HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Notices

The All-Purpose Goaltending Thread #8

View Poll Results: Should we use an amnesty buyout on Bryz?
Hell Yes! 65 72.22%
Hell No! 25 27.78%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-08-2013, 01:11 PM
  #551
zarley zelepukin
Registered User
 
zarley zelepukin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Norristown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,589
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
You clearly don't understand, they don't make stats to show how bad our defense is. Forget about all of the studies that show shot quality is pretty constant from team to team over the course of an NHL season, forget the fact that shots on goal and scoring chances have a high correlation and that scoring chances have a high correlation to goal-scoring, you need to throw all the stats out the window.

The fact of the matter is that the Flyers defense is a statistical anomaly. It's probably the worst defense ever assembled in the history of hockey at any level, NHL, AHL, ECHL, OHL, QMJHL, Pee-Wee, etc. They give up more shots from prime goal-scoring areas than any other team has ever given up. In fact, there's some teams that give up less prime goal scoring opportunities in 10 years than the Flyers have thus far in this one lockout shortened season. On any other team in the NHL, Ilya Bryzgalov is posting at minimum a .930 save %. More than likely it'd be closer to .970, maybe even 1.000. The point is, Ilya Bryzgalov is clearly the MVP of the Flyers and to be honest, he's easily #1 on my list of Vezina candidates. He'd probably be #1 on my Hart Trophy candidates list too if it weren't for this historically bad defense costing us all of these games.
So you're saying there's no chance that the data compiled over a period of a couple years (I believe) and looking at 30 teams doesn't apply in this instance to one team over about 25 games? Doesn't that qualify as a pretty small sample?

Is there a site that keeps track of scoring chances? I realize that they generally correspond with shots on goal, which makes sense. But I imagine the Flyers games this season are not a significant sample size to be sure that's happening. I'd just like to see the scoring chance numbers but can't seem to find them.

zarley zelepukin is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:16 PM
  #552
RJ8812
Gunner Stahl #9
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 24,308
vCash: 769
Bob was probably the future in net....if he wasnt rushed to the NHL so quickly and outsted because we signed Bryz to a career contract. That year after the 2010 run was when Jeff Carter should have been moved for a goalie (yes, I know that would mean we wouldn't have Couturier/Voracek). Carter had a lot of value. He was expendable with Giroux coming into his own and could have brought in a #1 goalie while we also had Bob waiting in the wings. Wasn't Halak available that summer? Habs needed size down the middle and we needed a goalie in net. We were the perfect trading partners.

I think that could have worked out, but since we ended up losing Pronger, we would still be ****ed, but at least we wouldn't have traded away our up-and-coming goalie to make room for Bryz. I'm not saying Bryz sucks. He's in a pretty ****** situation right now and is signed to a terrible contract, but if Homer was smart, Bryz would never have been signed to play for this team and Bob would still be on this team

RJ8812 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:20 PM
  #553
dawkins121
Registered User
 
dawkins121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,408
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
using the argument that he stepped up & bailed them out , like everybody here wants to see around here, is "pretty low" ?
OK, i get it: pointing out that he does well is "pretty low" to some around here.

ok, whatever. have a nice rest of the season.
No, it's pretty low to argue that he had a good game based on one PK when he was clearly average or worse for the rest of it. If Bryz had actually "stepped up and bailed them out" then he wouldn't have let up 4 goals in two periods. When good goalies step up and bail their team out, their team usually wins.

dawkins121 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:33 PM
  #554
Bernie Parent 1974
Registered User
 
Bernie Parent 1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 3,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dawkins121 View Post
No, it's pretty low to argue that he had a good game based on one PK when he was clearly average or worse for the rest of it. If Bryz had actually "stepped up and bailed them out" then he wouldn't have let up 4 goals in two periods. When good goalies step up and bail their team out, their team usually wins.

again: the '4 goals and we lost = bad goalie' Negadelphia theory.
which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

because of the 9 goals last night, i find only 1 was a "bad goal" [clearly the goalie's fault] : Kimmo's.

Bernie Parent 1974 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:38 PM
  #555
CanadianFlyer88
Moderator
Knublin' PPs
 
CanadianFlyer88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Van City
Posts: 13,948
vCash: 955
76 goalies have played time in the NHL this year. Bryz ranks 50th in save percentage.

How can you possibly defend him as an overall strong performing goaltender at this point?

He had a great start to the season; regardless of the excuses, his play has been terrible for weeks.

