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2013 World Baseball Classic: March 2–19

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Old
03-08-2013, 09:54 PM
  #76
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Rooting for AGone and Luis Cruz. Just wish they weren't playing for Mexico. Pathetic USA support in this game. Invaded by Mexicans.

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03-08-2013, 11:02 PM
  #77
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5-1 Mexico.

I don't understand this tournament.

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03-08-2013, 11:06 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Marc the Habs Fan View Post
5-1 Mexico.

I don't understand this tournament.
Vinnie Pistano is pitching for team USA. There's not much to get. It's like the Spengler Cup.

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03-08-2013, 11:14 PM
  #79
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US ain't doing too bad given it's a road game.

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03-08-2013, 11:35 PM
  #80
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Was Hosmer really the best 1B that they could get to participate? I mean, I'm still kind of high on the guy..but he was dog crap last year.

And no pitchers wanted to participate? The US easily has the best top pitchers and depth out of anyone, and yet none of our best pitchers are participating.

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03-08-2013, 11:56 PM
  #81
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It's not the lack of pitching that pisses me off. Our hitters have completely made these Mexican pitchers look elite. Yeah, they have Gallardo, but there's no excuse for getting shut down like this by a bunch of mediocre pitchers. Not when you still have all-star hitters like Wright, Mauer, Phillips, and Braun.

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03-09-2013, 12:18 AM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Rafa Nadal View Post
It's not the lack of pitching that pisses me off. Our hitters have completely made these Mexican pitchers look elite. Yeah, they have Gallardo, but there's no excuse for getting shut down like this by a bunch of mediocre pitchers. Not when you still have all-star hitters like Wright, Mauer, Phillips, and Braun.
Very true, but when you consider the nature of baseball, it's normal for even the best to have a bad day at the plate - even against bad pitchers. Which is why baseball is really a sport that needs to be played in a series, tough to judge anyone or draw conclusions from one game.

And with the talent pool the USA has, it's pretty unbelievable that 2 of the hitters in our lineup are guys that batted .230 in the majors last year.

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03-09-2013, 12:20 AM
  #83
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Wow, Garcia is severely overweight.

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03-09-2013, 01:38 AM
  #84
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Originally Posted by DisgruntledHawkFan View Post
Vinnie Pistano is pitching for team USA. There's not much to get. It's like the Spengler Cup.
Except that all players are available for selection and there are no club teams. It's pretty lame to make excuses for why we suck by devaluing the tournament.

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03-09-2013, 01:39 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Rafa Nadal View Post
Italia just killing Canada. I know he Italian team is mostly filled with Italian Americans, but How popular is baseball in Italy?
Frankly they are far and away the best European (counting only the European Dutch players) program out there.

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03-09-2013, 02:08 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Except that all players are available for selection and there are no club teams. It's pretty lame to make excuses for why we suck by devaluing the tournament.
We suck because our best players don't play. Our own players devalue you the tournament. Americans just don't care about any sports tourney we send our B teams to (or G team based on this roster), and who can blame them. Watching our scrubs isn't fun or exciting. Not the fans fault no one here cares. That's on the players.

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03-09-2013, 02:08 AM
  #87
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I believe all but two of the batters on team Italy that played today were all born and raised in North America.

a US vs Italy matchup would basically be Americans vs Americans

The whole tournament just seems so flawed.

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03-09-2013, 02:20 AM
  #88
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Switch pitcher Pat Venditte plays for Italy. Didn't realize that, although he is limited to lefty only this tourney because he's recovering from a right shoulder injury. Saw him pitch in A-ball. Just mindblowingly cool to see considering I pitched in HS.

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03-09-2013, 02:58 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Frankly they are far and away the best European (counting only the European Dutch players) program out there.
Wait, if you're counting only the European Dutch players, why would you count the Italian Americans who appear to be making up almost the entire team?

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03-09-2013, 03:28 AM
  #90
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Originally Posted by DisgruntledHawkFan View Post
Vinnie Pistano is pitching for team USA. There's not much to get. It's like the Spengler Cup.
I've literally never heard of him before this post.

I'd say it's more like the World Championships than the Spengler Cup (it's the B roster filled with apathy and a few C and D squad players instead of the straight D squad roster)...but it's clear that Major League issues take precedent over the tournament and that's inevitably going to hurt the American team more than the others. That and I'm assuming the bulk of Americans don't feel the need to defend our status as the world's best baseball country.

