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The Defenseman Acquisition Thread | Part I: Creating a Defense that is "no Soff"

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Old
03-10-2013, 09:47 AM
  #251
Darth Vitale
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEKaki View Post
I know that Umberger has a high contract but if we find a way to trade Orpik or Martin in the package for Johnson, we can ask for Umberger in the trade. Clutch in the playoffs
Have you watched Jack Johnson over his career? He would not make our defense tougher, he would make it worse. He is a liability in every sense of the word. The only D we'd want from CBJ are stay-at-home types. If Shero wastes good assets on Jack Johnson I will be lose a lot of faith in the guy because "JJ" is about as overrated as they come. Plus we have two guys in the system who will likely end up being better PPQB than he has managed to become to this point in his career.

Jack Johnson makes no sense. If we wanted a rental QB, I'd rather go with Gonch despite his age and slowness. Trading for Johnson would be like trading for Ryan Whitney. Disappoint is guaranteed.

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03-10-2013, 09:57 AM
  #252
Ogrezilla
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JJ is a good player imo. He is the complete opposite of what this team is lacking though.

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Old
03-10-2013, 10:20 AM
  #253
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
JJ is a good player imo. He is the complete opposite of what this team is lacking though.
He's a *talented* player with a lot of offensive upside that has rarely been realized, and washed out of an LA team that was loaded with talented guys to play with. His defense is indefensible in any case, so as you say, the opposite of what we need.

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03-10-2013, 10:29 AM
  #254
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
He's a *talented* player with a lot of offensive upside that has rarely been realized, and washed out of an LA team that was loaded with talented guys to play with. His defense is indefensible in any case, so as you say, the opposite of what we need.
I don't think I agree with that. It's not great, but its not terrible.

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Old
03-10-2013, 10:49 AM
  #255
Matt Damon
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What about a deal like this:

To LA

Brooks Orpik

To Pit

Rob Scuderi (UFA)
Jordan Nolan


LA needs Scuderi for the play-offs as well, but with a veteran defenseman coming back in Orpik who is signed through next season It should be very enticing. Scuderi would likely be a rental, but add in Nolan who's a big, fast 4th line energy guy with some 3rd line upside. He hits everything and adds much needed size and toughness to the bottom lines. He'd be a play-off warrior. Only problem is Scuderi is a short term fix to the blueline, but it does add about $2mill in cap space to help land a UFA winger or defenseman if he's not re-signed.

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Old
03-10-2013, 11:04 AM
  #256
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Damon View Post
What about a deal like this:

To LA

Brooks Orpik

To Pit

Rob Scuderi (UFA)
Jordan Nolan


LA needs Scuderi for the play-offs as well, but with a veteran defenseman coming back in Orpik who is signed through next season It should be very enticing. Scuderi would likely be a rental, but add in Nolan who's a big, fast 4th line energy guy with some 3rd line upside. He hits everything and adds much needed size and toughness to the bottom lines. He'd be a play-off warrior. Only problem is Scuderi is a short term fix to the blueline, but it does add about $2mill in cap space to help land a UFA winger or defenseman if he's not re-signed.
I would do this. I doubt they would.

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Old
03-10-2013, 11:30 AM
  #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Damon View Post
What about a deal like this:

To LA

Brooks Orpik

To Pit

Rob Scuderi (UFA)
Jordan Nolan


LA needs Scuderi for the play-offs as well, but with a veteran defenseman coming back in Orpik who is signed through next season It should be very enticing. Scuderi would likely be a rental, but add in Nolan who's a big, fast 4th line energy guy with some 3rd line upside. He hits everything and adds much needed size and toughness to the bottom lines. He'd be a play-off warrior. Only problem is Scuderi is a short term fix to the blueline, but it does add about $2mill in cap space to help land a UFA winger or defenseman if he's not re-signed.
I'm down for a deal like this. I've heard different opinions on how scuds has been playing this year. They can't wait to get Greene and Mitchell back

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Old
03-10-2013, 12:14 PM
  #258
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I don't think we don't need another defenseman. At least not one that will require significant assets. Maybe a veteran stay at home guy for a 3rd round pick or something. But the big assets should go toward adding the top six winger.

