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CBJ Board realignment discussion II (Jackets officially to the Atlantic Division)

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Old
02-28-2013, 09:34 AM
  #51
KeithBWhittington
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I don't care about whats fair as far as "divisonal balance" goes. It's my opinion that this organization has been at a clear disadvantage because of being an Eastern time zone team in the "western" conference.

Detroit nonwithstanding, How much of a disadvantage the CBJ have been at for this is subjective. All I want is a level playing field for this team. I don't care if we are put into a division or conference with the Biggest Heavyweights in the East, we belong in the "East".

I don't care if we have to fight through extra teams to qualify for the postseason, its still preferrable to having to leave the time zone for each away game.

If this doesn't happen, I'll be ticked, I won't lie.

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02-28-2013, 02:51 PM
  #52
Iron Balls McGinty
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has anyone in baseball really complained about only 4 teams in the AL West and 6 teams in the NL central?

The league hasn't exactly exploded over that one. I know it changed this year to even it out but it existed in that form since 1994 and I never heard complaints about it.

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02-28-2013, 03:18 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by 1857 Howitzer View Post
@Aportzline: Told #CBJ would fight like hell if plan is changed to send Detroit to the Eastern Conference and keep #CBJ in Western Conference.
I bet the NHL is really worried about that one. I mean of the 30 NHL teams Columbus probably ranks about #29 as far as teams the league doesn't want to tick off.

Seems like the NHL made a promise to Detroit to move them East, and Detroit is easily in the top 5 (if not the top) team the NHL doesn't want to tick off.

Lifes not fair and I assume unless the NHLPA agrees to 16 in the East, 14 in the West that we're not going East over Detroit. I'll assume they'll do that, then give us the ASG back in 2015 as a reward.

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02-28-2013, 03:22 PM
  #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacketsDavid View Post
I bet the NHL is really worried about that one. I mean of the 30 NHL teams Columbus probably ranks about #29 as far as teams the league doesn't want to tick off.

Seems like the NHL made a promise to Detroit to move them East, and Detroit is easily in the top 5 (if not the top) team the NHL doesn't want to tick off.

Lifes not fair and I assume unless the NHLPA agrees to 16 in the East, 14 in the West that we're not going East over Detroit. I'll assume they'll do that, then give us the ASG back in 2015 as a reward.
You're right, Columbus has no pull in discussions. But I've gotta assume that 13 other Western teams aren't happy with the top draw in the NHL leaving the conference either. They very well may have something to say about it before it's all said and done.

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02-28-2013, 03:45 PM
  #55
Columbus Mike
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
has anyone in baseball really complained about only 4 teams in the AL West and 6 teams in the NL central?

The league hasn't exactly exploded over that one. I know it changed this year to even it out but it existed in that form since 1994 and I never heard complaints about it.
I think this changed because the players association didn't like how it was easier for some teams to make the playoffs than others. I think the NHLPA is having the same thoughts.

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02-28-2013, 04:29 PM
  #56
Iron Balls McGinty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacketsDavid View Post
I bet the NHL is really worried about that one. I mean of the 30 NHL teams Columbus probably ranks about #29 as far as teams the league doesn't want to tick off.

Seems like the NHL made a promise to Detroit to move them East, and Detroit is easily in the top 5 (if not the top) team the NHL doesn't want to tick off.

Lifes not fair and I assume unless the NHLPA agrees to 16 in the East, 14 in the West that we're not going East over Detroit. I'll assume they'll do that, then give us the ASG back in 2015 as a reward.
What does it matter if the league ticks off Detroit? (or any other team for that matter)

What are they going to do? Break away and start their own league? Leave to join the AHL? Take their ball and go home by folding the team? B*tch and moan like a 3 year old who doesn't get to buy a toy? If the league says the Red Wings are staying in the West and the majority of the other teams agree, they'll have to deal with it. Its how a democracy works.

If the league has any balls at all, they should just do what is right regardless of the name on the front of the jersey and get it over with. I've yet to see any evidence on why moving Detroit to the East is in the best interest of the league. I only hear that they were "promised" to be moved. There is no way in H*ll moving the biggest draw out of the West is a viable business option

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02-28-2013, 06:34 PM
  #57
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what is wrong with 3, 10 team conferences. East, Central, and West. The games that you are not playing teams in your conference can be easily divided up between the other two.

Play-offs could easily remain at 16 teams. How, you ask? Easy. The top 5 teams in each conference make the playoffs. Of the remaining teams in all three conferences, the two teams with the best record, regardless of conference get in as wild cards and play each other in a three game series, or one game winner takes all, for the final spot. Why not just take the team with the best record of the rest? Why money, of course. It expands the play-off pool just a tad, and makes the league and two other cities a little more money.

