If I remember correctly, he does not look back at that trade with any pride, but something done out of necessity.
I'm pretty sure the rebuild was in full throttle the minute he took the job. Vets like Handzus, Blake, etc. were signed because they didn't cost any assets aside from cap space, which we had tons of, and to help mentor the young guys while not making us look like a complete joke on the ice. IIRC, only Handzus was signed long-term from the early rebuilding days.

Trades like Demitra for O'Sullivan and a 1st, and then Gleason and Belanger for Jack Johnson and Oleg Tverdovsky (salary cap dump) were done early in to give us good future assets at the expense of established veteran players.

The rebuild started before Visnovsky even signed that contract really.

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02-27-2013, 02:18 PM
  #179
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A portion of the team was also up for sale at that time of the Visnovsky trade and that was the main factor whether you believe it or not.

The trade came down not long after Lombardi's "Kings tattoo on the ass" speech.

Lubo tattooed "Kings" on his ass and was shuttled away because he made too much money and AEG wanted to cut salary so they could sell a minority stake. DL took some deserved heat for the deal...but I believe it is what AEG forced him to do.

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02-27-2013, 02:24 PM
  #180
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Originally Posted by driller1 View Post
Think of what Philly did to Jeff Carter...
and Mike Richards....and James Van Riemsdyk, doesn't seem to hurt them

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02-27-2013, 02:32 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by DeeMeck View Post
A portion of the team was also up for sale at that time of the Visnovsky trade and that was the main factor whether you believe it or not.

The trade came down not long after Lombardi's "Kings tattoo on the ass" speech.

Lubo tattooed "Kings" on his ass and was shuttled away because he made too much money and AEG wanted to cut salary so they could sell a minority stake. DL took some deserved heat for the deal...but I believe it is what AEG forced him to do.
Didn't JMFJ do the same thing? And before we knew it, he was gone lol


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02-27-2013, 02:47 PM
  #182
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Didn't JMFJ do the same thing? And before we knew it, he was gone lol
No, he was never given a NTC like Vis was. Johnson negotiates all of his own deals though and doesn't have an agent. It was the NTC that rubbed people the wrong way not really the long term contract.

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02-27-2013, 02:50 PM
  #183
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Originally Posted by tigermask48 View Post
No, he was never given a NTC like Vis was. Johnson negotiates all of his own deals though and doesn't have an agent. It was the NTC that rubbed people the wrong way not really the long term contract.
No no, I meant the tattoo part.

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02-27-2013, 03:00 PM
  #184
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No no, I meant the tattoo part.
Well then we'd never let anybody go that started here.

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02-27-2013, 04:19 PM
  #185
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Something minor to add was how Lubo said DL didn't even brace him for the imminent news of being traded. Just a brief phone call of "you're traded. bye" and that really upset him.

Then JJ said basically the same thing. "You're going to be here a long time" then followed with a very brief call of "you're traded. bye".

From this I'm just going to guess the business end of trades and GM-ing is a whole lot more cut-throat and viscous than we all think. We've talked about how other GM's (Philly lately) have just let guys go quickly when they arn't performing 100%, but dl has kinda done the same thing in both circumstances.

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Old
02-27-2013, 04:36 PM
  #186
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On Hard Knocks they've shown cut days during training camps. It is pretty ruthless. I imagine it feels even more so with players those GM's have known for years. There's really nothing you can tell the guy that will make him feel like he hasn't been stabbed in the back. Only exceptions are when the guys have asked for a trade or are being traded from a bottom feeder to a contender, but even still, not very many guys want to uproot their lives (especially from this city) to head somewhere else.

I totally understand why players get sulky and angry about it.

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02-27-2013, 04:47 PM
  #187
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Originally Posted by Mattias View Post
Something minor to add was how Lubo said DL didn't even brace him for the imminent news of being traded. Just a brief phone call of "you're traded. bye" and that really upset him.

Then JJ said basically the same thing. "You're going to be here a long time" then followed with a very brief call of "you're traded. bye".

From this I'm just going to guess the business end of trades and GM-ing is a whole lot more cut-throat and viscous than we all think. We've talked about how other GM's (Philly lately) have just let guys go quickly when they arn't performing 100%, but dl has kinda done the same thing in both circumstances.
Richards and Carter were performing. When Carter got his first big contract he outperformed his previous year by quite a bit. When he signed the long term, cap friendly deal, Holmgren told him he wouldn't trade him before the NTC kicked in, then he traded him a year later. And trading him to Columbus was the ultimate kick in the teeth.

JvR's situation was different, his NTC didn't kick in for a few years. He also didn't earn or deserve the extention he was given as he was a healthy scratch in a number of games his last 2 seasons. He got it based on a handful of games in a 4 game playoff season against Boston.

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Old
02-27-2013, 04:49 PM
  #188
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Originally Posted by Mattias View Post
Something minor to add was how Lubo said DL didn't even brace him for the imminent news of being traded. Just a brief phone call of "you're traded. bye" and that really upset him.

