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03-03-2013, 10:06 AM
  #401
Captain Hook
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Originally Posted by Rowdy Roddy Peeper View Post
I wonder if we can ever learn by reviewing the past. Hmm...

Bennett is playing well. He is also a rookie who is generally getting decent minutes. Moen got more TOI than Galchenyuk yesterday too. This happens on every damn team.
True.

The good news is Bennett isn't just hype. He's actually flashing the talent at the NHL level that everybody that's watched him at the lower levels talks about. Tangradi never really did that. Bennett will earn more minutes and trust from the coaches in time if he keeps his play up.


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03-03-2013, 10:14 AM
  #402
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Originally Posted by Captain Hook View Post
True.

The good news is Bennett isn't just hype. He's actually flashing the talent at the NHL level that everybody that's watched him at the lower levels talks about. Tangradi never really did that. Bennett will earn more minutes and trust from the coaches in time if he keeps his play up.
Absolutely.

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03-03-2013, 10:21 AM
  #403
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There's no argument for giving more shifts to TK than Bennett. It's getting comical.

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03-03-2013, 10:33 AM
  #404
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Originally Posted by Captain Hook View Post
True.

The good news is Bennett isn't just hype. He's actually flashing the talent at the NHL level that everybody that's watched him at the lower levels talks about. Tangradi never really did that. Bennett will earn more minutes and trust from the coaches in time if he keeps his play up.
the best part for me is Bennett looks great doing all of the non-offensive things. He can play 3rd and even 2nd-line minutes (imo) without being a liability. I think he'll need minutes with more offensively-gifted players if he's going to grow that part of his game this year (at the NHL level), but the kid's a keeper.

(Might quiet some of the 'omg we can't draft and develop wingers' talk)

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03-03-2013, 12:45 PM
  #405
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I'd like to see him get more minutes than he's getting. He's proving he's not a defensive liability out there (usually the thing that gets rookies limited minutes), and he's one of the better skilled guys offensively.
Dude, chill out. He's only played a handful of games. The primary thing you want to do is make sure this player feels comfortable and isn't in over his head or has fragile confidence. The 2nd thing you want to do is make sure that having this player in your line-up isn't hurting the team. The 3rd thing you want to do is make sure they are physically & mentally prepared for a larger role. The 4th thing you do is give him a taste with better players and see how he does (and he got a few shifts with Geno before he got injured, and Geno is still out, so this isn't an option right now). Once this is all done, and if everything is going well, then you start to bump up his ice time and see how things go. Jesus, people are so damn impatient and unrealistic.

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Agreed. I feared he'd be a soft, finesse, floater type out there. The most pleasant surprise about his game so far is he actually competes hard and can win those board battles you mentioned.
That's what a summer training with TR Goodman will do for you. I can't wait to see how good BB is going to be after yet another summer of training with TR. I think next year he will be a breakout player.


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Originally Posted by JimsDoors View Post
I feel he could be one of those top 6 wingers and fit just fine on the 2nd line. His abilities are being wasted on the 3rd line by playing with TK. Like someone else said, on the 3rd line he'll just end up being the next Morozov
That last sentence is a bunch of crap. Bennett and Morozov have nothing to do with each other. That's called cherry-picking B.S. for your argument. Bennett has already shown more hustle and physicality in a few games than Morozov did in his whole time in the NHL. If Bennett is playing on the 3rd line, he will be getting better and better at being a full 200-ft player in the NHL, while also providing a burst of offense to that line. Sprinkle in the odd shift with our stars and some time on the 2nd PP unit, and that's a perfect scenario for Beau, if he is not ready to handle 18+ minutes with Malkin/Neal.

If he was getting 4th line action with Vitale/Adams and playing 5 minutes per night, that would be a different story.


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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
absolutely. he should be getting regular third line shifts over TK. With how the lines are now, he should at the very least be getting regular shifts with TK and Jeffrey when they are out there. I just don't get that.
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Originally Posted by mpp9 View Post
If he was losing boards battles, turning the puck over, floating and/or just looking a step slow for the NHL game, then yes, I'd say send him back down. But he's not. He's NHL ready. Let's see if he can be an upgrade for us in the top 6 this season. If not, we likely don't have a place on the team for him and he can be sent down.
We are going to find out, very soon, if BB can be an option on Geno's line and if he can handle top-6 minutes this season. If he can't, but still is performing well on the 3rd line, I don't mind keeping him there.


