HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Atlantic Division > Toronto Maple Leafs
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Are we in the midst of another epic second-half collapse this season?

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-15-2013, 02:20 PM
  #126
LEAFANFORLIFE23
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 9,105
vCash: 500
it's just a slump all teams go through them now it's our turn. We built up enough of a cushion early this year to withstand this. With Lupul, now back things are about to turn around

LEAFANFORLIFE23 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:26 PM
  #127
sommervr
Registered User
 
sommervr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,358
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milan90 View Post
I don't care if it's for something that improves the team but acting like our leading scorer (who has developed an ability to pass as well) is the problem here is stupid as ****.

"I guess it wouldn't be Toronto if the sky wasn't falling" - Darcy Tucker
Re-read the quote. Sometimes the sky really is falling

sommervr is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 02:36 PM
  #128
Alflives*
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,746
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by ULF_55 View Post
Is anyone suggesting the Leafs make a bad trade?
It's a great trade if Kessel returns a bottom feeder's first round pick this season. Kessel for McKinnon, Jones, or another top prospect from this year's draft would look very good. Plus, add to that, moving Kessel for a future pick would assure the Leafs own pick would be high this draft too. Then, perhaps, all Leafs' fans would no longer feel so badly about what Boston ended up with in the Kessel deal?

Alflives* is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 03:27 PM
  #129
DaveT83*
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,760
vCash: 500
This team is not getting better anytime soon with PK

As good as he is - the last 4+ years have proven he needs a strong supporting cast to have any effect on standings (see his career year + lupuls and the teams lottery finish)

So trading for a 1C does nothing to improve our position in standings - the assets given up to acquire one would hurt us both short and long term.

Makes too much sense to trade Phil for either an IMPROVEMENT in his position.
Or a collection of players assets that would be improvemments n thier own categories.

For Example:

A Shutdown Defenceman better than Gunner in the 1B spot
A 1Gb that is better than Scrivens and/or Reimer
A PWF that is better than Kulie on our 2nd line (25+goals potential with increased icetime)
A Centre prospect ready for primetime (Ryan Strome comes to mind)

I'm not saying any of the above would be attainable or available - but simply illustrating that trading phil kessel for a collection of picks/less skilled roster players would benefit the team immensly. Certainly more than his indivdual contributions to date.

DaveT83* is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 03:33 PM
  #130
Milan90
Registered User
 
Milan90's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Etobicoke, Ontario
Country: Serbia
Posts: 1,446
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveT83 View Post
This team is not getting better anytime soon with PK

As good as he is - the last 4+ years have proven he needs a strong supporting cast to have any effect on standings (see his career year + lupuls and the teams lottery finish)

So trading for a 1C does nothing to improve our position in standings - the assets given up to acquire one would hurt us both short and long term.

Makes too much sense to trade Phil for either an IMPROVEMENT in his position.
Or a collection of players assets that would be improvemments n thier own categories.

For Example:

A Shutdown Defenceman better than Gunner in the 1B spot
A 1Gb that is better than Scrivens and/or Reimer
A PWF that is better than Kulie on our 2nd line (25+goals potential with increased icetime)
A Centre prospect ready for primetime (Ryan Strome comes to mind)

I'm not saying any of the above would be attainable or available - but simply illustrating that trading phil kessel for a collection of picks/less skilled roster players would benefit the team immensly. Certainly more than his indivdual contributions to date.
Strong supporting cast? Lupul was pretty much left for dead, he comes here and gets his career revived on a line with Kessel. JVR was frustrating as hell to Flyers' supporters (and wasn't playing too great when we had him on another line), he comes here and has the best year of his life. It's pretty damn obvious to me that PK is making these guys better, and not the other way around.

Milan90 is offline  
Old
03-15-2013, 03:49 PM
  #131
Faltorvo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 13,782
vCash: 500
What worries me more is that we don't trade our pending UFAs for a failed and short sighted PO push.

But lets face it, greed is what runs this organization, it always has and will.

Frankly, i hope we fall short and don't get returns on TB and Mac, greed needs to be kicked in the nts from time to time.

Faltorvo is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 10:50 AM
  #132
tmlfan98
Disappointed
 
tmlfan98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: The Hockey Mecca
Country: Canada
Posts: 517
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Could use a few more fans like that too.

Just happened to be in the Oiler's thread, and most still believe their 13th place team can make the playoffs. Don't see much of that optimism here in fragile city.
I'm not saying I think the Leafs won't make the playoffs, I'm just saying that the reason that once they start losing, they can't stop is because they're confidence is so fragile.

tmlfan98 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 11:02 AM
  #133
Stephen
Registered User
 
Stephen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 35,772
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
What worries me more is that we don't trade our pending UFAs for a failed and short sighted PO push.

But lets face it, greed is what runs this organization, it always has and will.

Frankly, i hope we fall short and don't get returns on TB and Mac, greed needs to be kicked in the nts from time to time.
We get kicked in the nuts every year!

Stephen is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 11:49 AM
  #134
darrylsittler27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,817
vCash: 500
Who are we?

