HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Chris Kreider

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-28-2013, 03:31 PM
  #251
DontStepanMe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Queens, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,377
vCash: 500
Is it just me or are people who are describing how he plays, very similar into the style Gaborik plays? You know, the person who many want to trade and are pissed off at because he looks unengaged and does nothing away from the puck.

If Kreider's style is to play like Gaborik (straight line speed, no puck possession, not engaging a ton physically and no boardwork), than

a) Kreider is wasting his physical gifts
b) Kreider is going to be a bust b/c his shot isn't anywhere near as good as Gabby's and he is not nearly as good as Gabby at passing.

Truthfully, I think he has a huge bust potential, and was never completely sold on him. I think in order for him to put it all together he needs to learn the defensive side more and also learn how to use his powerful body. From what I've seen he just doesn't have the greatest smarts or awareness compared to other players.

Just by .02. I hope he does great, but I'm actually more concerned with Miller and Fasth as I think over their careers they will be better players.

DontStepanMe is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 03:33 PM
  #252
Kreider Typical
flex
 
Kreider Typical's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 2,541
vCash: 500
i don't love him being sent down, but i liked the reasoning given... he has to learn to come up with the puck. means the issue isn't so much him 'sucking' but wanting to award him a possibility to learn that with big minutes against lesser players.

idk... still don't love him going down and not just getting minutes in the big club to do it, but i'm hopeful.


Last edited by Kreider Typical: 02-28-2013 at 03:42 PM.
Kreider Typical is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 03:35 PM
  #253
DontStepanMe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Queens, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,377
vCash: 500
Shouldn't have said highest bust potential. What I really meant that out of him, Miller, Fasth that he is the least likely to reach his full potential. But if he does, he will be the best out of those three.

I just personally don't think he will ever reach full potential. I hope he does though and look forward to seeing him develop as a NYR.

DontStepanMe is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 04:07 PM
  #254
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,779
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
What I really meant that out of him, Miller, Fasth that he is the least likely to reach his full potential.
Based on what?

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 04:11 PM
  #255
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Shouldn't have said highest bust potential. What I really meant that out of him, Miller, Fasth that he is the least likely to reach his full potential. But if he does, he will be the best out of those three.

I just personally don't think he will ever reach full potential. I hope he does though and look forward to seeing him develop as a NYR.
Why cant you admit you have no friggin' idea? Thats what I do until I see these guys play in the NHL. Its liberating, and it doesnt make you fall in love with prospects and look like an idiot when they dont perform.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 04:21 PM
  #256
JohnC
#FreeSteve
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 4,508
vCash: 500
Kreider plays around 25 games in the NHL, plays sub par for a dozen; bust.

I'm not even trying to be an apologist. He hasn't played well but he has time to prove himself, whether it's now or next season or 5 seasons from now

JohnC is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 04:35 PM
  #257
DontStepanMe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Queens, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcman View Post
Kreider plays around 25 games in the NHL, plays sub par for a dozen; bust.

I'm not even trying to be an apologist. He hasn't played well but he has time to prove himself, whether it's now or next season or 5 seasons from now
Never said he was a bust or is going to become a bust. I said he was the least likely to reach full potential. Big difference.

DontStepanMe is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 04:43 PM
  #258
DontStepanMe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Queens, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 5,377
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Based on what?
Just feel he doesn't have all that high a hockey IQ, and he isn't really showing a willingness to go into the dirty areas yet or use his size.

Miller is a much safer bet to become a steady reliable, if unspectacular, NHLer. I think Kreider is a much more boom or bust type of player, where either he is going to have a good/great year or a poor year, and not all that consistent. I just don't see him becoming a 3rd line type player. Where as Miller will become at least a 3rd line player.

Fasth i think is in the same boat as Miller.

I guess bust might have been too strong a word as he has plenty of time to right the ship. He just has to get more willing to play in the dirty areas and be more cognizant of what's going on around him. Because he has the size and athletic ability to become a good power forward. The only thing that can hold him back is his own head, which to me can be more problematic than physical attributes.

That is why I think Miller and Fasth are safer bets to have better careers.

Potential wise Kreider hands down though. I'm just unsure if he will ever put it all together. Sort of like Dubinsky who had size, speed, could handle the puck very well, but I don't think he ever got his head right, yet.

