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David Desharnais Discussion Part II: The 'Stay on your Feet' Edition

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Old
03-05-2013, 08:56 AM
  #126
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
For a puck-control expert like Eller, actually, he is strangely suited for 4th line duties at time. Our 4th line proved to be quite dominant with him there, which really, really tired the opposition more than they have since Eller was promoted.
That may be true but how long do you think Eller will happily play with a couple of stone handed grinders, getting 4th line minutes? He's too talented for the role.

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03-05-2013, 08:57 AM
  #127
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You still have too many centers for 2013-14 season and you can't really slot one on the 4th line they're just too good for that.
Classic case of a fan who's not used to cheer for a team full of talent, since it hasn't been the case for so long in Montreal. Having many good players is not a problem. It's actually a stenght we should be proud of. It will be a problem for the player having to spend time out of position or on the 4th line, but the solution will be in his hands : play better and you'll get your spot back. (or wait for the next injury)

Internal competition is good. Depth is good. Having many talented players is good. Please repeat after me.

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03-05-2013, 09:02 AM
  #128
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That may be true but how long do you think Eller will happily play with a couple of stone handed grinders, getting 4th line minutes? He's too talented for the role.
Who cares if the team is successful? If he's unhappy on a winning team, he can always ask to be traded to the Blue Jackets where he would be used on the 1st line.

Of course it won't happen, because Eller is not like that. The only real "unhappy" people here are the "fans" who think Eller success is more important than the team success.

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03-05-2013, 09:04 AM
  #129
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Originally Posted by bentheprop View Post
That may be true but how long do you think Eller will happily play with a couple of stone handed grinders, getting 4th line minutes? He's too talented for the role.
Well, with Eller on the 4th, the 4th gets much more minutes than they usually would. Which helps Therrien better manage his bench.

And I didn't make the argument that Eller should play long term on the 4th. He should be sent there on occasions; especially for games we need to manage our energy carefully and roll 4 lines regularly. You then put Galchenyuk as Centre 3rd, give him reliable wingers.

The point is to keep our depth alive and active. Which means occasionally appointing Galchy centre instead of Eller, and using Eller as superdepth. Trust me, when the injury bug will be biting our Centres, we'll be happy to have that depth.

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03-05-2013, 09:29 AM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
Are you really ready to roll with Eller (career .33 PPG)
Lyrical, behold the irrational arguments of a genuine hater.

Building an argument off obviously irrelevant and decontextualized statistics.

Eller was 23 to start this season. He has 0.55 ppg this year. You know what DD's points per game in the NHL was at that age? It was undefined. As such the comparison doesn't hold.

A huge number of players in the NHL, I think nearly all, would have higher points per game average in their career if they spent a full 4 years each in the Q and then a full 3.5 years in the ECHL/AHL. However, that doesn't often happen as managements often bite the bullet if the players can be good enough to start at age 21 or even 18 (like Galchenyuk).

I've had my glass of whiskey (it's late in this time zone), and even I know you can't compare career ppg between players who started at different ages. Only someone blinded by passion (let's be euphemistic) would fail to see that.

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03-05-2013, 09:34 AM
  #131
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How come such a nice, low key, quiet guy can get so much **** ?

Instead of bahing him left and right, we should be happy to have that type of player, productive and underpaid.

I am sure his teamates and coaches love him and aprreciate his play.

And that's the bottom line

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03-05-2013, 09:39 AM
  #132
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
A skeptic with a legit argument is not a hater. One without? Well, simple enough.

It's about being objective. DD is what he is.

I hear a lot of "you can't win with him", but we're winning with him. He's even being clutch.

I hear a lot of "DD needs big wingers to play well" and then he gets gallagher...and plays well.

At the end of the day, DD is an asset. He helps the team, he has a positive impact. Can we win with Desharnais? Absolutely. Can we win more with Mats Sundin in his prime? Yes. I'm sure we may win a few more with lemieux in his prime too. Just because one player may have a bigger impact, does not mean DD doesn't have a positive one.

People need to let it go. DD is part of the team and likely to stay unless we can find an upgrade. If we can get one at the right price, cya DD. Then again, if we can get one at the right price, cya Eller. And so on...

DD CLEARLY is not an untouchable. If anyone ever says that, I'd call them out for it. DD is not a star center nor is he martin st louis now and probably ever.

Still, DD competes, he plays bigger than his size, so does gallagher. I take these guys on my team 10 times out of 10. They help us win.