IMO, our issues defensively right now aren't because of our 6 guys playing defense (though Orpik has been trash lately). It's a team thing. So adding another defenseman doesn't exactly change the system, or the forwards lack of ability to help out, or the goalies letting in easily saveable goals.

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Old
03-10-2013, 01:22 PM
  #259
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chancellor Vitale View Post
Have you watched Jack Johnson over his career? He would not make our defense tougher, he would make it worse. He is a liability in every sense of the word. The only D we'd want from CBJ are stay-at-home types. If Shero wastes good assets on Jack Johnson I will be lose a lot of faith in the guy because "JJ" is about as overrated as they come. Plus we have two guys in the system who will likely end up being better PPQB than he has managed to become to this point in his career.

Jack Johnson makes no sense. If we wanted a rental QB, I'd rather go with Gonch despite his age and slowness. Trading for Johnson would be like trading for Ryan Whitney. Disappoint is guaranteed.
Have you seen our D lately?
Lyle Odelein would be an upgrade at this point lol

I'm not say JJ will be the savior but playing as a 3-4 would be an upgrade over Orpik and Martin.

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Old
03-10-2013, 01:47 PM
  #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hottubber View Post
I'm down for a deal like this. I've heard different opinions on how scuds has been playing this year. They can't wait to get Greene and Mitchell back
That's not because Scuderi has been bad. It's because Scuderi is their only legit defensive defensemen when both Greene and Mitchell are out. Jake Muzzin has played well with Doughty lately, and Doughty himself has been playing a far more defensive role this season (which is commendable, imo). But they're clearer a better team when they have Scuderi on one pairing, Mitchell on the second and Greene on the third. That's as good as it gets, really.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AEKaki View Post
Have you seen our D lately?
Lyle Odelein would be an upgrade at this point lol

I'm not say JJ will be the savior but playing as a 3-4 would be an upgrade over Orpik and Martin.
I like Jack Johnson but I am with Ogrezilla here. He's the opposite of what this team needs. Unless we're just trying to acquire a guy who gets along with our captain, it makes no sense.

Can we really commit $4.357M for the next FIVE seasons on a No. 3 or 4 defenseman?

As far as I'm concerned, we already have Jack Johnson. Simon Despres. Or maybe it'll be Joe Morrow. Or maybe it'll be Olli Maatta. We need to commit to our top assets. Otherwise, why the bleep do we have them?

The type of defenseman I'd be looking for this deadline is a Douglas Murray, a Ladislav Smid...both potential UFAs and both strictly defensive defensemen who could fill a role here. To a lesser degree, maybe get Hal Gill back or try for a Greg Zanon. Those two have a season left on their deals, making them less appealing to me than Murray or Smid. But they would fill a need, as well.

And if we do acquire a defenseman, we better be moving one out as well. Orpik would be my first choice. Or Niskanen. Martin's cap hit has to go by the summer time, too, so if there's value to move him now, do it.

Jack Johnson just makes no sense for a lot of reasons. And to be honest, it doesn't make much sense for the Jackets to move him, either. He wants to be there. That counts for a lot, imo.

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03-10-2013, 01:57 PM
  #261
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To be honest; I would much rather look into getting Yandle again from Phoenix. I read where they might be interested in moving him to free up assets for Larsen. He would be a much better get than Johnson.

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Old
03-10-2013, 02:07 PM
  #262
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Originally Posted by Saints11 View Post
To be honest; I would much rather look into getting Yandle again from Phoenix. I read where they might be interested in moving him to free up assets for Larsen. He would be a much better get than Johnson.
Why? If we're going after Yandle, then we're moving out Paul Martin or Kris Letang.

Yandle is a puck-moving defenseman and a guy who can quarterback the power play. But he also makes $5.25 million for the next three seasons.

I'd much rather give Morrow an opportunity to see if he can be that player for us. Or Pouliot for that matter.

Besides, isn't PP quarterback well down the list of priorities?

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03-10-2013, 02:12 PM
  #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidney the Kidney View Post
I don't think we don't need another defenseman. At least not one that will require significant assets. Maybe a veteran stay at home guy for a 3rd round pick or something. But the big assets should go toward adding the top six winger.

