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Do you have a bone in your body that can root for your team to tank?

View Poll Results: Do you have a bone in your body that can root for your team to tank?
Yes, I can root for them to tank 45 50.00%
No, it invalidates every fiber of my fandom 45 50.00%
Voters: 90. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:01 PM
  #51
WeekendAtBernies
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I voted yes, but I'd like to clarify. I will never root for my team to put bad players on the ice or bad line combos together or call up AHL players or sell NHL players all solely for the purpose of improving draft status. That type of stuff makes me sick. I expect the GM, coaches, and players to all continue to give 100% effort and try to win every game.

That being said, when I'm actually watching the games, I'm kind of indifferent as to the outcomes. I think my ideal outcome is a high-scoring affair where we get to see some magic from G, Voracek, etc. and the team fights w/ good effort, but eventually loses.

So I guess in effect I'm hoping they lose on most nights, but I'm hoping that they lose because they get outplayed by a better team, not because they're trying for a better draft pick.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:15 PM
  #52
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Teams don't intentionally lose and fans don't get happy about losing. It's just a point when the team sucks and has no shot therefore the fans become indifferent towards winning or losing. That's what the reality of the term tanking is.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:20 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryker View Post
Well, you've got a fair point there, and I wasn't implying there is one. I just threw that in, because that's one of the things often leveled at them, and is about as true as labelling the Flyers' fanbase as bandwagoners (or tankers or ...). But just ignore it.

What is tanking if not wanting the team to purposely lose games then? If they give their all and lose, that's not tanking, that's losing. And I wouldn't trade for pieces, either, but that's not tanking.
Ok maybe I should restate the way I feel.

I don't want my team to purposely lose games, but since this team is already going nowhere as is (this season at least) I honestly believe we should sell off the pieces that are hindering us. Guys like Briere, Meszaros, Coburn, Fedotenko and grab as many pieces for the future as possible. 1sts etc.

Now, that would probably mean throwing the season away, knowingly. But there is a stark difference between that and purposely losing games. But only to accomplish getting strong pieces including a potential franchise defenseman to make the team, ultimately, better than they are now.

That might be a different philosophy than "tanking", but honestly, I don't see why it's so frowned upon. It's not like the team started the season saying "ok, we're going to finish last this season so we can snatch up Seth jones". No, the team has just been awful

My philosophy in short:
We are not making the playoffs anyway, so we might as well sell off pieces that could help us attain young players and futures to make this team more successful in the future, because I don't see anything changing otherwise.

I actually think that shows MORE loyalty, because it suggests that I'd be willing to watch every game for as long as it takes and suffer through growing pains to see my team succeed in the future. I just don't see anything wrong with that.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:28 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Protest View Post
No, but I understand that at this point winning isn't going to help them as they are not going to make the playoffs. I can't root for them to lose. When it gets to this point in the season I have to stop watching because my heart and brain will battle during the game. My brain says "it's better to lose" and my heart says "shut up, you're a ****ing idiot."
hahaha...this was me last night!!

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03-19-2013, 01:39 PM
  #55
El Emperor
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I voted Yes, however, I believe any team should try and continue to win. When I say "tank," I think more of trading away assets for future well being. For instance, trading talented, but more expensive/aged players would lead to picks/prospects, but at the same time, the team's talent level should decrease leading to losses anyway.

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03-19-2013, 01:39 PM
  #56
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I view tanking as multilpe seasons of not trying to improve your team and just hording draft picks...like the Oilers. A 1 year re-load like this year for us is 100% acceptable. Sell off what you can, and then get ready for next year.

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Old
03-19-2013, 01:53 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Emperor View Post
I voted Yes, however, I believe any team should try and continue to win. When I say "tank," I think more of trading away assets for future well being. For instance, trading talented, but more expensive/aged players would lead to picks/prospects, but at the same time, the team's talent level should decrease leading to losses anyway.
precisely my stance.

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03-19-2013, 01:55 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripod View Post
I view tanking as multilpe seasons of not trying to improve your team and just hording draft picks...like the Oilers. A 1 year re-load like this year for us is 100% acceptable. Sell off what you can, and then get ready for next year.
Can't wait for the Oilers to have salary cap issues when all of those #1 forwards all want to get paid the big bucks.

You started seeing it with the Pens this past year... Jordan Staal wanted to get paid and they had to ship him off. What happens when Malkin wants his next payday. Can't give out another Crosby like contract, I think (don't quote me) it is no longer a valid contract with the new CBA.

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Old
03-19-2013, 02:05 PM
  #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Emperor View Post
Can't wait for the Oilers to have salary cap issues when all of those #1 forwards all want to get paid the big bucks.

You started seeing it with the Pens this past year... Jordan Staal wanted to get paid and they had to ship him off. What happens when Malkin wants his next payday. Can't give out another Crosby like contract, I think (don't quote me) it is no longer a valid contract with the new CBA.
Every team with a decent amount of talent is going to have problems. Unless 3rd/4th liners take a sizable paycut...which is the scenario the NHLPA hoped to avoid by fighting the contract term limits.

