HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

The All-Purpose Goaltending Thread #8

View Poll Results: Should we use an amnesty buyout on Bryz?
Hell Yes! 65 72.22%
Hell No! 25 27.78%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-11-2013, 12:16 PM
  #876
Broad Street Elite
Registered User
 
Broad Street Elite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,517
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Also, it has been shown on BSH and other sites that there is a very, very strong correlation between shot quality and shot quantity...to the point where shots allowed is a very good benchmark for scoring chances allowed. The more shots a team allows, the more scoring chances there are. The Flyers have done a pretty good job of preventing shots, and therefore scoring chances, to the tune of 26.9 SA/G...good for 6th in the league.

Yet they're 24th for GA per game. When all the stats that monitor defensive quality show the team is doing fine, yet loads of goals are going in, that's a goaltender problem.
Does that study differentiate from a PP or ES? I'm curious as to whether PP opportunities tend to be better than those at ES.

Broad Street Elite is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 12:18 PM
  #877
GoneFullHextall
JR=clueless
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 34,982
vCash: 50
Miller had a bad game last night. Between that and Buffalo playing dumb hockey with the stupid penalties they were taken that was the difference. The Flyers didnt play a great game last night. it was a pretty ****** game all around. Someone had to win.

the Flyers PK has been really good since the first half dozen games or so. Special teams lately have been pretty good. 5 on 5? not so much.

GoneFullHextall is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 12:20 PM
  #878
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Does that study differentiate from a PP or ES? I'm curious as to whether PP opportunities tend to be better than those at ES.
I'll repost at some point today; it's somewhere earlier in the thread.

Either way, since the PK is sitting at 11th at 83% it's not like they're giving up tons of goals there.

__________________
Down in the basement, I've got a Craftsman lathe. Show it to the children when they misbehave.
Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:02 PM
  #879
dawkins121
Registered User
 
dawkins121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Also, it has been shown on BSH and other sites that there is a very, very strong correlation between shot quality and shot quantity...to the point where shots allowed is a very good benchmark for scoring chances allowed. The more shots a team allows, the more scoring chances there are. The Flyers have done a pretty good job of preventing shots, and therefore scoring chances, to the tune of 26.9 SA/G...good for 6th in the league.

Yet they're 24th for GA per game. When all the stats that monitor defensive quality show the team is doing fine, yet loads of goals are going in, that's a goaltender problem.
Yeah, all those times the Flyers get chances but can't bury it? It's not because the Flyers are perpetually snakebitten, it's just that we see other teams bury every single good chance they get against us and we wonder why our offense can't score with that consistency.

Even in shootouts, wide open 1 on 1 shots with no defenders, the shooting percentage is only close to 1 in 3. Scoring on good chances isn't as easy as teams make it look against the Flyers and a lot of that falls on the goaltending.

dawkins121 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:09 PM
  #880
FreshPerspective
We don't need one!
 
FreshPerspective's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: Italy
Posts: 11,562
vCash: 500
Bryz was adequate last night. The whole team played mediocre pretty much and Buffalo played like crap..so the Flyers edged out a W...barely! Hardly inspiring hockey on the part of the Flyers

FreshPerspective is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:15 PM
  #881
CSKA1974
Registered User
 
CSKA1974's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Flyerville
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 1,790
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ8812 View Post
the 2 amnesty buy-outs can be used either this summer or next summer. So my guess is if Bryz doesn't turn it around next season, he'll be gone
He has to really turn it around to justify keeping his contract on the cap strapped team. On the other hand, I am not sure that front office will want to throw about $25 mill. down the drain and then pay for another goalie.