And Ogrezilla and others: I disagree about 2 things you mentioned. Number 1, I disagree that BB isn't a good fit with Malkin and Geno. I think he would be perfectly fine there. Neal's job is to be the monster forechecker he was last season; and we've all said, BB has been surprisingly good with his speed, forechecking and strength in that regard. Also, he has the intelligence to play with those players, and he has the skill to take advantage of all the open room he will get by people double-covering Malkin & Neal. I actually think it could be a good fit.

Number 2: I'm not convinced that BB would be any better, or even as good, on the RW as he is on the LW. When he was drafted, he was known to be a guy who could play either wing. I still feel that way. I remember after Neal's first season when he didn't score and then watched him play LW with Rick Nash in the WC's and always saw Neal going down the right side, and I stated on these boards: "I'd like to see Neal get looks on the RW instead of LW". And Bylsma saw that, too, and the result was a 40 goal year last season. When I watch Bennett, I see a guy who spends A LOT of time on the left side. I think his vision, playmaking ability and being open for a one-timer *might* make him a better fit as a LWer. The jury may still be out on this, but I see him as a LWer going forward, and that would especially be the case if we traded for (i.e. Setoguchi/Stewart/Kulemin) a winger, or signed a UFA in the summer (Perry/Iginla) because all of those guys would be good fits on the RW. BB may be better on LW short and/or long term.

Also, what's getting a bit lost in the "let's scratch Tyler Kennedy and put BB there instead" discussion, aside from the fact that they are playing different positions (LW vs RW) is the play of Dustin Jeffrey, and how he may look as a winger. No, Jeffrey hasn't lit the world on fire, and I wouldn't expect him to only because of how much time he has missed and unfairly been scratched for. But IF when Malkin comes back and they want to see DJ on the left side, how about a 3rd line of Jeffrey-Sutter-Bennett, and bump TK down or out (or if TK gets traded). Or if BB plays LW with Malkin/Neal, how about Jeffrey-Sutter-Cooke (the latter can play RW). There's a bunch of different options of how to configure our top-6, but I think Jeffrey deserves to be in the mix and should NOT be scratched any further. Worst case scenario, if Jeffrey can't stick in the top-9, let Glass sit out and role a 4th line of Adams-Jeffre-Vitale. Lots to think about.

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03-03-2013, 12:50 PM
  #406
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Jeffrey should punch DB in the face if he gets scratched over TK. IMO, it's a no brainer to see if Bennett is a fit with Geno and give TK's spot to Jeffrey on the third line.

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03-03-2013, 12:54 PM
  #407
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Think Bennett needs to start shooting buckets of weighted pucks before they start trusting him with top 6 minutes. As of now, his shot doesn't have enough on it to scare anyone.

Danger in giving him more minutes when he's not quite developed is that he might learn bad habits. Start subconsciously thinking that since his shot isn't beating goalies right this second and other guys' are, that the right play might be to dish, even when it's not.

I'm basically okay with the ice time he's getting. For now.

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03-03-2013, 12:57 PM
  #408
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His shot was greatly hampered by his wrist injury. Hopefully his wrist can heal 100% and he can get his strength back.

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03-03-2013, 12:59 PM
  #409
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Originally Posted by td_ice View Post
His shot was greatly hampered by his wrist injury. Hopefully his wrist can heal 100% and he can get his strength back.
I think I remember hearing that his wrist will never be 100% again. He doesn't need to have an overpowering shot though. Just accurate.

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03-03-2013, 01:05 PM
  #410
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I think I remember hearing that his wrist will never be 100% again. He doesn't need to have an overpowering shot though. Just accurate.
Yep. I remember an interview with him talking about it. Basically said he's going to shoot smarter rather than try and overpower a goalie. Accuracy and smart positioning.

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03-03-2013, 01:05 PM
  #411
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
And Ogrezilla and others: I disagree about 2 things you mentioned. Number 1, I disagree that BB isn't a good fit with Malkin and Geno. I think he would be perfectly fine there. Neal's job is to be the monster forechecker he was last season; and we've all said, BB has been surprisingly good with his speed, forechecking and strength in that regard. Also, he has the intelligence to play with those players, and he has the skill to take advantage of all the open room he will get by people double-covering Malkin & Neal. I actually think it could be a good fit.
Kunitz was the monster forechecker last year. Neal's main job was to get open and score goals. They can both do it, but forechecking shouldn't be Neal's or Bennett's main responsibility. Dupuis and Kunitz are both better suited for that role imo.