DontStepanMe is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 05:14 PM
  #259
RangerBoy
1994 FOREVER
 
RangerBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 31,574
vCash: 500
Is Torts trying to start a war with management?

Quote:
"Chris has a lot to learn about the game and a lot to learn about how to be a pro.":
https://twitter.com/stevezipay/statu...63550966075392

He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.

I heard Kyper saying on the FAN590 on Wednesday,"Torts needs to stop pushing". Stop cracking the whip. He is close to Graves and Messier.

If the Rangers don't win,Rangers management will get sick of the Torts act very fast. If they haven't already.

Hey John. Lets get Brad Richards on track. The Rangers paid your buddy $20M in one calendar year and pro-rated $4M in salary this season. Slats wasn't giving Richards that contract if Torts wasn't here. Richards spent the lockout drinking his wine and pining away for Olivia Munn.

RangerBoy is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 05:18 PM
  #260
Brian Boyle
portnor, pls
 
Brian Boyle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Country: Canada
Posts: 14,624
vCash: 659
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.
He also said you do it every time.

__________________
Rangers Unlimited
Hockey Graphs
Brian Boyle is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 05:42 PM
  #261
BroadwayBlues
oxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxo
 
BroadwayBlues's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New York City
Country: United States
Posts: 7,860
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Is Torts trying to start a war with management?



https://twitter.com/stevezipay/statu...63550966075392

He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.

I heard Kyper saying on the FAN590 on Wednesday,"Torts needs to stop pushing". Stop cracking the whip. He is close to Graves and Messier.

If the Rangers don't win,Rangers management will get sick of the Torts act very fast. If they haven't already.

Hey John. Lets get Brad Richards on track. The Rangers paid your buddy $20M in one calendar year and pro-rated $4M in salary this season. Slats wasn't giving Richards that contract if Torts wasn't here. Richards spent the lockout drinking his wine and pining away for Olivia Munn.
He's douchey.

BroadwayBlues is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 06:21 PM
  #262
Son of Steinbrenner
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Country: Tromelin
Posts: 9,481
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by -31- View Post
He also said you do it every time.
Yeah but ignoring that part of the quote doesn't fit the anti-Torts narrative of the post your quoted.

Look, i'm not a huge Torts fan but Kreider lack of development is on the player not on the coach.

This is a short 48 game season so the lack of a leash with a player is to be expected. Can we honestly say Kreider has look at ALL like he did in last years playoff?

Son of Steinbrenner is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 06:27 PM
  #263
NYRangers723
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,575
vCash: 500
I dont mind the move. I have a feeling kreider will kick ass in the AHL and be back soon

NYRangers723 is offline  
Old
02-28-2013, 06:36 PM
  #264
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Is Torts trying to start a war with management?



https://twitter.com/stevezipay/statu...63550966075392

He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.

I heard Kyper saying on the FAN590 on Wednesday,"Torts needs to stop pushing". Stop cracking the whip. He is close to Graves and Messier.

If the Rangers don't win,Rangers management will get sick of the Torts act very fast. If they haven't already.

Hey John. Lets get Brad Richards on track. The Rangers paid your buddy $20M in one calendar year and pro-rated $4M in salary this season. Slats wasn't giving Richards that contract if Torts wasn't here. Richards spent the lockout drinking his wine and pining away for Olivia Munn.
Torts has done a solid job developing the young talent during his tenure here. Perhaps this is on the player?

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 04:59 AM
  #265
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 14,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Torts has done a solid job developing the young talent during his tenure here. Perhaps this is on the player?
Holy **** I actually agree with you.


While I didnt like the timing of his demotion in the wake of the Boyle thing, and i think Torts' methods of mentoring will eventually ruin the hell out of somebody the organization covets, Kreider (hopefully) is taking this like a man.

When you consider the number of fragile, young players Torts has coached into legitimate NHL top/middle-tier players, he must be doing something right.

If Kreider becomes a casualty because of it, I'd chalk to up to percentages. Not every Rangers prospect is going to blossom, but we've been programmed to think that way:

Staal
Stepan
Hagelin
McDonagh
Sauer
Anisimov
Callahan
Del Zotto

That's a pretty good run.

