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Alain Vigneault/coaching discussion thread - Part 4

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Old
03-19-2013, 12:49 PM
  #676
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Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
Smith
Turris
Zibanejad
Regin

That's not even mentioning their wingers or their D or that they have a prospect in net.
And the thing is, they were more or less thought of as a 7th-9th place type of team with a HEALTHY lineup.

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03-19-2013, 12:50 PM
  #677
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thank-you. it's not rocket science is it
I guess Paul McLean is related to Wernher von Braun.

The Leafs have one 2nd line center, one rookie and a bunch of meh down the middle (as well as missing their 1st line winger for much of this season). Two sophmore goalies in net. And they're doing as well as us. I have higher expectations than that for this team. Not alot higher given the injuries but we should be better than that.

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03-19-2013, 12:54 PM
  #678
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Originally Posted by blendini View Post
Sedins Burrows
Raymond Ebbett Hansen
Higgins Lapierre Weise
Sestito Schroeder Pinni

There's the problem right there. That is not a lineup that can win NHL games.
Really? That's pretty much the same group that won all those games against the division at the beginning of the season and they're not even able to do that anymore.

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03-19-2013, 12:58 PM
  #679
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Really? That's pretty much the same group that won all those games against the division at the beginning of the season and they're not even able to do that anymore.
this would be worth something if we played a 10 game season

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03-19-2013, 01:01 PM
  #680
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this would be worth something if we played a 10 game season
How about half a season (last year).....Where the team was playing lethargically (defensively); relying on goaltending to bail them out?

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03-19-2013, 01:01 PM
  #681
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Originally Posted by stickside View Post
this would be worth something if we played a 10 game season
Does it matter when you win as long as you get the win?

The point was that this group has still stayed largely the same so the excuse that they're incapable of winning games even against division rivals doesn't fly.

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03-19-2013, 01:03 PM
  #682
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Does it matter when you win as long as you get the win?

The point was that this group has still stayed largely the same so the excuse that they're incapable of winning games even against division rivals doesn't fly.
It's not like they had such a great record during the games Kesler played. I believe we went 2-3-2 with him in the line-up?

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03-19-2013, 01:03 PM
  #683
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Does it matter when you win as long as you get the win?

The point was that this group has still stayed largely the same so the excuse that they're incapable of winning games even against division rivals doesn't fly.
soooo....what's changed? why aren't they able to win anymore?

my point is over the long haul that lineup is awful. the cream rises to the top or sinks to the bottom.

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03-19-2013, 01:03 PM
  #684
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all the av apologists that want to blame gillis for the state of the team, the current team has an elite first line, some tweeners, some elite 3rd liners, a deep blue line and retarded depth in goal. they should have a balanced offense and a rock solid defensive game. what they actually have is an anemic offense, putrid special teams and a leaky defense. if you don't think this roster can play any better than it is then it's time to just have the fire sale and work for a good draft pick. championship window closed.

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03-19-2013, 01:08 PM
  #685
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Originally Posted by mrbitterguy View Post
all the av apologists that want to blame gillis for the state of the team, the current team has an elite first line, some tweeners, some elite 3rd liners, a deep blue line and retarded depth in goal.
Nah, we're not supposed to beat lottery pick teams consistantly even with that. That's asking too much from the coach.

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03-19-2013, 01:14 PM
  #686
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Nah, we're not supposed to beat lottery pick teams consistantly even with that. That's asking too much from the coach.
maybe gillis needs to grow a pair and go into the locker room - a'la brian burke

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03-19-2013, 01:24 PM
  #687
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Great, now he's on Team 1040 blaming the goaltending and special teams.

"I need to be able to come in here after the game and say my goaltender was better than their goaltender"

He does have a point but how does he keep putting his foot in his mouth? He should have just gone with "we need to improve in all areas".

I mean he's basically calling out the Sedins, Edler, and Schneider/Luongo. You have a case with Edler and the goalies (only lately) but the Sedins have been a constant and until the last couple of games so have the goalies.

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03-19-2013, 01:27 PM
  #688
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maybe gillis needs to grow a pair and go into the locker room - a'la brian burke
Well we can certainly use Burke's vote of confidence regarding coaches right? (eg., his buddy Wilson after giving him a contract extension then canning him a few months later). Not that I don't think Keenan should've been sent to the EI office but how can anyone forgot "I will not judge Keenan until we deal Bure because it wouldn't be fair". After the trade, Keenan's record was 1-1 before he was canned.

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03-19-2013, 01:27 PM
  #689
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Originally Posted by mossey3535 View Post
Great, now he's on Team 1040 blaming the goaltending and special teams.

"I need to be able to come in here after the game and say my goaltender was better than their goaltender"

He does have a point but how does he keep putting his foot in his mouth? He should have just gone with "we need to improve in all areas".

I mean he's basically calling out the Sedins, Edler, and Schneider/Luongo. You have a case with Edler and the goalies (only lately) but the Sedins have been a constant and until the last couple of games so have the goalies.
wait a second...are you telling me he's trying to motivate players in the press? the nerve.

