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Datsyuk is the best 2 way player in the world

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Old
03-17-2013, 07:07 PM
  #301
Magnifique
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Dats and Toews do the same things, but Dats does them better. Add that he is one of the hardest players in the NHL to defend, while Toews is not, and you start to see why he is "so much" better to some people.

And the many that say Toews is overrated because he is Canadian have a fair point. If Dats was Canadian, this wouldn't even be a discussion. Everyone would submit that he is one of the top-five players in the world without any debate.

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03-17-2013, 07:08 PM
  #302
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Originally Posted by BigBootsie View Post
Doesn't do what? Score? Wasn't that Datsyuk's first goal in like 12 games?

Take the puck away from the other team? Datsyuk has one more "Takeaway" than Toews.

"Giveaways"? Toews ranked overall at 122 with 15, Dats at 22 with 23.

Not sure what your point is.
Still no matter what kinda situation it would be or whether it was a single game or 7-game series I would always choose Pavel Datsyuk in my team before Jonathan Toews. Sidney Crosby is the only player in the world I'd even consider taking before Datsyuk.

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03-17-2013, 07:08 PM
  #303
Novak Djokovic
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You keep saying they are overrated because of defense. Yet you have yet to give a reason as to why defense is overrated. The object of the game is to win. To win you have to outscore your opponent. The objective of every player is to contribute to scoring/stopping the other team from scoring. Datsyuk has three Selkies, he controls the play through possession, he's elite at reading the play and taking the puck from the opposing player.


All I see us the same posters parrot the crap over and over. Overrated, defense is overrated, take a ways are overrated, dangles this, dekes that, Youtube blah blah blah. Guess what the entire hockey world disagree with you. Opposing fans rave about him, opposing players rank him near the top in numerous categories and overall, every front office guy and coach calls him a top five or so player as does the hockey media.

At some point you have to wonder if it's you that is wrong and not everyone around you.

As a Karlsson fan you should understand thus more than most.
I have already admitted that Datsyuk is excellent defensively, but his primary goal is to score. You have two defensemen and a goalie to stop the puck. If I want a forward, I want the one that can score... as long as they aren't a liability defensively. He's a great player, but he's not the best two-way player. Crosby is, and I'd rank last year's Stamkos and Malkin ahead of him too. "Two-way" in my mind is best combination of offense and defense, therefore, after weighing both, I'd rank Datsyuk 4th in the league. Feel free to disagree.

Karlsson was 25 points ahead of the next defenseman. Datsyuk isn't ahead of any forward by that much in defense.

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03-17-2013, 07:08 PM
  #304
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I think Datsyuk is little better in both zones. They aren't separated by much...so no Datsyuk is not >> Toews.

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03-17-2013, 07:09 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by BigBootsie View Post
So one youtube video can tell you why Datsyuk is better than Toews?

I provided numbers because the topic is discussing "What makes Pavel Datsyuk so much better than Jonathan Toews?"
One youtube video? Lol...did you just start watching the NHL after the blackhawks won the cup? Datsyuk is a magician on ice, you shouldn't need youtube videos to tell you that. And shouldn't you hawks fan, new or old, be very familiar with Datsyuks skills in all 3 zones?

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03-17-2013, 07:09 PM
  #306
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Datsyuk is better offensively and defensively. He's also much more entertaining to watch

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03-17-2013, 07:09 PM
  #307
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As a Wings fan, you know what scared me about Sakic? His wrist shot.

You know what scared me about Forsberg? Everything.
Know what didn't scare me about Forsberg? His feet.

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03-17-2013, 07:09 PM
  #308
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Datsyuk can make every player in the NHL look like a fool. Toews, well, he is the typical Canadian hockey player: decent skill set and he is good winning battles for the puck. Datsyuk can excel both in small and large surfaces; Toews, as many other North American stars, would suck if he had to play on regular basis in the a large rink.

That's not necessary bad. The same things happens with a lot of Russian players, like Mozyakin, Morozov or Zaripov, who are unstoppable in large surfaces but suck in small rinks.

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03-17-2013, 07:10 PM
  #309
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Originally Posted by Yotes Persevere View Post
Dats and Toews do the same things, but Dats does them better. Add that he is one of the hardest players in the NHL to defend, while Toews is not, and you start to see why he is "so much" better to some people.

And the many that say Toews is overrated because he is Canadian have a fair point. If Dats was Canadian, this wouldn't even be a discussion. Everyone would submit that he is one of the top-five players in the world without any debate.
But everyone already considers Datsyuk a top 5 player...

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03-17-2013, 07:10 PM
  #310
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Toews isn't usually ranked much lower than Datsyuk is he? And some even rank Toews higher. Both very good players who play the right way.

That said Datsyuk has accomplished more, he generally produces more offensively (last couple of season's he's been having some injury problems and terrible linemates which has dragged down his production), and he can take over games in a way that I haven't really seen Toews do.

Actually I think Zetterberg/Toews is a better comparison. They're more similar. Datsyuk is a tier above, even if the difference is far from night and day. Toews is still very young though and can improve. And he's far from overlooked or underrated. Just about everyone respects him. No need to worry about where he's ranked on someones arbitrary top 10 list.