I agree with everything else you said.


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03-03-2013, 01:09 PM
  #412
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Seems like a great kid, really glad it's working out for him.

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03-03-2013, 01:18 PM
  #413
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I think I remember hearing that his wrist will never be 100% again. He doesn't need to have an overpowering shot though. Just accurate.
He talks about that here around the 6:00 mark.
http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2013/...-wrist-injury/

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03-03-2013, 01:19 PM
  #414
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Originally Posted by jmelm View Post
Dude, chill out. He's only played a handful of games. The primary thing you want to do is make sure this player feels comfortable and isn't in over his head or has fragile confidence. The 2nd thing you want to do is make sure that having this player in your line-up isn't hurting the team. The 3rd thing you want to do is make sure they are physically & mentally prepared for a larger role. The 4th thing you do is give him a taste with better players and see how he does (and he got a few shifts with Geno before he got injured, and Geno is still out, so this isn't an option right now). Once this is all done, and if everything is going well, then you start to bump up his ice time and see how things go. Jesus, people are so damn impatient and unrealistic.



That's what a summer training with TR Goodman will do for you. I can't wait to see how good BB is going to be after yet another summer of training with TR. I think next year he will be a breakout player.




That last sentence is a bunch of crap. Bennett and Morozov have nothing to do with each other. That's called cherry-picking B.S. for your argument. Bennett has already shown more hustle and physicality in a few games than Morozov did in his whole time in the NHL. If Bennett is playing on the 3rd line, he will be getting better and better at being a full 200-ft player in the NHL, while also providing a burst of offense to that line. Sprinkle in the odd shift with our stars and some time on the 2nd PP unit, and that's a perfect scenario for Beau, if he is not ready to handle 18+ minutes with Malkin/Neal.

If he was getting 4th line action with Vitale/Adams and playing 5 minutes per night, that would be a different story.






We are going to find out, very soon, if BB can be an option on Geno's line and if he can handle top-6 minutes this season. If he can't, but still is performing well on the 3rd line, I don't mind keeping him there.


And Ogrezilla and others: I disagree about 2 things you mentioned. Number 1, I disagree that BB isn't a good fit with Malkin and Geno. I think he would be perfectly fine there. Neal's job is to be the monster forechecker he was last season; and we've all said, BB has been surprisingly good with his speed, forechecking and strength in that regard. Also, he has the intelligence to play with those players, and he has the skill to take advantage of all the open room he will get by people double-covering Malkin & Neal. I actually think it could be a good fit.

Number 2: I'm not convinced that BB would be any better, or even as good, on the RW as he is on the LW. When he was drafted, he was known to be a guy who could play either wing. I still feel that way. I remember after Neal's first season when he didn't score and then watched him play LW with Rick Nash in the WC's and always saw Neal going down the right side, and I stated on these boards: "I'd like to see Neal get looks on the RW instead of LW". And Bylsma saw that, too, and the result was a 40 goal year last season. When I watch Bennett, I see a guy who spends A LOT of time on the left side. I think his vision, playmaking ability and being open for a one-timer *might* make him a better fit as a LWer. The jury may still be out on this, but I see him as a LWer going forward, and that would especially be the case if we traded for (i.e. Setoguchi/Stewart/Kulemin) a winger, or signed a UFA in the summer (Perry/Iginla) because all of those guys would be good fits on the RW. BB may be better on LW short and/or long term.

Also, what's getting a bit lost in the "let's scratch Tyler Kennedy and put BB there instead" discussion, aside from the fact that they are playing different positions (LW vs RW) is the play of Dustin Jeffrey, and how he may look as a winger. No, Jeffrey hasn't lit the world on fire, and I wouldn't expect him to only because of how much time he has missed and unfairly been scratched for. But IF when Malkin comes back and they want to see DJ on the left side, how about a 3rd line of Jeffrey-Sutter-Bennett, and bump TK down or out (or if TK gets traded). Or if BB plays LW with Malkin/Neal, how about Jeffrey-Sutter-Cooke (the latter can play RW). There's a bunch of different options of how to configure our top-6, but I think Jeffrey deserves to be in the mix and should NOT be scratched any further. Worst case scenario, if Jeffrey can't stick in the top-9, let Glass sit out and role a 4th line of Adams-Jeffre-Vitale. Lots to think about.
So where does that leave, Cooke?

