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2013 Draft Discussion (Mar. 29 article, post #976)

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03-11-2013, 04:51 PM
  #526
Krishna
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Originally Posted by Roo Mad Bro View Post
Is Zadarov wearing a Phillies cap in this pic?

http://instagram.com/p/WuaJgtD4n_/

He must want to get drafted by Philly
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.

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03-11-2013, 04:52 PM
  #527
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Page not found for the Zadorov picture.

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03-11-2013, 04:58 PM
  #528
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Oh no.

His Facebook picture is him with a capitals hat

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03-11-2013, 04:58 PM
  #529
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It was him at an autograph signing with 3 other teammates wearing a Phillies hat.

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03-11-2013, 06:59 PM
  #530
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Yes.
Yes.
Yes.
Krishna really, really, really wants Zadarov on the Flyers.

I would like that him too, but I wouldn't mind Nurse or Ristolainen either. Jones of course is the top d-man I would like to get.

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03-11-2013, 07:59 PM
  #531
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Originally Posted by FlyingPhilly View Post
Krishna really, really, really wants Zadarov on the Flyers.

I would like that him too, but I wouldn't mind Nurse or Ristolainen either. Jones of course is the top d-man I would like to get.
Don't get me wrong. If we are 1st or 2nd overall, I'd definitely take Jones.

But if we are 6-10 and Zadorov is there, I'd definitely take him over the others. There's two reasons why Zadorov gets bashed on here. One is because he's russian. The second is because he hasn't shown much offense. BCF16 can confirm that when Zadorov went to London, he was used as primarily a defensive D man since the Knights had Maatta, Harrington, and Mermis as offensive D men. With Harrington moving on, Zadorov will be able to take a more offensive role next season.

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03-11-2013, 08:05 PM
  #532
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Don't get me wrong. If we are 1st or 2nd overall, I'd definitely take Jones.

But if we are 6-10 and Zadorov is there, I'd definitely take him over the others. There's two reasons why Zadorov gets bashed on here. One is because he's russian. The second is because he hasn't shown much offense. BCF16 can confirm that when Zadorov went to London, he was used as primarily a defensive D man since the Knights had Maatta, Harrington, and Mermis as offensive D men. With Harrington moving on, Zadorov will be able to take a more offensive role next season.
I think the main reason people here don't want him is because he's pretty raw. I think most want a defensemen who is closer to being NHL ready. Personally I wouldn't mind Zadorov at 5-10 spots if Nurse is off the board.

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03-11-2013, 08:11 PM
  #533
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Don't get me wrong. If we are 1st or 2nd overall, I'd definitely take Jones.

But if we are 6-10 and Zadorov is there, I'd definitely take him over the others. There's two reasons why Zadorov gets bashed on here. One is because he's russian. The second is because he hasn't shown much offense. BCF16 can confirm that when Zadorov went to London, he was used as primarily a defensive D man since the Knights had Maatta, Harrington, and Mermis as offensive D men. With Harrington moving on, Zadorov will be able to take a more offensive role next season.
Ah, ok. I wasn't bashing Zadorov at all. I would be good with him or any of the other top d-men prospects. Yea, I read BCF16's analysis on Zadarov and I was impressed from reading it. I still think Nurse is the better prospect though so I would have him ahead of Zadarov and below Jones. I am just a bit taken aback by how much you really like him.

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03-11-2013, 08:11 PM
  #534
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Don't get me wrong. If we are 1st or 2nd overall, I'd definitely take Jones.

But if we are 6-10 and Zadorov is there, I'd definitely take him over the others. There's two reasons why Zadorov gets bashed on here. One is because he's russian. The second is because he hasn't shown much offense. BCF16 can confirm that when Zadorov went to London, he was used as primarily a defensive D man since the Knights had Maatta, Harrington, and Mermis as offensive D men. With Harrington moving on, Zadorov will be able to take a more offensive role next season.
Harrington is far from an offensive guy. Having seen him a few times I just don't see offensive potential in Zadorov. He's got a pretty hard shot which is expected from a guy of his frame, and he makes an okay first pass, but I just don't see the hands and instincts to be anything more than passable offensively.

