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Rand Paul's 11+ Hour Filibuster on the Senate Floor

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03-06-2013, 11:12 PM
  #1
Epsilon
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Rand Paul's 11+ Hour Filibuster on the Senate Floor

I don't agree with everything Rand Paul is saying, far from it (although he's certainly bringing up many good points and issues), but I absolutely respect his willingness to filibuster in the proper way: by holding the floor and speaking on an issue which he believes is important. The purpose of cloture is to cut off debate; as long as a senator wishes to continue debate, he should be allowed to hold the floor and do so. But the procedural filibuster (i.e. the effective requirement of 60 votes to move bills/nominations forward) is nonsense that needs to stop. If enough (40-50 senators) actually object to the idea of ending debate, surely at least one should be willing to do as Paul is doing and hold the floor to actually discuss the issue at end.

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03-06-2013, 11:41 PM
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Fish on The Sand
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Originally Posted by Epsilon View Post
I don't agree with everything Rand Paul is saying, far from it (although he's certainly bringing up many good points and issues), but I absolutely respect his willingness to filibuster in the proper way: by holding the floor and speaking on an issue which he believes is important. The purpose of cloture is to cut off debate; as long as a senator wishes to continue debate, he should be allowed to hold the floor and do so. But the procedural filibuster (i.e. the effective requirement of 60 votes to move bills/nominations forward) is nonsense that needs to stop. If enough (40-50 senators) actually object to the idea of ending debate, surely at least one should be willing to do as Paul is doing and hold the floor to actually discuss the issue at end.
That's a double edged sword. He just ends up repeating himself and is holding back the Senate from discussing other issues.

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03-06-2013, 11:53 PM
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He's grandstanding. Learned from one of the best.

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03-06-2013, 11:59 PM
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He's a butthole just like his miserable father.

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03-07-2013, 12:20 AM
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Concordski
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Not only is he repeating himself, he's letting other people do most of the talking. Also, where the heck does Rand Paul draw the line between Conflict and Non-conflict? It's a very arbitrary line. I also like how these senators are insisting that the government is going to assassinate the people and then essentially qualify it with "but I'm just asking questions!!!" Alex Jones has more coherent arguments...

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03-07-2013, 12:22 AM
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Boom, Rand Paul just got Durbin'd.

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03-07-2013, 12:27 AM
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JmanWingsFan
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Hah. This is hilarious. Are the Democrats so bent on holding the power to execute citizens of the United States on United States soil without due process, as is completely opposed to what is written so clearly in the Constitution, that they'll let this drag on? They're embarrassing themselves. All they have to do is answer that it is unconstitutional or consitutional to execute US citizens without due process. It's common Democrat strategy to never engage in debate, and this is a prime example.

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03-07-2013, 12:29 AM
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The Moose
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Obama and CIA should use a drone to remove Rand Paul from the floor.

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03-07-2013, 12:31 AM
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Concordski
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Obama and CIA should use a drone to remove Rand Paul from the floor.
They used Dick Durbin, which is a more humane way of doing things.

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03-07-2013, 12:33 AM
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Obama and CIA should use a drone to remove Rand Paul from the floor.
And then you make a martyr out of Rand Paul, proving their point that they'l use drone strikes on anyone that opposes them. Bad government policy. Best way to turn the sheeple on you.

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03-07-2013, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by DanielBryanRoleModel View Post
Also, where the heck does Rand Paul draw the line between Conflict and Non-conflict? It's a very arbitrary line.
It is?

Edit: Now I'm fairly sure I didn't read that properly.


Last edited by Garo: 03-07-2013 at 01:04 AM.
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03-07-2013, 01:09 AM
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Concordski
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It is?
Yes it is, are they in conflict 10 years after the fact and the criminal is no longer taking criminal action? Is a large passenger plane that may or may not have been hijacked an enemy combatant before all the planes have an opportunity to land, or do you not attack because you don't know for sure?

You could also argue that both Koreas are in open violent conflict with each other right now, or you could argue that they are not, both arguments have merit. The concept of what is conflict and what is not is very vague.

If Osama Bin Laden were American and lived in the United States under circumstances that were otherwise the same? Are you in open conflict with him, or do you have act under due process?

EDIT: Even if you misread, I just want to make it clear what I was trying to say

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03-07-2013, 01:53 AM
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Troy McClure
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Originally Posted by JmanWingsFan View Post
Hah. This is hilarious. Are the Democrats so bent on holding the power to execute citizens of the United States on United States soil without due process, as is completely opposed to what is written so clearly in the Constitution, that they'll let this drag on? They're embarrassing themselves. All they have to do is answer that it is unconstitutional or consitutional to execute US citizens without due process. It's common Democrat strategy to never engage in debate, and this is a prime example.
But this is a confirmation vote. I don't know what debate you want to see happen here. This is a yes or no issue on a vote to employ a guy to run the CIA.