What if the Pens did something like this for this playoffs.

Kunitz, Crosby, Iginla
Dupuis, Malkin, Neal -
Cooke, Sutter, Stafford
Glass, Vitale, Adams
Jeffrey, Bennett

That's a tough to play against set up. Dupuis certainly will help out line two at both ends, we all know Iggy doesn't need talked up, and Stafford would help create what the 3rd line is about helping pin teams in their own end and won't be easily pushed off the puck like Kennedy. If you would want to switch out Dupuis and Stafford to get the RHS on Geno's LW I'm all for trying it.

I also know Shero likes the 4th line make up, but it seriously lacks size, and certainly doesn't warrant playing against top lines. That should belong to a Cooke, Sutter, Stafford kind of line.

Either way I'd say Iginla and Stafford changes the make up of this team where it counts the most.

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03-03-2013, 01:38 PM
  #415
jmelm
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
So where does that leave, Cooke?

What if the Pens did something like this for this playoffs.

Kunitz, Crosby, Iginla
Dupuis, Malkin, Neal -
Cooke, Sutter, Stafford
Glass, Vitale, Adams
Jeffrey, Bennett

That's a tough to play against set up. Dupuis certainly will help out line two at both ends, we all know Iggy doesn't need talked up, and Stafford would help create what the 3rd line is about helping pin teams in their own end and won't be easily pushed off the puck like Kennedy. If you would want to switch out Dupuis and Stafford to get the RHS on Geno's LW I'm all for trying it.

I also know Shero likes the 4th line make up, but it seriously lacks size, and certainly doesn't warrant playing against top lines. That should belong to a Cooke, Sutter, Stafford kind of line.

Either way I'd say Iginla and Stafford changes the make up of this team where it counts the most.
Well, it's tough to answer your question outright because it's based very much on hypotehticals: namely trading for TWO wingers. I really, really don't think that's going to happen. We may very well trade for one winger, but trading for 2 is probably a bit optimistic. So for the sake of argument, I will address your question on the basis that we add only one winger (and will happily re-address it if we were to somehow trade for 2 in the future). Here's how I would do it

Kunitz, Crosby, Iginla/Stafford/Setoguchi/etc.
Bennett, Malkin, Neal -
Cooke, Sutter, Dupuis
Adams, Jeffrey, Vitale
Glass

or

Kunitz, Crosby, Iginla/Stafford/Setoguchi/etc.
Dupuis, Malkin, Neal
Bennett, Sutter, Cooke (or switch wings with Bennett & Cooke)
Adams, Jeffrey, Vitale
Glass

If they wanted to keep Glass in the line-up and keep the 4th line the same, or if Bennett couldn`t cut it come playoff time, then move Jeffrey to 3rd line LW.

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03-03-2013, 02:37 PM
  #416
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As much as Sid has been helping out Kunitz this year, I'd still prefer either Bennett or Dupuis with him on top line ( Iginla on the other side) and bump Kunitz down. Solves the second line and 3rd lines by just making one move to the top line. If Bennett continues to improve, there's no reason he can't be successful with Sid and Iginla..even in playoffs. I don't want to hear about inexperience, because there's been plenty of rookies to do well in the playoffs. Not to mention playing with Sid and Jarome. I didn't realize Bennett was actually this physical/strong , he can handle it.

Bennett - Crosby - Iginla
Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis

I'd even make a move replacing glass, but whatever .

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03-03-2013, 02:38 PM
  #417
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I heard him say somewhere recently that he's a playmaker at heart, that he prefers to pass first. I wonder if he's thinking that way now because his wrist injury has left him unable to ever be a sniper in this league, and he still wants to be an impact player in the top 6. Not that he won't put up goals -- he just won't be blowing them past anybody.

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03-03-2013, 02:41 PM
  #418
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Originally Posted by JimmyTwoTimes View Post
As much as Sid has been helping out Kunitz this year, I'd still prefer either Bennett or Dupuis with him on top line ( Iginla on the other side) and bump Kunitz down. Solves the second line and 3rd lines by just making one move to the top line. If Bennett continues to improve, there's no reason he can't be successful with Sid and Iginla..even in playoffs. I don't want to hear about inexperience, because there's been plenty of rookies to do well in the playoffs. Not to mention playing with Sid and Jarome. I didn't realize Bennett was actually this physical/strong , he can handle it.

