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Desharnais signed to a contract extension (4 years @ $3.5M/yr)

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Old
03-15-2013, 10:23 PM
  #551
Bad Natey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overlords View Post
That's really not so easy to say anymore.
No one is good on the PP anymore because no one gets the puck except Markov and Subban.

Quote:
Originally Posted by impudent_lowlife View Post
Desharnais plays very sheltered minutes, so he's not producing points against top opposition. Plekanecs and Eller face tougher opposition game in and game out than Desharnais, who is a defensive liability.
This really is not true.

Let's use Vancouver as a comparison;

Plekanec would play the Sedin/Sedin/Burrows line. Eller would play the Kesler/Raymond/Booth line. Desharnais would play the Higgins/Lapierre/Hansen line. Yes, the DD line should get scored on less (for some reason he gets ALL the flack for the poor defense on the line, he's a +4 over the past 15-games though).

DD would probably also play vs the Hamhuis pairing. So while, yes, DD's line faces "easier" minutes as far as worrying about defense goes, they usually tend to play the other teams best two-way line, and usually the most reliable defensive pair the opposition has to offer. It's not always the case, but generally that's how it turns out.


Last edited by Bad Natey: 03-15-2013 at 10:30 PM.
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03-15-2013, 10:26 PM
  #552
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Contract is ok but when the time comes for us to be a serious contender he'll have to go, Gally, Pleks, Eller are our top 3 centers for when things get serious.

That is all.

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03-15-2013, 10:34 PM
  #553
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I'm surprised the term is 4 year as I expected 3 but being at 3.5m its pretty cheap. He might turn out to be a steal for a while and is entering his prime. I hope people realise that.

Sure with him we have about 4 top6 (or very close to be top6) centers but depth has never hurt anyone. We can withstand injuries at the centerman position, who happen to be the most important forwards by far, better than any NHL team.

Oh and about the fact that he doesn't face the best lines : I'd rather he face the third or fourth line of opposing teams and produce while being paid what really is an average salary than watch an inferior player take his place.

Furthermore it gives us a position of strenght. We are strong at center since Galchenyuk made the team&with Eller breaking out. We are also strong in net with Carey Price. We are getting stronger on defense with our unexperienced defense getting steadier every passing game and with quality prospects like Tinordi&Beaulieu not so far from graduation.

If we win the cup it will be with a strong team. Good for us if we ice top6 players on the third line, top4 defensemen on the third pair and have the privilege to see Carey Price start a vast majority of games. Cup Winning teams often have an abundance of good players and I'd rather see Desharnais get ice than, say, a Travis Moen or Colby Armstrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Habs
I'm shocked at how many DD fanboys there are here, to be honest.
Including our evil General Manager and incompetent coach I suppose?


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03-15-2013, 10:53 PM
  #554
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I used to be a DD detractor, I thought his lack od size and speed would kill him at the NHL level, well I was wrong, maybe not totally wrong cause he will always have to face bigger guys and all but he definitely can play in this league and have a positive impact on our team.. Im happy with the deal, he worked hard enough and proved enough to earn a such contract, maybe the length is a bit too much, 3 years would have been perfect but perfect but still, solid move by Bergevin!

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03-15-2013, 10:55 PM
  #555
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Originally Posted by couris View Post
If his name was Gorges everyone would be happy with this signing(on HFboards).
The hilarious part is that Gorges is ridiculously overpaid while DD is paid just right, with the possibility of being underpaid if he can exceed that 60 pts season.

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03-15-2013, 11:01 PM
  #556
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I dont see him as a great player nor a bad one, just a guy that can be effective for a couple games then disappear for 3 or 4. If that garners 3.5 a season, why did PK have to sign for 2.8per, he brings it every night and is coveted throughout the league. He will surely get 5.5-6.5 on his next deal. With the cap rules tightening up, it makes me wonder how we can be a good team in the next few years. I think of Eller and Galchenyuk and Diaz, all due for hefty raises next time around. I think it was too much money for this player and hopefully his play can live up to it. I would have preferred to see him get 3 years at 2.5 per, 3.5 makes him tougher to move if things go sour.

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03-15-2013, 11:04 PM
  #557
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Galchenyuk plays 12 sheltered minutes while playing with Eller who is playing top opposition.

When Therrien see opponent 2nd line, the 1st thing he wants is to send Galchenyuk on the ice. Right?

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03-15-2013, 11:12 PM
  #558
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Originally Posted by Craig71 View Post
I dont see him as a great player nor a bad one, just a guy that can be effective for a couple games then disappear for 3 or 4. If that garners 3.5 a season, why did PK have to sign for 2.8per, he brings it every night and is coveted throughout the league. He will surely get 5.5-6.5 on his next deal. With the cap rules tightening up, it makes me wonder how we can be a good team in the next few years. I think of Eller and Galchenyuk and Diaz, all due for hefty raises next time around. I think it was too much money for this player and hopefully his play can live up to it. I would have preferred to see him get 3 years at 2.5 per, 3.5 makes him tougher to move if things go sour.
Disappears for 3-4 games? He doesn't produce every game, but he never disappears. He's always working hard. Always. Guy never takes a shift off. The only guys on our team that go harder are Prust and Gallagher.

