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02-28-2013, 09:44 AM
  #426
Agnostic
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There has been a concerted league effort to give the offensive team the benefit of the doubt and improve game flow. There are several calls a game (don't get me started on icings) that go against the rule book.

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02-28-2013, 10:02 AM
  #427
Madam Kadri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talks to Goalposts View Post
Go back and watch a game from Pacioretty period 2010-11, or early 2011-12 ( i suggest the match they lost against the Sabres). The puck possession principles aren't that far off.

The key difference is that Martin era teams relied more on breaking up the oppositon's own breakout to produce fast counter strikes while this group depends more on an aggressive defensive zone system coupled with their own fast breakouts. Therrien's system looks more aggressive, but it actually one more geared at preventing opposition offense rather than creating it for the Habs. Habs are just as dependant on a lower minute line that gets used in managed situations to make up the gap in 5 on 5 scoring this year as they were back then, just now its based on Galchenyuk rather than Desharnais.
And that is the fundemental difference between a trap first team and a puck possession team like Detroit. With the trap, you sit back and let the come to you to end the opponent's possession of the puck, but you do very little of the plays that sustain puck possession, such as passing it back to the Dman if the neutral zone is clogged and whatever else is necessary to keep the puck on your own players sticks.

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02-28-2013, 10:11 AM
  #428
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Originally Posted by Craig71 View Post
Markov is the straw that stirs the drink.
Not sure he's currently our best player BUT when you have 3 defensive pairings with at least one D who can play well against top lines, makes the team much harder to beat.

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02-28-2013, 10:23 AM
  #429
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Originally Posted by SB164 View Post
Embarrassing thread on the main board started by a Habs fan. This is why we can't have nice things, people!
We all have our "Ruprechts"

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02-28-2013, 10:25 AM
  #430
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Originally Posted by Prallchengher View Post
Markov has been mostly quiet and not as sharp recently, and he isn't playing the full 60 minutes. We still doing these things with Subban and Diaz's pair on the ice. Plus, Markov can't control and dictate how the forwards are supposed to play the way the coach can.
Even if Markov isn't as influential from shift-to-sfhit or game-to-game as he used to be. He's still a quality defensman who helps put all the other dmen in their proper slots (even though he himself, currently isn't).

This team is a different team with Markov on it...he's a stabilizing presence

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02-28-2013, 10:27 AM
  #431
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Just a random thought on last night's game

I find the Leafs much improved, much like the Habs...but Dion Phaneuf is arguably (close call between he and Rick Nash) the most overrated player in the NHL.

What happened to the Dion Phaneuf of his early days in Calgary? Was I focusing too much on TSN highlights and not watching enough Flames games?

That dude fell off big time
You know Phaneuf sucks when some Leafs fans want Grabovski to take over his "C".

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02-28-2013, 10:40 AM
  #432
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I was yelling offside at that play.

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02-28-2013, 10:44 AM
  #433
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1st in east 5 points ahead of the laffs with a game in hand.

So sorry leafs but the habs are better this year.

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02-28-2013, 10:47 AM
  #434
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We apologize to all Leaf fans for allowing the Habs to defeat our Leafs in the ACC. Usually we steer these games in the proper direction but we lost our bearings this time. We pledge we won't let it happen again,

The Officials

Let's not get rhapsodic about the Habs' lead over the Leafs. One prolonged slump and it's gone. The upcoming games against the Pens and the Bruins may punch holes in our euphoria.


Last edited by Teufelsdreck: 02-28-2013 at 11:09 AM.
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02-28-2013, 10:47 AM
  #435
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Originally Posted by JustAHabFan View Post
I was yelling offside at that play.
Same thing here, and on another play a couple minutes later.

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02-28-2013, 10:50 AM
  #436
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My wife told me to 'calm down' because I was screaming offside on that play, and another. When that stupid penalty shot call was made, I lost it.

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02-28-2013, 10:57 AM
  #437
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Originally Posted by Gros Bonhomme View Post
Tough guy/Bruins wanna-bes. Someone needs to remind them that you win games by putting the puck in the net. Something the Bruins can do that the Leafs can't. Happy with the W and a solid 60 min effort from the TEAM.
Boston doesn't have 4 guys that fight but can barely play hockey.

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02-28-2013, 10:59 AM
  #438
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Originally Posted by JusticeBeaver View Post
My highlight of the night, the price-grabo stare down after the penalty shot.

After reading stubbs article this morning about the girl who traveled from Austrailia to see some habs games, and because the nature of my mind, I just have to post this quote.



would marry.

repeatedly

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02-28-2013, 11:01 AM
  #439
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Just a random thought on last night's game

I find the Leafs much improved, much like the Habs...but Dion Phaneuf is arguably (close call between he and Rick Nash) the most overrated player in the NHL.

What happened to the Dion Phaneuf of his early days in Calgary? Was I focusing too much on TSN highlights and not watching enough Flames games?