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Old
03-19-2013, 02:33 PM
  #60
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Yes. Already rooting for them to tank.

We have a pretty good young core going forward. We don't have to win right now.

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03-19-2013, 02:48 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryker View Post
In the coming days, I will aware Pens fans of the existence of this thread, so that they can make fun of you when you say they're bandwagoners, tankers etc. As much as I hate those guys, I hate hypocrisy even more.
Tell whomever you want. All I know is we are having a bad year and if that bad year gives us a top 5 pick, then so be it. As I scan recent drafts I notice,

2002 - Penguins #5 overall (Ryan Whitney)
2003 - Penguins #1 overall (Fleury) was #3 but traded for #1
2004 - Penguins #2 overall (Malkin)
2005 - Penguins #1 overall (Crosby)
2006 - Penguins #2 overall (Staal)

1 top 5 pick, 2 top 2 and 2 #1 overall:

So were they tanking each year or were they just plain horrible?

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Old
03-19-2013, 02:54 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by El Emperor View Post
Can't wait for the Oilers to have salary cap issues when all of those #1 forwards all want to get paid the big bucks.

You started seeing it with the Pens this past year... Jordan Staal wanted to get paid and they had to ship him off. What happens when Malkin wants his next payday. Can't give out another Crosby like contract, I think (don't quote me) it is no longer a valid contract with the new CBA.
I think, he essentially signed for the same money that had been offered in Pit. I believe that being a permanent # 3 and opportunity to play with the brother affected his decision more than money.

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Old
03-19-2013, 02:54 PM
  #63
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I can, but it's not so much watching a game and rooting for the other team. It's just realizing, when the game's over, that it's better for the big picture if they lose.

I don't really feel the Flyers need to tank, so I wouldn't say I'm rooting for them to do so. But theoretically, some day it could happen. Take the Sixers for instance- they need to tank, and tank hard. It raises their chances of winning something important significantly if they would just go down the drain this year. But that's also the reality of the NBA's structure. The NHL isn't like that as much, and even though it would be nice to get a top D prospect through the draft, there's more than one way to improve the team in hockey.

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Old
03-19-2013, 03:00 PM
  #64
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The Pens tanked on purpose for Lemieux. They didn't tank on purpose for their current crop.

I think that's an important distinction...wanting a team to lose on purpose is different from not minding that they're sucking horribly because it allows you to stock talent. Shades of grey, and all that.

I'd say it's fair to relentlessly mock an organization for allowing itself to be so bad...for instance, I can't really defend the Flyers for this year. People on the main board say "You suck lolz tradez last year lolz Bryz lolz" and there isn't much else to say; sadly, the reality is that we do kind of suck, and it's easy to attribute that to management.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSKA1974 View Post
I think, he essentially signed for the same money that had been offered in Pit. I believe that being a permanent # 3 and opportunity to play with the brother affected his decision more than money.
A couple of my friends who are NYR fans are already coming to grips with losing their Staal to Carolina

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Old
03-19-2013, 03:53 PM
  #65
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I live in Pittsburgh. I get mad watching all these brand new Letang jerseys strut around who can't name more than 3 guys who suited up for their squad pre-2005. But that's digression: I also get mad because their team is very, very, very good right now, and will be for some time.

Now, I hate the way they built their team. They became a joke and lived it for more than half a decade. But I don't deny that the players they have now are excellent and they're the ones that my favorite players have to compete against. Our team's refuse-to-suck/spend-to-not-suck philosophy is noble, profitable, and maybe even sustainable. But at a certain point you need to get young, excellent talent from the start. If there's a way to get that stud #1 defender in the draft this year, then yes. Fall apart. **** it, it isn't even a real season anyway. Get in that top 5.

I want a solid victory over the Pens next Sunday and then a month of embarrassment. And then to make it to the Conference Finals next year.

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Old
03-19-2013, 04:11 PM
  #66
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No I cant root against my team. One reason being I feel teams like Chicago and pittsburgh abused the system and I dont think its very fair to claim they built a winner when they were handed top young talent year after year. However, i have accepted the fact my team is not very good this season, and maybe next so Im not as upset at their result, and wont be as upset if we end up with a high pick in the draft. Ive seen this coming with how poorly this team is run. This isnt like 06-07 where the expectation was a lot higher and the team just bombed. I said from the outset I have given up all care for this season since day one of the lockut, and im just happy to have games to watch. I dont wanna watch my team lose. I do expect them to, if this makes any sence to anyone

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Old
03-19-2013, 04:11 PM
  #67
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I would never root for them to tank, but at this point, a loss is just...meh for me. I expect it and it doesn't bother me