By no means does this mean DD is immune to criticism. I surely hope if he plays badly, we discuss it. Yet, he's playing well and competing, what's the problem?
Last year, having DD play with Pacioretty and Cole mean that Plekanec played with Staubitz and White (or Moen, or Darche) and Eller played with Bourque. The reverbations of a strong DD line was a last place team.

This year, our winger depth is stronger:
- Galchenyuk and Gallagher have been added to the team. We get a full season of these two rather than half a season of Cammalleri of AK46. An unexpected upgrade.
- Darche's replacement, Armstrong, is not playing on the 2nd line.
- Prust and Armstrong each play 2 minutes a game on the PK, saving the stamina of Plekanec, who is playing a minute less per game than last year, making him more effective on offense.
- Bourque's injury has the same effect as Gionta's injury last year.

Due to the upgrades on the wings, having DD center an offensive specialist line is not a detriment to the team this year as it was last year. Last year it was a net negative because rolling Staubitz-Plekanec-White as a 2nd line was too big a price to pay, this year, we have more depth, so it is strategic time allocation.

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03-05-2013, 11:04 AM
  #133
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Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
This is all based on speculation. The only facts we have is :

DD has reached the conference finals 2 years in a row in the QMJHL (2003-04, 2004-05)
He has won the Kelly Cup (ECHL) 2007-08.
He lost in 7 games in conference finals for the Calder Cup (AHL) in 2009-10.

Based in these evidences, nothing tells us that he couldn't repeat in the NHL. To compare DD to Kyle Wellwood is really showing your bias...

Also, I agree DD is unidimensional as an offensive player. But last time I checked, scoring goals was still the most effective way to win hockey games.
NHL as your top line

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03-05-2013, 12:46 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Last year, having DD play with Pacioretty and Cole mean that Plekanec played with Staubitz and White (or Moen, or Darche) and Eller played with Bourque. The reverbations of a strong DD line was a last place team.

This year, our winger depth is stronger:
- Galchenyuk and Gallagher have been added to the team. We get a full season of these two rather than half a season of Cammalleri of AK46. An unexpected upgrade.
- Darche's replacement, Armstrong, is not playing on the 2nd line.
- Prust and Armstrong each play 2 minutes a game on the PK, saving the stamina of Plekanec, who is playing a minute less per game than last year, making him more effective on offense.
- Bourque's injury has the same effect as Gionta's injury last year.

Due to the upgrades on the wings, having DD center an offensive specialist line is not a detriment to the team this year as it was last year. Last year it was a net negative because rolling Staubitz-Plekanec-White as a 2nd line was too big a price to pay, this year, we have more depth, so it is strategic time allocation.

You're so ****ing biased. It's not even funny any more.

there is NO corrolation between this line performance and the last place finish last season.

Have you ever heard about coaching decisions ?.. DD is not the one picking up his linemates and deciding about his ice time. So, get the **** off his back. Off course, you gonna find a zillion stats, including the birth date of DD's father or the name of his dog to prove your point.

No one ever said that DD was the new incarnation of Wayne Gretzky. But he is a ****ing honest, hard working guy who has some shortcomings in his game...But very few have none, don't you trhink ?

This treads about DD are beyond ridiculous.


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03-05-2013, 04:21 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Habtchum View Post
You're so ****ing biased. It's not even funny any more.

there is NO corrolation between this line performance and the last place finish last season.

Have you ever heard about coaching decisions ?.. DD is not the one picking up his linemates and deciding about his ice time. So, get the **** off his back. Off course, you gonna find a zillion stats, including the birth date of DD's father or the name of his dog to prove your point.

No one ever said that DD was the new incarnation of Wayne Gretzky. But he is a ****ing honest, hard working guy who has some shortcomings in his game...But very few have none, don't you trhink ?

This treads about DD are beyond ridiculous.
It was a coaching decision to put Cole and Pacioretty on the first line, thereby putting staubitz and white on the 2nd line, thereby finishing in last place. Not DD's fault at all. He was a plus to the team under Martin, and a minus under Cunneyworth.

If you do not think stats matter then don't bring up assists - ever. Assists are just a stat.

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03-05-2013, 04:58 PM
  #136
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Wow! Are we all habs fans?

Anyway, There a wise think to say '' If it's not broken, don't fix it!'' DD, Patch Line working. Goals are not alway a beautly but hey! DD has 15 pts, we are first, second line we be doing around 50 pts a year on a normal season. We are first!