Young rebuilding team or playoff pretenders? I think we need a puck moving number one defenseman(Gardiner or Reilly),a top center(draft) and too unload some of our vets for picks and/or prospects.

Some guys I think need to be dealt or at least considered.Phaneuff(not for $6.5 million,thanks),Grabo($5.5 million for this?),MacArthur(good role player but we need play youth i.e Frattin now),Liles(may fetch a 2nd at deadline),Komisarek(sorry it just didnt work out),and possibly Kostka or Gunner.

We have to face reality,even if we made the playoffs,it would be over fast with this group.If we are out in 2 weeks,let's clean house and get ready for a strong draft.

Yes, I would consider a high pick for Kessel,not because of his play but because Burke mis built this team and Phaneuff/Kessel are not the right pieces.

darrylsittler27 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 12:20 PM
  #135
Pyrophorus
Registered User
 
Pyrophorus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Eastern GTA
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,122
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to Pyrophorus Send a message via Yahoo to Pyrophorus Send a message via Skype™ to Pyrophorus
Midst? Maybe after 7 straight more losses.

"The peaks and valleys, have to be changed into rolling hills"

Weird thing is, we've played well, during this streak, for the most part.

Pyrophorus is online now  
Old
03-16-2013, 12:37 PM
  #136
Stats01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,149
vCash: 580
Yes I think we are in the midst of one, a short one so far and we can turn things around the sooner we start winning games again. We wouldn't have lost a game like Thursday earlier on in the season but once again the games get tighter and we are falling off the map again. Tonight is a huge huge game. We lose then all of a sudden we're looking at 8th/9th territory when earlier on we were comfortable in 5th. JUST WIN!!

Stats01 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 12:39 PM
  #137
Stats01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,149
vCash: 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by darrylsittler27 View Post
Young rebuilding team or playoff pretenders? I think we need a puck moving number one defenseman(Gardiner or Reilly),a top center(draft) and too unload some of our vets for picks and/or prospects.

Some guys I think need to be dealt or at least considered.Phaneuff(not for $6.5 million,thanks),Grabo($5.5 million for this?),MacArthur(good role player but we need play youth i.e Frattin now),Liles(may fetch a 2nd at deadline),Komisarek(sorry it just didnt work out),and possibly Kostka or Gunner.

We have to face reality,even if we made the playoffs,it would be over fast with this group.If we are out in 2 weeks,let's clean house and get ready for a strong draft.

Yes, I would consider a high pick for Kessel,not because of his play but because Burke mis built this team and Phaneuff/Kessel are not the right pieces.
I'm sick of the rebuilding word it gets thrown around the world of sports way too often. This team is young yes but we're not re-building. We've already built a decent core of players, a re-building team is Columbus. Whether we're a playoff pretender is yet to be known, we were in 5th like two weeks ago, and now we're down to 7th and a couple of losses away from being completely out of it.

Stats01 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 12:48 PM
  #138
rojac
HFBoards Sponsor
 
rojac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Waterloo, ON
Posts: 7,562
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by egd27 View Post
Could use a few more fans like that too.

Just happened to be in the Oiler's thread, and most still believe their 13th place team can make the playoffs. Don't see much of that optimism here in fragile city.
Well, I'm convinced that because of the drama queens and negative nellies on these boards, the more rational posters have either left these boards entirely or have decided to no longer waste their energy arguing with them.

rojac is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 12:54 PM
  #139
Stats01
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,149
vCash: 580
Quote:
Originally Posted by rojac View Post
Well, I'm convinced that because of the drama queens and negative nellies on these boards, the more rational posters have either left these boards entirely or have decided to no longer waste their energy arguing with them.
Hard to be positive when they sucked ass against Winnipeg, and blew a game with 7 mins left in the third. Big 4 pts lost there. Plus last week they lost to Boston there's another 2 pts..big time of the year and this team is falling behind a bit here, what do you expect..happy faces?

In saying that though, an Ottawa loss tonight and a win against WPG we move up to 5th so still time to get back on track. This team has to bear down though at the end of games, I'm seeing the same sort of thing from the past collapses.

Stats01 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 02:24 PM
  #140
black charger
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: GTA
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,567
vCash: 500
I think there are a lot of people posting in this forum that aren't even Leaf fans.Take a look anytime there is a thread on the main board about the Leafs,nothing but sarcasm and negativity.

A week ago we were in 5th and threatening to tie it up with the Habs,a few losses and everyone wants to blow it up.Have a bit of patience.And stop trolling the team.

black charger is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 02:32 PM
  #141
Rinzler
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Mississauga
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,093
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by black charger View Post
I think there are a lot of people posting in this forum that aren't even Leaf fans.Take a look anytime there is a thread on the main board about the Leafs,nothing but sarcasm and negativity.

A week ago we were in 5th and threatening to tie it up with the Habs,a few losses and everyone wants to blow it up.Have a bit of patience.And stop trolling the team.
I generally try to stay away from these threads. Good for the health.