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03-15-2013, 11:14 PM
  #559
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
The hilarious part is that Gorges is ridiculously overpaid while DD is paid just right, with the possibility of being underpaid if he can exceed that 60 pts season.
i know that this is a DD thread, but care to elaborate as to why you think Gorges is "ridiculously" overpaid?

how many UFA-contract dmen are out there who assume the role he does effectively with us, at less than 4M$?

from what I can tell, not many at all.

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03-15-2013, 11:24 PM
  #560
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
i know that this is a DD thread, but care to elaborate as to why you think Gorges is "ridiculously" overpaid?

how many UFA-contract dmen are out there who assume the role he does effectively with us, at less than 4M$?

from what I can tell, not many at all.
What role is that though ? Defensively reliable shot blocker sidekick to Subban?

He looked terrible away from Subban at the beginning of the year too.

I said ridiculously overpaid but that was probably a bit of an exaggeration.

I just don't think he brings that much to the table. A 6 years deal at 4M is a bit much. I'd have given him less than what DD is making and 3-4 years at most, and certainly not a NTC.

But then again, I am not very high on Gorges contrarily to most here.

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03-15-2013, 11:24 PM
  #561
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In a vacuum, this is a decent deal.

3.5m/yr is pretty good for a solid 2nd-line center. And Desharnais has shown enough over the past year and a half that he can be a solid scoring line center.

But I think that what bothers a lot of Habs fans here, and myself as well, is how it's hard to view this deal as anything short of "a commitment". The 4-year term is a significant commitment. It suggests that the Habs want Desharnais as a core part of our team (or at least as a core part of our supporting cast) for the mid-to-long term.


Well, if you look at where we are down the middle, that really does suggest a "decision" of sorts. We have Pleks, DD, Eller, and Chucky. Absolutely none of these guys is a 4th line center. Within 2 to 3 years, its possible that all of them are Top 6 centers. It's hard to imagine us keeping all four beyond the end of the 2013-2014 season.

I don't dislike DD, but he'd be the first of the four I'd let go (once either Eller or Chucky is ready for a full-time role on the top two lines). He doesn't have Pleks two-way game, or proven long-term NHL success. He doesn't have Eller's size and pedigree. And Chucky simply has more pure skill, with him being a 3rd overall pick that we have every reason to think will be an excellent 1st/2nd-line center for us one day.

I hope this doesn't mean that Pleks is going to be the odd man out in a year or less.

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03-15-2013, 11:28 PM
  #562
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Ok... The guy has 1 complete season in the nhl and in that season he made 60 points. A lot of you make it sound like it's easy as hell making that much point. It is not.

A lot of you act like he has reached is ceiling and forget that the guy is only in his 2nd complete season. He could and probably will improve.

Desharnais is a consistent offensive threat and cause a lot of penalty for the other team. He is hard to play against because he never gives up on the puck.

Desharnais has a better contract at 3.5 than Gorges at 4 and Moen for 4 years.

The way I see it : if Eller and Galchenyuk develop like we want them to, Plekanec is the odd man out because of his salary.

I'd rather have a 3.5 million Desharnais on the third line in 3 year than a 6 million Plekanec. Pleky is better defensively but in a salary cap structure the 3.5 Desharnais is more useful especially if you count in the fact that on a third line he could still be sheltered and not lose his effectiveness.

I'm disappointed in what I'm reading from a lot of you in here. Like Desharnais didn't prove that he's worth 3.5 million. What the ---- does he have to do to prove it ? A 100 point season ? It's like look at what's happenning on the ice rather than going with the theory. It'd help a lot of you.

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03-15-2013, 11:29 PM
  #563
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Originally Posted by HawkeyeCB View Post
Disappears for 3-4 games? He doesn't produce every game, but he never disappears. He's always working hard. Always. Guy never takes a shift off. The only guys on our team that go harder are Prust and Gallagher.
Disappears might be harsh but what about the rest of the post about the salary of a signed player and the guys that will command much higher salaries? Good for DD, he got paid, I would have given him less but thats just me on a message board, not looking to start a keyboard fight.

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03-15-2013, 11:33 PM
  #564
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Originally Posted by Darth Joker View Post
In a vacuum, this is a decent deal.

3.5m/yr is pretty good for a solid 2nd-line center. And Desharnais has shown enough over the past year and a half that he can be a solid scoring line center.