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03-17-2013, 07:10 PM
  #311
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I'd say defensively they're equal but unlike Toews, Datsyuk just commands the other side of the ice. His stickhandling/hockey IQ are among the best, if not the best, in the NHL. Toews needs to hit 80 points first.

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03-17-2013, 07:11 PM
  #312
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
Datsyuk: 30 points in 28 games.
Toews: 26 points in 28 games.

Datsyuk's most common linemates: Justin Abdelkader. Dan Cleary
Toews' most common linemates: Marian Hossa. Brandon Saad.

Anddd... Bootsie's about to get mad.
I ain't even mad tho. I love Datsyuk, guy's a beast.

But what you're saying is, since Toews has better linemates, Datsyuk is a better player??

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03-17-2013, 07:11 PM
  #313
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I was merely trying to demonstrate flashier isn't always better.
You know Sakic was the better player right?
It wasn't Sakic Bowman matched Lidstrom up against.

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03-17-2013, 07:12 PM
  #314
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Originally Posted by ottawa View Post
One youtube video? Lol...did you just start watching the NHL after the blackhawks won the cup? Datsyuk is a magician on ice, you shouldn't need youtube videos to tell you that. And shouldn't you hawks fan, new or old, be very familiar with Datsyuks skills in all 3 zones?
He's been around here longer than you and I have been, but if you really want the answer to that question, check his join date...

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03-17-2013, 07:14 PM
  #315
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Originally Posted by BigBootsie View Post
I ain't even mad tho. I love Datsyuk, guy's a beast.

But what you're saying is, since Toews has better linemates, Datsyuk is a better player??
No what he's saying is that Datsyuk is outscoring Toews even though he has worse linemates. Reverse the roles (Datsyuk on blackhawks and Toews on the wings) and Datsyuk would have more points for sure and Toews may have less (I would assume he would)

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03-17-2013, 07:16 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by ottawa View Post
One youtube video? Lol...did you just start watching the NHL after the blackhawks won the cup? Datsyuk is a magician on ice, you shouldn't need youtube videos to tell you that. And shouldn't you hawks fan, new or old, be very familiar with Datsyuks skills in all 3 zones?
I started watching hockey in 92. So yes, it was after the Hawks won a couple of Cups.

And yes, I'm very familiar with Datsyuk playing against the Hawks.

He's not a "Magician" on the ice. It's an even worse term than intangibles. Well maybe, not, but it's close. But good job repeating what Pierre McGuire tells you about Datsyuk playing with magic.

Datsyuk is a ******* beast, and obviously has accomplished more than Toews has. He's been in the league a few years longer, right?

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03-17-2013, 07:16 PM
  #317
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
He's been around here longer than you and I have been, but if you really want the answer to that question, check his join date...
I don't care about his join date, I didn't even notice it but it was during the hawks' cup run and that's not why I made my previous comment (about him being new to hockey). You could join the boards today and have been watching hockey for 40 years, don't read too much into join dates.

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03-17-2013, 07:16 PM
  #318
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
He's been around here longer than you and I have been, but if you really want the answer to that question, check his join date...
I didn't realize you have to register to this site to posses hockey knowledge.
I'm sure Timmy 10 yo is much more knowledgeable beacuse he reistered first.

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Old
03-17-2013, 07:17 PM
  #319
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Originally Posted by BigBootsie View Post
I ain't even mad tho. I love Datsyuk, guy's a beast.

But what you're saying is, since Toews has better linemates, Datsyuk is a better player??
Better would be an understatement in terms of linemates. As I recall, one of Datsyuk's two best offensive seasons came when he was playing with Hossa. And his other linemate at that time was Holmstrom...

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03-17-2013, 07:18 PM
  #320
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Datsyuk is a HFBoards darling?

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03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
  #321
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Because Datsyuk has ever had a PPG season.

I know there's a lot more to hockey then just points, but this is a big one.

The main reasons that Datsyuk is so much better though aren't things you whip numbers out to prove. Just actually focus on each of them while they play. Toews is a fantastic player, he busts his hump on all 200 feet of the ice, he's got great hands and he's pretty all you could ask for in a hockey player. But Datsyuk is a one of kind player because of other things, because of his creativity, his unparalleled hockey sense, and the fact that he is constantly improving his game, trying new things, and plays like an 18-year-old even as he's gaining on 35.

Of course, Datsyuk can never be considered strong defensively, because he doesn't kill penalties, so Toews AINEC.

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03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
  #322
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Originally Posted by Wingsfan2965 View Post
He's been around here longer than you and I have been, but if you really want the answer to that question, check his join date...
LOL, that's a good one. Hats off to you good sir.

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03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
  #323
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datsyuk is more creative and he's all around way more talented, his hands are incredible and his ability to win puck battles are truely amazing.

toews is clutch and is usually the hardest working player on the ice, he has a no quit attitude.


in the end man, its too hard to not pick datsyuk as the number 2 way forward in the league, he's just incredible to watch

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03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
  #324
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Datsyuk has tangibles, Toews has intangibles.

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03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
  #325
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Not much these days. Datsyuk isn't a 90+ point player anymore and Toews offensive game is getting better. It's close these days. Still think Pavel is slightly better both offensively and defensively.

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