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02-28-2013, 06:34 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
Its how a democracy works.
Just wanted to point out it is not a democracy. Really about 6 owners control the league sadly.

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02-28-2013, 06:36 PM
  #59
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Has nothing to do with ticking off Detroit or promising them anything. The league wants Detroit in the East for the TV ratings in all of the Eastern markets. Columbus will have no impact on TV ratings in other cities until we get good.

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02-28-2013, 06:37 PM
  #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Fire View Post
what is wrong with 3, 10 team conferences. East, Central, and West. The games that you are not playing teams in your conference can be easily divided up between the other two.

Play-offs could easily remain at 16 teams. How, you ask? Easy. The top 5 teams in each conference make the playoffs. Of the remaining teams in all three conferences, the two teams with the best record, regardless of conference get in as wild cards and play each other in a three game series, or one game winner takes all, for the final spot. Why not just take the team with the best record of the rest? Why money, of course. It expands the play-off pool just a tad, and makes the league and two other cities a little more money.
That's what I proposed three years ago. What's wrong with it is this - it's perfect for 30 teams. Not so much for 32.

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02-28-2013, 06:41 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JacketsDavid View Post
I bet the NHL is really worried about that one. I mean of the 30 NHL teams Columbus probably ranks about #29 as far as teams the league doesn't want to tick off.

Seems like the NHL made a promise to Detroit to move them East, and Detroit is easily in the top 5 (if not the top) team the NHL doesn't want to tick off.

Lifes not fair and I assume unless the NHLPA agrees to 16 in the East, 14 in the West that we're not going East over Detroit. I'll assume they'll do that, then give us the ASG back in 2015 as a reward.
Off topic but ASG topic reminded me that the league is contemplating two more outdoor games next year. One in Yankee stadium and the other in Dodger stadium. Source Jeff Rimer on the Jackets Sunday morning show. Shows where the Jackets rank with NHL

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02-28-2013, 06:42 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Fire View Post
what is wrong with 3, 10 team conferences. East, Central, and West. The games that you are not playing teams in your conference can be easily divided up between the other two.

Play-offs could easily remain at 16 teams. How, you ask? Easy. The top 5 teams in each conference make the playoffs. Of the remaining teams in all three conferences, the two teams with the best record, regardless of conference get in as wild cards and play each other in a three game series, or one game winner takes all, for the final spot. Why not just take the team with the best record of the rest? Why money, of course. It expands the play-off pool just a tad, and makes the league and two other cities a little more money.
The big problem with the 3 conference format is that you would have a Western Conference straddling three time zones. A maximum of two time zones per conference is sine qua non of realignment.

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02-28-2013, 06:43 PM
  #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
That's what I proposed three years ago. What's wrong with it is this - it's perfect for 30 teams. Not so much for 32.
I agree, but as Bill Daley said, they need to fix the problem that they have today. If or when they expand to 32 teams, they can make another change.

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02-28-2013, 06:45 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by major major View Post
The big problem with the 3 conference format is that you would have a Western Conference straddling three time zones. A maximum of two time zones per conference is sine qua non of realignment.
But it still diminishes that problem from what it is today. Like everybody has been saying, no plan is perfect, but might still make more sense than what we have today.

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02-28-2013, 07:05 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by cslebn View Post
Just wanted to point out it is not a democracy. Really about 6 owners control the league sadly.
And if those 6 owners are the ones from Boston, Philly, NYRangers, Toronto etc., do those owners want to bring in a team that (on paper) create more competition for them or would they prefer a team that has been a perennial doormat of the league and think they could pad their win total against?

If you consider a presidential election analogy, I'm sure the democratic party certainly hopes their competition is weaker than their candidate in the next election.

I just don't see how those powerful owners who seem to be the most influential would want to bring another team into their conference that create a more direct threat to their win records. The Eastern Conference already has their share of good draws in the conference. Detroit leaving the West hurts more than what the East gets in return.

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02-28-2013, 09:00 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr. Fire View Post
what is wrong with 3, 10 team conferences. East, Central, and West. The games that you are not playing teams in your conference can be easily divided up between the other two.

Play-offs could easily remain at 16 teams. How, you ask? Easy. The top 5 teams in each conference make the playoffs. Of the remaining teams in all three conferences, the two teams with the best record, regardless of conference get in as wild cards and play each other in a three game series, or one game winner takes all, for the final spot. Why not just take the team with the best record of the rest? Why money, of course. It expands the play-off pool just a tad, and makes the league and two other cities a little more money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by leesmith View Post
That's what I proposed three years ago. What's wrong with it is this - it's perfect for 30 teams. Not so much for 32.
Yep, I've also been on board with this for awhile. It seems weird to have 3 conferences, but hockey is the only game with 3 periods instead of a half-time. Let's embrace the number 3.