But I think that what bothers a lot of Habs fans here, and myself as well, is how it's hard to view this deal as anything short of "a commitment". The 4-year term is a significant commitment. It suggests that the Habs want Desharnais as a core part of our team (or at least as a core part of our supporting cast) for the mid-to-long term.


Well, if you look at where we are down the middle, that really does suggest a "decision" of sorts. We have Pleks, DD, Eller, and Chucky. Absolutely none of these guys is a 4th line center. Within 2 to 3 years, its possible that all of them are Top 6 centers. It's hard to imagine us keeping all four beyond the end of the 2013-2014 season. I don't dislike DD, but he'd be the first of the four I'd let go (once either Eller or Chucky is ready for a full-time role on the top two lines). He doesn't have Pleks two-way game, or proven long-term NHL success. He doesn't have Eller's size and pedigree. And Chucky simply has more pure skill, with him being a 3rd overall pick that we have every reason to think will be an excellent 1st/2nd-line center for us one day.

I hope this doesn't mean that Pleks is going to be the odd man out in a year or less.
Wish I could have said it like that.

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03-15-2013, 11:53 PM
  #565
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
What role is that though ? Defensively reliable shot blocker sidekick to Subban?

He looked terrible away from Subban at the beginning of the year too.

I said ridiculously overpaid but that was probably a bit of an exaggeration.

I just don't think he brings that much to the table. A 6 years deal at 4M is a bit much. I'd have given him less than what DD is making and 3-4 years at most, and certainly not a NTC.

But then again, I am not very high on Gorges contrarily to most here.
leads the team in PK ice time/game
2nd in ES ice time/game (while maintaining best +/- for dmen*)
leads team in blocked shots
3rd in hits for dmen
fewest turnovers of our regular dmen (>10 games)
2nd in team ES pts for a dman (despite fewest offensive zone starts)
only 4 minor penalties in 27 games -->T-4th (despite 20+min + primariy D-zone starts)


Gorges is, right now, playing about as well as any "defensive" dman in the league, while actually producing effectively at ES.
The entertainment reality of the league is such that we fans overvalue point production in evaluating the value of players, and being an entertainment industry first and foremost, the contracts tend to reflect that...

but from a hockey pov, Gorges @ 3.9M$ on a 70M$ cap is ridiculously good value... @ a 64M$ cap, he will remain a good value.
He does a lot for the team, even if it's not the type of things that will get featured on in TSN highlights or game recaps.

we were lucky to snag him and I highly doubt that he'll ever be a burden at his 3.9M$ cap hit.



*i know +/- can be misconstrued... but with Gorges, fact that he gets fewest Off zone starts & yet still leads the defense in +/-, while playing 20+min/night (with no pp time), i think it does reflect positively on his impact.

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03-16-2013, 12:32 AM
  #566
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
If we win the cup it will be with a strong team. Good for us if we ice top6 players on the third line, top4 defensemen on the third pair and have the privilege to see Carey Price start a vast majority of games. Cup Winning teams often have an abundance of good players and I'd rather see Desharnais get ice than, say, a Travis Moen or Colby Armstrong.
Completely agree! If we're fortunate enough to have 9 forwards better than DD, it will be a great day to be a Hab fan. Until then, at worst DD will continue to provide offence from whatever line he's on.

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I dont see him as a great player nor a bad one, just a guy that can be effective for a couple games then disappear for 3 or 4. If that garners 3.5 a season, why did PK have to sign for 2.8per, he brings it every night and is coveted throughout the league. He will surely get 5.5-6.5 on his next deal. With the cap rules tightening up, it makes me wonder how we can be a good team in the next few years. I think of Eller and Galchenyuk and Diaz, all due for hefty raises next time around. I think it was too much money for this player and hopefully his play can live up to it. I would have preferred to see him get 3 years at 2.5 per, 3.5 makes him tougher to move if things go sour.
Ryder (Cole) expires this year along with the likely buyout of Kaberle so that's $8.75M free this summer. Next summer Markov and Gionta expire, which frees $10.75M. We'll have the money to keep these guys.

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03-16-2013, 12:37 AM
  #567
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Well, if you look at where we are down the middle, that really does suggest a "decision" of sorts. We have Pleks, DD, Eller, and Chucky. Absolutely none of these guys is a 4th line center. Within 2 to 3 years, its possible that all of them are Top 6 centers. It's hard to imagine us keeping all four beyond the end of the 2013-2014 season.
I think you're getting ahead of yourself. This move assures depth at centre and depth on offence. It does not imply a "decision" (which, if there is a decision coming, won't have to made for at least another year and a half). This move is all about asset management and to me signals that the Habs will be rolling 3 offensive lines for the indefinite future, which thrills me.

