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Imagine if Prime Lindros played in this era...

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Old
03-01-2013, 11:56 PM
  #51
redbull
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Originally Posted by PhillyBluesFan View Post
What????? If Lindros played today where forwards weren't able to grab him on the forecheck he would literally kill defensemen and would be 2x as dominant
Yup.

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Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
No, he wouldn't get 2000 points. One player has done that and it's Gretzky at 2857. Messier never did it. Howe never did it. Jagr won't do it either. If Jagr won't do it than Lindros wouldn't have either. You really think Lindros averages 100 points a year for 20 seasons? Not a chance.

Anyway, I think Lindros would still dominate today. He only retired in 2007 although he wasn't the Lindros we remember like from before 2000.

One thing about Lindros was that he was the best package of size and skill we've ever seen. He used both tools well. I just don't think he always had his head screwed on right though. If he's healthy I think he is the same type of player that he was in his prime, but would he have learned to skate with his head up by now? If not, he'd still be toast in the NHL and would have a stream of injuries.
Agree with this. Lindros was a great scorer but it was the combination of skill and pure power that was deadly. I don't think he would have scored much more than Sid/Malkin/Stamkos even if healthy but he'd have hurt a lot of defensemen, that's for sure.

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03-02-2013, 01:23 AM
  #52
Wrath
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Lets put it this way, he put up 115 points in the beginning of the DPE which has similar league-wide scoring to nowadays. So I find it implausible that he'd score less points with the rule changes/lack of clutching and grabbing.

If he could stay healthy for 70+ games per season and his prime was in todays NHL he'd still be putting up plenty of 100+ points per season, all while easily being the most physical player in all of hockey.




Once again though, and as always with Lindros. His greatness hinges on his ability to stay healthy, which I seriously doubt with his playstyle.

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03-02-2013, 02:08 AM
  #53
MadLuke
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Originally Posted by Wrath View Post
Lets put it this way, he put up 115 points in the beginning of the DPE which has similar league-wide scoring to nowadays.
95-96 was not the DPE yet, 1 goal a game more than today and 19 player with 95 points or more.

The Panthers beating the pens in the playoff was a little bit the start of the dpe.

Lack of clutching and grabbing could be not that good for Lindros because those strategy was not great againts him. So team playing defensive system not using those could be a better fit against him (or not worst at least).

I see him having those 100+ seasons nowaday, but not an higher ppg than in high scoring year like 94/95 and 95/96, probably a little bit worse ppg today.

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03-02-2013, 09:36 AM
  #54
Big Phil
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Originally Posted by redbull View Post
Agree with this. Lindros was a great scorer but it was the combination of skill and pure power that was deadly. I don't think he would have scored much more than Sid/Malkin/Stamkos even if healthy but he'd have hurt a lot of defensemen, that's for sure.
Right. I think we have to look at it in context too. At the time Lindros was scoring similar to what Kariya, Forsberg, Sakic, Selanne were doing. Jagr eventually became part of his own exclusive group, but the rest of the players weren't much worse offensively, if at all, than Lindros. That's a group that is similar to Crosby/Stamkos/Malkin.

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03-02-2013, 02:55 PM
  #55
Lafleurs Guy
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He'd dominate just like he did in the 90s and he'd still get creamed at some point. He's like Achilles... invincible but with a fatal flaw.

Just did not learn to keep his head up.

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03-02-2013, 03:52 PM
  #56
vadim sharifijanov
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Originally Posted by Big Phil View Post
Right. I think we have to look at it in context too. At the time Lindros was scoring similar to what Kariya, Forsberg, Sakic, Selanne were doing. Jagr eventually became part of his own exclusive group, but the rest of the players weren't much worse offensively, if at all, than Lindros. That's a group that is similar to Crosby/Stamkos/Malkin.
there's a small window, from '95 to '97, where lindros is outscoring everyone but mario and jagr if you count points per game and not total points. in that span francis was close one year but in those three years lindros was outscoring kariya, selanne, sakic, and forsberg by between .10 and .20 percent on a per game basis. that's 8-16 points over a full season.

