Gilbert is 5th in ES icetime, and 4th in total icetime.
Gilbert is playing 3rd pairing minutes in Minnesota with PP time.
N.Schultz is playing 2nd pairing minutes in Edmonton.
They have both been on the ice for quite a few goals against.
Gilbert-22 N.Schultz-23 J.Schultz-24
Gilbert has a better plus/minus by 3. Mostly because more goals are score while he is on the ice. Nick is just supposed to cover for Justin while he produces the offence. Justin hasn't. He has put up 3 points at ES, same as Nick.
Maybe Nick is just getting all the blame for Justin's growing pains.
this is how i see the situation as well, Gilbert is not playing top pairing minutes, Brodin/Suter are, in fact that tandem plays the hard minutes so of course gilberts ES GA go down. N. Schultz has been given the baby sitting job and its taking its toll on him. J. Schultz started great but hasnt been that good lately. N. Schultz has been the victim of several 2-1 3-1's. We really need a big skating space muncher to play with J. Schultz and have smid/NS or Petry/NS play together.
Gilbert is 5th in ES icetime, and 4th in total icetime.
Gilbert is playing 3rd pairing minutes in Minnesota with PP time.
N.Schultz is playing 2nd pairing minutes in Edmonton.
They have both been on the ice for quite a few goals against.
Gilbert-22 N.Schultz-23 J.Schultz-24
Gilbert has a better plus/minus by 3. Mostly because more goals are score while he is on the ice. Nick is just supposed to cover for Justin while he produces the offence. Justin hasn't. He has put up 3 points at ES, same as Nick.
Maybe Nick is just getting all the blame for Justin's growing pains.
just fyi Gilbert was earlier in the season recieving top minutes along with Suter although they were not on same pairing. Gilberts toi, and contribution has dropped. Not sure whats going on there. He played well to start the year for 15 games and theres been a decline in his play over the last dozen.
Oddly enough Suter really struggled those first 15 games.
You can suggest the bolded, but a veteran shutdown D should be capable of shouldering an inexperienced D. We've certainly seen this before. The thing is that Nick isn't a a shutdown D, never really was, and if the only argument that can be made now is "Gilbert is just as bad in GA" well then its pretty clear we lost this trade because Schultz brings zero offence or PMD upside.
just fyi Gilbert was earlier in the season recieving top minutes along with Suter although they were not on same pairing. Gilberts toi, and contribution has dropped. Not sure whats going on there. He played well to start the year for 15 games and theres been a decline in his play over the last dozen.
Oddly enough Suter really struggled those first 15 games.
You can suggest the bolded, but a veteran shutdown D should be capable of shouldering an inexperienced D. We've certainly seen this before. The thing is that Nick isn't a a shutdown D, never really was, and if the only argument that can be made now is "Gilbert is just as bad in GA" well then its pretty clear we lost this trade because Schultz brings zero offence or PMD upside.
Gilbert is ****Terrible***** in his own end. Very very obviously ****Terrible***** devensively in general. That is what has happened to his ice time. Since he got his last contract Gilbert's puck moving abilities have greatly deminished as well.
We traded a defensive liability with some inconsistant offensive upside for an all around mediocre D-man. A move widely considered by all sideways at best or worse. Trying to spin it any other way is really grasping.
Gilbert is ****Terrible***** in his own end. Very very obviously ****Terrible***** devensively in general. That is what has happened to his ice time. Since he got his last contract Gilbert's puck moving abilities have greatly deminished as well.
We traded a defensive liability with some inconsistant offensive upside for an all around mediocre D-man. A move widely considered by all sideways at best or worse. Trying to spin it any other way is really grasping.
These would be your opinions and nothing more. Gilberts GA, and +/- through his tenure here was quite good considering his circumstances here, the team, and peers. He logged huge minutes here for years, and floated, on a team perennially drowning.
These would be your opinions and nothing more. Gilberts GA, and +/- through his tenure here was quite good considering his circumstances here, the team, and peers. He logged huge minutes here for years, and floated, on a team perennially drowning.
This isnt just my opinion. It is the opinion of the Edmonton Oilers fanchise and I have not heard a decent hockey mind dispute it. Not when the trade happened and not now.
Think about it impartialy for a moment. If you are saying Shultz is terrible... and every professional hockey mind out there thinks Shultz for Gilbert is a fair trade... That makes Gilbert... Terrible.
Gilbert is obviously more talented offensively, if inconsistant, then it would be safe to reason that Gilbert is that much worse defensively.
I found it rather funny that the Wild added Suter, a big defensively reliable D-man, and are quoted as saying the Wild are weak down low and that pressuring thier weaker D for turnovers is thier primary tatic against them...
Kinda strange that the Oil would point that out this year...
We got fleeced on this deal. We traded a guy that could put up points and was mediocre defensively for a guy that can't put up points and is mediocre defensively.
Traded a 3rd defenseman for a borderline 5th defenseman. Another Tambo gem.
I think at some point you need to question the pro scouting of the oilers. This isn't the first time in the last few years we've traded for or signed a guy who ended up being something other then they thought. Tambo refered to him as a warrior that could match up again other teams top players, clearly that isn't the case.
Thought I would bump this after seeing this tweet today
Quote:
Michael Russo @Russostrib 1h
Veteran Tom Gilbert scratched tonight. Yeo: It was time to make a change. Hopefully this helps him get back on track #mnwild
Thought I would bump this after seeing this tweet today
So, you know, not world beating, probably.
