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Old
03-03-2013, 11:31 AM
  #1
Fleury14
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Irving Question

If I recall correctly, Irving has to play a certain number of NHL games this year to prevent him from becoming a UFA instead of an RFA at the end of the season. Does anyone know/remember how many games that was?

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03-03-2013, 11:33 AM
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It was something stupidly high if I recall. I also remember people saying that there was no way he'd hit it unless Kipper got hurt. Way to jinx it

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03-03-2013, 11:53 AM
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Sean Monahan
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25 games I believe

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03-03-2013, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Jarome Iginla View Post
25 games I believe
Well, he won't be getting that this year..

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03-03-2013, 01:02 PM
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Is the number of required GP the same for goalies as other rookie skaters as well?

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03-03-2013, 01:46 PM
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im getting sick or irving myself we need to space ourself from him... in all honesty i think he has McE potential

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03-03-2013, 02:18 PM
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We will lose him for free while we watch Talyor get light up. We have some of the worst prospect development in the NHL.

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03-03-2013, 02:33 PM
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Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
We will lose him for free while we watch Talyor get light up. We have some of the worst prospect development in the NHL.
This.

We haven't given him a fair chance. Especially since he is a former 1st rounder. Disappointed we will lose him.

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03-03-2013, 03:31 PM
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Irving will definitely be a UFA after this year and with what has transpired this year I doubt he will even consider a contract offer from the Flames. I see him signing elsewhere to be the AHL starter/#3 goaltender in hopes of getting back to the NHL.

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03-03-2013, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
Irving will definitely be a UFA after this year and with what has transpired this year I doubt he will even consider a contract offer from the Flames. I see him signing elsewhere to be the AHL starter/#3 goaltender in hopes of getting back to the NHL.
I could see a team like Carolina giving him a chance at the backup job, and given how poor Ward has been he could a have a shot at getting some starts there.

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03-03-2013, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
I could see a team like Carolina giving him a chance at the backup job, and given how poor Ward has been he could a have a shot at getting some starts there.
I thought the same about Edmonton, Khabibulin is hitting free agency and the Oilers may be willing to go with the cheap young guy as Duby's backup.

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03-03-2013, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
I thought the same about Edmonton, Khabibulin is hitting free agency and the Oilers may be willing to go with the cheap young guy as Duby's backup.
God that is the last thing I need, watching Irving becoming a solid 1B type of goaltender mean while we are left trying to find a starting goaltender for the next few years.

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03-03-2013, 03:48 PM
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If Irving was a 4th round pick you guys wouldn't care as much. I understand the being givens chance argument. I do. But you still have to earn it and he hasn't for over two years now.

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03-03-2013, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flames Fanatic View Post
If Irving was a 4th round pick you guys wouldn't care as much. I understand the being givens chance argument. I do. But you still have to earn it and he hasn't for over two years now.
Hasn't earned it? He was the only reason we got any points last year when Kipper didn't play and while his numbers haven't been great he has sure as hell earned his shot more than Taylor. Young players need a chance to shine while they do have to earn it they also have to be given a longer look than older players as they need time to adjust and adapt to a new league. The management was simply looking for a reason to dump Irving back to the AHL and they got it in his last game here. He put up good numbers last year but be complained he couldn't get the wins this year his numbers haven't been great but he was getting wins and we simply gave up on him.

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Old
03-03-2013, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flames Fanatic View Post
If Irving was a 4th round pick you guys wouldn't care as much. I understand the being givens chance argument. I do. But you still have to earn it and he hasn't for over two years now.
Maybe you shouldn't try telling people why they think what they do. Because I don't see anyone really making a case to call Irving up or anything like that.

Irving was one of the best goaltenders in the AHL last year, he earned his recall from Abbotsford based on his play. He didn't struggle until after he was sent back down and his wife had a baby. Taylor never became the starter in Abbotsford because Irving played poorly, he and the team just played so well while Irving was away from the team (on the recall and for his child) that Ward had no choice but to keep running with Taylor.

It really bothers me when people that have no idea what they are talking about spew nonsense because they think they can read a stats sheet. You really remind me of one of those hack writers like you see on Flames Nation that think everyone is defined by a statistic.

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Old
03-03-2013, 04:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
Maybe you shouldn't try telling people why they think what they do. Because I don't see anyone really making a case to call Irving up or anything like that.

Irving was one of the best goaltenders in the AHL last year, he earned his recall from Abbotsford based on his play. He didn't struggle until after he was sent back down and his wife had a baby. Taylor never became the starter in Abbotsford because Irving played poorly, he and the team just played so well while Irving was away from the team (on the recall and for his child) that Ward had no choice but to keep running with Taylor.

It really bothers me when people that have no idea what they are talking about spew nonsense because they think they can read a stats sheet. You really remind me of one of those hack writers like you see on Flames Nation that think everyone is defined by a statistic.
If you think I'm going purely off stats that's your own prerogative. I hate people using goalie stats without watching a player. I've been defending Kipper for the years where his numbers don't reflect his stellar play. I also despise Corsi.

I fully realize that Irving was the MVP for the Heat for quiet some time. My problem is he hasn't had the consistency with that higher end playing ability. Blame it on being a first time parent, being in the NHL or whatever you will.The fact remains he lost the starting job in the AHL to Taylor and couldn't win it back. More recently even beaten out of the backup position by Brust. Not to take anything away from Taylor or Brust, both players I enjoy. Brust particularly when I watched him with the Bingo Sens.

