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Old
03-02-2013, 12:41 PM
  #26
Dick Whitman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by internetdotcom View Post
Any goalie that can win with Methot as the only NHL calibre Dman (considering that Phillips and Gonchar are both older than dirt, and almost as slow), and put up the numbers that Bishop has is easily worth a 1st. Heck, if Varlomov (I know, the thread isn't about him, but just making a comparison) can net a first, Bishop sure can.
Ottawa's defence is playing NHL calibre d. Don't listen to this guy. With that said, this team isn't designed to score much so it's important that we get solid goaltending which Bishop has provided in all but one game he's played in this year.

God, this powerplay is awful.

A 2nd and a mid level prospect should be enough to get it done.

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Old
03-02-2013, 12:52 PM
  #27
Hale The Villain
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Originally Posted by Dick Whitman View Post
A 2nd and a mid level prospect should be enough to get it done.
Most people would agree this is Bishop's value, but what exactly seperates a 2nd round pick + good prospect from a late 1st round pick? Seems like similar value to me

Bishop for 2nd + prospect = fair value
Bishop for late 1st = highway robbery



The obsession people have with 1st round picks on this board is incredible.

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Old
03-02-2013, 12:54 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik View Post
Steve Mason
Sergei Bobrovsky
Oscar Dansk (2012 2nd round pick, 31st overall)
Joonas Korpisalo (2012 3rd round pick, 62nd overall)

In a first round deep with talent, I doubt they're looking to trade a 1st for a goalie unless he's a proven starter.They used their 2nd and 3rd round picks in last year's draft on goalies and they acquired one before the draft.
I agree, Columbus needs to stop with acquiring young unproven goalies with potential and hoping for the best. Obviously some few goalies would be exempted from this rule but I don't think Bishop is one of them.

Steve Mason - He got a new contract in hopes that he would bounce back. Failed although kind of looks ok this year. Not good enough to be the full time starter and I can see them letting him go after this season.

Mark Dekanich - Signed as a UFA to challenge Mason. Got injured in pre season. Went to the AHL, did poorly and then got injured again. Never had his shot with Columbus but assuming it would have gone poorly based on his current and last years AHL stats.

Sergei Bobrovsky - Acquired in a trade. Sometimes looks good and sometime looks bad. Not good enough to steal games from Mason and become a full time starter.

I wouldn't mind Bishop(not for a first) if the plan was to get rid of both Mason/Bob and acquire a veteran number 1 goalie. Then have Bishop playing as the backup and then take over as the number 1 once the veteran starter is no longer needed. But if that were to happen, I would rather keep the assets that it would take to acquire Bishop and have Bob as the backup and learn from the veteran. Then hope Bob is ready for the number 1 job in a couple of years.

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Old
03-02-2013, 12:56 PM
  #29
Dick Whitman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
Most people would agree this is Bishop's value, but what exactly seperates a 2nd round pick + good prospect from a late 1st round pick? Seems like similar value to me

Bishop for 2nd + prospect = fair value
Bishop for late 1st = highway robbery



The obsession people have with 1st round picks on this board is incredible.
Would you trade a 1st for a 2nd and a 3rd?

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:02 PM
  #30
Hale The Villain
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Originally Posted by Dick Whitman View Post
Would you trade a 1st for a 2nd and a 3rd?
I would certainly trade a late 1st for a mid-2nd and a decent prospect.

Not sure why you mentioned a 3rd.

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:09 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
Most people would agree this is Bishop's value, but what exactly seperates a 2nd round pick + good prospect from a late 1st round pick? Seems like similar value to me

Bishop for 2nd + prospect = fair value
Bishop for late 1st = highway robbery



The obsession people have with 1st round picks on this board is incredible.
I might consider the CBJ's second-round pick (barely separated in value from a low first-rounder, you know) and a throw-in prospect like JAM, Amroz or Weber. That'd be about it, because, despite Bishop's decent pedigree an current play...

Quote:
Originally Posted by punk_o_holic View Post
Columbus needs to stop with acquiring young unproven goalies with potential and hoping for the best. Obviously some few goalies would be exempted from this rule but I don't think Bishop is one of them.
What he said.

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:19 PM
  #32
InjuredChoker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyes of Orpik View Post
Steve Mason
Sergei Bobrovsky
Oscar Dansk (2012 2nd round pick, 31st overall)
Joonas Korpisalo (2012 3rd round pick, 62nd overall)

In a first round deep with talent, I doubt they're looking to trade a 1st for a goalie unless he's a proven starter.

They used their 2nd and 3rd round picks in last year's draft on goalies and they acquired one before the draft.
And Anton Forsberg.

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:26 PM
  #33
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I vowed earlier this morning to murder the next person who tried to send us another tweener goalie.

I'm sure you understand it's not personal.



Proven. Established. Full-Time. NHL Starter. All of the above or no deal.

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:36 PM
  #34
Dick Whitman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hale The Villain View Post
I would certainly trade a late 1st for a mid-2nd and a decent prospect.

Not sure why you mentioned a 3rd.
Would would assume that you could get a "decent prospect" in the 3rd round.

You'd be out of a job if you kept trading your 1st rounders for 2nd round picks and a decent prospect.