The playoffs get a little wonky, but with a little creativity, they could get something that doesn't mess up what's great about the playoffs now.

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03-01-2013, 06:39 AM
  #67
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Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
What does it matter if the league ticks off Detroit? (or any other team for that matter)

What are they going to do? Break away and start their own league? Leave to join the AHL? Take their ball and go home by folding the team? B*tch and moan like a 3 year old who doesn't get to buy a toy? If the league says the Red Wings are staying in the West and the majority of the other teams agree, they'll have to deal with it. Its how a democracy works.

If the league has any balls at all, they should just do what is right regardless of the name on the front of the jersey and get it over with. I've yet to see any evidence on why moving Detroit to the East is in the best interest of the league. I only hear that they were "promised" to be moved. There is no way in H*ll moving the biggest draw out of the West is a viable business option
it's better for the NHL to have Detroit in the East than the West. Just compare all the major TV markets in East vs West. Many more in the East. LA is not a hockey market, yes you do lose Chicago, but it's a plus for the league (putting the most storied US franchise in the East vs Pittsburgh, NYR, Toronto, Philly, Boston (sorry I'm not an expert on Canadian TV markets but sure Mtl and others are large).

And I fully expect most of the CBJ fans to do exactly what you say here: B*tch and moan like a 3 year old when we don't move East.

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03-01-2013, 09:21 AM
  #68
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For a very interesting discussion of this matter, find yesterday's Cannon Fodder podcast. The first half is Arace and Mitchell catching up on the past week of CBJ play, but the second half is Arace and Portzline on the phone with Elliotte Friedman of HNIC, the guy who first broke the realignment story. iTunes has it, or you can access it through Puckrakers. It's worth your time and effort, I think.

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03-01-2013, 11:01 AM
  #69
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Much like the initial realignment talks last april, this is, again, skewing towards a "Columbus or Detroit" east move, it seems. As long as this remains the case, I do not like our chances. Say what you will about how other owners would vote, Illitch is one of the most powerful owners, not just in the NHL, but in all of pro sports. Not to mention the amount of goodwill he's no doubt built up with the BoG and Bettman over the last few decades. With the addition of Davidson, our chances are better than last offseason, but I don't see the CBJ being able to rally enough support if it comes down to an "Us vs. Them".

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03-01-2013, 11:26 AM
  #70
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Much like the initial realignment talks last april, this is, again, skewing towards a "Columbus or Detroit" east move, it seems. As long as this remains the case, I do not like our chances. Say what you will about how other owners would vote, Illitch is one of the most powerful owners, not just in the NHL, but in all of pro sports. Not to mention the amount of goodwill he's no doubt built up with the BoG and Bettman over the last few decades. With the addition of Davidson, our chances are better than last offseason, but I don't see the CBJ being able to rally enough support if it comes down to an "Us vs. Them".
Friedman addresses just this question. Surprisingly, he said the league has great respect for the McConnell family, as well. Certainly not in the Illich class, but not completely without some juice, either. The situation we would find ourselves in were we left as the only ETZ team in the West would be even worse than now!

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03-01-2013, 11:45 AM
  #71
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Friedman addresses just this question. Surprisingly, he said the league has great respect for the McConnell family, as well. Certainly not in the Illich class, but not completely without some juice, either. The situation we would find ourselves in were we left as the only ETZ team in the West would be even worse than now!
Yeah, but really, its not like the Wings have suffered greatly because of the move into the western conference, so to me, its like we've been suffering with the travel schedule alone anyways. Easily countered with the "well-run" organization comment but its still not totally without merit in my mind.

A healthier bottom line, and a strong show of committment to the Columbus market would be the best thing we could take from a move east, for a league thats been very flaky on the Phoenix issue, I'm worried about the team's future stability despite the Arena deal if this team stays in the "west"

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03-01-2013, 12:48 PM
  #72
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per Nick Kypreos @RealKyper:
Quote:
Hearing #NHL and #NHLPA will soon announce an agreement in principle on realignment. Players appear comfortable enough moving forward.
Sounds like whatever was on the table in the latest talks will be put in motion.

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03-01-2013, 02:42 PM
  #73
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per Nick Kypreos @RealKyper:

Hearing #NHL and #NHLPA will soon announce an agreement in principle on realignment. Players appear comfortable enough moving forward.
I find that disappointing. I'm in the minority now and thats ok with me. I'm confident that as time moves forward, this wont be seen to be as wonderful as some are suggesting. Wouldnt be surprised to see the CBJ reuniting with central rivals in 4 or 5 years.

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03-01-2013, 03:01 PM
  #74
Matthew
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I like this picture, too.


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03-01-2013, 03:26 PM
  #75
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I like this picture, too.

Cool thanks, have been trying to get that info.

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