A tournament held in March will never properly say that Mexico, a country with one position player starting in the Majors, is better at baseball than America is. Especially when that same team lost to Italy, a team filled almost exclusively with Americans of Italian heritage, the day before. Iceland beat Italy in soccer not too long ago...

I just don't see any way that this tournament is ever going to be fully realized. You can't play the sport out of season (and Spring Training is effectively out of season because you have pitchers stuck to a pitch limit), but the schedule doesn't allow for a mid-season break to be possible, either. As it stands you have players backing out on the slightest reason and star players declining out of sheer indifference.

I made a semi-joke earlier about half of the Pirates going to the tournament not being from the country they're representing...and that wound up being true since there's only 4 Pirates at the tournament after players declined for every reason ranging from fighting for an outside shot at a roster spot (Iván De Jesus, Jr. was set to be on the Puerto Rico squad) to not wanting to catch this early in Spring Training (Martin...who promptly got hurt after and hasn't actually caught for the Pirates yet either) and covering an injury or two (Ali Solis was to catch for Mexico, but back spasms took him out).

That leaves the Pirates sending just Wandy Rodriguez (legitimate, Dominican Republic), Jason Grilli (of Royal Oak, Michigan playing for Italy), Jameson Taillon (born in Florida, raised in Texas, and never stepped foot in Canada until this past year...oh, and he's represented Team USA before...but at least he's a dual-citizen because his parents are Canadian...but that still bugs me since he never actually spent any time there), and Chris Leroux...who only semi-counts since he's making a start for Team Canada tomorrow (born in Montréal) and then immediately returning to Bradenton to fight for a bullpen spot.

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Old
03-09-2013, 03:33 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Have My Baby Pierre View Post
I believe all but two of the batters on team Italy that played today were all born and raised in North America.

a US vs Italy matchup would basically be Americans vs Americans

The whole tournament just seems so flawed.
Haha, even the US manager is Italian.

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03-09-2013, 03:34 AM
  #92
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Wait, if you're counting only the European Dutch players, why would you count the Italian Americans who appear to be making up almost the entire team?
I wasn't. I was counting the Italian players who have won the last two European titles, even facing Dutch teams filled with Caribbean players.

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03-09-2013, 03:35 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Have My Baby Pierre View Post
I believe all but two of the batters on team Italy that played today were all born and raised in North America.

a US vs Italy matchup would basically be Americans vs Americans

The whole tournament just seems so flawed.
One change they need to make is that you must be a citizen of the country you play for. This seems an obvious issue.

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03-09-2013, 03:37 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by visor wearing goon View Post
We suck because our best players don't play. Our own players devalue you the tournament. Americans just don't care about any sports tourney we send our B teams to (or G team based on this roster), and who can blame them. Watching our scrubs isn't fun or exciting. Not the fans fault no one here cares. That's on the players.
Great, so we suck and we try to find excuses for why it happens. It's not the tournament, it's us. This tournament is extremely popular in the rest of the world. Japan's last game drew nearly a third of all TV sets in the country. It's our loss.

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03-09-2013, 03:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
I've literally never heard of him before this post.

I'd say it's more like the World Championships than the Spengler Cup (it's the B roster filled with apathy and a few C and D squad players instead of the straight D squad roster)...but it's clear that Major League issues take precedent over the tournament and that's inevitably going to hurt the American team more than the others. That and I'm assuming the bulk of Americans don't feel the need to defend our status as the world's best baseball country.

A tournament held in March will never properly say that Mexico, a country with one position player starting in the Majors, is better at baseball than America is. Especially when that same team lost to Italy, a team filled almost exclusively with Americans of Italian heritage, the day before. Iceland beat Italy in soccer not too long ago...

I just don't see any way that this tournament is ever going to be fully realized. You can't play the sport out of season (and Spring Training is effectively out of season because you have pitchers stuck to a pitch limit), but the schedule doesn't allow for a mid-season break to be possible, either. As it stands you have players backing out on the slightest reason and star players declining out of sheer indifference.

I made a semi-joke earlier about half of the Pirates going to the tournament not being from the country they're representing...and that wound up being true since there's only 4 Pirates at the tournament after players declined for every reason ranging from fighting for an outside shot at a roster spot (Iván De Jesus, Jr. was set to be on the Puerto Rico squad) to not wanting to catch this early in Spring Training (Martin...who promptly got hurt after and hasn't actually caught for the Pirates yet either) and covering an injury or two (Ali Solis was to catch for Mexico, but back spasms took him out).

