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The Armchair GM Thread - XXXV

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:53 AM
  #126
arsmaster
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
It was my mistake, I wasn't factoring in the bonus cushion. Here's the line-up:


CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Taylor Hall ($6.000m) / Shawn Horcoff ($5.500m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Ryan Smyth ($2.250m) / Ryan N.-Hopkins ($3.775m) / Ales Hemsky ($5.000m)
Magnus Paajarvi ($0.951m) / Sam Gagner ($4.500m) / Nail Yakupov ($3.775m)
Ryan Jones ($1.500m) / Eric Belanger ($1.750m) / Ben Eager ($1.100m)
Teemu Hartikainen ($0.927m) / Mike Brown ($0.737m)
DEFENSEMEN
Justin Schultz ($3.775m) / Nick Schultz ($3.500m)
Ladislav Smid ($4.250m) / Ryan Whitney ($4.000m)
Theo Peckham ($1.475m) / Jeff Petry ($1.750m)
Mark Fistric ($1.475m) /
GOALTENDERS
Devan Dubnyk ($3.500m)
Yann Danis ($0.800m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $63,466,542; BONUSES: $8,550,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $5,655,958


So if they take Whitney out of that, they can more than fit, yet their D is worse than it was this year... and the team up front is the same. So a worse team overall. The only way they improve is to turn Jones+Whitney into a good player, without taking much else away from their roster, and hope their young guys take steps forward.

They need veteran players that are medium to good contributors ASAP. For a team pushing the cap, their results aren't there at all. Of course, you could say the same about the Canucks right now...
Just mentioned it above.

Why would Gagner sign for $4.5 when he's out producing the guys on his team who make $5m (Hemsky and Horcoff) and $6, (Hall and Eberle).

I don't see him buying in (at least I assume he's not dumb enough to leave money on the table to play 2nd fiddle in Edmonton).

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Old
03-12-2013, 11:54 AM
  #127
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
What do you think Gagner gets paid?

I think EDM is going to have to give him $5+ million cap hit. The comparable are on his team (Horcoff, Hemsky, Eberle, and Hall), Ryan O'Reilly in Col. I don't think Sammy is gonna hand out a discount to stay there.
I figure he'll be making at least $4m, over $5m would be an overpayment in my books but maybe that's what it takes.

But my point is that if that's trouble for the Oilers it's a frickin catastrophe for the Canucks from a cap standpoint.

If I'm the Oilers and it takes $5.5m to re-sign Sam Gagner, I start talking to GMs around the league who need a second line center and can part with a defenseman or a forward from a very different mould.

Edit: I don't know. Maybe Sam wants nothing more than to play in the same organization dad works for, and would take less to play here. I'd certainly consider moving players to make a fit for him at $4m.

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03-12-2013, 11:58 AM
  #128
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Originally Posted by dave babych returns View Post
There is no way Whitney suits up for them next year. They could get a moderately disappointing $4m defenseman on the free agent market instead that would still give them more than he has this season.

Or they could trade Sam Gagner for a better defenseman than Keith Ballard.

Whitney is just there as a placeholder. EDM will have to find a top4D to replace him.


Quote:
Still, I'd rather be in the Canucks shoes than the Oilers at this point. Unless that team makes some real changes to their core (and it's probably going to take an overhaul of management) and manages their cap situation exceptionally they are not going be contenders..

I would too, specifically because VAN is able to shed assets and stay competitive, rather than have to get more quality assets to become competitive.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:00 PM
  #129
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Just mentioned it above.

Why would Gagner sign for $4.5 when he's out producing the guys on his team who make $5m (Hemsky and Horcoff) and $6, (Hall and Eberle).

I don't see him buying in (at least I assume he's not dumb enough to leave money on the table to play 2nd fiddle in Edmonton).

Yeah with Zajac netting 5.75m per, and Weiss rumoured to be asking for 5m+, I don't see how a PPG Gagner takes 4.5m per. I was fitting him in on that roster more based on what he deserves, not what he will actually get.

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03-12-2013, 12:00 PM
  #130
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would love to acquire teddy purcell & nate thompson from TBL. would ship either of our goalies. Top 6 playmaker for Kelser or with the Sedins. & a stabilizing presence on the third or fourth line centre

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:00 PM
  #131
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Whitney is just there as a placeholder. EDM will have to find a top4D to replace him.
Fair enough. My point is just that it would be tough for the Oilers to find a worse way to spend that $4m than they are on Whitney right now.

(Still, if there's a franchise out there that can do it...)

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:01 PM
  #132
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.

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03-12-2013, 12:02 PM
  #133
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac: There's no question Mike Gillis understands the clock is ticking on this group

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03-12-2013, 12:03 PM
  #134
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.
I wouldn't mind us giving up mid-tier picks/prospects for guys like Visnovsky or Jagr, if they're made available.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:04 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Yeah with Zajac netting 5.75m per, and Weiss rumoured to be asking for 5m+, I don't see how a PPG Gagner takes 4.5m per. I was fitting him in on that roster more based on what he deserves, not what he will actually get.
His agent has to be happy he's leading the team in scoring and is PPG in his contract year.

Edmonton will give him $5.5 is my guess.

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03-12-2013, 12:11 PM
  #136
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.

I really hope Gillis isn't this stupid. Any future piece the Canucks have that is worth value in trade is a piece they will dearly miss, given their weak pipeline.

Gillis should be thinking about hockey deals that involve Raymond, Ballard and Luongo. Not futures for rentals. Because I don't see how this team retains any player on a big contract without moving anymore pieces out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
His agent has to be happy he's leading the team in scoring and is PPG in his contract year.

