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Daly on impact of realignment on expansion, negotiations w/NHLPA

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02-27-2013, 04:04 PM
  #76
Kane One
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Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
Agreed. So much of this "superiority" is based on circumstantial things such as lottery wins and teams that happen to own cable networks. There are a handful of teams in the East that people in the West really care about. Whatever team Crosby and Ovechkin play for, then the Leafs, Bruins, Habs, Detroit and that's about it. The Rangers don't really have much following outside of Manhattan and even Chicago was a nothing draw before they started winning the draft lottery and won a cup.
The Rangers don't have much of a following outside of Manhattan? This is news to me

And what's this play-in system for the Eastern teams?

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02-27-2013, 04:06 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
Agreed. So much of this "superiority" is based on circumstantial things such as lottery wins and teams that happen to own cable networks. There are a handful of teams in the East that people in the West really care about. Whatever team Crosby and Ovechkin play for, then the Leafs, Bruins, Habs, Detroit and that's about it. The Rangers don't really have much following outside of Manhattan and even Chicago was a nothing draw before they started winning the draft lottery and won a cup.
Always seems like there is a lot of Rangers fans when they go to Phoenix. That's about it when it comes to the Western Conference.

As for your comment about Manhattan, you are WAAAAY off. Rangers fans have a strong presence when they are in Washington, NJ, LI, Buffalo, Florida, TB, Carolina, even now in Boston and Philly there are a lot making the trip. As for NY-metro area itself, they draw from all 5 boroughs, LI, Westchester, Rockland, Northern and a little bit of Central Jersey, and even Southern Connecticut.


Last edited by patnyrnyg: 02-27-2013 at 04:12 PM.
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02-27-2013, 04:09 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvercanuck View Post
The Rangers don't really have much following outside of Manhattan and even Chicago was a nothing draw before they started winning the draft lottery and won a cup.

Oh no? Ever been to Long Island? Northern New Jersey? Southern Connecticut? South Florida?

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02-27-2013, 04:11 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Shockmaster View Post
If how much "pull" a team has depends on how good they are on the ice, then Toronto must not have any.
Pull is more about $$$, hence why Toronto will always have pull. They could go 0-82 and still have pull. Noticed in my post I said their revenues likely weren't as high relative to the rest of the league as now.

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02-27-2013, 04:11 PM
  #80
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Oh no? Ever been to Long Island? Northern New Jersey? Southern Connecticut? South Florida?
You see, there, another reason why... You know!

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02-27-2013, 04:23 PM
  #81
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I would like to get more clarify from the league on what would happen if Vancouver and Chicago is the divisional winner and LA and Nashville is the wild card.

Will they pair Vancouver/LA and Chicago/Nashville first round match-up?

If we follow to their strictest format according to the article stating that the top divisional winner plays against lower ranked wild card while the next divisional winner plays against the higher wild card:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
LA 86 points

With this lettering of the proposal, Chicago will face off LA and Vancouver plays against Nashville.

Now, since this is the divisional playoff format, this will screw them over in term of travel.

I just need a clarify on this one.

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02-27-2013, 04:29 PM
  #82
patnyrnyg
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Originally Posted by coolboarder View Post
I would like to get more clarify from the league on what would happen if Vancouver and Chicago is the divisional winner and LA and Nashville is the wild card.

Will they pair Vancouver/LA and Chicago/Nashville first round match-up?

If we follow to their strictest format according to the article stating that the top divisional winner plays against lower ranked wild card while the next divisional winner plays against the higher wild card:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
LA 86 points

With this lettering of the proposal, Chicago will face off LA and Vancouver plays against Nashville.

Now, since this is the divisional playoff format, this will screw them over in term of travel.

I just need a clarify on this one.
That was my issue yesterday. I HOPE they plan to set it up so that if it is 4 and 4, they just stick with the division. Use the records if it is 5 and 3.

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02-27-2013, 04:47 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morris Wanchuk View Post
Its seems as though the NHL thinks that showcasing star players from other teams is a better way to generate revenues than focusing on rivalries and the atmosphere that comes out of them.

Having experienced both, in person, for a number of years, the divisional or conference rivalry games trump the showcase games every day of the week.
And you aren't a casual fan, nor am I, because we are here talking hockey. Those marquee players are what can draw casual fans to the game or maybe even those that have just heard about said player. What is best for the league in terms of growth doesn't always relate to what the hard core fan wants.

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02-27-2013, 05:23 PM
  #84
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"Central"

Is it geographically accurate? No.

Is it based on the time zone? No.

I could just name the 4 divisions Spongebob, Patrick, Squidward, and Mr. Krabbs if it's just a name.

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02-27-2013, 08:07 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolboarder View Post
I would like to get more clarify from the league on what would happen if Vancouver and Chicago is the divisional winner and LA and Nashville is the wild card.

