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Alain Vigneault/coaching discussion thread - Part 4

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Old
03-18-2013, 04:55 PM
  #576
vanuck
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TallPoppySyndrome View Post
I know that this is going to start going in around in a circle,,but I don't think it has been that long. since the SCF, this team has had an improving win record. each half season better then the last, until this slump of about one month, I know people will say it was because of goal tending, but that conversation was thrashed by myself and others in the last AV thread.
The win record doesn't tell the whole story either. It was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck, cycle etc. weren't effective anymore. During last playoffs LA seemingly had our game plan read like a book. Same with the PP which has been decidely mediocre for about a calendar year too.

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03-18-2013, 05:35 PM
  #577
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Isn't the constant complaint that AV's teams have always sat back with the lead? I believe that is one of the constant criticism's of AV on this board.

I think it's human nature to sit back and not try and make mistakes with the lead. When you don't need to score, you take your foot off the pedal, it's actually pretty common.
I don't know. They had no issue with keeping up the pressure in recent years when they had so much success. This year though they seem to be sitting back as soon as they're up by one. Would the players change mindset so easily/quickly?

Darryl Sutter has mentioned he wants the Kings to attack all the time even with a lead. Hawks did it too in their Cup year. Same with Detroit who almost never let up on you.

Agree with the rest of your post though.

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03-18-2013, 07:26 PM
  #578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
The win record doesn't tell the whole story either. It was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck, cycle etc. weren't effective anymore. During last playoffs LA seemingly had our game plan read like a book. Same with the PP which has been decidely mediocre for about a calendar year too.
It is not that I don't see a need for change, I am just prepared to give the organisation the benefit of the doubt that they can make the changes needed (for this season anyway). and the reason I think they were not made until now (hopefully) is because it is hard to make changes to, what could be described as (until mid feb) a winning formula.

sadly we are close to the point were no matter what changes are made it will be shoveling **** uphill, due to a very un-threatening roster.

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Old
03-18-2013, 08:13 PM
  #579
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It's at the point where seeing people chew gum in day to day life irritates me.

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03-18-2013, 08:15 PM
  #580
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
The win record doesn't tell the whole story either. It was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck, cycle etc. weren't effective anymore.
no, it was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck and cycle have, at points this season, been ineffective. if you want to demonstrate that they are consistently ineffective you need a lot more data than the stuff tiranis posted

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03-18-2013, 09:09 PM
  #581
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Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
no, it was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck and cycle have, at points this season, been ineffective. if you want to demonstrate that they are consistently ineffective you need a lot more data than the stuff tiranis posted
I know the numbers don't lie. This is still a top 5 possession team in terms of score-adjusted Fenwick. But is there any other way to illustrate it when it happens in-game without using gifs, and with numbers instead?

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03-18-2013, 09:11 PM
  #582
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Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
I know the numbers don't lie. This is still a top 5 possession team in terms of score-adjusted Fenwick. But is there any other way to illustrate it when it happens in-game without using gifs, and with numbers instead?
you could count zone entries and see how they matchup to minnesota and philly from that sloan conference, i guess

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03-18-2013, 10:19 PM
  #583
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Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
you could count zone entries and see how they matchup to minnesota and philly from that sloan conference, i guess
The sports stats conference? What's up with that one, and why Minny and Philly in particular?

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03-18-2013, 10:24 PM
  #584
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Originally Posted by vanuck View Post
The sports stats conference? What's up with that one, and why Minny and Philly in particular?
http://nhlnumbers.com/2013/2/20/zone...ics-conference

minny/philly because those are the dudes that volunteered to count the zone entries, i think

there's a lot of really cool conclusions and stuff in that post/paper. read it if you have an interest!

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Old
03-18-2013, 10:42 PM
  #585
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Minnesota knows they can go back and get the puck without getting hit.

We're easy to play against.

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03-18-2013, 10:59 PM
  #586
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Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
no, it was illustrated that our breakouts, forecheck and cycle have, at points this season, been ineffective. if you want to demonstrate that they are consistently ineffective you need a lot more data than the stuff tiranis posted
I think the question always has to be: can the team be better or not? Even if the results are good possession-wise, my feeling from seeing some of the issues is that we could be even better with some significant adjustments. You also have to wonder how much of that success is resting on the pure dominance of the Sedins.

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03-18-2013, 11:16 PM
  #587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
http://nhlnumbers.com/2013/2/20/zone...ics-conference

minny/philly because those are the dudes that volunteered to count the zone entries, i think

there's a lot of really cool conclusions and stuff in that post/paper. read it if you have an interest!
That's a lot of stuff in there. Thanks for the link!

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Old
03-18-2013, 11:24 PM
  #588
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I credit AV with that PP goal.

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03-19-2013, 12:36 AM
  #589
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I credit AV with that PP goal.
And I credit him with yet another dismal and tedious loss. Division on the line and we come out with no fight, drive or any real interest. This team is about as lively as a zombie.

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03-19-2013, 12:39 AM
  #590
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AV should have been fired after last season. Team fell apart after jan 2012 and got worked in the playoffs. Gillis needs to stop being such a pansy.

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03-19-2013, 12:42 AM
  #591
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AV should have been fired after last season. Team fell apart after jan 2012 and got worked in the playoffs. Gillis needs to stop being such a pansy.
The reason Gillis keeps Vigneault is so that he can have a scapegoat for turning an elite team into mediocreness...

I hate this GM I hate this coach. We really need a new face besides these arrogant fools.

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Old
03-19-2013, 12:45 AM
  #592
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Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
I credit AV with that PP goal.
I also credit him that we went 40 or so for nothign before it. Wow you got 1 PP goal!!! Jack Adams!!

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Old
03-19-2013, 12:50 AM
  #593
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Originally Posted by Grub View Post
The reason Gillis keeps Vigneault is so that he can have a scapegoat for turning an elite team into mediocreness...

I hate this GM I hate this coach. We really need a new face besides these arrogant fools.
How could Gillis fire AV they only have two NHL centers. They have played a total of 7 games this seson with three NHL centers. How is any coach going to win matchup w Ebbet Schoeder and Lappy as three of your centers.

IF we even had Bozak on this team instead of Ebbet and the team was still no good i would say yeh AV needs to go. W no centers there is no hope.Need Kesler and one more NHL center. If Gillis does not acquire one then this season is on him period.

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Old
03-19-2013, 12:54 AM
  #594
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Originally Posted by Catamarca Livin View Post
How could Gillis fire AV they only have two NHL centers. They have played a total of 7 games this seson with three NHL centers. How is any coach going to win matchup w Ebbet Schoeder and Lappy as three of your centers.

IF we even had Bozak on this team instead of Ebbet and the team was still no good i would say yeh AV needs to go. W no centers there is no hope.Need Kesler and one more NHL center. If Gillis does not acquire one then this season is on him period.
This team has played like garbage since jan 2012. AV just sits there and blames the team or injuries the entire time. He doesn't take any responsibility for this team losing. The team has tuned him out. It's time for him to get out.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:04 AM
  #595
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they need a hard ass coach. not some gum chewing *******

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:05 AM
  #596
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they need a hard ass coach. not some gum chewing *******
Time for some Ruff love?

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03-19-2013, 01:10 AM
  #597
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The official fire Alain Vigneault thread: "he tried his best"

I know there's a discussion thread, I felt this deserves it's own thread, He's done in Vancouver and I'll welcome change.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:11 AM
  #598
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I approve of this thread.

#FIREAV

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:11 AM
  #599
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Time for some Ruff love?
I don't think Ruff is a hard ass at all.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:12 AM
  #600
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Fire French Coach.

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