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03-11-2013, 08:14 PM
  #535
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I think also the fact that he compares to Coburn turns people off. Given the fact that Coburn's not really liked around here at the moment it makes sense.

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03-11-2013, 08:20 PM
  #536
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I think also the fact that he compares to Coburn turns people off. Given the fact that Coburn's not really liked around here at the moment it makes sense.
Eh.

Coburn is the new scapegoat. Bryz is far more the problem honestly.

In reality though, if we want another Coburn we should go after Myers.

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03-11-2013, 08:23 PM
  #537
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I think the reason I don't want Zadorov, even if he's skilled, is because we don't need shutdown D-men that may have a big offensive game (as someone said, he's raw). I'd rather have someone like Nurse who seems to have a better two-way game.

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03-11-2013, 08:28 PM
  #538
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Eh.

Coburn is the new scapegoat. Bryz is far more the problem honestly.

In reality though, if we want another Coburn we should go after Myers.
I like Coburn despite his poor play this season. I actually don't want to trade him. I was just saying that could be a reason some might be turned off by him.

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03-11-2013, 08:42 PM
  #539
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Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I think you are misconstruing my argument. What I said was that I assume the hype surrounding those guys was the same as Seth Jones' hype at this moment. The same stuff you are saying about Seth Jones was likely said about the guys I mentioned. They were all good players, but none of them lived up to their hype.
I couldn't tell you what their hype was as I was still a youngster back then. All I know is Jones is in a different class for a number of reasons than those guys.

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And that's fine, but again, it's all speculation. He has the tools, but at this point he is all potential. What you are saying may very well turn out to be true. But is just as likely that he turns into only a guy like the guys I mentioned. You may be willing to risk Couturier for that, I am not. You may wind up right in the end, but I am not willing to risk it.
That's your opinion. You're entitled to that. I'm usually pretty neutral on prospects when it comes to their potential, but I am so confident that Jones will become that franchise defenseman that I am willing to pay a hefty price to get him. It's kind of like when Washington mortgaged part of their future to get in position to take RG3. They definitely gave up a lot, but they got their franchise guy and are now in a position to compete for the next decade (god willing).

Quote:
If Couturier and a first doesn't move you up to where you want to be, that is all the more reason to not make the deal.
It's all hypothetical.

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The difference is that Couturier is in his second NHL season. While he is struggling this year, he has already shown that he can shut down one of the best, if not the best player in the world on the biggest stage (see: Evgeni Malkin). If he stays a 35-40 point center but also stays a top defensive forward on the team, I would be fine. A bird in hand is worth two in the bush.
I acknowledged that he would still be a valuable player if his offensive game never develops, but his value also takes a serious hit. I don't want to say shutdown centers are easy to find, because they are not, but they are a lot easier to find than a true number 1 center which is what we had hoped (and still hope) Couts could someday be to some extent. A number 1 defenseman also lessens the burden to have a true shutdown center as that defenseman is going to be on the ice a lot more than a 3rd line center. Also consider, Laughton, while maybe not the prototype shutdown guy like Couturier, is no slouch himself and could contribute as soon as next season.

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I think you are underestimating just how difficult it is to be a true #1 defender.There are like what, five guys that are true #1 defenders out there (i.e. guys you would build your team around)? It is so much more likely that Jones turns out to be a good not great defenseman than it is that he turns into Zdeno Chara. It is 100% absolutely possible. He has the talent and his ceiling is very high. But that is best case scenario.
Again it comes down to confidence in Jones. I am extremely confident in Jones' ability and hockey sense to become that franchise defenseman. Between his smarts, size, skill, athleticism, etc., there's just too much going for him not to amount to a #1 defenseman in some form (in my eyes). He's obviously got an enormous ceiling, but I also see him with a pretty high floor. And just like you say there's a good chance Jones turns out to be a good not great defenseman, there's also a chance Couturier becomes Martin Hanzal as opposed to Eric Staal. I'll take my chances with the potential #1 defenseman.


