HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Are we in the midst of another epic second-half collapse this season?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-15-2013, 01:10 PM
  #101
Milan90
Registered User
 
Milan90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Etobicoke, Ontario
Country: Serbia
Posts: 1,402
vCash: 500
My God honestly the Leafs' fanbases is absolutely awful. 4 game losing streak and the "get rid of Kessel" posts start. Yeah I'd love to get rid of one of three guys who have actually been creating offense.

Literally right before the losing streak, everyone was praising Carlyle. 4 games later it's "we needa fire him".


Last edited by ULF_55: 03-15-2013 at 01:13 PM. Reason: flaming
Milan90 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:10 PM
  #102
hockeyfanz
Registered User
 
hockeyfanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 7,743
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThirdRowGreens View Post
I haven't discredited anybody. How does saying the team has had a good defensive game overall take away anything from any of those players? It doesn't.
Its the only way any NHL team will have success. They haven't been spectacular defensively. Not at all. Its just that you are so used to watching shinny hockey that you dont even recognize what an NHL team should play like. Thats what 4 years of Ron Wilson has done to you.

hockeyfanz is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:11 PM
  #103
Mess
Global Moderator
 
Mess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: Canada
Posts: 61,161
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
you guys really need to stop this nonsense..scrivens 919 SV% and Reimer 916.....lets blame the goalies. Its easier than just realizing and admitting that the team has a long way to go before it can be considered good. They are playoff bubble team...
Nonis is going to need time to sort out and build this team into a true contender. He has a ways to go from the bottom 5 team he inherited to turn this thing around.

Carlyle if anything deserves credit for having this team overachieve to this point. Where this isn't a collapse as much as a reality check for where this team actually resides on the competitiveness scale overall. IMO

They've battled hard as a blue collar team while its best offensive players (Kessel, Grabovski etc) have been MIA and essentially passengers, having little effect on the current success it has had. Fortunately its players like Kadri and Frattin and JVR (its youngest players) that have carried the team early on, or the season would already be lost.

Where has the patience that was once pleaded for gone, and doesn't the new GM deserve some as well ? After all the team just underwent a major house cleaning GM & Coach management overhaul this past season, which should be a strong indication that everything was not going well. Overnight those things are not going to be instantly & magically going to fixed themselves either.

__________________
Signature: There is no greater demonstration of Fan patience then to suggest to "Play the Kids " and be willing to accept the consequences of those actions..
Mess is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:11 PM
  #104
Alflives
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
you guys really need to stop this nonsense..scrivens 919 SV% and Reimer 916.....lets blame the goalies. Its easier than just realizing and admitting that the team has a long way to go before it can be considered good. They are playoff bubble team..the same as they were before the fathead overhauled the roster....twice.

The stellar and admirable play of the two goalies along with JVR and Kadri are the reason why the Leafs aren't battling Florida for McKinnon this year. Thats all...but you can pretend its McLaren and Orr's toughness or the AHL plugs that litter the lineup....
Following your logic, the Leafs finnish 10th in the conference, and draft another plug, or AHL player, instead of getting a top pick, who has the potential to be a star and a difference maker.

Alflives is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:13 PM
  #105
ULF_55
Global Moderator
 
ULF_55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Mountain Standard Ti
Posts: 56,872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
My God honestly the Leafs' fanbases is absolutely awful. 4 game losing streak and the "get rid of Kessel" posts start. Yeah I'd love to get rid of one of three guys who have actually been creating offense.

Literally right before the losing streak, everyone was praising Carlyle. 4 games later it's "we needa fire him".
There have always been trade Kessel discussions.

It really isn't about individual stats though. Hockey is a team game, not like tennis where individually what you do is the goal.

If you improve the team (long term) by trading Kessel you do it. Easily. Team > Individual.

__________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bA3LN_8hjM8.

Vaive and Ludzik on collapse, and Phaneuf.
ULF_55 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:17 PM
  #106
Milan90
Registered User
 
Milan90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Etobicoke, Ontario
Country: Serbia
Posts: 1,402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
There have always been trade Kessel discussions.

It really isn't about individual stats though. Hockey is a team game, not like tennis where individually what you do is the goal.

If you improve the team (long term) by trading Kessel you do it. Easily. Team > Individual.
I don't care if it's for something that improves the team but acting like our leading scorer (who has developed an ability to pass as well) is the problem here is stupid as ****.

"I guess it wouldn't be Toronto if the sky wasn't falling" - Darcy Tucker

Milan90 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:23 PM
  #107
Alflives
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
I don't care if it's for something that improves the team but acting like our leading scorer (who has developed an ability to pass as well) is the problem here is stupid as ****.