Will they pair Vancouver/LA and Chicago/Nashville first round match-up?

If we follow to their strictest format according to the article stating that the top divisional winner plays against lower ranked wild card while the next divisional winner plays against the higher wild card:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
LA 86 points

With this lettering of the proposal, Chicago will face off LA and Vancouver plays against Nashville.

Now, since this is the divisional playoff format, this will screw them over in term of travel.

I just need a clarify on this one.
Totally agree. It just seems like a useless idea. Just say top 4 in each division and do 1-4 and 2-3.

For people who are concerned about one division being weaker than others, take a look at the Eastern Conference standings this season. Carolina is in first place, would get home ice in the first round. Meanwhile they are barely an 8th place team based on points.

You will never get things to be 100% equal unless you just have one giant table like they do in European soccer.

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Old
02-27-2013, 09:06 PM
  #86
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Bob McKenzie spoke a little bit about realignment on NHL Live on NBCSN. He mentioned Phoenix and said this alignment proposal probably means that if the Coyotes do in fact relocate it would probably be somewhere in the west.

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02-27-2013, 09:23 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
KC is a non-NHL market with an arena. Quebec is an NHL market getting an arena. Markham is a MASSIVE NHL market getting an arena. No comparison whatsoever.

If there isn't a guarantee the NHL is expanding to two more Canadian markets, there should be.
Markham survived a council vote to ’continue discussions’ by a staggering count of ONE. Nothing remotely close to a guarantee of anything. Very highly likely it gets put to rest in future votes.

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02-27-2013, 09:36 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Bucky_Hoyt View Post
Markham survived a council vote to ’continue discussions’ by a staggering count of ONE. Nothing remotely close to a guarantee of anything. Very highly likely it gets put to rest in future votes.
If there's realistic chance team is avaible weather expanion or relocation many of thise no votes will switch on a dime. They just don't want to see an white elephant going up...can't blame them

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02-27-2013, 10:04 PM
  #89
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more evidence for why the Florida teams should be in the Division with the NYC area teams:
http://www.census.gov/newsroom/relea...ion_map_v6.pdf

New Yorkers flock to Florida — and Gov. Scott is pleased
http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/1...tt-is-pleased/

together with the Pennsylvania teams and Washington... Just so no one gets the idea that I'm suggesting breaking up the current Atlantic Divsion.

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02-27-2013, 10:21 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreOrr View Post
more evidence for why the Florida teams should be in the Division with the NYC area teams:
http://www.census.gov/newsroom/relea...ion_map_v6.pdf

New Yorkers flock to Florida — and Gov. Scott is pleased
http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/1...tt-is-pleased/

together with the Pennsylvania teams and Washington... Just so no one gets the idea that I'm suggesting breaking up the current Atlantic Divsion.
Who is more likely to make the hockey getaway trips down south? Especially since in the new schedule matrix, you'll still get some teams from the other division twice per year

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02-27-2013, 10:54 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreOrr View Post
more evidence for why the Florida teams should be in the Division with the NYC area teams:
http://www.census.gov/newsroom/relea...ion_map_v6.pdf

New Yorkers flock to Florida — and Gov. Scott is pleased
http://www.postonpolitics.com/2012/1...tt-is-pleased/

together with the Pennsylvania teams and Washington... Just so no one gets the idea that I'm suggesting breaking up the current Atlantic Divsion.
Agreed. If having to settle with this crap realignment, swapping TB and FLO with CLM and CAR is at least more palatable.

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02-27-2013, 11:07 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by patnyrnyg View Post
Always seems like there is a lot of Rangers fans when they go to Phoenix. That's about it when it comes to the Western Conference.

As for your comment about Manhattan, you are WAAAAY off. Rangers fans have a strong presence when they are in Washington, NJ, LI, Buffalo, Florida, TB, Carolina, even now in Boston and Philly there are a lot making the trip. As for NY-metro area itself, they draw from all 5 boroughs, LI, Westchester, Rockland, Northern and a little bit of Central Jersey, and even Southern Connecticut.
All of the original six teams have strong international followings.

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02-27-2013, 11:10 PM
  #93
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Let me all remind you guys that The Nordiques were officially sold in late may/early june That the Avalanche played in the Pacific in it's first season.

The NHL probably 3-4 contingency plans up it's sleeve.

And McCown is a clown.


Last edited by Shawa666: 02-27-2013 at 11:10 PM. Reason: typo
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02-27-2013, 11:22 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by coolboarder View Post
I would like to get more clarify from the league on what would happen if Vancouver and Chicago is the divisional winner and LA and Nashville is the wild card.

Will they pair Vancouver/LA and Chicago/Nashville first round match-up?

If we follow to their strictest format according to the article stating that the top divisional winner plays against lower ranked wild card while the next divisional winner plays against the higher wild card:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
LA 86 points

With this lettering of the proposal, Chicago will face off LA and Vancouver plays against Nashville.