IMO, our issues defensively right now aren't because of our 6 guys playing defense (though Orpik has been trash lately). It's a team thing. So adding another defenseman doesn't exactly change the system, or the forwards lack of ability to help out, or the goalies letting in easily saveable goals.

I think we need a change of defenseman. If Orpik can change and get better, just like Martin (in my opinion) has gotten better from last year then that would be fine. But each game recently, Orpik seems to get worse and worse.

Yes, why can't Shero address the winger situation as well as the defense by the trade deadline.

Maybe we need to start listing the possibilities in trades for D. I would trade Orpik, Niskanen, or Engelland for the right improvement. We could throw in TK, Glass, and/or picks and/or possibly a prospect for the right trade. Here are some D not mentioned much yet to add to the D list (Murray, Scuderi, Regehr):

Smid (EDM) - top 5 in NHL defenseman in hits AND blocks
Brewer (TBL) - has some size (6'4" 220 lbs), leads Tampa in hits + blocks
Beauchemin (ANA) - top 2 in +/- , leads ANA in SH time on ice and overall TOI
Klein (NSH) - top 20 in NHL defenseman in BLKS + Takeaways, leads NSH in SH TOI
Fraser (TOR) - leads the NHL in defensive +/-, 3rd in NHL defenseman with Hits

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Old
03-10-2013, 02:44 PM
  #264
Ogrezilla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEKaki View Post
Have you seen our D lately?
Lyle Odelein would be an upgrade at this point lol

I'm not say JJ will be the savior but playing as a 3-4 would be an upgrade over Orpik and Martin.
he is not better than Martin. Have you been watching this season?

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03-10-2013, 02:49 PM
  #265
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I love Smid. I've wanted him for a while. Pretty sure he's one of the best Dmen in the history of the NHL.


Source: I devour every episode of "Oil Change"

(but seriously, I really like Smid)

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03-10-2013, 03:02 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by IcedCapp View Post
I love Smid. I've wanted him for a while. Pretty sure he's one of the best Dmen in the history of the NHL.


Source: I devour every episode of "Oil Change"

(but seriously, I really like Smid)
Oiler fans seem confident that they'll be able to re-sign him, but why would he want to stay in that mess? i guess they have the cap-space to overpay.

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Old
03-10-2013, 03:18 PM
  #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEKaki View Post

I'm not say JJ will be the savior but playing as a 3-4 would be an upgrade over Orpik and Martin.
Bat **** crazy. I don't know what else to say, if you think Jack Johnson would be an upgrade over Paul Martin this year. Even Orpik most nights will be better defensively than Johnson. I understand he has name recognition but you don't seem to understand the history behind the name / what he has become vs. what he was predicted to become.

Johnson will not help our defense in terms of giving up fewer goals, period.

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03-10-2013, 03:26 PM
  #268
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I wonder if Shero created some good will with Maloney sending him Michalek back for peanuts. I'd be interested in Morris and Klesla.

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03-10-2013, 03:28 PM
  #269
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If we could flip kennedy for dougie murray I would be a happy camper!

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03-10-2013, 03:28 PM
  #270
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Rusty would be all right, depending on the price.

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03-10-2013, 03:30 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by ObsessedCreative View Post
If we could flip kennedy for dougie murray I would be a happy camper!
I think we'd have to make a side move since we don't need 9 D-Men on the roster.

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03-10-2013, 03:34 PM
  #272
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I think we'd have to make a side move since we don't need 9 D-Men on the roster.
didn't shero say he wants 9-10 NHL d-men ready for the playoffs?

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03-10-2013, 03:36 PM
  #273
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Rusty would be all right, depending on the price.
Both of their contracts expire after next season. Ideal for us.

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03-10-2013, 03:40 PM
  #274
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What are the chances of getting Anaheim to trade with us. Are there any chances of getting Beauchemin? If not, what about Sbisa?

http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=659193

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03-10-2013, 03:47 PM
  #275
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If we could flip kennedy for dougie murray I would be a happy camper!
You do not want Murray. There is a very good reason Sharks fans want to get rid of him.

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