GWOW is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 12:48 PM
  #266
Drewbackatu*
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,048
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Is it just me or are people who are describing how he plays, very similar into the style Gaborik plays? You know, the person who many want to trade and are pissed off at because he looks unengaged and does nothing away from the puck.

If Kreider's style is to play like Gaborik (straight line speed, no puck possession, not engaging a ton physically and no boardwork), than

a) Kreider is wasting his physical gifts
b) Kreider is going to be a bust b/c his shot isn't anywhere near as good as Gabby's and he is not nearly as good as Gabby at passing.

Truthfully, I think he has a huge bust potential, and was never completely sold on him. I think in order for him to put it all together he needs to learn the defensive side more and also learn how to use his powerful body. From what I've seen he just doesn't have the greatest smarts or awareness compared to other players.

Just by .02. I hope he does great, but I'm actually more concerned with Miller and Fasth as I think over their careers they will be better players.
Kind of early to say that about Fasth but Miller, who clearly gets it, might very well end up being a better player than Kreider.

I am thinking that perhaps when all is said and done, perhaps we may be able to draw a parallel between Kreider and Nazem Kadri(who was also in the 2009 draft and couldn't break into the Leaf's lineup because of defensive issues and is now lighting it up in his 1st pro season).

Drewbackatu* is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 12:58 PM
  #267
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drewbackatu View Post
Kind of early to say that about Fasth but Miller, who clearly gets it, might very well end up being a better player than Kreider.

I am thinking that perhaps when all is said and done, perhaps we may be able to draw a parallel between Kreider and Nazem Kadri(who was also in the 2009 draft and couldn't break into the Leaf's lineup because of defensive issues and is now lighting it up in his 1st pro season).
With Kreider, at least currently, it goes beyond defensive and transition issues - which are definitely evident. But they're also evident with Miller, or any young player. For all this conversation about what kind of player Kreider is, or how hes not being utilized correctly, or any of the other ridiculous excuses that have popped up in this thread - the common theme I see when I watch Kreider play is someone who is extraordinary timid and disengaged. Hes not moving his feet, and hes certainly not using his big frame to any sort of advantage. Thats unforgivable and, rightfully so, earned him a ticket back to Hartford.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 01:27 PM
  #268
NYR Viper
Moderator
 
NYR Viper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: PA
Country: United States
Posts: 28,022
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
With Kreider, at least currently, it goes beyond defensive and transition issues - which are definitely evident. But they're also evident with Miller, or any young player. For all this conversation about what kind of player Kreider is, or how hes not being utilized correctly, or any of the other ridiculous excuses that have popped up in this thread - the common theme I see when I watch Kreider play is someone who is extraordinary timid and disengaged. Hes not moving his feet, and hes certainly not using his big frame to any sort of advantage. Thats unforgivable and, rightfully so, earned him a ticket back to Hartford.
To be fair, he did the same thing in his freshman season at BC. It takes him a little while to figure out his way to engage. I am not sure if it is because he is overly cautious of making mistakes or because he gets inside his own head or what. He will show spurts, and then he will sit back.

It's almost exactly what he did his freshman season.

NYR Viper is online now  
Old
03-01-2013, 01:39 PM
  #269
McRanger
Registered User
 
McRanger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,703
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
To be fair, he did the same thing in his freshman season at BC. It takes him a little while to figure out his way to engage. I am not sure if it is because he is overly cautious of making mistakes or because he gets inside his own head or what. He will show spurts, and then he will sit back.

It's almost exactly what he did his freshman season.
That is what I saw most of his college career.

The only difference was how effective his "spurts" were as a upperclassman. And that he usually came up big when it mattered.

Even without changing his game he will probably have a fine career. Contribute offensively here and there, play a smart, quietly effective game.

But if he really wants to tap into his ridiculous potential he should listen to Torts and keep his stick and legs moving. Even if he never finishes a check, use his speed to menace the opposition.

McRanger is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 01:48 PM
  #270
Bleed Ranger Blue
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 14,736
vCash: 500
Quote:
To be fair, he did the same thing in his freshman season at BC. It takes him a little while to figure out his way to engage. I am not sure if it is because he is overly cautious of making mistakes or because he gets inside his own head or what. He will show spurts, and then he will sit back.

It's almost exactly what he did his freshman season.
But I thought this was all Torts' fault.