__________________
I deride your truth handling abilities
CanadianFlyer88 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:39 PM
  #556
zarley zelepukin
Registered User
 
zarley zelepukin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Norristown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,589
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
again: the '4 goals and we lost = bad goalie' Negadelphia theory.
which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

because of the 9 goals last night, i find only 1 was a "bad goal" [clearly the goalie's fault] : Kimmo's.
I think two he had basically no shot with (the two that bounced off our d-men). The Dupuis goal was maybe preventable if he stayed upright the whole time, but clearly more about the defense not protecting the area around the net. The Kennedy goal he obviously didn't see, but I think he could have done a better job of finding it. I'm pretty sure he saw the pass going into the middle of the ice, so I think he could have Kennedy shooting by looking around the screen in front.

zarley zelepukin is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 01:54 PM
  #557
Bernie Parent 1974
Registered User
 
Bernie Parent 1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 3,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
76 goalies have played time in the NHL this year. Bryz ranks 50th in save percentage.
which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

because of the 9 goals last night, i find only 1 was a "bad goal" [clearly the goalie's fault] : Kimmo's.

Bernie Parent 1974 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:05 PM
  #558
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
Wing or Retire!
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alexandria
Country: Liberia
Posts: 36,745
vCash: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

because of the 9 goals last night, i find only 1 was a "bad goal" [clearly the goalie's fault] : Kimmo's.
Post it all you want, it doesn't change the fact that, once again, Bryz failed to make a big save at a big time and it cost the team at least a point. One big save is all that's needed. He hasn't been keeping the team in games for quite a while now.

__________________
Down in the basement, I've got a Craftsman lathe. Show it to the children when they misbehave.
Beef Invictus is online now  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:12 PM
  #559
Bernie Parent 1974
Registered User
 
Bernie Parent 1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 3,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zarley zelepukin View Post
The Dupuis goal was maybe preventable if he stayed upright the whole time, but clearly more about the defense not protecting the area around the net.
ok, so that's 3 goals not on Bryz.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zarley zelepukin View Post
The Kennedy goal he obviously didn't see, but I think he could have done a better job of finding it.
i'm sorry .. he made A GREAT POKE CHECK [for those who say he never does] and never saw Kennedy:



if you want to blame him for not being able to see him through 1 to 3 players, we will just havta disagree

Bernie Parent 1974 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:14 PM
  #560
SolidSnakeUS
Registered User
 
SolidSnakeUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pipersville, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
ok, so that's 3 goals not on Bryz.


i'm sorry .. he made A GREAT POKE CHECK [for those who say he never does] and never saw Kennedy:



if you want to blame him for not being able to see him through 1 to 3 players, we will just havta disagree
And 2 of them being Flyers players no less.

SolidSnakeUS is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:16 PM
  #561
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
Wing or Retire!
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alexandria
Country: Liberia
Posts: 36,745
vCash: 156
I see we're back to dissecting every single minute detail of every single goal to proclaim that Bryz isn't at fault, while ignoring the big picture.

Beef Invictus is online now  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:17 PM
  #562
SolidSnakeUS
Registered User
 
SolidSnakeUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pipersville, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I see we're back to dissecting every single minute detail of every single goal to proclaim that Bryz isn't at fault, while ignoring the big picture.
That the team can't win and help him out at the same time?

SolidSnakeUS is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:18 PM
  #563
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
Wing or Retire!
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alexandria
Country: Liberia
Posts: 36,745
vCash: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
That the team can't win and help him out at the same time?
That he can't help out the team if they aren't winning. It's rare that he does.

Beef Invictus is online now  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:19 PM
  #564
bennysflyers16
Registered User
 
bennysflyers16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 16,528
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I see we're back to dissecting every single minute detail of every single goal to proclaim that Bryz isn't at fault, while ignoring the big picture.
.899 svptg and 2.9 GAA and under 10 goals in 22 games to blame on him ??????

Why do we keep trying ?

bennysflyers16 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:21 PM
  #565
bennysflyers16
Registered User
 
bennysflyers16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 16,528
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
That the team can't win and help him out at the same time?
The team was bad, but did their part for 20 mins and scored 4 goals, that should of been enough for 1 point.

But give Bryz another pass and **** on team cause they didnt once again score 6 goals.

bennysflyers16 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:25 PM
  #566
SolidSnakeUS
Registered User
 
SolidSnakeUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Pipersville, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 29,235
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
That he can't help out the team if they aren't winning. It's rare that he does.
With how disoriented and how often the Flyers turn over pucks in their own zone this season, it's really not that surprising for this season. Bryz has let some really weak goals go through this year, I will give you that. But I feel that it hasn't been as much as Bryz causing us to lose this year, as it is more the consistency of the whole team around him has become a huge factor. Some days (hell, some periods), the Flyers just lose interest and get stuck in their own zone and cough up the puck constantly.