Therrian call the shot, Any lines could score. No superstar, just a good gang of players that have find a way to win more!

DD working with Patch, to fix the line right now.

Go DD go, no excuse!

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03-05-2013, 06:23 PM
  #137
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Make a valid argument on how DD, being the centre of our only productive line last year, was a minus. Till now, you didn't, you only brought the most unlogical correlation you could find to bring him down.

What about Hurberdeau in Florida? Stamkos with Tamba bay? Ribeiro with the Caps? and so on and so on. Those player bring even more than DD to their club teams, doesn't stop them from being the less competitive ones of the NHL teams.

What does DD had to do with staubitz playing on the second line? Even if he was not there , Brad would of still been playing on the 2th. You think Plekanec could of been even more productive than DD on the first line and take the Habs to the playoff?

It's pretty clear that the DD line is still our first line this year, funny that now the Habs are 1st in the east. Reason of the success of this team are pretty obvious: coaching, offensive deepness and team spirit. If you can't realise that and put the past struggle of the team on DD back for no valid reason, you're just showing your bias.

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03-06-2013, 06:01 AM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Maelpj View Post
Make a valid argument on how DD, being the centre of our only productive line last year, was a minus. Till now, you didn't, you only brought the most unlogical correlation you could find to bring him down.
I like what DD brings to the team this year and what he brought under Martin, I didn't like how he was used under Cunneyworth.

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Originally Posted by Maelpj View Post
What about Hurberdeau in Florida? Stamkos with Tamba bay? Ribeiro with the Caps? and so on and so on. Those player bring even more than DD to their club teams, doesn't stop them from being the less competitive ones of the NHL teams.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. Can you explain?

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Originally Posted by Maelpj View Post
What does DD had to do with staubitz playing on the second line? Even if he was not there , Brad would of still been playing on the 2th. You think Plekanec could of been even more productive than DD on the first line and take the Habs to the playoff?
Cunneyworth's strategy last year was to put all his eggs in one basket, or rather, all his good wingers on one line. It means one good line and three horrible lines, as opposed to two decent ones and two horrible lines (inevitable given the injuries).

When you put all your eggs in one basket, you are explicitly deciding to leave the other baskets empty. It's more than just a "correlation", it's a causal links.

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Originally Posted by Maelpj View Post
It's pretty clear that the DD line is still our first line this year, funny that now the Habs are 1st in the east. Reason of the success of this team are pretty obvious: coaching, offensive deepness and team spirit. If you can't realise that and put the past struggle of the team on DD back for no valid reason, you're just showing your bias.
Pacioretty-DD-Gallagher is our best line over the past few games.

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03-06-2013, 08:57 AM
  #139
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Originally Posted by LyricalLyricist View Post
A skeptic with a legit argument is not a hater. One without? Well, simple enough.

It's about being objective. DD is what he is.

I hear a lot of "you can't win with him", but we're winning with him. He's even being clutch.

I hear a lot of "DD needs big wingers to play well" and then he gets gallagher...and plays well.

At the end of the day, DD is an asset. He helps the team, he has a positive impact. Can we win with Desharnais? Absolutely. Can we win more with Mats Sundin in his prime? Yes. I'm sure we may win a few more with lemieux in his prime too. Just because one player may have a bigger impact, does not mean DD doesn't have a positive one.

People need to let it go. DD is part of the team and likely to stay unless we can find an upgrade. If we can get one at the right price, cya DD. Then again, if we can get one at the right price, cya Eller. And so on...

DD CLEARLY is not an untouchable. If anyone ever says that, I'd call them out for it. DD is not a star center nor is he martin st louis now and probably ever.

Still, DD competes, he plays bigger than his size, so does gallagher. I take these guys on my team 10 times out of 10. They help us win.

By no means does this mean DD is immune to criticism. I surely hope if he plays badly, we discuss it. Yet, he's playing well and competing, what's the problem?
I agree about most of your post.

A team CAN win with DD on his team.....but this team will need to compensate for his lack of size and lack of defensive skills. That's not what the habs seems to be doing though! (Drafted small wingers, traded big wingers)

He do help us with some game, and some are only wins because of that line.....but they help us loose a couple also.

Therrien must do something with that line and i don't know what. They are so good offensively but such a liability defensively that this is mind boggling.