after the '97 season, he falls back to the pack. but that was after his first really serious injuries, right? i think it was his groin beginning in '97?

so if we hypothesize that a different era might have saved lindros some wear and tear, because he wouldn't be allowed to run around like a bull in a china shop due to the new rules, i can see the lindros of his '95-'97 form lasting longer and being on a higher plane than crosby, malkin, ovechkin, and stamkos except in their respective career years. it's obviously extremely speculative that lindros would have the brain to tone down his reckless playing style in the face of a crackdown on charging (bertuzzi, for instance, was never able to adapt once refs started cracking down on his "pushing off" move in the crease on power plays). but without injuries and the first slowing down of his offensive game after '97, i think he was better than anyone currently in the game.

that of course assumes that prime jagr would be winning the art ross every year over crosby, malkin, et al. too, but i'd be curious to hear arguments to the contrary. to my eyes, crosby's absolute best is around where jagr's best is, but crosby hasn't been able to put together a full season at that level. malkin, ovechkin, and stamkos, i think, aren't on prime jagr's level except maybe in a career year.

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03-02-2013, 03:57 PM
  #57
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He probably picked up that habit when he was a kid 6" and 30lbs bigger than everyone.Was fearless because nobody could touch him.

Come NHL time it's almost a players main goal in the game to take the biggest guy.

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03-02-2013, 04:09 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Lindros was an excellent skater. The reason he could be so dominant compared to a Neely, Tkachuk, Shanahan, Stevens, etc. was because he not only had all of the same physical dominance and goal scoring tools, he was an excellent playmaker (one of the best in the league) and he was a very good skater. He wasn't Fedorov, but against most defenses they wouldn't be able to stop his speed OR power.

Fedorov is a guy I'd really like to see in today's era. Also prime Jagr. Those two had serious wheels, and physical power to push off any opposing defenseman while easily maintaining puck control with one hand. Those guys would truly dominate.



Not so sure about that. Lindros played when guys were allowed to basically do whatever they wanted to stop you from scoring, and still scored at an insane pace. Without defensemen hanging off of him, what kinds of numbers could he hit?

For that matter, that last sentence can be applied to Mario Lemieux also.

This is exactly why I'd be more interested to have been able to see guys that COULDN'T bull through defense in the DPE have a shot at the new rules. Bure, Palffy, Kariya, Selanne, Ray Whitney even.

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03-02-2013, 04:21 PM
  #59
vadim sharifijanov
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tombombadil View Post
This is exactly why I'd be more interested to have been able to see guys that COULDN'T bull through defense in the DPE have a shot at the new rules. Bure, Palffy, Kariya, Selanne, Ray Whitney even.
i don't know how much of an advantage guys like bure, kariya, or selanne would have. those guys had such ridiculous speed that i don't think the era really held them back much if at all, relative to their peers. i think they dominate the current era about the same as the previous one. same with bondra.

prime whitney, though, is definitely a guy who might have torn up the league post-lockout. little shifty guys like that, without that high end speed: steve sullivan or cliff ronning... what could they have done in this era?

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03-03-2013, 08:46 PM
  #60
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I love the comments about lindros wouldn't benefit from the new NHL because he could just bulldoze through the clutching and holding anyway... Can you imagine what he would be capable of if none of that was allowed? In his prime in the dead puck era he had his way with defenders, he looked like a man playing with pee wee kids, and this was when hooking, grabbing, hugging, pinning were ok..

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03-03-2013, 09:27 PM
  #61
tjcurrie
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The changes in the game are a bit overplayed.

Sure there's different rules and all, but Lindros had ALL the tools and I don't care what era it is, a guy with that much size and talent is going to dominate. Period.

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03-07-2013, 03:40 PM
  #62
Mad Max
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Lindros never showed any signs of keeping his head up. Ask his brother, Brett. All it takes is one hit to the head.

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03-07-2013, 04:47 PM
  #63
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Lindros would be the best player in the game if he played today. I can't imagine what he would do if players weren't allowed to hang all over him to try and stop him.

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