Irving has played decently well at the NHL level, especially if you take away the two blowouts the team simply didn't show up for (Boston last year and Vancouver this year). But not well enough to keep the job over Joey Macdonald in my personal opinion. Mac won't give you as high a potential but more consistent, and for a team that is struggling to find their own ***** half the time is an important factor.

Would I rather have Irving starting tonight instead of Taylor? Indubitably. Am I mad that Flames management want to see what they have in Taylor at the NHL level? No. Based solely on this season Taylor has definitely earned a chance. There's also no one from Flames management saying we won't see Irving back up if he plays well in Abby. Then again Mac might make that difficult but you never know, especially if Kipper gets moved.

I'm just sick and tired of people *****ing and moaning that the Flames always **** up by not giving our prospects free ice time. It had to be earned.

Edit: the more I think about it the more my argument makes sense in regards to the NHL than the AHL.


Last edited by Flames Fanatic: 03-03-2013 at 05:59 PM.
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Old
03-03-2013, 05:50 PM
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I see that Brust got lit up again (5-1 loss against Houston yesterday) while Irving sat.

Does anybody have any idea what Ward is thinking? Is this a numbers game where they don't want him to play too many games because of this free agency thing?

If they don't want him around then fine - they should show some compassion, loan him to another organization and say goodbye. They've thrown the poor kid under a bus and they just keep backing over him.


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Old
03-04-2013, 03:41 AM
  #18
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You said Irving hadn't earned anything in over 2 years. I showed you were wrong. It's pretty clear you didn't watch much of Irving last year if that is your opinion. Losing a job in the final month of the season is not the same as showing nothing in over 2 years, Irving didn't even get the chance to win it back.

Not sure why you went on your little tirade about MacDonald and Taylor because them playing now has nothing to do with what was said. No one will argue MacDonald has earned the backup job that has watched the team since Kiprusoff got hurt.

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Old
03-04-2013, 07:13 AM
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Mike Jones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
You said Irving hadn't earned anything in over 2 years. I showed you were wrong. It's pretty clear you didn't watch much of Irving last year if that is your opinion. Losing a job in the final month of the season is not the same as showing nothing in over 2 years, Irving didn't even get the chance to win it back.

Not sure why you went on your little tirade about MacDonald and Taylor because them playing now has nothing to do with what was said. No one will argue MacDonald has earned the backup job that has watched the team since Kiprusoff got hurt.
I'm not sure but are you responding to my previous post. Let me know so that I can offer a better response later.

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Old
03-04-2013, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
You said Irving hadn't earned anything in over 2 years. I showed you were wrong. It's pretty clear you didn't watch much of Irving last year if that is your opinion. Losing a job in the final month of the season is not the same as showing nothing in over 2 years, Irving didn't even get the chance to win it back.

Not sure why you went on your little tirade about MacDonald and Taylor because them playing now has nothing to do with what was said. No one will argue MacDonald has earned the backup job that has watched the team since Kiprusoff got hurt.
I'm willing to admit 2 full years might be a stretch. Fine. Whatever. I'm saying that for whatever reason he wasn't capable of holding his job/earning back whatever. I disagree that you showed me wrong, but that's your opinion and I've got mine. You stated some facts, some of which I agree with some of which I don't. If that means we won't agree ever, fine. I'm not saying Irving hasn't been awesome, just that for whatever reason he hasn't been able to keep up that level of play and keep being that guy.

And my tirade is not only pointed at you, but everyone complaining that Irving got sent down. I merely stated potential reasons as why.

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Old
03-05-2013, 11:03 AM
  #21
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I don't really see it being an issue if he's a UFA or RFA - I just can't see him in the Flames plans any more.

I think Ramo will be with the Flames next year, Brossoit will be the number one on the farm and Irving will be out.

There's also Gillies and Ortio to account for longer term.

Irving may make it somewhere - he seems like a nice guy and I hope he succeeds. I just don't think it will be with Calgary.

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03-05-2013, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
I thought the same about Edmonton, Khabibulin is hitting free agency and the Oilers may be willing to go with the cheap young guy as Duby's backup.
This is exactly what i see happening.

Oilers pick him up for cheap, in a few years he becomes Schneider Esq and goes on to win a cup (or be really good) with the oilers.

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03-05-2013, 11:25 AM
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Originally Posted by TylerSVT View Post
This is exactly what i see happening.

Oilers pick him up for cheap, in a few years he becomes Schneider Esq and goes on to win a cup (or be really good) with the oilers.
I could see Irving going up there and making a mark. I could see lots of goalies going there and having a good time. The way things are going in Edmonton a couple of rec hockey goalies will be able to pair up and win the cup with that team.

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03-05-2013, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by TheHudlinator View Post
Hasn't earned it? He was the only reason we got any points last year when Kipper didn't play and while his numbers haven't been great he has sure as hell earned his shot more than Taylor. Young players need a chance to shine while they do have to earn it they also have to be given a longer look than older players as they need time to adjust and adapt to a new league. The management was simply looking for a reason to dump Irving back to the AHL and they got it in his last game here. He put up good numbers last year but be complained he couldn't get the wins this year his numbers haven't been great but he was getting wins and we simply gave up on him.
i disagree, Taylor has been a brick wall in the AHL (it seems with out him in Abby they cant win)... and irving has been soft, and inconsistent

i think the flame fan base is too harsh on taylor he got his first NHL start and win this season

I much rather roll with Brossiot, Orito, Ramo, and Gillies in our system than focus on a former 1st rounder thats proved nothing (in both the NHL, and AHL)

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03-05-2013, 01:11 PM
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Judging ortios numbers I don't think he pans out.

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