CSKA1974 is online now  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:18 PM
  #882
dawkins121
Registered User
 
dawkins121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,435
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
Bryz was adequate last night. The whole team played mediocre pretty much and Buffalo played like crap..so the Flyers edged out a W...barely! Hardly inspiring hockey on the part of the Flyers
The two goals he gave up were both makeable saves, but they weren't necessarily soft, and he made at least one huge momentum save late in the first off a wide open rebound in the slot. If Bryz could consistently make those momentum saves without surrendering soft goals like he did last night, I think a lot of people would feel better about having him in net. But he hasn't, so we don't.

dawkins121 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:22 PM
  #883
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dawkins121 View Post
The two goals he gave up were both makeable saves, but they weren't necessarily soft, and he made at least one huge momentum save late in the first off a wide open rebound in the slot. If Bryz could consistently make those momentum saves without surrendering soft goals like he did last night, I think a lot of people would feel better about having him in net. But he hasn't, so we don't.
You hit the nail on the head.

Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:22 PM
  #884
RJ8812*
Hellooooo ladiiiies
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Sudbury
Country: Canada
Posts: 28,092
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CSKA1974 View Post
He has to really turn it around to justify keeping his contract on the cap strapped team. On the other hand, I am not sure that front office will want to throw about $25 mill. down the drain and then pay for another goalie.
if they want to win, they will

RJ8812* is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:27 PM
  #885
spudnick
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 328
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyersfan139 View Post
Is the buyout that every team has only valid this off season?

I think Bryz has been decent this year, if we buy him out who else are the Flyers going to get?
Does it really matter? The way I look at it, we are near the bottom of the league with a goalie getting 5.6 million for 7 more years am putting up a sub .900 sv%. We could sign a goalie at league minimum and get Sub .900 sv% then use the 5 million somewhere else. Whether its Bryz's fault or the defense's fault we CANNOT continue to pay 5.6 million for a goalie where a league minimum goalie would get us the same results.

spudnick is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:29 PM
  #886
FLYERSFAN18
Registered User
 
FLYERSFAN18's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Florida
Country: United States
Posts: 2,062
vCash: 500
Bryz will be here next season unless his cap hit prevents us from bringing in a #1 defenseman if there are any available, which is unlikely. That gives us a year to try to find a young replacement and hopefully we can find a back up this summer. Then in 2014 they will buy him out if he isnt playing great or if they find a replacement

FLYERSFAN18 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:38 PM
  #887
zarley zelepukin
Registered User
 
zarley zelepukin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Norristown, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 1,674
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Also, it has been shown on BSH and other sites that there is a very, very strong correlation between shot quality and shot quantity...to the point where shots allowed is a very good benchmark for scoring chances allowed. The more shots a team allows, the more scoring chances there are. The Flyers have done a pretty good job of preventing shots, and therefore scoring chances, to the tune of 26.9 SA/G...good for 6th in the league.

Yet they're 24th for GA per game. When all the stats that monitor defensive quality show the team is doing fine, yet loads of goals are going in, that's a goaltender problem.
I asked this before but don't think I got a reply. Is there a site that tracks scoring chances? I accept that they are correlated with shots allowed, but isn't it possible that our team's 25ish game sample is not large enough to be sure that it's played out that way for us?

zarley zelepukin is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:50 PM
  #888
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by zarley zelepukin View Post
I asked this before but don't think I got a reply. Is there a site that tracks scoring chances? I accept that they are correlated with shots allowed, but isn't it possible that our team's 25ish game sample is not large enough to be sure that it's played out that way for us?
No, it's not publicly tracked. BSH got their data by emailing the Flyers, and other media outlets.

Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 01:54 PM
  #889
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
 
LegionOfDoom91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 18,449
vCash: 500
I really wish the NHL would make scoring chances an official stat.

LegionOfDoom91 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:03 PM
  #890
FlyersFan61290
Registered User
 
FlyersFan61290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 9,320
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I really wish the NHL would make scoring chances an official stat.
and yet they're in love with +/-. not saying it doesn't have any meaning but when used to portray defensive ability it's pretty moronic. keep track of scoring chances on the other hand makes too much sense.

FlyersFan61290 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:04 PM
  #891
CanadianFlyer88
Moderator
Knublin' PPs
 
CanadianFlyer88's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Van City
Posts: 15,651
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I really wish the NHL would make scoring chances an official stat.
It's a highly subjective stat, so it's difficult.

Similar to takeaways and giveaways.

