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The 2013 NHL Entry Draft

View Poll Results: What type of player should we draft?
Powerforward [Centre/Winger] 10 5.92%
Two-Way Forward 1 0.59%
Playmaking Centre 8 4.73%
Goalscoring Winger 64 37.87%
Defensive-Defenseman 16 9.47%
Offensive-Defenseman 10 5.92%
Two-Way Defenseman 47 27.81%
Goaler 0 0%
Trade our 1st for an upgrade 4 2.37%
Other [Smallish Character Centres] 9 5.33%
Voters: 169. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-21-2013, 11:31 AM
  #651
Ivan13
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The thing that concerns me with MacK is all those reports that state he often just watches the game happening around him when he doesn't have the puck, sadly I haven't been able to watch the QMJHL apart from a couple of Remparts games so I'm not really in a postion to comment on him and Drouin all that much.

On another note, I just love the way Barkov and Valeri Nichushkin play, those two are going to be stars in this league for quite some time IMHO, but I have some serious concerns about Valeri Nichushkin coming over.

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03-21-2013, 11:39 AM
  #652
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Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
The thing that concerns me with MacK is all those reports that state he often just watches the game happening around him when he doesn't have the puck, sadly I haven't been able to watch the QMJHL apart from a couple of Remparts games so I'm not really in a postion to comment on him and Drouin all that much.

On another note, I just love the way Barkov and Valeri Nichushkin play, those two are going to be stars in this league for quite some time IMHO, but I have some serious concerns about Valeri Nichushkin coming over.
I just love the way everything comes together for Drouin offensively. He reads the game and can execute in whatever way he wants, and I think it helps make MacK look better than he is. Drouin can do everything offensively and he's as quick/elusive as a fox. Put him on a line with Landeskog & Stastny, I think we'd be watching magic every night. Even as soon as October (but I'd prefer he get another year to bulk up, look at RNH).

Barkov would be nice, but would spell the end of Stastny ultimately and that bothers me, I want to add to our roster rather than move any key pieces around. Nichushkin I can't comment on, but I'd be very opposed to risking what could be our last high draft pick on a guy that may never come over.

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03-21-2013, 11:51 AM
  #653
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I feel like both MacK and Drouin need to work a lot on their play without the puck, and bulk up.

Barkov on the other hand, looks like this draft's version of Couturier. Once he gets drafted and spends the summer training with a power skating coach, he's going to be able to immediately make an impact at both ends of the ice in the NHL.

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03-21-2013, 11:54 AM
  #654
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Originally Posted by Lonewolfe2015 View Post
I just love the way everything comes together for Drouin offensively. He reads the game and can execute in whatever way he wants, and I think it helps make MacK look better than he is. Drouin can do everything offensively and he's as quick/elusive as a fox. Put him on a line with Landeskog & Stastny, I think we'd be watching magic every night. Even as soon as October (but I'd prefer he get another year to bulk up, look at RNH).

Barkov would be nice, but would spell the end of Stastny ultimately and that bothers me, I want to add to our roster rather than move any key pieces around. Nichushkin I can't comment on, but I'd be very opposed to risking what could be our last high draft pick on a guy that may never come over.
Neither do I, plus I could really see him slide down the rankings as we get closer to the draft.

Barkov is a no brainer for me if the big 3 is already selected whne we're up. And considering Drouin I really liked what I saw from him at the WJC, but like I said before I can't really comment on him.

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03-21-2013, 12:01 PM
  #655
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Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
The thing that concerns me with MacK is all those reports that state he often just watches the game happening around him when he doesn't have the puck, sadly I haven't been able to watch the QMJHL apart from a couple of Remparts games so I'm not really in a postion to comment on him and Drouin all that much.

On another note, I just love the way Barkov and Valeri Nichushkin play, those two are going to be stars in this league for quite some time IMHO, but I have some serious concerns about Valeri Nichushkin coming over.
Where are you hearing this? From the game's I've watched he always tries to position himself well. He may not be able to process the game like Drouin but he still thinks it well.

There is nothing concerning to me about Mackinnon. The guy's skating already is in the upper echelon in the world. He's great defensively and really hounds the puck and wins a ton of battles. Shift in and shift out he always gives everything he's got. He gives Parise like effort.