And i'm not getting this out of nowhere.....tha habs lost 5 big games (high scores) and here's a little something:

Islanders wins 6-3 (Last night)
3 even strenght goals by Islanders : DD on the ice for 2 of them

Pitsburgh wins 7-6
6 even strenght goals by Pitsburgh: DD on the ice for 4 of them

Toronto wins 6-0
4 even strenght goals by Toronto: DD on the ice for 3 of them

Buffalo wins 5-4
3 even strenght goals by Buffalo: DD on the ice for 2 of them

Ottawa wins 5-1
3 even strenght goals by Ottaw: DD on the ice for 2 of them

I'm not saying he or they are totally responsable for thoses losses....but it's no coincidence either. They wins us 4-5 games, but they lost 4-5 also.

That's the problem!

Habs must do something to fix this...the line of Pacioretty - DD - Gallgher is really exciting offensively, they are on the rolls and fun to watch, when they are in the offensive zone.....but do something to get better in your own zone!!!

Some posters thinks that DD's got easier points because he is not playing against top offensive line......but DD's often plays against top defensive line....so i got nothing against his offensive side and points.

But top defensive line SHOULDN'T score that many goals against that line on the ice!!!!

The defensive side of DD and this line in general is simply AWFUL!!!!
But it can be fix.....i want it fix!!

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Old
03-06-2013, 09:45 AM
  #140
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I agree about most of your post.

A team CAN win with DD on his team.....but this team will need to compensate for his lack of size and lack of defensive skills. That's not what the habs seems to be doing though! (Drafted small wingers, traded big wingers)

He do help us with some game, and some are only wins because of that line.....but they help us loose a couple also.

Therrien must do something with that line and i don't know what. They are so good offensively but such a liability defensively that this is mind boggling.

And i'm not getting this out of nowhere.....tha habs lost 5 big games (high scores) and here's a little something:

Islanders wins 6-3 (Last night)
3 even strenght goals by Islanders : DD on the ice for 2 of them

Pitsburgh wins 7-6
6 even strenght goals by Pitsburgh: DD on the ice for 4 of them

Toronto wins 6-0
4 even strenght goals by Toronto: DD on the ice for 3 of them

Buffalo wins 5-4
3 even strenght goals by Buffalo: DD on the ice for 2 of them

Ottawa wins 5-1
3 even strenght goals by Ottaw: DD on the ice for 2 of them

I'm not saying he or they are totally responsable for thoses losses....but it's no coincidence either. They wins us 4-5 games, but they lost 4-5 also.

That's the problem!

Habs must do something to fix this...the line of Pacioretty - DD - Gallgher is really exciting offensively, they are on the rolls and fun to watch, when they are in the offensive zone.....but do something to get better in your own zone!!!

Some posters thinks that DD's got easier points because he is not playing against top offensive line......but DD's often plays against top defensive line....so i got nothing against his offensive side and points.

But top defensive line SHOULDN'T score that many goals against that line on the ice!!!!

The defensive side of DD and this line in general is simply AWFUL!!!!
But it can be fix.....i want it fix!!
Cherry picking stats at its worst.

Since you're using a cherry picking version of the +/- stats (which is already a bad tool), here's at least the full, complete version :

In the last 10 games (since DD's line is playing well) :
- DD is +5
- MaxPac is +9
- Gallagher is +3 (the 6 games since he's back)

Now you can cherry pick only the games in which DD looks bad to make up your argument, but that still looks pretty awful. Fact is this line is scoring more goal than it is allowing. Think about it and come back with a stronger argument.

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03-06-2013, 09:51 AM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
Cherry picking stats at its worst.

Since you're using a cherry picking version of the +/- stats (which is already a bad tool), here's at least the full, complete version :

In the last 10 games (since DD's line is playing well) :
- DD is +5
- MaxPac is +9
- Gallagher is +3 (the 6 games since he's back)

Now you can cherry pick only the games in which DD looks bad to make up your argument, but that still looks pretty awful. Fact is this line is scoring more goal than it is allowing. Think about it and come back with a stronger argument.
Okay, i'm sorry

DD's is the best all-around player in the NHL...He is so good defensively he should nominate for the Selke!! Good god, somme poeple will never understand that bieng good at one thing doens't mean you are good at everything!!!

You see hte difference between you and me....it that I admit the upsides of a player....i admit DD's is awesome offensively...why can you admit that he sucks defensively, cause he does (no wonder why not 1 coach trusted him enough to let him go on the PK)

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03-06-2013, 09:58 AM
  #142
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Okay, i'm sorry

DD's is the best all-around player in the NHL...He is so good defensively he should nominate for the Selke!! Good god, somme poeple will never understand that bieng good at one thing doens't mean you are good at everything!!!