"I guess it wouldn't be Toronto if the sky wasn't falling" - Darcy Tucker
Sure it's just hockey, and there are far more important matters in our world, but the team is falling out of the play-offs. Their good team play from earlier in the season is no longer there. Whether it's the recent poor goaltending, or bad D zone play, the "sky is falling" on the team's play-off hopes.

Alflives is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:25 PM
  #108
KPower
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 2,473
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
I don't care if it's for something that improves the team but acting like our leading scorer (who has developed an ability to pass as well) is the problem here is stupid as ****.

"I guess it wouldn't be Toronto if the sky wasn't falling" - Darcy Tucker
Tucker gets it.


KPower is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:26 PM
  #109
Milan90
Registered User
 
Milan90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Etobicoke, Ontario
Country: Serbia
Posts: 1,402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alflives View Post
Sure it's just hockey, and there are far more important matters in our world, but the team is falling out of the play-offs. Their good team play from earlier in the season is no longer there. Whether it's the recent poor goaltending, or bad D zone play, the "sky is falling" on the team's play-off hopes.
Am I the only one who watched the game last night? They capitalized twice in what was otherwise an incredibly solid defensive effort against probably the best (or second best) team in the East.

Milan90 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:26 PM
  #110
leafspring*
 
leafspring*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 4,361
vCash: 500
Wendle Clark told a player traded to the leafs when asked what the Fans/media is like He said, your never as good as they say you are,your never as bad as they say you are,and your never who you really are! lol.

N thats that.

leafspring* is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:27 PM
  #111
ThirdRowGreens
Registered User
 
ThirdRowGreens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Ottawa
Country: Canada
Posts: 79
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfanz View Post
Its the only way any NHL team will have success. They haven't been spectacular defensively. Not at all. Its just that you are so used to watching shinny hockey that you dont even recognize what an NHL team should play like. Thats what 4 years of Ron Wilson has done to you.
Geez, I didn't say they were spectacular defensively... I said they have played a good team game in the games they've won, for the most part, and that it's not just 4 people that have won all their games for them. Keep covering your eyes and ears, though.

ThirdRowGreens is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:29 PM
  #112
ULF_55
Global Moderator
 
ULF_55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Mountain Standard Ti
Posts: 56,872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
I don't care if it's for something that improves the team but acting like our leading scorer (who has developed an ability to pass as well) is the problem here is stupid as ****.
Phil Kessel
or
Toronto Maple Leafs

Not a hard choice for me.

If you can make one better at the cost of the other ...

ULF_55 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:31 PM
  #113
Milan90
Registered User
 
Milan90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Etobicoke, Ontario
Country: Serbia
Posts: 1,402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Phil Kessel
or
Toronto Maple Leafs

Not a hard choice for me.
What the hell are you talking about? If trading Kessel makes our team better then pull the trigger but Kessel is in no way the problem on this team.

My posts are in response to the "Kessel is not the answer here" "get him out of here, he's shooting us in the foot" posts.

Milan90 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:35 PM
  #114
Alflives
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,539
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Phil Kessel
or
Toronto Maple Leafs

Not a hard choice for me.

If you can make one better at the cost of the other ...
Could trading Kessel make the Leafs miss the playoffs for sure, and draft in the top 5? If that's the case, then the Leaf's should trade him now. And trade him to a team that will finish in the bottom 5 too, for that team's first round pick. Then the Leaf's could have two picks in the top 5 in a really good draft. Keep Kessel and the Leafs will draft in the middle of the pack.

Alflives is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:44 PM
  #115
HappyGilmourr
Registered User
 
HappyGilmourr's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Milton
Posts: 5,330
vCash: 500
You can look at it in two ways: Glass half full or glass half empty.

Glass half empty: Leafs do this every year, they give us hope then BAM - mid season calapse... 1967, leafs suck, fire Carlyle - etc. Normally I hate this type of fan, but I have no problem with it anymore. This team has failed to many times in the last 10 years to deserve any credibility. This orginzation has a strong history of failing hard half way through the season. Its just a fact... We can't defend it they truly have failed for so long now.

Glass half full: We have had better goaltending this year and this year is different. This is a slump, every team goes through at least once. With only 20 games left we can reload for the last 20 games with Lupul and Gardiner and make a strong push for the playoffs. Next 3 games are winnable and we are due for some better fait... As of now we are in a playoff spot and the leafs control there own fait!

My opinion Personally i'm neutral, it could go either way. I really wouldn't be surprised with either. I feel we're due for the playoffs since it's been so long and we likely won't make it next year... but also I realize it's going to be a photo finish... All we can do is hope. Common leafs please just make it in!! Please, please, please for the of god show us some playoff hockey!!!

HappyGilmourr is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:50 PM
  #116
SayWhatAgain
Registered User
 
SayWhatAgain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 131
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Phil Kessel
or
Toronto Maple Leafs

Not a hard choice for me.