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03-21-2013, 12:09 PM
  #656
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Originally Posted by avsfan09 View Post
Where are you hearing this? From the game's I've watched he always tries to position himself well. He may not be able to process the game like Drouin but he still thinks it well.

There is nothing concerning to me about Mackinnon. The guy's skating already is in the upper echelon in the world. He's great defensively and really hounds the puck and wins a ton of battles. Shift in and shift out he always gives everything he's got. He gives Parise like effort.
I hate repeating myself, but the games I watched MacKinnon is like Phil Kessel out there. Much more physical and better than Kessel for sure, but the same gametype. With that I did say he would fit the Avs better, but now you gotta draft Drouin at the #2 spot regardless.

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03-21-2013, 12:14 PM
  #657
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Mac will be a very good player in the NHL. There is no doubt about that. Some people question his hockey IQ and usefulness without the puck. I don't really see it, but I admit I am higher on him than most. The top 3 in this draft would have all been the #1 picks for at least the last 2 years... hell, Jones being a year underage would have been the #1 pick last year if he could have been drafted. The top 3 are pretty much interchangeable IMO. We need defense and there is an organization connection to Jones, no brainer pick. Beyond that flip a coin for Drouin and Mac, both will be great players in their own rights.

When we get past the top 3, you have Barkov, Lindholm, Nichushkin (who will drop like a rock), and Monahan in the next group who should all be really good NHL players.

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03-21-2013, 12:14 PM
  #658
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Maybe.
Going back to Hishon, there was a rumour that another team in the 20s was going to select him. I think the Avs should've moved back in the early 20s to select Hishon and possibly get another pick, but I don't think the Avs thought it was worth moving back 2-4 spots and getting a 5th or 6th round and the possibility of him getting drafted before they picked.

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03-21-2013, 12:15 PM
  #659
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Originally Posted by avsfan09 View Post
Where are you hearing this? From the game's I've watched he always tries to position himself well. He may not be able to process the game like Drouin but he still thinks it well.

There is nothing concerning to me about Mackinnon. The guy's skating already is in the upper echelon in the world. He's great defensively and really hounds the puck and wins a ton of battles. Shift in and shift out he always gives everything he's got. He gives Parise like effort.
From people who watch him play, scouting reports etc.

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03-21-2013, 12:27 PM
  #660
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Originally Posted by S E P H View Post
Going back to Hishon, there was a rumour that another team in the 20s was going to select him. I think the Avs should've moved back in the early 20s to select Hishon and possibly get another pick, but I don't think the Avs thought it was worth moving back 2-4 spots and getting a 5th or 6th round and the possibility of him getting drafted before they picked.
Agreed, I would believe that the Avs brass thought it more wise to select him before a team grabbed him in the 20's.

I'm reading "Moneyball" right now and there's an interesting part of the book that deals w/ Billy Beane, GM of the Oakland A's talking w/ various managers before the MLB Draft, about who they're taking, and apparently it's a common thing in MLB to have happen, so I wouldn't put it out of the question for it to happen in other league's as well, for GM's to sort of communicate/indicate who they would most likely take.

If the Avs believed that Hishon wouldn't be there later, then I see no problem w/ taking him if they believed that he's the BPA at the time of their selection.

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03-21-2013, 12:36 PM
  #661
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Originally Posted by RockLobster View Post
Agreed, I would believe that the Avs brass thought it more wise to select him before a team grabbed him in the 20's.

I'm reading "Moneyball" right now and there's an interesting part of the book that deals w/ Billy Beane, GM of the Oakland A's talking w/ various managers before the MLB Draft, about who they're taking, and apparently it's a common thing in MLB to have happen, so I wouldn't put it out of the question for it to happen in other league's as well, for GM's to sort of communicate/indicate who they would most likely take.

If the Avs believed that Hishon wouldn't be there later, then I see no problem w/ taking him if they believed that he's the BPA at the time of their selection.
Sure there is some talk as many have seen first hand with Toronto and Ottawa when it came to Kadri but most teams are not going to disclose who they like without some reason. No reason to disclose to a team you want say Pickard or Barrie unless you are thinking of moving up or down.

