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Old
03-21-2013, 12:06 PM
  #251
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So now we're not considering Babcock as a replacement coach because he had Lidstrom? He's won a Cup, gone to 2 other finals, won Olympic gold.

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03-21-2013, 12:08 PM
  #252
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Wow the Tambo hate on here is pretty bad. I get that people want to hate on the guy but he has done a good job thus far of adding now without sacrificing the future.

Over the past year he's added Yakupov, Schultz, Fistric and Brown without losing anything. On paper we are better than we were last year. If he can do this every year I'm happy with him as our GM (outside of the 1st overall part).

Sure you would like to see him more active but he hasn't let anyone important walk. He managed to sign Eberle and Hall long term. I don't see Smid going anywhere.
LOL, yeah keep patting him on the back for being so totally inept that the team sewered into a forced rebuild and then he has 3 1st overall picks in a row.

People are actually looking at the moves he has made over the years other than picking 1st in each round and seeing all the errors.

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03-21-2013, 12:13 PM
  #253
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And what makes you think he isn't? Don't assume lack of action is due to lack of trying. Understand that the hockey trade market isn't conducive to the type of action you're talking about and alluding to in your Blue Jays example. Further, give some examples of these types of trades happening in the league? There are a few but nothing to suggest that making them is easy.



How can you assume any of this? That trades weren't made. Maybe they couldn't be made. The last offseason was right before the end of the CBA, which led to the lockout - there was little trade action, obviously. How many trades are ever made early in the season and well before the lockout?

Understand that in hockey and in the current market, deals are exceptionally hard to make. Big power forwards, puck moving Dmen, faceoff specialists, etc. don't just grow on trees. And can cost a relatively significant amount. Personally, I'm glad that management isn't so myopic in their focus.

I never once said it would be easy, you need to take risks to move forward, we trade lows picks, for washed up players, then trade our guys who don't fit our plan, for picks. Once in a blue moon we will trade one of our sturggling guys, for someone on a different team who is struggling "hoping for the change of scenario". I am not saying blow it up, or do this or that, but the team has to be getting close, at some point, a first or 2nd needs to be dangled out there. Itc ould be done that way.

On the other hand you can stand pat, and let the ship stay course, cause in 3 years this team can still develop into a powerhouse of a team, just as many other team have. I don't like the approach as a fan.

Thats my opinion, I don't agree with standing pat, or going, well we tried but the market ain't out there. Other teams take risks, do they always turn out no. I don't see this managment taking risks. That frustrates me.

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03-21-2013, 12:14 PM
  #254
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So now we're not considering Babcock as a replacement coach because he had Lidstrom? He's won a Cup, gone to 2 other finals, won Olympic gold.
So if he is so good why can't he overcome losing Lidstrom? Detroit has always had a real damn good team. now that players are getting older and leaving Babcock isn't doing so well.

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:23 PM
  #255
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Old
03-21-2013, 12:24 PM
  #256
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
So if he is so good why can't he overcome losing Lidstrom? Detroit has always had a real damn good team. now that players are getting older and leaving Babcock isn't doing so well.
They will likely make the playoffs, and possibly finish 2nd in their division. They aren't struggling that bad.

He lost Lidstrom and they sit 6th in the West, are they suppose to be first in the league after losing one of the best dmen of all time for people to say hes a good coach?

We would be beyond lucky to have a guy like Babcock coaching our team. After having MacT, Quinn, Renney, and now Krueger we're to good to consider Babcock?

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:32 PM
  #257
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
So if he is so good why can't he overcome losing Lidstrom? Detroit has always had a real damn good team. now that players are getting older and leaving Babcock isn't doing so well.
On the Jason Gregor show he said Babcock is widely regarded as one of the best coaches in the league..

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:39 PM
  #258
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Originally Posted by jsho View Post
They will likely make the playoffs, and possibly finish 2nd in their division. They aren't struggling that bad.

He lost Lidstrom and they sit 6th in the West, are they suppose to be first in the league after losing one of the best dmen of all time for people to say hes a good coach?