His size and speed are undeniable assets from the brief glimpse of when he used them in last year's playoffs. His problem seems to be in between his ears.

Miller and, especially, Hagelin dont have the physical attributes of Kreider - they're just smarter hockey players.

Bleed Ranger Blue is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 02:34 PM
  #271
NYRangers723
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,575
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
But I thought this was all Torts' fault.

His size and speed are undeniable assets from the brief glimpse of when he used them in last year's playoffs. His problem seems to be in between his ears.

Miller and, especially, Hagelin dont have the physical attributes of Kreider - they're just smarter hockey players.

S i still think Kreider will be fine and even though i like Hagelin i still think Kreider will be the bigger impact player once he goes through the process. you cant judge him on 11 games really especially with injuries and a lockout. I have a feeling next year he will be a very good player for us after working a little bit in the AHL and a full training camp

NYRangers723 is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 02:40 PM
  #272
dethomas07
Registered User
 
dethomas07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New York, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 1,204
vCash: 500
Id keep in the ahl for the rest of the season unless he really turns it up anotch.. let him understand the pro game a little bit better and when he proves a better overall 2 way game he will shine here in ny..everyone sees the skill he has, but i feel let him understand the defensive side of the game, take it all in, show/understand the work ethic that needs to be a pro and he'll be back up..

maybe in a month or playoffs or by the start of next year.. its up to him to show what he's made out of..everyone on this team had to prove their worth to make it/play at nhl and with torts especially and what he demands..

mcd, hags, cally, girardi MDZ they all benefited from it and so will kreider..

dethomas07 is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 02:42 PM
  #273
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,635
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Is Torts trying to start a war with management?



https://twitter.com/stevezipay/statu...63550966075392

He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.
He's been taking 'shots' at management ever since he got here. Every time he mentions the teams 'personnel' and his problems with it thats usually a direct shot at management. Which also gives him a great excuse when things are not working.

"I don't have the players I need" said every coach ever(but the good ones make it work no matter what they are dealt).

Bluenote13 is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 03:49 PM
  #274
Vidic15
Registered User
 
Vidic15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Romania
Posts: 1,028
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
He's been taking 'shots' at management ever since he got here. Every time he mentions the teams 'personnel' and his problems with it thats usually a direct shot at management. Which also gives him a great excuse when things are not working.

"I don't have the players I need" said every coach ever(but the good ones make it work no matter what they are dealt).
He was BSing last year, too. In his radio interviews, he would constantly say were aren't there yet. Really? When will be finally be there? When our core players are on the wrong side of 30? He's been playing it safe saying all the right things so he can keep his job longer. His priority is to keep his job. He's making this team play safe because he knows he if experiments too much and they fail, then he is out on his ass.

Vidic15 is offline  
Old
03-01-2013, 04:00 PM
  #275
haveandare
Registered User
 
haveandare's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 5,748
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Is Torts trying to start a war with management?



https://twitter.com/stevezipay/statu...63550966075392

He always mentions how the summer moves took away his ability to move players around in the line-up when anyone asks him about Powe. That's a shot at management.

I heard Kyper saying on the FAN590 on Wednesday,"Torts needs to stop pushing". Stop cracking the whip. He is close to Graves and Messier.

If the Rangers don't win,Rangers management will get sick of the Torts act very fast. If they haven't already.

Hey John. Lets get Brad Richards on track. The Rangers paid your buddy $20M in one calendar year and pro-rated $4M in salary this season. Slats wasn't giving Richards that contract if Torts wasn't here. Richards spent the lockout drinking his wine and pining away for Olivia Munn.
I'm not sure I see how these things are him taking shots at management.

Kreider does have a lot to learn. What has management done to suggest otherwise? He's a draft pick and a rookie, it's not like they traded the world for him being sure he'd be the next big thing.

The roster did lose flexibility, losing two two-way guys who played both C and LW. It's not really an opinion. They lost two of their most versatile guys.

Sather signs who he signs, he alone is responsible for Richards whether or not Torts talked to him about it. His own decisions are his own responsibility.

Richards taking the lockout as an excuse to not come in shape is Richards' fault. Again, why blame the coach, who under normal circumstances would have used his camp to ensure that Richards, and everyone else, began the season in shape?

haveandare is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:05 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.