That dude fell off big time
Phaneuf got overrated early on because he used his shot to score and threw big hits, but he was used at a #3-4 behind veterans, once he got moved up to #1 or 2 and expectations went up, tougher matchups too, his poor HS was more and more evident.

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02-28-2013, 11:09 AM
  #440
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Originally Posted by Rosso Scuderia View Post
You know Phaneuf sucks when some Leafs fans want Grabovski to take over his "C".
Some Leafs fans also think Kadri is a bust and that the Habs are a terrible team. I wouldn't consider the opinion of a few loudmoth fans on an anonymous message board as anything substantive.

Phaneuf is an excellent defenceman (advanced statistics back this up, as do basic statistics, or just watching hockey), and is a huge part of any success the Leafs have had. Not saying he is a true #1 guy or anything, but he certainly doesn't suck.

Was just stopping by to say good game, but I wanted to clarify that what some Leafs fans think doesn't indicate anything about reality, unless you're suggesting we are all that smart and realistic?

Habs played a really solid game. I disagree with the 5 minute call, but the Leafs didn't deserve to win so I can't be too upset (and the officiating was pretty messy overall, don't think it was tilted). I have to say I like the way Gallagher and Galchenyuk played. Hopefully the Leafs can respond to this loss to the Habs like your Habs responed to the last loss to the Leafs, Toronto could really use a run (and I know you're all pulling for us ).

Cheers, and congratulations on the success so far!

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02-28-2013, 11:18 AM
  #441
Madam Kadri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RollTheBones109 View Post
Some Leafs fans also think Kadri is a bust and that the Habs are a terrible team. I wouldn't consider the opinion of a few loudmoth fans on an anonymous message board as anything substantive.

Phaneuf is an excellent defenceman (advanced statistics back this up, as do basic statistics, or just watching hockey), and is a huge part of any success the Leafs have had. Not saying he is a true #1 guy or anything, but he certainly doesn't suck.

Was just stopping by to say good game, but I wanted to clarify that what some Leafs fans think doesn't indicate anything about reality, unless you're suggesting we are all that smart and realistic?

Habs played a really solid game. I disagree with the 5 minute call, but the Leafs didn't deserve to win so I can't be too upset (and the officiating was pretty messy overall, don't think it was tilted). I have to say I like the way Gallagher and Galchenyuk played. Hopefully the Leafs can respond to this loss to the Habs like your Habs responed to the last loss to the Leafs, Toronto could really use a run (and I know you're all pulling for us ).

Cheers, and congratulations on the success so far!
Watching the highlights tell me that Phaneuf loves having a defensive brain fart rather frequently.

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02-28-2013, 11:19 AM
  #442
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gros Bonhomme View Post
Tough guy/Bruins wanna-bes. Someone needs to remind them that you win games by putting the puck in the net. Something the Bruins can do that the Leafs can't. Happy with the W and a solid 60 min effort from the TEAM.
Habs were the better team tonight, no doubt. Congrats. But you seem to have a short memory about putting pucks in the net. lol

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02-28-2013, 11:22 AM
  #443
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Habs were the better team tonight, no doubt. Congrats. But you seem to have a short memory about putting pucks in the net. lol
What? That the Leafs seemed completely disinterested in doing it in the first half of the game; preferring to take charges at our players?

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02-28-2013, 11:22 AM
  #444
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I'm not so sure its offside it's impossible to tell though we'd need the camera to be on the other side of rink to see where the puck is when Kadri (I think) is seemingly offside.. It's really close though

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02-28-2013, 11:25 AM
  #445
RollTheBones109
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Originally Posted by Prallchengher View Post
Watching the highlights tell me that Phaneuf loves having a defensive brain fart rather frequently.
Well that's why we watch entire games and not just highlights

But you are correct, Phaneuf's game can lapse, as I still think he tries to do a bit too much from the backend. This is likely do to a poor supporting cast, however, because when the Leafs are playing confidently (Reimer helps with this), Phaneuf doesn't seem to force hits or rushes. I didn't think he was particularly guilty of this last night, as the goals against were typically the result of blown coverage by the forwards (Kessel and JVR), but the whole team (sans perhaps Kadri's line) was just terrible.

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02-28-2013, 11:28 AM
  #446
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Just a random thought on last night's game

I find the Leafs much improved, much like the Habs...but Dion Phaneuf is arguably (close call between he and Rick Nash) the most overrated player in the NHL.

What happened to the Dion Phaneuf of his early days in Calgary? Was I focusing too much on TSN highlights and not watching enough Flames games?

That dude fell off big time
At the time Hamrlik was pretty much a number 1 D(Or damn close to it.)
They had a really good D corp Regher, Ference, Hamrlik, leopold and Phaneuf. Phaneuf was pretty much the PP specialist so he racked up huge numbers(playing over 5 minutes per game of PP) but overall I think he his what he his. Kind of like a poor man P.K. where he will sometime make dumb plays but unlike P.K. he doesn't have the physical abilities to recover the play and overall he's really like P.K. but a young P.K. who hasn't matured... Last game was a pure Phaneuf game... Running around not playing D trying to kill people he wasn't doing that back in the days. (Not as much...) I don't know what got into him... He used to be one of my favorite players.