If you can make one better at the cost of the other ...
Your acting like there is a deal out there that will improve our team by trading Kessel, do you know something we all dont?

Do you honestly think some team is going to give us over-value for Kessel? chances are if we have to trade Kessel we will not get a player of his calibre back..... so what makes you so sure?

SayWhatAgain is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:56 PM
  #117
ULF_55
Global Moderator
 
ULF_55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Mountain Standard Ti
Posts: 56,872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
What the hell are you talking about? If trading Kessel makes our team better then pull the trigger but Kessel is in no way the problem on this team.

My posts are in response to the "Kessel is not the answer here" "get him out of here, he's shooting us in the foot" posts.
Sorry, I thought you were suggesting he was too important to trade.

You were taking the rational approach, that can be confusing here, afterall the Leafs would be up there with Boston if Gardiner was playing instead of Holzer.

ULF_55 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 01:58 PM
  #118
ULF_55
Global Moderator
 
ULF_55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Mountain Standard Ti
Posts: 56,872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SayWhatAgain View Post
Your acting like there is a deal out there that will improve our team by trading Kessel, do you know something we all dont?

Do you honestly think some team is going to give us over-value for Kessel? chances are if we have to trade Kessel we will not get a player of his calibre back..... so what makes you so sure?
Is anyone suggesting the Leafs make a bad trade?

ULF_55 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:03 PM
  #119
black charger
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: GTA
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,425
vCash: 500
Bottom line is,the AHLer"s have been exposed.We have a roster full of guys that played AHL last year and earlier this year.They started the season game ready.Where the regular NHLer's were still rusty and a step behind.Now that the regulars are back up to speed the AHLer"s have been exposed.

Whether it's because of these players lack of skill or opponents scouting and finding weaknesses in said players or holes in Carlyle's system it's hard to be sure.

But,as long as this team ices a roster full of AHLer's,things aren't going to go smoothly every game.

black charger is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:08 PM
  #120
SonofMan
Registered User
 
SonofMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North York
Country: Canada
Posts: 135
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
My God honestly the Leafs' fanbases is absolutely awful. 4 game losing streak and the "get rid of Kessel" posts start. Yeah I'd love to get rid of one of three guys who have actually been creating offense.

Literally right before the losing streak, everyone was praising Carlyle. 4 games later it's "we needa fire him".
To be fair, with the shorten season a 4-game losing streak can have a huge impact. It's not like the beginning of the season where the 8th-10th spot were well behind in points. But I agree, the fanbase can be a little awful at times.

SonofMan is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:51 PM
  #121
tmlfan98
Disappointed
 
tmlfan98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: The Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 445
vCash: 500
We need more players who are mentally tough, who won't lose all of their confidence like f***ing babies after they f***ing lose! Everyone makes mistakes during their lives! The Leafs have to learn how to f***ing get over it and start winning again! Oh yeah, and we also need a captain that isn't named Dion Phaneuf.

tmlfan98 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:56 PM
  #122
calcal798
Registered User
 
calcal798's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,656
vCash: 500
So we lose three games to two of the top teams in the league (and they were pretty close games, a lot closer then previous years), one game to a team thats hot right now and were collapsing?

Give the team some faith. We were bound to have a slump at some point.

If we can beat Winnipeg tomorrow and then beat Tampa and Buffalo it'll be a good bounce back (and exactly what we need).

calcal798 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:58 PM
  #123
Duffman955
Registered User
 
Duffman955's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,077
vCash: 500
I don't think we will collapse. We are still in a playoff spot and in the 4 losses, 3 of them were to the top 2 teams in the east who got narrow victories.

Although a huge hole we have been witnessing is a clear need for a top pairing RightDman

Duffman955 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 03:02 PM
  #124
egd27
#freethebigpicture
 
egd27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3,835
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tmlfan98 View Post
We need more players who are mentally tough, who won't lose all of their confidence like f***ing babies after they f***ing lose! Everyone makes mistakes during their lives! The Leafs have to learn how to f***ing get over it and start winning again! Oh yeah, and we also need a captain that isn't named Dion Phaneuf.
Could use a few more fans like that too.

Just happened to be in the Oiler's thread, and most still believe their 13th place team can make the playoffs. Don't see much of that optimism here in fragile city.

egd27 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 03:07 PM
  #125
calcal798
Registered User
 
calcal798's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: London
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,656
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duffman955 View Post
I don't think we will collapse. We are still in a playoff spot and in the 4 losses, 3 of them were to the top 2 teams in the east who got narrow victories.

Although a huge hole we have been witnessing is a clear need for a top pairing RightDman
Yep our defense really needs some help lol. Im sure Nonis will address that need leading up to the deadline and if not during the summer.

calcal798 is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:33 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.