It does not matter one bit what he says or what questions he answers. Even if he was to say that he was against the drone strikes, there is nothing binding about that answer. He could go in front of Congress today and say he thinks those are unconstitutional and then go order a strike tomorrow. The only way to outlaw these things is to... well... pass a law or have someone targeted by a strike sue claiming their due process rights were violated.

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03-07-2013, 02:58 AM
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I thought preventing a single person from dominating the whole policymaking process was the point of democratic institutions?

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03-07-2013, 04:12 AM
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Ilkka Sinisalo
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Originally Posted by JmanWingsFan View Post
Hah. This is hilarious. Are the Democrats so bent on holding the power to execute citizens of the United States on United States soil without due process, as is completely opposed to what is written so clearly in the Constitution, that they'll let this drag on? They're embarrassing themselves. All they have to do is answer that it is unconstitutional or consitutional to execute US citizens without due process. It's common Democrat strategy to never engage in debate, and this is a prime example.
Speaking of embarrassing, your posts.

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03-07-2013, 04:32 AM
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I thought preventing a single person from dominating the whole policymaking process was the point of democratic institutions?
Not when that single person is for your own beliefs.


Duh.

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03-07-2013, 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by JmanWingsFan View Post
Hah. This is hilarious. Are the Democrats so bent on holding the power to execute citizens of the United States on United States soil without due process, as is completely opposed to what is written so clearly in the Constitution, that they'll let this drag on? They're embarrassing themselves. All they have to do is answer that it is unconstitutional or consitutional to execute US citizens without due process. It's common Democrat strategy to never engage in debate, and this is a prime example.
As long as Republicans hate women, gays, the transgendered, the disabled, the chronically ill, blacks, Hispanics, most Jews left of Conservadox, abortion, universal healthcare, equal treatment of Communists (China/Cuba double standard), family leave, having corporations pay their fair share of taxes, and more, people will look the other way with the Democrats. The Democrats, for better or worse, are the only ones looking for most of the middle class.

The US is in a bad place from which it cannot return in its current state. And I wonder why a few years under a nonpartisan dictatorship would do wonders for this sinking hole teetering on the Third World. Homelessness in Canada looks mighty good right now.

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03-07-2013, 08:03 AM
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He's a butthole just like his miserable father.
This times 100.

Have the rules of procedure changed, or is he doing this voluntarily? I can't really disagree with the ostensible purpose of his filibuster, and he's smart to draw attention to it this way, but I can't help thinking what he really wants is to grandstand as much as possible to increase his profile for future political endeavors, like he did with the Benghazi hearings.

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03-07-2013, 08:12 AM
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Originally Posted by KirkP View Post
He's a butthole just like his miserable father.
Standing up against drone strikes and arguing for due process is courageous. He is one of the few Republicans willing to stand up for what he believes is right. He should truly be commeneded and not vilified.

"In an empire of lies, truth is treason".

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03-07-2013, 08:16 AM
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Originally Posted by JmanWingsFan View Post
Hah. This is hilarious. Are the Democrats so bent on holding the power to execute citizens of the United States on United States soil without due process, as is completely opposed to what is written so clearly in the Constitution, that they'll let this drag on? They're embarrassing themselves. All they have to do is answer that it is unconstitutional or consitutional to execute US citizens without due process.
I pretty much agree with what I underlined. However, I read the 16 page report leaked by NBC and I remember it saying that they can only execute Al Quada and associated forces currently NOT on American soil. I could be wrong with this but you are pretty much summing the important part which is that no one seems to care that due process and habeas corpus is being eroded. This has been happening since post 9/11.

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03-07-2013, 08:52 AM
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Troy McClure
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Originally Posted by PricePkPatch View Post
I thought preventing a single person from dominating the whole policymaking process was the point of democratic institutions?
He didn't prevent anything. He delayed it a bit.

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03-07-2013, 08:54 AM
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Morris Wanchuk
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I wonder what this did for CSPAN 2's ratings

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03-07-2013, 09:16 AM
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Vyacheslav
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Originally Posted by Troy McClure View Post
He didn't prevent anything. He delayed it a bit.
What's the difference? While he was actively delaying, he was preventing. Just because it comes to an end doesn't mean it wasn't a case of preventing.

A delay is just a prevention that has come to an end.

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03-07-2013, 09:38 AM
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Troy McClure
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What's the difference? While he was actively delaying, he was preventing. Just because it comes to an end doesn't mean it wasn't a case of preventing.

A delay is just a prevention that has come to an end.
We've been waiting for a confirmation hearing for well over a month. That the hearing took an extra 11 hours is not a delay that bothers me.

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03-07-2013, 10:12 AM
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Wow, I thought all you liberals would be on his side on this issue, I guess civil liberties is not as an important issue as the left as always claimed it is.

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