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02-28-2013, 11:29 AM
  #447
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RollTheBones109 View Post
Some Leafs fans also think Kadri is a bust and that the Habs are a terrible team. I wouldn't consider the opinion of a few loudmoth fans on an anonymous message board as anything substantive.

Phaneuf is an excellent defenceman (advanced statistics back this up, as do basic statistics, or just watching hockey), and is a huge part of any success the Leafs have had. Not saying he is a true #1 guy or anything, but he certainly doesn't suck.

Was just stopping by to say good game, but I wanted to clarify that what some Leafs fans think doesn't indicate anything about reality, unless you're suggesting we are all that smart and realistic?

Habs played a really solid game. I disagree with the 5 minute call, but the Leafs didn't deserve to win so I can't be too upset (and the officiating was pretty messy overall, don't think it was tilted). I have to say I like the way Gallagher and Galchenyuk played. Hopefully the Leafs can respond to this loss to the Habs like your Habs responed to the last loss to the Leafs, Toronto could really use a run (and I know you're all pulling for us ).

Cheers, and congratulations on the success so far!
Not sure that I agree he's excellent...he's a good defensman, but has no business being on a top pairing IMO.

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02-28-2013, 11:32 AM
  #448
egd27
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
What? That the Leafs seemed completely disinterested in doing it in the first half of the game; preferring to take charges at our players?
Montreal was clearly the hungrier team and dominated the play pretty much the whole game, however I didn't see anyone going out of there way to run anyone.

Either way, it's your board and I'll head out rather than risk being called a troll. Good win.

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02-28-2013, 11:35 AM
  #449
417
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Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Montreal was clearly the hungrier team and dominated the play pretty much the whole game, however I didn't see anyone going out of there way to run anyone.Either way, it's your board and I'll head out rather than risk being called a troll. Good win.
Orr and Brown especially were running around alot in the first period...but that's what they're there for and that's how the Leafs play

Nothing wrong with that, it worked in Montreal twice...just so happens it didn't last night, next game, things could be different.

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02-28-2013, 11:39 AM
  #450
RollTheBones109
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Originally Posted by 417 View Post
Not sure that I agree he's excellent...he's a good defensman, but has no business being on a top pairing IMO.
In an attempt not to derail this (well-deserved) victory thread, I will leabve this here for your reference. It is a post from the end of last season in which a Leafs fan makes a case for Phaneuf as a #1 defenceman. Quibble over that term if you like, but I think this shows he is well-suited to a top-pairing:

Quote:
Originally Posted by MastuhNinks View Post
... And a good one at that.

Anyways, for whatever reason hf seems to consistently disrespect Phaneuf, saying he isn't a #1 defensemen and even going so far as to say that he sucks defensively. This just plain isn't true. I can't help but feel like the extent to which a lot of people here have analysed his game is watching him miss a hit on Sportcentre or something. The guy can do more than hit and slap pucks into the boards.

I know '#1 defensemen' is a term often debated here, but really what it boils down to is being able to be depended upon by your team to play at a high level defensively and offensively. I believe Phaneuf more than fits the criteria, especially after his excellent (yes, excellent) 2011-2012 campaign.

Dion Phaneuf had the 3rd highest quality of competition in the league among defensemen (behind Gorges and Seabrook) this season, and he was top 10 in the league among defensemen in Corsi Rel QoC. He had more points than anyone else in the top 10 (the two other than Phaneuf with the most points, Seabrook and Lidstrom, had 10 less points than Phaneuf).
Source

On top of all this, he was also 12th among all defensemen in points this season and tied for 6th in goals.

Now, I'm not saying Corsi Rel QoC is the be-all-end-all stat for determining defensive ability, I'm not saying he's better defensively than Chara or Weber just because he had them beat in this particular statistic this season, what I am saying is that it's time for Phaneuf to start getting some respect for his defensive game.

You can't blame Phaneuf for the Leafs bad goaltending, you could've replaced Phaneuf with any other defensemen in the league and the Leafs would've still been in the bottom 3rd in the league in goals against.

The Leafs looked to Phaneuf to be the go-to guy offensively and defensively from the blueline, and he succeeded in all situations, if that's not a #1 defensemen I don't know what is. If Phaneuf really isn't a #1 defensemen, than I think the list of them must be pretty damned short.
Anyway, I'm sure this won't persuade plenty of people here (as I know a post celebrating Galchenyuk or Plekanec would likely go ignored by many on the Leafs board), but hopefully it shows that there is a bit of a myth about Phaneuf's shortcomings, which are greatly exaggerated in the fishbowl that is Toronto.

I mean, if you want to give us Markov to soldify our top pairing, that'd be fine by me

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