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Philly - Buffalo

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Old
03-21-2013, 11:51 AM
  #1
stokes84
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Philly - Buffalo

I have read that some Flyer fans are desperately seeking a top flight winger to pair with Giroux. Buffalo is seeking a two way center. Is there any chance we can work something around this base:

Vanek for Couturier?

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03-21-2013, 11:52 AM
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Salary.

Can't.

Wouldn't.

Flyers Pass.

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03-21-2013, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
I have read that some Flyer fans are desperately seeking a top flight winger to pair with Giroux. Buffalo is seeking a two way center. Is there any chance we can work something around this base:

Vanek for Couturier?
No.

Setting aside the cap, there's simply no value there for the Flyers. Vanek is UFA after next season. Couturier is cost-controllable for the next half-decade.

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Old
03-21-2013, 11:57 AM
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The deal was fair until you included Couturier.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:00 PM
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I assume Buffalo would take back a bad cap hit or something as well, and Philly is a team with the means to re-sign, giving you a year head start. I know Couturier is a non-starter for many, but Vanek is no ordinary winger either.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:01 PM
  #6
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Originally Posted by stokes84 View Post
I assume Buffalo would take back a bad cap hit or something as well, and Philly is a team with the means to re-sign, giving you a year head start. I know Couturier is a non-starter for many, but Vanek is no ordinary winger either.
It's not that he's a non-starter. Most Flyers fans realize he's our biggest trade chip, except we'd move him in a deal to get that defender we desperately need.

I don't see us paying the price for Vanek.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:19 PM
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Aside from my username I would pass on this, vanek is one of the top wingers in the game. I feel we could get a similar package or better for him at the deadline, philly just doesn't have the cap.

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03-21-2013, 12:23 PM
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While Buffalo would be willing to eat some of Vanek's salary next year in a trade---they arent taking some sort of long term salary dump.

Its picks + prospects/players under 26.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:36 PM
  #9
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The flyers are a team built on youth. Vanek is a much better player at this poin in their careers, but coots is just SO young and has loads of potential. He showed a glimpse of what he's capable of last year and is obviously struggling this season as a sophomore just as a lot of kids who are brought in young do.

I, unlike most flyers fans, am actually not COMPLETELY opposed to trading him. I like him a lot and my belief isn't based on his performance this year, I'm actually not worried about him at all, I have confidence in how good of a player he will be. I just can't help but think how good it may be for us to deal him to address an area of dire need. Especially when we would still have Laughton to fill the 3C spot for the future. That would only include getting a young defenseman with an equally high ceiling in return.

That said, only piece the flyers would likely be interested in from the Sabres in return for couturier is Meyers. It just wouldn't make sense otherwise, and I'm fairly certain that the flyers have no desire to deal couturier, but a player LIKE Meyers is likely what it would take to get homer talking.

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03-21-2013, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by palindrom View Post
The deal was fair until you included Couturier.
to say a Vanek for Couturier deal isn't "fair" value wise is one of the dumbest things I have read recently on this forum, it may not be in PHI best interest but Vanek value is more than Couturier. He is drafted in 2003 the same year as guys like Parise, Perry, Getzlaf and Weber. Isn't even close to the end of his career.

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03-21-2013, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by orange is better View Post
The flyers are a team built on youth. Vanek is a much better player at this poin in their careers, but coots is just SO young and has loads of potential. He showed a glimpse of what he's capable of last year and is obviously struggling this season as a sophomore just as a lot of kids who are brought in young do.

I, unlike most flyers fans, am actually not COMPLETELY opposed to trading him. I like him a lot and my belief isn't based on his performance this year, I'm actually not worried about him at all, I have confidence in how good of a player he will be. I just can't help but think how good it may be for us to deal him to address an area of dire need. Especially when we would still have Laughton to fill the 3C spot for the future. That would only include getting a young defenseman with an equally high ceiling in return.

That said, only piece the flyers would likely be interested in from the Sabres in return for couturier is Meyers. It just wouldn't make sense otherwise, and I'm fairly certain that the flyers have no desire to deal couturier, but a player LIKE Meyers is likely what it would take to get homer talking.
1. Myers
2. What is PHI adding to Couturier for him? General consensus seems to be Couturier's ceiling is roughly as a very good two-way 2nd liner. Myers' is that of a #1 D-man, and a particularly unique one because of his size. If the trade revolves around potential, there needs to be more to it than that to tempt Buffalo.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
1. Myers
2. What is PHI adding to Couturier for him? General consensus seems to be Couturier's ceiling is roughly as a very good two-way 2nd liner. Myers' is that of a #1 D-man, and a particularly unique one because of his size. If the trade revolves around potential, there needs to be more to it than that to tempt Buffalo.
Myers is the next Coburn, and Flyers fans are hoping Couturier is the next Brind'Amour.

This won't go over well. Both sides will keep their young player.