You see hte difference between you and me....it that I admit the upsides of a player....i admit DD's is awesome offensively...why can you admit that he sucks defensively, cause he does (no wonder why not 1 coach trusted him enough to let him go on the PK)
Your math doesn't work, so you lose your temper??? That won't make it work better.

No, the difference between you and me is that I can live with the fact that a player has a few shortcomings (in DD's case, it's his defensive play), as long as what he brings positive to the team (his offensive game) are stronger than his shortcomings. In other words, as long as his line scores more goal than it allows, I'm pretty happy with that.

Every player has shortcomings. The Canes won't trade Semin because he's too soft. The Wild won't trade Clutterbuck because he doesn't score enough. The Kings won't trade Mitchell because his offense is not good enough. But you know what? These players are still successful in the NHL for one reason : Their strenghts are stronger than their weaknesses. Overall, they bring more positive than negative. Same for DD. Just do your math well.

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03-06-2013, 10:30 AM
  #143
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Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
Your math doesn't work, so you lose your temper??? That won't make it work better.

No, the difference between you and me is that I can live with the fact that a player has a few shortcomings (in DD's case, it's his defensive play), as long as what he brings positive to the team (his offensive game) are stronger than his shortcomings. In other words, as long as his line scores more goal than it allows, I'm pretty happy with that.

Every player has shortcomings. The Canes won't trade Semin because he's too soft. The Wild won't trade Clutterbuck because he doesn't score enough. The Kings won't trade Mitchell because his offense is not good enough. But you know what? These players are still successful in the NHL for one reason : Their strenghts are stronger than their weaknesses. Overall, they bring more positive than negative. Same for DD. Just do your math well.
Who's talking about trading anyone right now?
Habs are doing well, no need for ANY trade right now!!!

But tweak can be made....things can be learn, lines can be changed too.
I'm not saying he must be put in a box and send to China....if this line could get a little bit of help defensively, it's a win for everybody, including DD.

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals scored. He's the best!!
That is truly awesome

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals allowed. He's the worst!!
That truly sucks.

It kind of balance itself....but it help as much as it hurt, that's the problem.

I wouldn't mind if DD was facing top offensive line night after night like Plekanec is....but it's so not the case.

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03-06-2013, 10:59 AM
  #144
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Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Who's talking about trading anyone right now?
Habs are doing well, no need for ANY trade right now!!!

But tweak can be made....things can be learn, lines can be changed too.
I'm not saying he must be put in a box and send to China....if this line could get a little bit of help defensively, it's a win for everybody, including DD.

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals scored. He's the best!!
That is truly awesome

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals allowed. He's the worst!!
That truly sucks.

It kind of balance itself....but it help as much as it hurt, that's the problem.

I wouldn't mind if DD was facing top offensive line night after night like Plekanec is....but it's so not the case.
That was last year. Do you have any stats from this year that shows it's still the case? John Tavares goal was against DD's line. 2 of the 3 Crosby line goals Saturday were also scored against his line, while the other goals from the weaker lines were scored against Plekanec, Eller or White line. I think DD's line is facing much more offensively powerful lines this year.

Anyway, check your math again. It actually helps much more than it hurts right now.

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03-06-2013, 11:02 AM
  #145
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Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Who's talking about trading anyone right now?
Habs are doing well, no need for ANY trade right now!!!

But tweak can be made....things can be learn, lines can be changed too.
I'm not saying he must be put in a box and send to China....if this line could get a little bit of help defensively, it's a win for everybody, including DD.

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals scored. He's the best!!
That is truly awesome

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals allowed. He's the worst!!
That truly sucks.

It kind of balance itself....but it help as much as it hurt, that's the problem.

I wouldn't mind if DD was facing top offensive line night after night like Plekanec is....but it's so not the case.
You're argument is very flawed. If we go by this, Desharnais was our "best defensive" top-6 guy last year. He was on the ice for less ES goals against than Cole, Pacioretty, and Plekanec.

It's a flawed argument because its based on luck right now.

The goalies SV% when DD and Pacioretty are on the ice is downright horrific and a complete anomaly, despite that line severely outshooting opposition while they are on the ice.

PS. All the guy was saying above you is that that line has a positive +/- since being put together which doesn't even take credit for their PP production. Even having a positive +\- through the last few weeks when including the Carey Price stinkers is incredible.