Edmonton will give him $5.5 is my guess.

Agreed. With RNH and Yakupov getting 5m+ around the bend, that team is going to be real top heavy, real soon.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:19 PM
  #137
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Whichever team overpays Gagner will be sorely disappointed with what they get out of him next season.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:28 PM
  #138
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.
Ugh. This is exactly how you become the Calgary Flames.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:36 PM
  #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crows View Post
@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crows View Post
@taj1944: Bobby Mac: There's no question Mike Gillis understands the clock is ticking on this group
Ugh this concerns me. This team isn't good enough to win it all. Unless we are talking a MAJOR upgrade such as a Corey Perry or Jarome Iginla this would be a horrible way to go. We better not be talking about trading picks and prospects for guys like Marcel Goc and leaving it at that. This team needs A LOT more than just Marcel Goc to be competitive in the playoffs and a threat for the Cup.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:38 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Finkle is Einhorn View Post
Ugh. This is exactly how you become the Calgary Flames.
We don't even know what type of upgrades we're talking about. A 1st round pick + other assets for Iginla or Perry? Sing me up. What we do know is that Gillis hasn't wasted his picks on rentals and has looked for bargains (and players he can retain) when talking about the classical TD acquisitions (Higgins, Lapierre, etc.). They're not going to suddenly trade a 1st for Marcel Goc.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:39 PM
  #141
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@taj1944: Bobby Mac said Canucks are willing to give up future pieces to win now. As long as it's not their top prospects. Willing to give up picks.
Haha, this gave me a 2nd round pick for Keith Carney type vibe. I really don't see us getting anything particular impactful with a draft pick that isn't our first rounder. I mean I guess we could fill out some depth positions, but I dunno what Gillis expects.

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:40 PM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Ugh this concerns me. This team isn't good enough to win it all. Unless we are talking a MAJOR upgrade such as a Corey Perry or Jarome Iginla this would be a horrible way to go. We better not be talking about trading picks and prospects for guys like Marcel Goc and leaving it at that. This team needs A LOT more than just Marcel Goc to be competitive in the playoffs and a threat for the Cup.
My concern is who he considers to be "top prospects".

We've already given away Grabner and Hodgson for an abysmal return and one the jury is still out on respectively. Who else is there? Jensen, Lack and Gaunce are probably are most enticing pieces, but I don't want to part with any of them.

Which would then beg the question, does anyone else in our system really have a great deal of value?

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03-12-2013, 12:40 PM
  #143
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How about a booth for Dubinsky swap?

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Old
03-12-2013, 12:41 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
We don't even know what type of upgrades we're talking about. A 1st round pick + other assets for Iginla or Perry? Sing me up. What we do know is that Gillis hasn't wasted his picks on rentals and has looked for bargains (and players he can retain) when talking about the classical TD acquisitions (Higgins, Lapierre, etc.). They're not going to suddenly trade a 1st for Marcel Goc.
Well which is it? Perry or Iginla? Because one's an elite, young player, and the other is an old, average player.

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03-12-2013, 12:42 PM
  #145
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Well which is it? Perry or Iginla? Because one's an elite, young player, and the other is an old, average player.
Iginla is an average player? Good one. He's tied for 40th in ES scoring. Better PP and he's likely Top 30 in league-wide scoring. On our team, only the Sedins are ahead of him at ES.

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03-12-2013, 12:43 PM
  #146
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Originally Posted by Mr. Canucklehead View Post
My concern is who he considers to be "top prospects".

We've already given away Grabner and Hodgson for an abysmal return and one the jury is still out on respectively. Who else is there? Jensen, Lack and Gaunce are probably are most enticing pieces, but I don't want to part with any of them.

Which would then beg the question, does anyone else in our system really have a great deal of value?
Good point. Personally I consider Jensen, Schroeder, Gaunce, Lack and Corrado to be our top prospects. Connauton could potentially be expendable but what kind of value does he have left if he had much at all? Outside of that, I suppose we could shop guys like Rodin, Grenier, Mallet, Rai, Price, McNally, etc. but these aren't even B level prospects. Our cupboards are so bare that I don't see much trade value there amongst the players we can afford to move.

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03-12-2013, 12:44 PM
  #147
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Iginla is an average player? Good one.
Have you watched any Calgary games this year?

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03-12-2013, 12:44 PM
  #148
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I'm gonna be livid if he gives up our first for a rental.

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03-12-2013, 12:46 PM
  #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crows View Post
How about a booth for Dubinsky swap?
I would definitely do this. Dubinsky is a guy who can play C or LW (ideally LW on a line that has a RH C). He hits, and he's good for about 20g/40-50p. Not a huge upgrade in terms of point production from where Booth likely would be at in the future, but what Dubinsky does for me is he provides us another guy who can take faceoffs, and he plays with a bit more of an edge than Booth.

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03-12-2013, 12:47 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Good point. Personally I consider Jensen, Schroeder, Gaunce, Lack and Corrado to be our top prospects. Connauton could potentially be expendable but what kind of value does he have left if he had much at all? Outside of that, I suppose we could shop guys like Rodin, Grenier, Mallet, Rai, Price, McNally, etc. but these aren't even B level prospects. Our cupboards are so bare that I don't see much trade value there amongst the players we can afford to move.
I forgot Corrado. [facepalm] Add him to the (short) list of people I really don't want to part with.

Schroeder is a solid prospect, but I don't think he's one that will be garnering a high demand league wide. To wit, I think he has more value to us as an organization than he would in a trade.

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