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03-16-2013, 12:52 AM
  #568
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I think you're getting ahead of yourself. This move assures depth at centre and depth on offence. It does not imply a "decision" (which, if there is a decision coming, won't have to made for at least another year and a half). This move is all about asset management and to me signals that the Habs will be rolling 3 offensive lines for the indefinite future, which thrills me.
Pretty much this. I don't see anyone else's job in danger here. Reality is, we have a good group and each contributes, they are trying to keep the core intact for time being.

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03-16-2013, 01:05 AM
  #569
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Ok... The guy has 1 complete season in the nhl and in that season he made 60 points. A lot of you make it sound like it's easy as hell making that much point. It is not.

A lot of you act like he has reached is ceiling and forget that the guy is only in his 2nd complete season. He could and probably will improve.

Desharnais is a consistent offensive threat and cause a lot of penalty for the other team. He is hard to play against because he never gives up on the puck.

Desharnais has a better contract at 3.5 than Gorges at 4 and Moen for 4 years.

The way I see it : if Eller and Galchenyuk develop like we want them to, Plekanec is the odd man out because of his salary.

I'd rather have a 3.5 million Desharnais on the third line in 3 year than a 6 million Plekanec. Pleky is better defensively but in a salary cap structure the 3.5 Desharnais is more useful especially if you count in the fact that on a third line he could still be sheltered and not lose his effectiveness.

I'm disappointed in what I'm reading from a lot of you in here. Like Desharnais didn't prove that he's worth 3.5 million. What the ---- does he have to do to prove it ? A 100 point season ? It's like look at what's happenning on the ice rather than going with the theory. It'd help a lot of you.
Pleks the odd man out.. are you serious? As someone said earlier DD can't carry Pleks jockstrap.You WIN with 2 way player like Pleks, you loose in the playoffs with DD. I've watched most of the games this year and I think I've seen DD throw 2 bodychecks all year.

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03-16-2013, 01:06 AM
  #570
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Pretty good deal. Bergevin does it again.

If we lived in a science-fiction we would say "oh but we need to be bigger at the center position!". But it's the real World and DD is a good player. So you sign that.

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03-16-2013, 01:10 AM
  #571
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Pleks the odd man out.. are you serious? As someone said earlier DD can't carry Pleks jockstrap.You WIN with 2 way player like Pleks, you loose in the playoffs with DD. I've watched most of the games this year and I think I've seen DD throw 2 bodychecks all year.
Yea like Plekanec checks hurt so much. DD doesn't hit but get his nose dirty in front of the net way above Plek in that department. He's like Gallgaher and Dumont, little guys with tons of heart that go in front of the net where it's supposed to hurt.

But it's pointless to go into another DD vs Plek thing, they are both good players.

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03-16-2013, 01:10 AM
  #572
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Matt Stajan makes 3.5m a year and had 18 pts last year. Someone would have given Desharnais 3m. A contender? No, not likely, but the Canadiens obviously felt he was a part of their core. Remains to be seen if it works out. It's definitely not a bargain but I don't see it hampering them in any way.
Desharnais is part of the secondary core, till age 30 now. That's ok. I actually didn't mind locking him up for four prime years of his career. I thought we might have had him cheaper. But it's true that even $3.5M money is not #1 C type of money, not at all. Looking again at contracts around the NHL for guys approaching UFA years, this one is not that unreasonable. In hindsight I guess I was looking for a steal due to the timing of the move, and I was wrong.

However, in a cap world of around $65M, the average salary of the 20 starters is about $3.15M and so from that point of view, this contract will not hinder us. DD's stats are good enough to justify a slightly above average contract.

One thing I don't buy is that this signing reduces the role of anyone else on the team. The coaches will play the guys the way they want to play them, just like they did yesterday.

Yesterday, we had Plekanec, Desharnais, Eller and Galchenyuk in the mix, and tomorrow nothing changes, except that we now know that we won't be losing any of them to UFA status until 2016 at the earliest. In the meantime, Galchenyuk is playing wing, and one day maybe Eller will switch positions with him, or not, but it is great to have this kind of depth for the next few years secured.

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03-16-2013, 01:14 AM
  #573
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The issue here is 4 years.

2 years would have been perfect.
4 years is perfect. Cause two years it's "screw you" money. And 4 years at 3.5 you can trade the guy if you want to upgrade. It's easy to take that contract by another team.

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03-16-2013, 01:15 AM
  #574
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Desharnais plays very sheltered minutes, so he's not producing points against top opposition. Plekanecs and Eller face tougher opposition game in and game out than Desharnais, who is a defensive liability.
Eller is CAPABLE of handling defensive zone duties better, I totally agree, but at this time, playing with Pacioretty, Desharnais is not getting sheltered minutes, it is the Eller-Galchenyuk line that gets sheltered sometimes, which is ok given Alex's age and inexperience.

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03-16-2013, 01:18 AM
  #575
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never such a thing as having too many centers! as for plekanec leaving - that would be sad

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