Now, since this is the divisional playoff format, this will screw them over in term of travel.

I just need a clarify on this one.
I think we are all looking at getting some clarity on how this would work...here is another one:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
Colorado 86 points

Is it Chicago vs Colorado and Vancouver vs Nashville...or does common sense prevail? Does it really matter what the exact lettering of the proposal is when common sense seems to clearly point in one direction?

Even as I type this I can't come to a conclusion within my own head!?!?!?


EDIT: The quoted example is easily fixed (as many have stated already) by placing the "wildcards" within their division IF it is 4 and 4. But what do you do in the unusual 5 and 3 situations like my example? Common sense or to the letter of the rule?

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02-27-2013, 11:28 PM
  #95
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If there's four divisions, and the NY Metro Area teams and Philly are in one, and BOS-BUF and Canadian teams are in another, and CHI, STL, MIN are in a third, and LA, CAL, EDM are in the fourth... I don't care what the NHL labels them, I'm calling them Patrick, Adams, Norris and Smythe.

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02-27-2013, 11:46 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ober View Post
I think we are all looking at getting some clarity on how this would work...here is another one:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
Colorado 86 points

Is it Chicago vs Colorado and Vancouver vs Nashville...or does common sense prevail? Does it really matter what the exact lettering of the proposal is when common sense seems to clearly point in one direction?

Even as I type this I can't come to a conclusion within my own head!?!?!?


EDIT: The quoted example is easily fixed (as many have stated already) by placing the "wildcards" within their division IF it is 4 and 4. But what do you do in the unusual 5 and 3 situations like my example? Common sense or to the letter of the rule?
I mentioned the same thing 2 or 3 pages back. I suggested using geography to pair 'em...or more importantly time zones. We'll see if common sense prevails this time.

Ok, really, that last line wasn't meant as a joke.

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02-28-2013, 02:19 AM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ober View Post
I think we are all looking at getting some clarity on how this would work...here is another one:

Divisional winner:
Chicago 100 points
Vancouver 99 points

Wild Card (4th seed):
Nashville 87 points
Colorado 86 points

Is it Chicago vs Colorado and Vancouver vs Nashville...or does common sense prevail? Does it really matter what the exact lettering of the proposal is when common sense seems to clearly point in one direction?

Even as I type this I can't come to a conclusion within my own head!?!?!?


EDIT: The quoted example is easily fixed (as many have stated already) by placing the "wildcards" within their division IF it is 4 and 4. But what do you do in the unusual 5 and 3 situations like my example? Common sense or to the letter of the rule?
This is what the league is going for, a wild card is fine with me if it is 5 and 3 situation like you posted. Remember, Colorado is not Pacific division as Vancouver but it is what it is but 4 and 4 situation, I do not like cross over just like I just posted. This is why I would like the league to think it over before they announce it unless they have already thought it over and decides to screw the western conference with 4 and 4 wild card situation with this lettering proposal playoff format.

Nashville could play round 2 against pacific team if they beat Vancouver from round 1 while Colorado stays in the mid-west division playoff bracket.

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02-28-2013, 09:39 AM
  #98
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I just hope for no divisional playoffs and wildcard nonsense. Worst idea ever. The playoffs should remain as they are and the seeding should be worked out for the two divisions versus three now. Or they could just seed by points and be done with it. You get in the top eight and you're in. The west will eventually even out with Seattle and such, Houston maybe.

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02-28-2013, 11:55 AM
  #99
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http://video.tsn.ca/?dl=nhl-analysis...74299/clip/566

According to this, the NHLPA isn't fond of imbalanced conferences, but the NHL really wants both Detroit and Columbus in the Eastern Conference. Detroit has supposedly been promised a move east, and the Blue Jacket's survival could depend on them moving east.

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02-28-2013, 12:22 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shockmaster View Post
http://video.tsn.ca/?dl=nhl-analysis...74299/clip/566

According to this, the NHLPA isn't fond of imbalanced conferences, but the NHL really wants both Detroit and Columbus in the Eastern Conference. Detroit has supposedly been promised a move east, and the Blue Jacket's survival could depend on them moving east.
It should've been obvious that the PA wouldn't like it since that was part of what they were against in the first place. The only thing is though that in order to have a scheduling matrix and Playoff seeding as they want it, then having all the ETZ teams in the East is the fair thing to do, so that Detroit and Columbus don't have to deal with a Conference schedule in the West nor crossover seeding in the Playoffs.

Will say this though, having the unbalanced Conferences makes the Regular Season schedule matrix a nightmare. I don't know what's worse, having one of Detroit or Columbus in the West under a 2-Conference system, or having both of them in the East and having to put together a scheduling matrix around the unbalanced Conferences.

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