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Who is to blame?

View Poll Results: The blame game
Trotz and his system 16 38.10%
Poile and his horrible asset management and forward drafting 25 59.52%
Legwand/Fisher/Sk (players) 26 61.90%
The summer of Suter and Weber (which is kinda on Poile too) 10 23.81%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 42. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-05-2013, 01:50 PM
  #26
hoosierpred
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Not at all

duplicate post sorry


Last edited by hoosierpred: 03-05-2013 at 01:54 PM. Reason: duplicate post
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Old
03-05-2013, 01:51 PM
  #27
predfan24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SavageSteve View Post
I blame the lockout and the lack of a training camp more than any of the other reasons listed. The Preds always go through these funks only to peak at some point for a period of time. You can see them all thinking too much about what they need to do instead of reacting to the situation and making good decisions in short order.

Totally agree that Legwand has become useless and needs to be moved or put on IR since he plays like he needs his head removed from his anus and the amount of time needed to recover from being bow-legged. He needs to move on for the good of everyone, including himself.
I think the lockout and lack of training camp hurt as well but it's not an excuse when every other team went through the same thing. Also here we 23 games into the season and scoring has been an issue since day 1. That's about the point where I stop considering an issue is a slump and look at it more as a trend.

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03-05-2013, 02:24 PM
  #28
luckofirish8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SavageSteve View Post
I blame the lockout and the lack of a training camp more than any of the other reasons listed. The Preds always go through these funks only to peak at some point for a period of time. You can see them all thinking too much about what they need to do instead of reacting to the situation and making good decisions in short order.

Totally agree that Legwand has become useless and needs to be moved or put on IR since he plays like he needs his head removed from his anus and the amount of time needed to recover from being bow-legged. He needs to move on for the good of everyone, including himself.
+1..

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03-05-2013, 03:50 PM
  #29
Paranoid Android
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Everyone. No one is free from blame

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Old
03-05-2013, 04:20 PM
  #30
Joe T Choker
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If we had real scouts, we could've stayed in 3rd & drafted Brad Richards

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03-05-2013, 04:24 PM
  #31
glenngineer
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Originally Posted by Dave is a killer View Post
If we had real scouts, we could've stayed in 3rd & drafted Brad Richards
Yeah. I guess that means all the other teams had terrible scouts too. Everyone passed on him for the first two rounds. Second guessing drafts is the funniest thing around here. It's been said time and time again, Vinny was the best player that year. Legwand was a distant second. Then came everyone else.

What about our crappy scouts getting Hornqvist with the last pick or that Rinne guy late in a draft or Weber in the second round or Erat in the sixth round? Yeah, horrible scouts we have.

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03-05-2013, 04:29 PM
  #32
glenngineer
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Heck, if we stayed where we were we could've had Brad Stuart, Mike Ribiero and Brad Richards with our first three picks. Maybe pick up Horcoff in round 4? Pick up Mikael Samuelsson in round 5. Andrei Markov in round 6. No pick in round 7 but Michael Ryder in round 8. Skrastins was a good pick in round 9.

Man, if we had done that we would've been set up the middle for years and had two decent wingers and a pair of defensemen in our first year. Hindsight is funny isn't it. I could do this for all the drafts but if it were all that easy, anyone could do it.

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03-05-2013, 04:50 PM
  #33
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Lamberts Hair, Trotz is envious, he has alo asked Masons beard to be a donor.

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Old
03-05-2013, 05:03 PM
  #34
Gnashville
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SavageSteve View Post
I blame the lockout and the lack of a training camp more than any of the other reasons listed. The Preds always go through these funks only to peak at some point for a period of time. You can see them all thinking too much about what they need to do instead of reacting to the situation and making good decisions in short order.
I was thinking this myself. The Pens went trough this the year they won the cup. basically a lot of teams are like this at the 1/2 way point of a season. It's just this season there will be no time to recover since the season will be over when they pull out of this funk.

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Old
03-05-2013, 06:15 PM
  #35
AEM6729
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I voted for the players, but it's hard to say. I mean, is it Fisher's fault that he's not really a 1st line center? No. But he and his fellow veteran leaders have been pretty invisible lately, and we know they're capable of playing significantly better than they are now. So it's surely partly the players' fault.

But on the other hand, we don't really have any legitimate first-line players outside of Erat (who isn't playing like one right now). Maybe Wilson someday, but not now. It's tempting to say that's Poile's fault, but without knowing a heck of a lot more about the inner workings of the team than I actually do, I don't think that judgement can be made. We have no idea how many first-line players he's attempted to acquire by trade or signing that just haven't happened for whatever reason. I have to believe that there have been at least a few.

Also, I'd like to lay some blame on Radulov. He is the only legitimately gifted goal-scoring forward we've ever had, and he screwed us. If he was a committed NHLer, I think we'd be looking at a different team right now...not only because of his play, but because his play might've enticed other players to come here (or some who have left to stay here). But, alas...he screwed us.

I have no idea whose fault it is, basically. But we suck.


ETA: I would also like to blame all of the poll choices, for not sucking harder in the past. We've always been juuuust good enough to not have a great draft position. How did Chicago and Pittsburgh get good? They SUCKED! They sucked hard. They sucked enough to get into the position of drafting people like Kane, Toews, Crosby, Malkin. We've never blown it big enough, and definitely not in a good enough draft year, to do that. Damn us for being so marginally good.