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03-06-2013, 11:29 AM
  #146
Not The One
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Islanders wins 6-3 (Last night)
3 even strenght goals by Islanders : DD on the ice for 2 of them

Pitsburgh wins 7-6
6 even strenght goals by Pitsburgh: DD on the ice for 4 of them

Toronto wins 6-0
4 even strenght goals by Toronto: DD on the ice for 3 of them

Buffalo wins 5-4
3 even strenght goals by Buffalo: DD on the ice for 2 of them

Ottawa wins 5-1
3 even strenght goals by Ottaw: DD on the ice for 2 of them
That's a really weak and crappy argument.

Pacioretty was also on the ice for those two goals last. Subban was on the ice for FOUR Islander goals last night. Price was a sieve. Trade them all.

Saturday, Pacioretty was on the ice for FOUR goals and Price was absolutely craptastic.

For the Toronto game, same deal. Pacioretty on the ice for three goals, Price = meltdown.

But it's really Desharnais' fault, right?

Edit: Too late. Too obvious I suppose.

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03-06-2013, 11:57 AM
  #147
Cyclones Rock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Who's talking about trading anyone right now?
Habs are doing well, no need for ANY trade right now!!!

But tweak can be made....things can be learn, lines can be changed too.
I'm not saying he must be put in a box and send to China....if this line could get a little bit of help defensively, it's a win for everybody, including DD.

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals scored. He's the best!!
That is truly awesome

DD as been on the ice more than any forward on this team for goals allowed. He's the worst!!
That truly sucks.


It kind of balance itself....but it help as much as it hurt, that's the problem.

I wouldn't mind if DD was facing top offensive line night after night like Plekanec is....but it's so not the case.
And last season, that wasn't the case. Nor has it been the case over the past 10 games.

He had a better +/- than Pacioretty last season (+10 compared to +2). DD's plus minus was third on the team overall and only 2nd to Erik Cole's (+11) among all forwards.

In fact, EVERY other forward with significant playing time other than the DD line were MINUS players last season.

What do you make of that? I will assume that a full season makes less difference than the 13 games which started this season.

Give it up. You look sillier by the post.

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03-06-2013, 12:02 PM
  #148
Cyclones Rock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAChampion View Post
Lyrical, behold the irrational arguments of a genuine hater.

Building an argument off obviously irrelevant and decontextualized statistics.

Eller was 23 to start this season. He has 0.55 ppg this year. You know what DD's points per game in the NHL was at that age? It was undefined. As such the comparison doesn't hold.

A huge number of players in the NHL, I think nearly all, would have higher points per game average in their career if they spent a full 4 years each in the Q and then a full 3.5 years in the ECHL/AHL. However, that doesn't often happen as managements often bite the bullet if the players can be good enough to start at age 21 or even 18 (like Galchenyuk).

I've had my glass of whiskey (it's late in this time zone), and even I know you can't compare career ppg between players who started at different ages. Only someone blinded by passion (let's be euphemistic) would fail to see that.
The point was simple. DD is a relatively accomplished scorer over a 100 game period at a level Eller hasn't come close to replicating over a significant sample. Also, Galchenyuk is an 18 year rookie who needs time to adjust. That was the point.

Pretty simple to comprehend, me thinks. I am also pretty certain that Eller will never be much more than a 40 point per year player even with power play time. He just doesn't appear to have a higher scorer's abilities to my eyes. If that's "irrational" and a "hater" to you, then so be it.

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03-06-2013, 12:24 PM
  #149
Lozela
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Dudes are so funny here

Desharnais is not good defensively and that's a fact

You can't have Desharnais & Plekanec in your team playing center when you have small fowards like Gallagher & Gionta...

On top of that we don't even have enough size in defense


Guys like Gorges, Bouillon & Gionta should be traded to add more size

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03-06-2013, 12:27 PM
  #150
Monctonscout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Partisan du CH View Post
Cherry picking stats at its worst.

Since you're using a cherry picking version of the +/- stats (which is already a bad tool), here's at least the full, complete version :

In the last 10 games (since DD's line is playing well) :
- DD is +5
- MaxPac is +9
- Gallagher is +3 (the 6 games since he's back)

Now you can cherry pick only the games in which DD looks bad to make up your argument, but that still looks pretty awful. Fact is this line is scoring more goal than it is allowing. Think about it and come back with a stronger argument.
Here here

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