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03-21-2013, 12:51 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
1. Myers
2. What is PHI adding to Couturier for him? General consensus seems to be Couturier's ceiling is roughly as a very good two-way 2nd liner. Myers' is that of a #1 D-man, and a particularly unique one because of his size. If the trade revolves around potential, there needs to be more to it than that to tempt Buffalo.
Their isn't the slightest chance I move Myers for Couturier. Especially when their are better 2 way centers to choose from in the draft who are as much of a sure thing as him offensively.

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03-21-2013, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Myers is the next Coburn, and Flyers fans are hoping Couturier is the next Brind'Amour.

This won't go over well.
you keep saying this and it's always wrong.

Myers is much more mobile, way more skilled. Myers has played at a level Coburn hasn't

I have no idea where you get that comparison from

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03-21-2013, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
to say a Vanek for Couturier deal isn't "fair" value wise is one of the dumbest things I have read recently on this forum, it may not be in PHI best interest but Vanek value is more than Couturier. He is drafted in 2003 the same year as guys like Parise, Perry, Getzlaf and Weber. Isn't even close to the end of his career.
Point to an actual trade, post lockout, that would demonstrate your position...

the only time bluechip prospects get moved in trade is when it's for similarly aged talent (EJ, Shat), or young veterans locked up LONG term (carter, richards)

There is a difference between talent and trade value... Vanek has the talent, but his trade value includes his contract/UFA.

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03-21-2013, 12:53 PM
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Doesn't make sense for either team. Philly can't afford Vanek's salary, and Buffalo has plenty of young unproven centres with high potential of their own.

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03-21-2013, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
you keep saying this and it's always wrong.

Myers is much more mobile, way more skilled. Myers has played at a level Coburn couldn't dream of playing at.

I have no idea where you get that comparison from
Oh... my mistake... I didn't realize you were playing homer... please proceed

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03-21-2013, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jame View Post
Point to an actual trade, post lockout, that would demonstrate your position...

the only time bluechip prospects get moved in trade is when it's for similarly aged talent (EJ, Shat), or young veterans locked up LONG term (carter, richards)

There is a difference between talent and trade value... Vanek has the talent, but his trade value includes his contract/UFA.
in coming Couturier fan boy

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
Their isn't the slightest chance I move Myers for Couturier. Especially when their are better 2 way centers to choose from in the draft who are as much of a sure thing as him offensively.
I can't say I'd complain about drafting Monahan or Barkov and keeping Myers.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
1. Myers
2. What is PHI adding to Couturier for him? General consensus seems to be Couturier's ceiling is roughly as a very good two-way 2nd liner. Myers' is that of a #1 D-man, and a particularly unique one because of his size. If the trade revolves around potential, there needs to be more to it than that to tempt Buffalo.
Myers needs to demonstrate the offensive ability he showed in his first year again to be considered a potential #1, IMO, and I think you're selling Couturier's ceiling a bit short at a second-line center. If you can be that optimistic about Myers' upside, then I don't see how Couturier doesn't have at least a 1B-type ceiling (Patrice Bergeron-level production).

Myers gets the edge because he has proven more and because his ceiling is more valuable (if it is a true #1 vs. a 1B), but that edge is offset a bit by the premature contract. I'm not sure what a reasonable make-weight would be, but I'm surprised Couturier would be a player that Buffalo would covet, with Hodgson, Grigorenko, that other G-guy in the fold.

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03-21-2013, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Jack de la Hoya View Post
Myers needs to demonstrate the offensive ability he showed in his first year again to be considered a potential #1, IMO, and I think you're selling Couturier's ceiling a bit short at a second-line center. If you can be that optimistic about Myers' upside, then I don't see how Couturier doesn't have at least a 1B-type ceiling (Patrice Bergeron-level production).

Myers gets the edge because he has proven more and because his ceiling is more valuable (if it is a true #1 vs. a 1B), but that edge is offset a bit by the premature contract.

I'm surprised Couturier would be a player that Buffalo would covet, though, with Hodgson, Grigorenko, that other G-guy, etc.
complety agree

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
in coming Couturier fan boy
Im not familiar with that trade

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03-21-2013, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darcy Regier View Post
you keep saying this and it's always wrong.

Myers is much more mobile, way more skilled. Myers has played at a level Coburn hasn't

I have no idea where you get that comparison from
Hahaha. No.

They're the EXACT SAME PLAYER.

When Myers has reached his prime, he will be exactly what Coburn is now. It's actually pretty creepy how matched up their career trajectory has been.

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03-21-2013, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Hahaha. No.

They're the EXACT SAME PLAYER.

When Myers has reached his prime, he will be exactly what Coburn is now. It's actually pretty creepy how matched up their career trajectory has been.
What am I missing here?

When did Coburn pot 48 points?

I think it is very possible that Myers ends up a similar player to Coburn, but I think it is a bit unfair to simply ignore Myers' offensive production.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:13 PM
  #25
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Flyers can't take on that cap hit.

Vanek is a great player, though.

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