__________________
I deride your truth handling abilities
CanadianFlyer88 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:06 PM
  #892
FlyersFan61290
Registered User
 
FlyersFan61290's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 9,320
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
It's a highly subjective stat, so it's difficult.

Similar to takeaways and giveaways.
and hits yet they are counted. some places you have to earn your hits others a little bump counts as a hit.

FlyersFan61290 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:08 PM
  #893
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,110
vCash: 500
Here is this link again, actually not by BSH (but they did get info from them, and I'm pretty sure based on another article that BSH got their info from media and the org):

http://nhlnumbers.com/2012/6/26/shot...nd-shot-totals

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadianFlyer88 View Post
It's a highly subjective stat, so it's difficult.

Similar to takeaways and giveaways.
It does look like a rough outline has been constructed based on goals scored where; it's in that article. That could be a good basis.

Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:08 PM
  #894
funghoul
retardo montalbon
 
funghoul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: upper drugs
Country: United States
Posts: 1,671
vCash: 500
i think the scoring chances stat would just be used for evil on this thread.

funghoul is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:09 PM
  #895
Beef Invictus
Global Moderator
FAT SLOB
 
Beef Invictus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Centreville
Country: Lord Howe Island
Posts: 47,110
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by funghoul View Post
i think the scoring chances stat would just be used for evil on this thread.
Only if it reflects badly on Bryz, right? Chances are extremely good it would reflect poorly on him.

Beef Invictus is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:19 PM
  #896
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
 
LegionOfDoom91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 18,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan61290 View Post
and hits yet they are counted. some places you have to earn your hits others a little bump counts as a hit.
Yeah if the people broadcasting the game can keep track of it I'm pretty sure an official stat guy getting paid to keep track of stats can do it.

LegionOfDoom91 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:23 PM
  #897
funghoul
retardo montalbon
 
funghoul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: upper drugs
Country: United States
Posts: 1,671
vCash: 500
those boston goals were a joke in terms of breakdowns. i assume your saying if there was a stat that most of the goals against on him are not scoring chances? but people got all over him saturday because boston scored 3 quick goals but there were all plays which led to guys being wide open. first goal was a great pass on a p.p. second was a guy alone in the slot (had the most chance to stop that one) and the breakaway on the giveaway. no ******** along the ice slapshots from the blue line. no wraparounds or misplays behind the net. if fact those goals against miller, 2 of them looked horrible last night but you said you'd rather have miller. what is the difference? i guess that vezina he beat out bryzgalov for.

funghoul is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:23 PM
  #898
BillDineen
Registered User
 
BillDineen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,668
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Yeah if the people broadcasting the game can keep track of it I'm pretty sure an official stat guy getting paid to keep track of stats can do it.
You would think both broadcasting crews for each game would store the stats somewhere. You would think their data could be available (at a price). I would like for the NHL to buy the data, take the average of the two crews and publish it.

BillDineen is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:28 PM
  #899
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
 
LegionOfDoom91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 18,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDineen View Post
You would think both broadcasting crews for each game would store the stats somewhere. You would think their data could be available (at a price). I would like for the NHL to buy the data, take the average of the two crews and publish it.
Yeah they could do that also. I think it really should be a stat recorded by the NHL.

LegionOfDoom91 is offline  
Old
03-11-2013, 02:30 PM
  #900
LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
 
LegionOfDoom91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 18,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by funghoul View Post
those boston goals were a joke in terms of breakdowns. i assume your saying if there was a stat that most of the goals against on him are not scoring chances? but people got all over him saturday because boston scored 3 quick goals but there were all plays which led to guys being wide open. first goal was a great pass on a p.p. second was a guy alone in the slot (had the most chance to stop that one) and the breakaway on the giveaway. no ******** along the ice slapshots from the blue line. no wraparounds or misplays behind the net. if fact those goals against miller, 2 of them looked horrible last night but you said you'd rather have miller. what is the difference? i guess that vezina he beat out bryzgalov for.
Pretty much every goal Miller gave up last night was defensive break down. Using your logic it wasn't his fault.

LegionOfDoom91 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:55 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.