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03-19-2013, 01:29 PM
  #690
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wait a second...are you telling me he's trying to motivate players in the press? the nerve.
Motivate the Sedins are who actually playing like 1st line forwards this season? Really? The same coach who admitted that he doesn't tell the Sedins how to do anything because "he doesn't understand them".

Why doesn't he tell Bieksa to get his head out of his azz?

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03-19-2013, 01:30 PM
  #691
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Originally Posted by mossey3535 View Post
Great, now he's on Team 1040 blaming the goaltending and special teams.

"I need to be able to come in here after the game and say my goaltender was better than their goaltender"

He does have a point but how does he keep putting his foot in his mouth? He should have just gone with "we need to improve in all areas".

I mean he's basically calling out the Sedins, Edler, and Schneider/Luongo. You have a case with Edler and the goalies (only lately) but the Sedins have been a constant and until the last couple of games so have the goalies.
Can you tell me what show its on so I can find the podcast later on??

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03-19-2013, 01:35 PM
  #692
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soooo....what's changed? why aren't they able to win anymore?

my point is over the long haul that lineup is awful. the cream rises to the top or sinks to the bottom.
First off it was a response to an overly simplistic way of looking at the roster and making conclusions from that alone and which was patently false.

Perhaps against other conference foes only, yeah we probably see the 'cream' sink to the bottom over the long haul. But against divisional opponents like CGY and MIN? We've dominated possession against them, yet like last night struggle to create enough chances. The difference between us and them is not just Kesler. That's putting way too much responsibility on his absence when we have a very good 1st line plus a wealth of two-way players and arguably the deepest D-corps in the league. Not to mention the goaltending... Even without him there's still enough good players on this team that they shouldn't be struggling like this.

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03-19-2013, 01:41 PM
  #693
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Barry Trotz's tenure says hi.
nashville's new market and the need for a permanent fixture in the marketplace says thanks

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03-19-2013, 01:46 PM
  #694
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nashville's new market and the need for a permanent fixture in the marketplace says thanks
That would only be relevant if you felt he was doing a poor/medicore job and is still employed there because of that.

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03-19-2013, 01:49 PM
  #695
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That would only be relevant if you felt he was doing a poor/medicore job and is still employed there because of that.
well, the teams he had to work with at the beginning of his tenure weren't much to write home about

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03-19-2013, 01:52 PM
  #696
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well, the teams he had to work with at the beginning of his tenure weren't much to write home about


Difference between this team and the AV coached Canucks that missed the playoffs in 2007-08?

1) Luongo's "mind" was elsewhere after the all-star break (his wife's difficult preg) and AV had no other option in net
2) Blueline was injury riddled

This is why AV deserved alot of slack to be cut then but not now.


Last edited by Barney Gumble: 03-19-2013 at 02:01 PM.
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03-19-2013, 01:59 PM
  #697
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Can you tell me what show its on so I can find the podcast later on??
Sekeres and Price.

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03-19-2013, 02:08 PM
  #698
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If he's blaming the goaltending he's out of his mind. The goaltending is why he still had a job this year.
They've struggled of late, but the D In front of them had been brutal and baffling.
Luongo and Schneider must look at AV like he's an idiot.

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03-19-2013, 02:19 PM
  #699
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If he's blaming the goaltending he's out of his mind. The goaltending is why he still had a job this year.
They've struggled of late, but the D In front of them had been brutal and baffling.
Luongo and Schneider must look at AV like he's an idiot.
WHY in public? That's a big issue with AV. He needs to learn to keep his mouth shut, or at least make it sound like he is sharing some of the blame.

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03-19-2013, 02:23 PM
  #700
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Originally Posted by mrbitterguy View Post
all the av apologists that want to blame gillis for the state of the team, the current team has an elite first line, some tweeners, some elite 3rd liners, a deep blue line and retarded depth in goal. they should have a balanced offense and a rock solid defensive game. what they actually have is an anemic offense, putrid special teams and a leaky defense. if you don't think this roster can play any better than it is then it's time to just have the fire sale and work for a good draft pick. championship window closed.
hehe people would probably say I am an apologist, although the term seems to be use as a derogatory term on hockey forums... I see myself as someone who tries to look at these guys and see things from there point of view, and not use my emotional based reasoning to determine perceived performance. I think the answer can lie in the middle and is not as black and white as painted around here.

AV has got a stink roster at the moment, It has key positional changes, and so he has had to adapt, this is harder when the players are not putting a 60 min game together.

MG has had a string of bad circumstances that have prevented him making any moves with our assets. I will not get into It in the AV thread but I don't think MG could have done much more then he has.

Our team is going to go into the playoffs in this log jam, or just missing it. from there who knows, we get Kesler back, the team gets hot, anything could happen in the playoffs, if you make the playoffs each year then we are perennial contenders IMO.

This is not a fire sale...

Next year, Goalie gone, Ballard gone, Alberts and Barker gone, also a couple of forwards gone...

Jensen comes in to line up, Kesler and Booth healthy, all of a sudden we have a Great top 9 and a better 4 line then before, all energy, big hits and Pkers

AHL team moves to Abby, and we have a heap of promising prospects getting key roles.

We haven't even started talking about UFAs and return for the goalie trade...

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