Rinzler is online now  
Old
03-16-2013, 02:37 PM
  #142
darrylsittler27
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 3,817
vCash: 500
I meant if...

We are out of it at trade deadline we need to take a serious look at some key parts.We clearly have too many 2nd rate centers and need that big number one center.If we arent going to school Gardiner we need to upgrade Phaneuff.Is it a rebuild or the final year of a proper build? I like Kessel but wonder if he is the right guy for that leadership/star role that leads this team to Stanley's cup.I wonder if Phaneuff is a number one dman.If we collapse again, isn't it time we faced up and realized some pieces are missing,serious pieces.

We need a star center and a number dman,to even make the semi's in the brutal East while Reimer and Scrivens need some time to grow.I just don't think we are quite there yet and by the time we are Liles,Phaneuff,Grabo,Macarthur will be past their prime anyway.At some point highly paid vets get in the way more than help.

We have $18 to $19 million tied up in just those 4 guys yet alone Komi.That is money for Weber and a star center.Which would you rather have when young guys like Kadri,Frattin,Gardiner,Reilly can fill those roles now?


Last edited by darrylsittler27: 03-16-2013 at 02:58 PM.
darrylsittler27 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 03:41 PM
  #143
Al14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,739
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alflives View Post
It's a great trade if Kessel returns a bottom feeder's first round pick this season. Kessel for McKinnon, Jones, or another top prospect from this year's draft would look very good. Plus, add to that, moving Kessel for a future pick would assure the Leafs own pick would be high this draft too. Then, perhaps, all Leafs' fans would no longer feel so badly about what Boston ended up with in the Kessel deal?
In a way, the sooner Kessel is gone, the sooner I can forget that trade with Boston!

Al14 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 03:42 PM
  #144
Daisy Jane
trust the vision
 
Daisy Jane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 35,050
vCash: 500
Yeah I think we've "past" rebuilding stage, for the most part we've "rebuilt". We just now need to retool (heh), to get the final pieces of the puzzle.

I hope that we make the playoffs. Even if we were swept by whomever, blown out every game, it give the team 4 games to know what a playoff atmosphere and the culture.

Daisy Jane is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 03:43 PM
  #145
Al14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 11,739
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by black charger View Post
I think there are a lot of people posting in this forum that aren't even Leaf fans.Take a look anytime there is a thread on the main board about the Leafs,nothing but sarcasm and negativity.

A week ago we were in 5th and threatening to tie it up with the Habs,a few losses and everyone wants to blow it up.Have a bit of patience.And stop trolling the team.
Can the team please stop trolling us fans and play a full 60 minute game?

Al14 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 03:52 PM
  #146
egd27
#freethebigpicture
 
egd27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 4,334
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by rojac View Post
Well, I'm convinced that because of the drama queens and negative nellies on these boards, the more rational posters have either left these boards entirely or have decided to no longer waste their energy arguing with them.
Any idea where they went? It does seem like the level of rationality has plummeted like an 18 wheeler going off a cliff.

egd27 is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 04:25 PM
  #147
HellasLEAF
#93Gilmour/#93Marner
 
HellasLEAF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Greece
Posts: 12,175
vCash: 500
I think we are right at the edge of the cliff anyway...

HellasLEAF is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 05:01 PM
  #148
Darcy Tucker
Registered User
 
Darcy Tucker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Richmond Hill, Ont
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,718
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HellasLEAF View Post
I think we are right at the edge of the cliff anyway...
tonights game is HUGE. 16-12-1 is decent. a loss and were close to .500

Darcy Tucker is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 05:38 PM
  #149
Kingstonian84*
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,069
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyrophorus View Post
Midst? Maybe after 7 straight more losses.



Weird thing is, we've played well, during this streak, for the most part.
Can I please have some of what your smoking? We have been god awful, we don't show up for until the 2nd half of the games, we're giving up 4-5 goals against per game, can't close out a lead (when we do have it) etc. The only and I mean ONLY bright spot during this streak is the PK unit which has been amazing, other then that I don't have many nice things to say right now about the leafs.

Kingstonian84* is offline  
Old
03-16-2013, 05:55 PM
  #150
Doug Gilmour
Leafer Since '95
 
Doug Gilmour's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Kingsville
Country: Mexico
Posts: 1,186
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotpaws View Post
We'll know after the next 3 games , Wpg/TB/Buff are all very winnable games .
Look at Detroit this year as an example of what needs to happen to break out slumps where you are losing games that should be "easy" wins.

March 9: LOST 3-0 to Columbus
March 10: LOST 3-2 to Columbus
March 13: LOST 5-2 to Calgary
March 15: WIN 3-2 to Edmonton
March 16: A game against the Canucks that they beat last meeting 8-3.

With this shortened season, every team is playing spoiler and every team is hunting for a playoff spot (with the exception of Florida).

The epic second half collapse of last season is something I can still see happening this year. I just don't see this team having the leadership and mental toughness to endure the hardships of playing a full season through with the intensity that start the season with. I hope Carlyle can push them through with Phaneuf leading the way.

Doug Gilmour is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:55 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2015 All Rights Reserved.