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03-21-2013, 12:41 PM
  #662
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In the Hishon case, the Avs seem to have a list of guys that they really want, and will pick them no matter how far off the board they might be in the media's eyes. I seem to remember the Avs valued ROR really high, around mid 1st in 2009. If they Avs would have had a pick around 15, I think they would have drafted him. It would have been another off the board pick like the Hishon one and people would have freaked out in a similar way. It would have also paid off in the end. I think the scouts have shown they know what they are doing with our drafting. The only real questionable pick IMO was Heard, and that isn't so much about Heard as it is that he was an overager and his ceiling is lower than others that were picked around him. That pick could still very easily prove me wrong.

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03-21-2013, 12:41 PM
  #663
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Sure there is some talk as many have seen first hand with Toronto and Ottawa when it came to Kadri but most teams are not going to disclose who they like without some reason. No reason to disclose to a team you want say Pickard or Barrie unless you are thinking of moving up or down.
No, I wouldn't expect that in the rounds after the 1st, but I don't think it's entirely out of the question that the Avs may have received some sort of indication that a team picking after them in the 1st round would take Joey if he were still available.

My point being that I don't necessarily see a problem picking the player you feel to be the BPA, even if the others don't.

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03-21-2013, 12:42 PM
  #664
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If we had a choice between the three, i'd easily pick Drouin. Mind you have I haven't seen Drouin play first hand, but based on what i've seen from Jones, he isn't anything different from JBouw or EJ when they were drafted. Defensemen are so much more unpredictable, and I honestly don't see where these Lidstrom + Pronger comparisons are coming from. He made a few nice plays, but he wasn't a gamechanger in the games I watched.

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03-21-2013, 12:43 PM
  #665
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Oh I am very sure the GMs who want to trade up and down try to find out which teams plan on taking who around their pick and potential trade picks. But it seems to me the Avs don't really like talking to the rest of the league except in parts they're only interested in.

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03-21-2013, 12:47 PM
  #666
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if you're picking in the top 3 it has to be Jones,Drouin & MacKinnon.
me personally i like Nurse as the #4 guy because i don't think Nichushkin is coming over for awhile and i think he has a huge upside. Barkov,Lindholm and Mohanan would be after him(Nichushkin). then to me the draft drops off in talent after that.

you have 4 guys with the talent to go #1 and not be a bad choice at all.
then you have 4 others who are good to take in the next 4 picks and not regret if they pan out.
after that it's all up to the scouts and developmental areas to get them up to snuff.
this is a deep draft, it's just fluctuating in talent level from the very top to the end of the first.

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03-21-2013, 12:48 PM
  #667
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If you trade down you have to have a plan B/C that you're ok with if your guy get picked before it's your turn. It's possible Avs were so high on Hishon and didn't have any alternative picks close to him.

Sherman did trade up to grab Bourneval, so I don't think he has a problem with trading up/down if the situation calls for it.

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03-21-2013, 12:52 PM
  #668
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Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
In the Hishon case, the Avs seem to have a list of guys that they really want, and will pick them no matter how far off the board they might be in the media's eyes. I seem to remember the Avs valued ROR really high, around mid 1st in 2009. If they Avs would have had a pick around 15, I think they would have drafted him. It would have been another off the board pick like the Hishon one and people would have freaked out in a similar way. It would have also paid off in the end. I think the scouts have shown they know what they are doing with our drafting. The only real questionable pick IMO was Heard, and that isn't so much about Heard as it is that he was an overager and his ceiling is lower than others that were picked around him. That pick could still very easily prove me wrong.
it wasn't just the Avs. ROR was expected to be a first rounder in his draft year but most. much like with Stastny they were some folks who were stunned he fell to the 2nd.

and we Avs fans were thrilled about him falling and considered him to be a 2nd first rounder. though i doubt any of us thought he'd break camp with the big club as a rookie.

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03-21-2013, 12:57 PM
  #669
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Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
In the Hishon case, the Avs seem to have a list of guys that they really want, and will pick them no matter how far off the board they might be in the media's eyes. I seem to remember the Avs valued ROR really high, around mid 1st in 2009. If they Avs would have had a pick around 15, I think they would have drafted him. It would have been another off the board pick like the Hishon one and people would have freaked out in a similar way. It would have also paid off in the end. I think the scouts have shown they know what they are doing with our drafting.
Absolutely agree. I remember watching their scout meeting and they were discussing that Elliott and Barrie were (I believe) in their top 15 list and look where they went in the draft.