Bennett - Crosby - Iginla
Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis

I'd even make a move replacing glass, but whatever .
Those lines look incredible, but we'd have to see DB actually play BB with Crosby for 18+ a night over a number of games before we'd even have a chance of seeing it come playoff time.

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03-03-2013, 02:53 PM
  #419
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i'll take a stab at 'fantasy' playoff lines.

Kunitz-Crosby-RW acquisition
Kulemin-Malkin-Neal
Bennett-Sutter-Dupuis
Cooke-Vitale-Glass
Adams

Després-Letang
Rental D-Martin
Niskanen-Engelland
Eaton-Bortuzzo

not sure what combination of Orpik, TK, Jeffrey, 1st and Määttä would get you Kulemin, Sid's RW and a rental D. it's tougher than it looks, Shero has his work cut out for him. that said, 1st + TK + Määttä gets you Pominville on the trade board. and there's a trade that can be worked out around Orpik + for Kulemin + according to some leafs fans. rental d-men are always available.


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03-03-2013, 03:36 PM
  #420
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I wonder if we can ever learn by reviewing the past. Hmm...

Bennett is playing well. He is also a rookie who is generally getting decent minutes. Moen got more TOI than Galchenyuk yesterday too. This happens on every damn team.
The difference, of course, is that Galchenyuk currently looks lost playing wing. He's a center. Also, Galchenyuk isn't going anywhere. He can't go to the AHL.

In our case, Bennett is a candidate to head back to the AHL when Geno returns.

Because after all, how can a Disco Dan-coached team have more than two skilled guys up front? What absurdity!

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03-03-2013, 05:56 PM
  #421
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As much as Sid has been helping out Kunitz this year, I'd still prefer either Bennett or Dupuis with him on top line ( Iginla on the other side) and bump Kunitz down. Solves the second line and 3rd lines by just making one move to the top line.
Why are we solving the second line by hurting the 1st? I don't understand the logic. Haven't since the season started and people wanted to do this.

If James Neal plays like he did yesterday, they don't need Kunitz.

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03-03-2013, 05:58 PM
  #422
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Why are we solving the second line by hurting the 1st? I don't understand the logic. Haven't since the season started and people wanted to do this.

If James Neal plays like he did yesterday, they don't need Kunitz.
no, but if Neal plays that much like Kunitz every night, they'll likely need to find Malkin his Neal.

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03-03-2013, 06:10 PM
  #423
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no, but if Neal plays that much like Kunitz every night, they'll likely need to find Malkin his Neal.
I just mean that engaged. He doesn't have to throw his weight around to that degree, but before he last night he was invisible and almost lazy 5-on-5. If he can play with that energy level and tenacity at 5-on-5 when Geno comes back, the 2nd line will be OK, whether they are flanked by Cooke or Bennett.

As for Kunitz, I think he has undeniable chemistry with Crosby. Moreover, every time people talk about Kunitz or Crosby or the 1st line, they all mention that Crosby says he feels comfortable with Kunitz. I think it's important that 1) Crosby is comfortable with him 2) Crosby goes out of his way to express that comfort level constantly.

I want two top-6 wingers brought in, but, regardless of the number (0,1,2) I would prefer Kunitz stay with Sid. I think his numbers thus far have shown that Sid can get as much out of him (or more) as Neal and Geno.

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03-03-2013, 06:21 PM
  #424
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I just mean that engaged. He doesn't have to throw his weight around to that degree, but before he last night he was invisible and almost lazy 5-on-5. If he can play with that energy level and tenacity at 5-on-5 when Geno comes back, the 2nd line will be OK, whether they are flanked by Cooke or Bennett.

As for Kunitz, I think he has undeniable chemistry with Crosby. Moreover, every time people talk about Kunitz or Crosby or the 1st line, they all mention that Crosby says he feels comfortable with Kunitz. I think it's important that 1) Crosby is comfortable with him 2) Crosby goes out of his way to express that comfort level constantly.

I want two top-6 wingers brought in, but, regardless of the number (0,1,2) I would prefer Kunitz stay with Sid. I think his numbers thus far have shown that Sid can get as much out of him (or more) as Neal and Geno.
I completely agree that Kunitz should stay with Sid. I was just being an jag

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03-03-2013, 06:24 PM
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Jag68Sid87
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I completely agree that Kunitz should stay with Sid. I was just being an jag
I resemble that remark.

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