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Old
03-02-2013, 01:39 PM
  #35
Dick Whitman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viqsi View Post
I vowed earlier this morning to murder the next person who tried to send us another tweener goalie.

I'm sure you understand it's not personal.



Proven. Established. Full-Time. NHL Starter. All of the above or no deal.
The reason why that's not going to happen is because they aren't available. If they are, they have no trade clauses and they're not going to Columbus. Oh and finally, they'll cost you a lot more than a guy that's still unproven.

Most starters are home grown or traded before they turn into #1 goaltenders. I can understand your desire as a Jackets fan but it's not very realistic.

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03-02-2013, 02:10 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick Whitman View Post
The reason why that's not going to happen is because they aren't available. If they are, they have no trade clauses and they're not going to Columbus. Oh and finally, they'll cost you a lot more than a guy that's still unproven.

Most starters are home grown or traded before they turn into #1 goaltenders. I can understand your desire as a Jackets fan but it's not very realistic.
You may also note that, y'know, we haven't asked for anyone like that because we're quite aware that that's a very difficult type of asset to acquire. That's why we're going with two young borderline-NHLers while the goaltenders in the system develop, and will probably be taking a look at the UFA market.

It's not about what we're trying to get. It's about what folks are trying to send us.


(That said, we might look into seeing if Jonas Hiller can be poached from the Ducks.)

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03-02-2013, 02:12 PM
  #37
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What would you give ottawa for Anderson?

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Old
03-02-2013, 02:27 PM
  #38
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What would you give ottawa for Anderson?
Not what Ottawa would ask for.

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03-02-2013, 02:30 PM
  #39
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Not what Ottawa would ask for.
lol...

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03-02-2013, 02:43 PM
  #40
Benny FTW
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What would you give ottawa for Anderson?
Johansen and Erixon

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Old
03-02-2013, 02:52 PM
  #41
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Johansen and Erixon
I don't even know what to say to this. It is one of the more ridiculous things I've ever read on HFB.

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:11 PM
  #42
Dick Whitman
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I don't even know what to say to this. It is one of the more ridiculous things I've ever read on HFB.
Why is that?

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:23 PM
  #43
Benny FTW
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Originally Posted by Double-Shift Lassť View Post
I don't even know what to say to this. It is one of the more ridiculous things I've ever read on HFB.
It would take an over-payment for Anderson. Didn't expect Jacket fans to like it...

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:36 PM
  #44
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Ben Bishop is nothing special and isnt worth a first. Columbus doesnt even need another goalie so the trade makes little sense for Columbus. Ottawa should just hold onto him anyway.

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:38 PM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobloblawLeaf View Post
Ben Bishop has the exact same trade value as Ben Scrivens. They're both 26 year old goaltenders getting their first taste of the NHL and playing well. That is not nearly worth a first round pick; if a leaf fan posted this thread asking for a first for Scrivens HF would explode from all the trolling.
Scrivener is just garbage though.... Not Bishop.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BROOKLYnKNIGHTS View Post
Ben Bishop is nothing special and isnt worth a first. Columbus doesnt even need another goalie so the trade makes little sense for Columbus. Ottawa should just hold onto him anyway.
True true.

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:40 PM
  #46
couture23
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Originally Posted by Benny FTW View Post
Johansen and Erixon
Hahaha good luck with that.

CBJ does not need another goalie, especially not at the expense of one of their firsts.

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Old
03-02-2013, 03:52 PM
  #47
Benny FTW
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Hahaha good luck with that.

CBJ does not need another goalie, especially not at the expense of one of their firsts.
It would take luck... or Howson

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Old
03-02-2013, 04:08 PM
  #48
couture23
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Originally Posted by Benny FTW View Post
It would take luck... or Howson
Haha good recovery.

I don't know if Bishop would fetch a 1st. Has he really proved that much since being acquired for a 2nd? Probably not, but something would have to be added to that 2nd to acquire Bishop nowadays.

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Old
03-02-2013, 05:43 PM
  #49
Mayor Bee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny FTW View Post
It would take luck... or Howson
Scott Howson acquired the following goalies by the following means:

- Wade Dubielewicz (waivers)
- Kevin Lalande (trade for a 4th-rounder)
- Mathieu Garon (UFA)
- David LeNeveu (UFA)
- Curtis Sanford (UFA)
- Mark Dekanich (UFA)
- Allen York (draft)
- Shawn Hunwick (college UFA)
- Sergei Bobrovsky (trade for a 2nd- and two 4th-rounders)

Therefore, your assertion that Howson would have traded a 1st-rounder for a 26-year-old goalie is completely idiotic and 100% without merit.

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03-02-2013, 06:39 PM
  #50
Benny FTW
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Scott Howson acquired the following goalies by the following means:

- Wade Dubielewicz (waivers)
- Kevin Lalande (trade for a 4th-rounder)
- Mathieu Garon (UFA)
- David LeNeveu (UFA)
- Curtis Sanford (UFA)
- Mark Dekanich (UFA)
- Allen York (draft)
- Shawn Hunwick (college UFA)
- Sergei Bobrovsky (trade for a 2nd- and two 4th-rounders)

Therefore, your assertion that Howson would have traded a 1st-rounder for a 26-year-old goalie is completely idiotic and 100% without merit.
I never said anything about a 1st for Bishop. Re-read my comments and try again.

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