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Well that's just a difference of opinion. I would not make that move. I like Jones. I want the Flyers to draft him. I would like the Flyers to trade up to get him. But any deal to move up would not involve Couturier if it were me (unless it was part of a larger deal with more moving parts).
It comes down to how bad you want him. I would be willing to part with anyone not named Giroux to get my hands on Jones. I'm just that confident in the kid.

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03-11-2013, 08:46 PM
  #540
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I like Coburn despite his poor play this season. I actually don't want to trade him. I was just saying that could be a reason some might be turned off by him.
Yeah, I don't want Coburn traded either.

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03-11-2013, 08:51 PM
  #541
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No to redundant offensively stunted stay-at-home defensemen.

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03-11-2013, 10:33 PM
  #542
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Originally Posted by FLYguy3911 View Post
Skill wise, Nichuskin should be in the conversation at #4.
The way he's scoring in the Gagarin Cup playoffs right now, I'd certainly say his draft stock is rising.

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03-12-2013, 12:43 AM
  #543
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Eh.

Coburn is the new scapegoat. Bryz is far more the problem honestly.

In reality though, if we want another Coburn we should go after Myers.
Coburn has deserved the critisism. He hasnt been very good this year at all.

and yes I would trade him.

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03-12-2013, 05:31 AM
  #544
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Originally Posted by Krishna View Post
Don't get me wrong. If we are 1st or 2nd overall, I'd definitely take Jones.

But if we are 6-10 and Zadorov is there, I'd definitely take him over the others. There's two reasons why Zadorov gets bashed on here. One is because he's russian. The second is because he hasn't shown much offense. BCF16 can confirm that when Zadorov went to London, he was used as primarily a defensive D man since the Knights had Maatta, Harrington, and Mermis as offensive D men. With Harrington moving on, Zadorov will be able to take a more offensive role next season.
Zadarov is a nice player, but I think where the Flyers are picking, they should go with a defensemen with more of an offensive upside. Why draft Zadarov in the top 15 when you can get a guy like Samuel Morin in the 2nd round? If I was drafting, I would go Nurse, Ristolainen, Pulock, Morrissey or Hagg before Zadarov and pick up Morin in the 2nd.

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03-12-2013, 12:57 PM
  #545
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
Zadarov is a nice player, but I think where the Flyers are picking, they should go with a defensemen with more of an offensive upside. Why draft Zadarov in the top 15 when you can get a guy like Samuel Morin in the 2nd round? If I was drafting, I would go Nurse, Ristolainen, Pulock, Morrissey or Hagg before Zadarov and pick up Morin in the 2nd.
For some reason, I think they will be picking between 10 and closer to 20. Given that I go after Pulock and Morrissey then Muellar. But if we drop into the 20's I go(take a guess) Kerby Rychel. Love this kid. Not as much as the man crush I had on Landeskog who would have been great in Black and Orange, but a young man who may be ready to step in and help right away next year. This kid is a winner who would fit in here like a glove at left wing. Then go for D in the later rounds.

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03-12-2013, 01:20 PM
  #546
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For some reason, I think they will be picking between 10 and closer to 20. Given that I go after Pulock and Morrissey then Muellar. But if we drop into the 20's I go(take a guess) Kerby Rychel. Love this kid. Not as much as the man crush I had on Landeskog who would have been great in Black and Orange, but a young man who may be ready to step in and help right away next year. This kid is a winner who would fit in here like a glove at left wing. Then go for D in the later rounds.
You think the Flyers are making the playoffs?

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03-12-2013, 02:54 PM
  #547
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In reality, id be ecstatic with any of Jones, Nurse, Pulock, Ristolainen or Zadorov

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03-13-2013, 08:35 PM
  #548
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I'm pretty sure I'll be spending most of my time in this thread after tonight's total fold to the Devils

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03-13-2013, 09:02 PM
  #549
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In reality, id be ecstatic with any of Jones, Nurse, Pulock, Ristolainen or Zadorov
honestly these are the same guys i would want as well. then work up a trade, move up and grab hagg.

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03-13-2013, 09:03 PM
  #550
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honestly these are the same guys i would want as well. then work up a trade, move up and grab hagg.
Hagg will probably be somewhere between 20-30. He is not top 10.

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