SolidSnakeUS is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:25 PM
  #567
CanadianFlyer88
Moderator
Knublin' PPs
 
CanadianFlyer88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Van City
Posts: 13,948
vCash: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

because of the 9 goals last night, i find only 1 was a "bad goal" [clearly the goalie's fault] : Kimmo's.
He's paid to stop pucks. This season he stops less than 9 of every 10 that come his way (and even he he made $500K, a sub-0.500 save percentage sucks).

Picking out random saves, like a poke check that finally worked, doesn't make up for the fact that his entire body of work this season has been unacceptable.

You can pick a scapegoat on all indvidual plays, but when a cumulative total shows a disturbing trend, you can't ignore the stats.

CanadianFlyer88 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:26 PM
  #568
Schenn Bros Pizza*
All-Star
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 776
vCash: 500
We are not going to buy out Bryz so let's get a top dman and a capable backup FINALLY. I don't know wth is taking them so long. We've had this problem since Pronger got hurt. We tried to get Weber but was there no plan B?

Schenn Bros Pizza* is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:26 PM
  #569
Bernie Parent 1974
Registered User
 
Bernie Parent 1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 3,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
The team was bad, but did their part for 20 mins and scored 4 goals, that should of been enough for 1 point.
bingo !!! there you go.

give them a pass, when they got outworked for 2/3 of the game, shot 1 puck into our net & allowed 2 other guys to score undefended. brilliant !

only in Philly

Bernie Parent 1974 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:26 PM
  #570
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
 
LegionOfDoom91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 13,283
vCash: 500
We can sit here going back and forth all day. Fact is Bryz needs to be better. An .899 save percentage is unacceptable for a guy being paid top 5 money for his position.

LegionOfDoom91 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:27 PM
  #571
CanadianFlyer88
Moderator
Knublin' PPs
 
CanadianFlyer88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Van City
Posts: 13,948
vCash: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schenn Bros Pizza View Post
We are not going to buy out Bryz so let's get a top dman and a capable backup FINALLY. I don't know wth is taking them so long. We've had this problem since Pronger got hurt.
There's a pretty good chance they buy out Bryz, if only due to the albatross contract.

CanadianFlyer88 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:27 PM
  #572
BillDineen
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2,653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
He's paid to stop pucks. This season he stops less than 9 of every 10 that come his way (and even he he made $500K, a sub-0.500 save percentage sucks).

Picking out random saves, like a poke check that finally worked, doesn't make up for the fact that his entire body of work this season has been unacceptable.

You can pick a scapegoat on all indvidual plays, but when a cumulative total shows a disturbing trend, you can't ignore the stats.
You can't ignore the stats either. He has been defending Bryz non stop in this thread approaching 8000 posts! He is not going to give up now!

BillDineen is online now  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:28 PM
  #573
CanadianFlyer88
Moderator
Knublin' PPs
 
CanadianFlyer88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Van City
Posts: 13,948
vCash: 955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
bingo !!! there you go.

give them a pass, when they got outworked for 2/3 of the game, shot 1 puck into our net & allowed 2 other guys to score undefended. brilliant !

only in Philly
The team is bad. So is Bryz.

It's not a mutually exclusive scenario.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDineen View Post
You can't ignore the stats either. He has been defending Bryz non stop in this thread approaching 8000 posts! He is not going to give up now!


Fair enough.

CanadianFlyer88 is offline  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:32 PM
  #574
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
Wing or Retire!
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Alexandria
Country: Liberia
Posts: 36,745
vCash: 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bennysflyers16 View Post
.899 svptg and 2.9 GAA and under 10 goals in 22 games to blame on him ??????

Why do we keep trying ?
I tried to give him every benefit of the doubt for as long as I could, but it's too much at this point. It's been too much for over a week.

Bryz has played about 10 months worth of hockey for the Flyers. He has been consistently good for 1.5 months. So...about 6 weeks out of 40. Excuse the deafening roar of my underwhelmedness.

Beef Invictus is online now  
Old
03-08-2013, 02:32 PM
  #575
Bernie Parent 1974
Registered User
 
Bernie Parent 1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Country: United States
Posts: 3,181
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
He's paid to stop pucks.
the d is paid to block shots, not make turnovers, not give up breakaways ---- the offense is paid to block shots, not make turnovers, not give up breakaways & score goals & not miss wide open nets ...... yea, we know all that .....

so, which goals vs Bryz were "bad goals" vs PITT ? please tell me which ones were his fault ?

surely this is an easy question.

Bernie Parent 1974 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:26 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.