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Old
03-19-2013, 04:43 PM
  #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDrizzle81 View Post
No I cant root against my team. One reason being I feel teams like Chicago and pittsburgh abused the system and I dont think its very fair to claim they built a winner when they were handed top young talent year after year. However, i have accepted the fact my team is not very good this season, and maybe next so Im not as upset at their result, and wont be as upset if we end up with a high pick in the draft. Ive seen this coming with how poorly this team is run. This isnt like 06-07 where the expectation was a lot higher and the team just bombed. I said from the outset I have given up all care for this season since day one of the lockut, and im just happy to have games to watch. I dont wanna watch my team lose. I do expect them to, if this makes any sence to anyone
I never try to defend a team when they intentionally tank. In the case of Pittsburgh, the Igloo was a money pit and the Pens never made money from it. There was a reason they had to suck - they couldn't afford to sign players until the new arena was built. Once the new arena was built, things changed and they're now paying in to the revenue sharing, so there's no excuse there for them to tank.

As for Chicago, that was just old man Wirtz who maximized profits at the expense of putting out a bad club. Once he passed away and Rocky Wirtz became the owner, things changed very quickly there.

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03-19-2013, 05:11 PM
  #69
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I will always root for the Flyers, but this team has glaring needs that need to be addressed. We are sucking during one of the deepest drafts in exactly a decade (2003) and the amount of poetential superstars this draft seems to have can really help the flyers. Even if they don't get Jones. Imagine if the flyers get Barkov, Drouin, or Mckinnon, that puts the flyers in a position to trade some of their assets for a d-man.

Lets put it like this, I always want my team to win (Because my personality leads me to despise losing) but when the flyers lose (specifically this season) I know the team can really benefit to this draft.

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03-19-2013, 05:36 PM
  #70
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If you're not first, you might as well be last.

Besides its a strike shortened season of suck. Not like the seven month root canal of the season that shall not be named. And really we loose alot of 1 or 2 goal games, I remember being down by 3 at the end of the first alot that really bad year.

If homer can somehow magically get another first round pick in this draft, I'd be really happy.

I would not however condone 5 years of being horrible, hiring your color guy as your coach, threatening to move a franchise, becoming bettmans personal pet project and have a spanking new building be built by taxpayer funds and a whiny owner.

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03-19-2013, 06:54 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I never try to defend a team when they intentionally tank. In the case of Pittsburgh, the Igloo was a money pit and the Pens never made money from it. There was a reason they had to suck - they couldn't afford to sign players until the new arena was built. Once the new arena was built, things changed and they're now paying in to the revenue sharing, so there's no excuse there for them to tank.

As for Chicago, that was just old man Wirtz who maximized profits at the expense of putting out a bad club. Once he passed away and Rocky Wirtz became the owner, things changed very quickly there.
Chicago's situation does remind me of ours in a sence that a stubborn old man completely out of touch and doesnt care runs the show. I call it Al Davis Syndrome. Cling on to passed success, sell it, sell it, sell it, and exploit the loyal money pit. Its sad

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Old
03-19-2013, 07:05 PM
  #72
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Never give up hope! It's getting harder every day though!!

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Old
03-19-2013, 07:31 PM
  #73
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Pretty much every bone in my body is rooting for them to tank and get a top #10 pick. They've looked terrible, and scouts are saying this draft is like any other year outside the top 10.

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03-19-2013, 08:02 PM
  #74
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voted no

i do not think their has ever been tanking in any sport in the history of sports. if their ever was or is. that team is gonna become hated by hundreds of millions of fans world wide. in the nfl they operate without a lotto. they have several levels set up if their is a tie for dead last. and in the history of the nfl, their is not a single team in the leagues history that picked #1 multi times in a short span of years. no controversial lotto. the nfl does not need it. i prefer they way the nfl operates by not having a large media event night to snag ratings for a lotto. they have other events that can drum up ratings. the nba has some teams that are horrible year after year. a team like charlotte is a disaster in the nba. that is real bad and one can see why they have a lotto. can you imagine this squad with multi #1s in a short number of years, that team would still be bad, and the teams on the cusp of improving deserve a chance to do so, by drafting 1st overall. and then their is the nhl. part of the problem with that league was the way the lotto was set up. a team can be really bad for years, and snag some #1s overall. then this creates a suspision world wide that such team has tanked. the teams that fall into the category of suspected but unproven tanking would be the edmonton oilers and pittsburgh penguins. hopefully the nhl has fixed this problem with the new cba,cause if it hasnt this league is gonna turn into a laughing stock.

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Old
03-19-2013, 08:11 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jabba2 View Post
Pretty much every bone in my body is rooting for them to tank and get a top #10 pick. They've looked terrible, and scouts are saying this draft is like any other year outside the top 10.
At this point we hardly have to tank to get a top 10 pick. I think we got that locked up at this point

The question is now will we be in a position to draft one of jones, Drouin or mackinnon.

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