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The only real questionable pick IMO was Heard, and that isn't so much about Heard as it is that he was an overager and his ceiling is lower than others that were picked around him. That pick could still very easily prove me wrong.
My theory about this pick is they REALLY wanted Lukas Sutter or Di Giuseppe. So without trading down they selected Heard who was again rumoured to be picked by another team somewhere in the 2nd round. I do think there were other players that could've been a better selection like Sieloff, McCabe, McGinn, Sissons (The player I REALLY wanted), and Severson. We all know from the scouting video that Avs had major debates about skating which is one reason why we didn't select Couturier and probably the reason why we didn't select Frk.

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If we had a choice between the three, i'd easily pick Drouin. Mind you have I haven't seen Drouin play first hand, but based on what i've seen from Jones, he isn't anything different from JBouw or EJ when they were drafted. Defensemen are so much more unpredictable, and I honestly don't see where these Lidstrom + Pronger comparisons are coming from. He made a few nice plays, but he wasn't a gamechanger in the games I watched.
You're entitled to your opinion, but you're wrong. There is a reason why he jumped from from top 5 to clear-cut #1 and it wasn't based on a few games. The worst thing I see from him is his defensive positioning (easily fixable) and decision making at times is iffy (comes with experience).

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03-21-2013, 12:58 PM
  #670
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If you trade down you have to have a plan B/C that you're ok with if your guy get picked before it's your turn. It's possible Avs were so high on Hishon and didn't have any alternative picks close to him.

Sherman did trade up to grab Bourneval, so I don't think he has a problem with trading up/down if the situation calls for it.
So high on him that we traded him for O'Byrne.

Again, I do understand that Hishon was better than his draft projection. It is absolutely possible that, had we traded down into the 20's or 30's, he would have been selected with our pick at 17. At this point it's impossible to tell.

All I'm really saying is that I have this great fear that Sherman steps up to the podium and says, "With the second pick of the 2013 draft, the Colorado Avalanche select, Hunter Shinkaruk."

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03-21-2013, 01:00 PM
  #671
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If you trade down you have to have a plan B/C that you're ok with if your guy get picked before it's your turn. It's possible Avs were so high on Hishon and didn't have any alternative picks close to him.

Sherman did trade up to grab Bourneval, so I don't think he has a problem with trading up/down if the situation calls for it.
But we also wasted picks' grabbing the new effin all-star in Silas, so IMO I don't really like trading up or down except if a Hamilton type of player was on the board, which I wish the Avs were all over that and overpayed to jump to get him. Only problem was I don't think Boston wanted to trade. :/

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03-21-2013, 01:05 PM
  #672
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All I'm really saying is that I have this great fear that Sherman steps up to the podium and says, "With the second pick of the 2013 draft, the Colorado Avalanche select, Hunter Shinkaruk."
You would have to think that if the Avs end up with a top-3 pick that they will draft one of Jones, MacKinnon, Drouin barring any changes to their projections. Especially considering some draft lists have Shinkaruk outside the top-10.

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03-21-2013, 01:07 PM
  #673
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So high on him that we traded him for O'Byrne.

Again, I do understand that Hishon was better than his draft projection. It is absolutely possible that, had we traded down into the 20's or 30's, he would have been selected with our pick at 17. At this point it's impossible to tell.

All I'm really saying is that I have this great fear that Sherman steps up to the podium and says, "With the second pick of the 2013 draft, the Colorado Avalanche select, Hunter Shinkaruk."
If there is something Avs have done really good since under Shermans regim it's drafting the right players. So I don't think you have to worry about. No real busts and decent prospects who were taken in later rounds.

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03-21-2013, 01:08 PM
  #674
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I hate repeating myself, but the games I watched MacKinnon is like Phil Kessel out there. Much more physical and better than Kessel for sure, but the same gametype. With that I did say he would fit the Avs better, but now you gotta draft Drouin at the #2 spot regardless.
I live in NS and watch him alot. Never seen him play like Phil Kessel, how many games have you watched? I do agree that if Drouin is around than we should pick him I was just saying I would have no concerns with drafting him.

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03-21-2013, 01:14 PM
  #675
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If NHL drafted players at the age of 19-20, a lot of the weird picks would disappear. I think 17-18 is not the best age to draft, but it adds to the gamble element of the draft. It certainly makes round two and later more interesting.

Pretty much only 1st-3rd/4th overall picks are sure things and historically there isn't much difference in the success rate of picks 6-10 and picks 11-20. It's so hard to predict where young guys end up.

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