That leaves the Pirates sending just Wandy Rodriguez (legitimate, Dominican Republic), Jason Grilli (of Royal Oak, Michigan playing for Italy), Jameson Taillon (born in Florida, raised in Texas, and never stepped foot in Canada until this past year...oh, and he's represented Team USA before...but at least he's a dual-citizen because his parents are Canadian...but that still bugs me since he never actually spent any time there), and Chris Leroux...who only semi-counts since he's making a start for Team Canada tomorrow (born in Montréal) and then immediately returning to Bradenton to fight for a bullpen spot.

I don't think international sports are for you. The US features Alex Galchenyuk and Jason Pominville in hockey. Danny Williams and Jermaine Jones in soccer. It's the nature of the global world, very few people have clean cut nationality situations.

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03-09-2013, 04:01 AM
  #96
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I don't think international sports are for you. The US features Alex Galchenyuk and Jason Pominville in hockey. Danny Williams and Jermaine Jones in soccer. It's the nature of the global world, very few people have clean cut nationality situations.
Most of those guys didn't step foot in their national team's country for the first time when named to their national team.

Hell, one of my favorite soccer players is in a similar situation - Aron Jóhannsson still hasn't declared for a national team (though he's played for Iceland U21) despite being eligible for both Iceland and the US...but at least he was actually born in this country. Taillon was born in Winter Haven, Florida.

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Originally Posted by Xokkeu View Post
Great, so we suck and we try to find excuses for why it happens. It's not the tournament, it's us. This tournament is extremely popular in the rest of the world. Japan's last game drew nearly a third of all TV sets in the country. It's our loss.
That proves it's popular in Japan...not 'the rest of the world'.


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03-09-2013, 04:15 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Big McLargehuge View Post
Most of those guys didn't step foot in their national team's country for the first time when named to their national team.

Hell, one of my favorite soccer players is in a similar situation - Aron Jóhannsson still hasn't declared for a national team (though he's played for Iceland U21) despite being eligible for both Iceland and the US...but at least he was actually born in this country. Taillon was born in Winter Haven, Florida.



That proves it's popular in Japan...not 'the rest of the world'.
Aron Johanssen has much less of a connection to the US than Taillon does to Canada. Taillon has Canadian parents, whereas Johansson was simply born in the US as more of a fluke than anything. As I said, this tournament needs a rule that you must be a citizen of the country you are playing for and that's it. Of course if you look back at the early years of international play in soccer and hockey, you see a lot worse than this.


The 2009 final was seen in nearly 50% of South Korean households. The largest attendance ever at a baseball game in Taiwan was a WBC game. Hugo Chavez used to speak personally to the Venezuelan manager before games. You are truly fooling yourself if you think this tournament is not popular in the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Japan, Korea and elsewhere.

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03-09-2013, 04:23 AM
  #98
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You are truly fooling yourself if you think this tournament is not popular in the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Japan, Korea and elsewhere.
And you are truly fooling yourself if you think that the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Japan, and Korea represent 'the rest of the world'.

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03-09-2013, 04:39 AM
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And you are truly fooling yourself if you think that the Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Japan, and Korea represent 'the rest of the world'.
Oh jeez. It's a baseball tournament. It's popular in countries that like baseball. The same way you say the world cares about Olympic hockey, when we all know that Nigeria or Iraq don't give a hoot.

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03-09-2013, 04:51 AM
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Oh jeez. It's a baseball tournament. It's popular in countries that like baseball. The same way you say the world cares about Olympic hockey, when we all know that Nigeria or Iraq don't give a hoot.
Well I wouldn't say the world cares about Olympic Hockey, so there's our fundamental disagreement

Hell, I have a problem when people say America is the only large country that doesn't care about soccer...when Brazil is the only member of the 150+ million population club that actually has a soccer team that could regularly beat anyone in the top 75 FIFA rankings. China (FIFA #96), India (167), Indonesia (163), Pakistan (180), and Bangladesh (169) are terrible at the sport.


It's obvious that there is a small handful of countries that do care about this tournament (the Asian powerhouses and the Dominican Republic)...but that's about it. Iván De Jesus, Jr. backed out of Team Puerto Rico because he wanted to improve his chances of making the Pirates from 4% to 5%. Russell Martin backed out of team Canada because he didn't want to play his natural position this early in the Spring. Andrew McCutchen (USA) and José Tábata (Venezuela) outright declined their invitations. I see why the countries that do care about this tournament care - just why I see why the countries that see the World Championships as being a big deal care...but as an American this tournament, just like the World Championships, means nothing to me.


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