Gilbert has been brutal lately. Only been playing 14-18 minutes per night for quite awhile now, heavily sheltered, and still can't keep his head above water. I think Nick Schultz is having a better season.
Still a questionable trade, but it is starting to look a lot more even. Especially if moving Gilbert was any kind of assist in picking up Justin Schultz.
Clearly schultz has been exposed. This guy is a total hack.
Only read the first page thus far, but had to ask, is this for real?
Has Schultz really played that poorly lately? Seems kind of crazy that someone would say that about a rookie d-man after only 30 NHL games?
I have only seen him a couple of times. Is this a case of a fan with totally unrealistic expectations, or has Schultz really been that bad.
I'm not an Oilers fan, but I like seeing good young players fulfill their potential. It bothers me when fans turn on players so early.
Sometimes it's warranted (and it very well may be here as I admit to not knowing anything about him to this point in his rookie season), but more often than not it's just a fan (or fans) that are frustrated and start turning on certain players.
Only read the first page thus far, but had to ask, is this for real?
Has Schultz really played that poorly lately? Seems kind of crazy that someone would say that about a rookie d-man after only 30 NHL games?
I have only seen him a couple of times. Is this a case of a fan with totally unrealistic expectations, or has Schultz really been that bad.
I'm not an Oilers fan, but I like seeing good young players fulfill their potential. It bothers me when fans turn on players so early.
Sometimes it's warranted (and it very well may be here as I admit to not knowing anything about him to this point in his rookie season), but more often than not it's just a fan (or fans) that are frustrated and start turning on certain players.
Out of 127 defenseman who have played at least 30 games, Gilbert is ranked 123rd in GA/60.
Schultz isn't much better at 114th.
I think it'd be pretty tough to say either team won this trade at this point.
Now there's the ringing endorsement we've all been looking for. The guy we got sucks just a little bit less than the guy we gave up. Great job Tambellini.
Out of 127 defenseman who have played at least 30 games, Gilbert is ranked 123rd in GA/60.
Schultz isn't much better at 114th.
I think it'd be pretty tough to say either team won this trade at this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr V
Now there's the ringing endorsement we've all been looking for. The guy we got sucks just a little bit less than the guy we gave up. Great job Tambellini.
I'll say this for those stats
Nick Schultz has put them up on the Oilers who's best defenseman is Smid/Petry
Tom Gilbert has put them up on the Wild who's best defenseman is Ryan Sutter.
Several of us at the time said it was a stupid trade. You don't trade a puck moving D-man with his offensive upside for a stay at home, 3 to 4 minute less a night, steady D-man with no physical side to hiis game. Once again, Tamblowe got OWNED!
Minni must love the Oilers ... first Brodziak for nothing, then Gilbert for a has been.
Unbelievable how dumb our management is.
FIRE TAMBLOWE !!!
The two former Oilers are a collective -28 in Minny right meow.
As to the Gilbert trade, specifically: Its a fair question to ask if we could've gotten more for Gilbert?
But maybe we ONLY talked with Minnesota...knowing thats where Tom would have wanted to go...and if thats the case...then I think thats poor asset management and way more than we ever owed Gilbert.
Moving Gilbert shouldve only ever been a business deal with no sentimental considerations ever entering the process.
Now there's the ringing endorsement we've all been looking for. The guy we got sucks just a little bit less than the guy we gave up. Great job Tambellini.
I think you just gave me what will be my lasting impression of Tambo after he eventually leaves: the guy who got rid of players who sucked and replaced them with players who suck just a little bit less.
Out of 127 defenseman who have played at least 30 games, Gilbert is ranked 123rd in GA/60.
Schultz isn't much better at 114th.
I think it'd be pretty tough to say either team won this trade at this point.
I like how the three worst are:
1. Giordano
2. Wideman
3. Bouwmeester
lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins
I'll say this for those stats
Nick Schultz has put them up on the Oilers who's best defenseman is Smid/Petry
Tom Gilbert has put them up on the Wild who's best defenseman is Ryan Sutter.
Not an insignificant difference there.
Not an insignificant difference, but an irrelevant one perhaps? They are putting up those stats when they are on the ice and the top guys aren't. It would make sense that those numbers would be the same if the top guy was Nick Lidstrom or Bobby Orr wouldn't it?
This isnt just my opinion. It is the opinion of the Edmonton Oilers fanchise and I have not heard a decent hockey mind dispute it. Not when the trade happened and not now.
Think about it impartialy for a moment. If you are saying Shultz is terrible... and every professional hockey mind out there thinks Shultz for Gilbert is a fair trade... That makes Gilbert... Terrible.
Or it means that most hockey minds are a bunch of irrelevant hacks.
Everyone who has put in the work to look at the underlying numbers has proclaimed him to be a pretty good defenceman. And you are citing the Edmonton Oilers, perennial bottom feeder that is likely going to be bailed out only by their ability to win at random lotteries, for their acumen in making that deal?
It's a stupid argument. Gilbert was a good player playing with some of the league's worst goaltenders, fellow defencemen and abysmal forwards for most of his time here.
But if you want to set up Steve Tambellini as some kind of paragon of intelligence and hockey savvy, I don't know what to say to you, except that the results speak for themselves.
Hockey experts who won't take the time to delve into understanding concepts like Corsi, zone starts, quality of competition and so on aren't worth the fifteen second sound bites they get on Sportsnet.
probably. Don't cry for me Tammy Gilbert.