Last edited by AEM6729: 03-05-2013 at 06:25 PM.
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Old
03-05-2013, 06:42 PM
  #36
Jarnberg
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I'll quote myself:
Quote:
Everyone on here always praises Poile for doing the best in the business in finding great players. People on here think Trotz is a great coach for being able to get more out of less. So what is it? Was he given less? If so then it is Poile. Was he given great players? If so it is Trotz. Either the wrong players have been chosen or Trotz is mismanaging them.
Which one is it?

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03-05-2013, 07:15 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stranger View Post
I'll quote myself:

Which one is it?
Why can't it be both?

In 06/07 and 11/12 I think we had very good teams capable of going deep, yet Trotz couldn't get it done.

They are both great at getting something out of nothing on a shoestring budget. But if ownership is serious about spending more, then I think we may need to move on and look elsewhere. Neither are capable of getting over the hump.

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Old
03-06-2013, 10:17 AM
  #38
triggrman
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So I'm hearing that Poile had a higher budget the last 2 seasons than he actually used, so maybe not all the blame should go to the owners on the budget.

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Old
03-06-2013, 11:39 AM
  #39
deanwormer
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Originally Posted by triggrman View Post
So I'm hearing that Poile had a higher budget the last 2 seasons than he actually used, so maybe not all the blame should go to the owners on the budget.
which, if true, brings us back to "why"? Does Poile suck? Was the uncertainty around the big 3 a stumbling block? Still some residual from the Liarpold dismantling? Is this really more a place for family guys and later-in-career guys and not really attractive cause it's so not a traditional market and doesn't offer the high-profile extras?

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Old
03-06-2013, 02:05 PM
  #40
Cashville
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My expectation was to claw for 7th or 8th, but likely miss the playoffs; we're in line with my expectations generally. I don't lay all the blame on Poile because I think he does the best he can with the options he has available. I also look at some alternatives like Howson, Feaster, Regier who were/are just terrible, and others like Burke and Carlyle who had successes and failures. If we ditch Poile, who do we pick up that we can say is better with a large degree of confidence?

We all love the Preds and most love the city of Nashville, but the area is not currently attractive to top players and GMs as a destination. We effectively have to offer a premium above and beyond large market teams to have the terms viewed the same. It has to be hard for Poile.

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Old
03-06-2013, 06:40 PM
  #41
dulzhok
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cashville View Post
My expectation was to claw for 7th or 8th, but likely miss the playoffs; we're in line with my expectations generally. I don't lay all the blame on Poile because I think he does the best he can with the options he has available. I also look at some alternatives like Howson, Feaster, Regier who were/are just terrible, and others like Burke and Carlyle who had successes and failures. If we ditch Poile, who do we pick up that we can say is better with a large degree of confidence?
It's up to ownership to find the right guy. Pittsburgh didn't re-sign Craig Patrick (a reputable GM) because they found their guy Ray Shero. And Shero has made the right agressive moves to get that team at the top and they will be for the indefinite future. Good asset mgmt like trading Staal when he wasn't going to re-sign only furthers their stability as a franchise.

Yes you can make the wrong hire, but fear of making the wrong move isn't in the DNA of successful franchises, or people for that matter.

Unfortunately, that is in Poile's DNA. He has to be the one, if not the most complacent GM in the game. Does his patience pay dividends? To a degree, but we've seen the degree...

Both Suter and Weber wanted out primary because of Poile's complacency. They have both publicly stated that want to see improvement in the roster. We saw a last ditch effort by Poile and owners by outbidding everyone for deadline rentals.

We as fans have that complaint, but when our stars start seeing the same pattern of inactivity, they don't want to be a part of it. And when they don't want to be a part of it, other players don't want to be a part of it.

Poile hasn't made a good trade in 10 years, since Steve Sullivan. By good trade, I mean semi long-term top 6 forward or top 4 dman. Our most agressive long-term trades (Sullivan, Dunham, etc) happened when Shero was assitant GM. One has to wonder what role he played in those, because it's certainly not the norm for Poile.

Poile did not have a pulse on the likes of Weber, Radulov, Suter. Taking Weber to arbitration was a horrible move, and Poile publicly stated he didn't have time to work on Suter and Rinne extensions because he was too busy with Weber's arbitration. Not to mention you're taking your best player to court to argue that he's not worth the money.

3-4 years ago, we had a lot of assets (credit to Poile and scouts). Now we don't, and we're left with an average (at best) roster. This falls directly on Poile.

Beyond dealing with star players and managing assets, we continue to put all our faith in 3rd line players or marginal players. Signing Gaustad to the contract we did was one of the worst NHL signings recent memory. Since the 2nd part of last year, Fisher has shown why he was mostly a 3rd liner in Ottawa. We go a sign him to an even more expensive contract and force him to be a scoring line center. Hal Gill is the slowest player in the NHL and agining fast- we sign him to a multi-year deal at an even higher rate. The list goes on...

I've said the past 2 years--- we could either be a team on cusp of eliteness or a team scrapping to get by. Our fate was in Poile's hands. Unfortunately, it's looking like like the latter.

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