Then JJ said basically the same thing. "You're going to be here a long time" then followed with a very brief call of "you're traded. bye".

From this I'm just going to guess the business end of trades and GM-ing is a whole lot more cut-throat and viscous than we all think. We've talked about how other GM's (Philly lately) have just let guys go quickly when they arn't performing 100%, but dl has kinda done the same thing in both circumstances.
Ever seen the movie Money Ball?

Hey Jeremy we traded you. Here's the number of the other team's travel secretary you should contact them right away. Good luck.

I think that's basically how it went. GMs aren't the friend of any player.

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02-27-2013, 05:05 PM
  #189
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DL also traded Sean Avery to the Rangers....and Sean was happy with that. He dealt Demitra to Minny to play with Gaborik and Conroy to back to Calgary.

Visnovsky and JJ, though DL did say he was committed to them long term, the bottom line was we were going to draft Doughty, had already drafted Hickey in Lubo's case. In JJ's case, Voynov was ready. So he had to deal from strength in both cases.

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02-27-2013, 06:15 PM
  #190
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I don't like this for the simple fact that Gagne is a far better option than Dwight King.
Exactly! People are pointing out how Gagne has yet to score but his speed in the lineup was needed. Penner CAN play physical but often doesn't or is too slow to get in on hits. Much like King. IMO Gagne's physical game is no worse than Carter's. I'm sure people would be ripping Carter if he was sitting at 3 goals instead of ten. Basically despite the goals Carter isn't playing much more of a Sutter style than Gagne was.

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02-27-2013, 07:50 PM
  #191
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He already scored on the PP...

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02-27-2013, 07:53 PM
  #192
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Exactly! People are pointing out how Gagne has yet to score but his speed in the lineup was needed. Penner CAN play physical but often doesn't or is too slow to get in on hits. Much like King. IMO Gagne's physical game is no worse than Carter's. I'm sure people would be ripping Carter if he was sitting at 3 goals instead of ten. Basically despite the goals Carter isn't playing much more of a Sutter style than Gagne was.
Well, what does that tell you? If you are a forward and you aren't playing Sutter's game and you aren't scoring, your residence is going to be Chateau BowWow.

Carter is doing the job filling the sniper role on THIS team and Gagne wasn't.

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02-27-2013, 07:54 PM
  #193
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I Don't get how people magically learn to take a shot when they get traded off our team.

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02-27-2013, 07:57 PM
  #194
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It's only a matter of time before some of our posters add Gagne to the list of players who couldn't score with us but are scoring with another team: Moulson, Purcell and eventually, Gagne.

Gagne will have a great season for the flyers if he remains healthy!

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02-27-2013, 07:59 PM
  #195
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Awesome to see from him. Hope he keeps scoring to get them into the playoffs.

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02-27-2013, 08:01 PM
  #196
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Gagne didn't fit in here so there is no use getting upset if he does well in Philly. He had a chance and it didn't work. He seems like a nice dude so I'm happy for him. We need Philly to make the Playoffs anyway.

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02-27-2013, 08:04 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
I Don't get how people magically learn to take a shot when they get traded off our team.
When did he ever forget how? We rarely have open space for a guy like Gagne to get off good shots. The Western Conference is almost like a different hockey league than the East.

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02-28-2013, 12:24 AM
  #198
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Originally Posted by KingKopitar11 View Post
I Don't get how people magically learn to take a shot when they get traded off our team.
I just spent the past weekend in LA visiting Simon. Caught both games, Colorado and Anahiem from his seats. Flew in from Toronto to see him. Even went to Seal Beach on Sunday when he was there for the promo. Kings being my team, Simon being my friend its obviously super disappointing but Im very happy for him. Maybe Im bias but we'll miss his scoring and speed a lot more then we would have missed Penner's and King's game. Im happy DL did right by him, just hope it doesnt hurt us long run.

Simon always knew how to score, they just needed to use him in the right situations. LA is where offense goes to die.

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02-28-2013, 12:26 AM
  #199
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LA is where offense goes to die.
Carter says what?

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02-28-2013, 12:27 AM
  #200
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Originally Posted by DocWest View Post
Gagne didn't fit in here so there is no use getting upset if he does well in Philly. He had a chance and it didn't work. He seems like a nice dude so I'm happy for him. We need Philly to make the Playoffs anyway.
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Originally Posted by DocWest View Post
Boyle didn't fit in here so there is no use getting upset if he does well in Philly. He had a chance and it didn't work. He seems like a nice dude so I'm happy for him. We need Philly to make the Playoffs anyway.
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Moulson didn't fit in here so there is no use getting upset if he does well in Philly. He had a chance and it didn't work. He seems like a nice dude so I'm happy for him. We need Philly to make the Playoffs anyway.
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Purcell didn't fit in here so there is no use getting upset if he does well in Philly. He had a chance and it didn't work. He seems like a nice dude so I'm happy for him. We need Philly to make the Playoffs anyway.
I could go on and on.......

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