We would be beyond lucky to have a guy like Babcock coaching our team. After having MacT, Quinn, Renney, and now Krueger we're to good to consider Babcock?
Exactly, he's got a half decent but not great team within 3 points of 4th in the conference. He's 1 point behind the 5th place team. If they miss the playoffs then maybe it's something worth discussing but right now it's very early to start calling him a bad coach. Especially when you consider the crap we've seen come through here the last few years.

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03-21-2013, 12:50 PM
  #259
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Outstanding, seriously

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:55 PM
  #260
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For those of you saying that Tambo is not doing anything and is "sitting on his hands", here is a complete list of the trades that have happened so far this season.

Out of 31 trades that have taken place, the Oil have been involved in 2 of them, and I would argue that they were 2 of the better pick ups for players that have moved.



Florida acquires D T.J. Brennan for a 5th-Round Pick (2013)

Anaheim Acquires F David Steckel for F Ryan Lasch & 7th-Round Pick (2014)

Washington Acquires D Chay Genoway for Conditional 7th-Round Pick (2014)

Toronto Acquires D Kevin Marshall for F Nicolas Deschamps

Ottawa Acquires F Matt Kassian for 6th-Round Pick (2014)

Columbus Acquires F Matthew Ford for Future Considerations

Winnipeg Acquires F Tomas Kubalik for F Spencer Machacek

Edmonton Acquires F Mike Brown for Conditional 4th-Round Pick (2014)

Calgary Acquires F Brian McGrattan for D Joe Piskula

Montreal Acquire F Michael Ryder & 3rd-Round Pick (2013) for F Erik Cole

Philadelphia Acquires F Simon Gagne for Conditional 4th-Round Pick (2013)

Calgary Acquires F Mike Testwuide for F Mitch Wahl

Nashville Acquires D Scott Ford for F Jani Lajunen

Montreal Acquires G Dustin Tokarski for G Cedrick Desjardins

New Jersey Acquires F Alexei Ponikarovsky for 7th-Round Pick (2013) 4th-Round Pick (2014)

Winnipeg Acquires F Eric Tangradi for 7th-Round Pick (2013)

Los Angeles Acquires D Keaton Ellerby for 5th-Round Pick (2013)

NY Islanders G Tim Thomas for 2nd-Round Pick (2014 or 2015)

Anaheim Acquires D Ben Lovejoy for 5th-Round Pick (2014)

New Jersey Acquires F Andrei Loktionov for 5th-Round Pick (2013)

Minnesota Acquires F Mike Rupp for F Darroll Powe F Nick Palmieri

Washington Acquires F Peter LeBlanc for F Mathieu Beaudoin

Washington Acquires F Casey Wellman for F Zach Hamill

Dallas Acquires F Carl Sneep for Conditional 7th-Round Pick

Pittsburgh Acquires F Chad Kolarik January 24 F Benn Ferriero

Chicago Acquires G Henrik Karlsson for 7th-Round Pick (2013)

Tampa Bay Acquires F Jean-Francois Jacques for Future Considerations

Phoenix Acquires F Matthew Lombardi for Conditional 4th-Round Pick (2014)

San Jose Acquires F Tommy Grant, Conditional Draft Pick (2014) for F Brandon Mashinter

Edmonton Acquires D Mark Fistric for 3rd Round Pick (2013)

Carolina Acquires F Kevin Westgarth for F Anthony Stewart 4th-Round Pick (2013) 6th-Round Pick (2014)

Philadelphia Acquires G Brian Boucher D Mark Alt for F Luke Pither



One could argue that the Oil might be able to use a couple guys off of this list, but there hasen't been any earth shattering moves or anything involving anyone that would really solve any of the Oilers problems right now.

There are too many teams that still think they're "in it" and the players just aren't moving right now. Once a few teams start to drop off in the next week we may see more moves start to happen.

And as Dan Rosen quoted Tambellini at the GM meetings, it sounds like if he can pick something up to help the team moving forward he will do it.

There's just nothing out there right now.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:06 PM
  #261
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If Babcock was ever available, I'd ditch Ralph so quickly to grab him. The guy is a terrific coach. Knows how to run systems, can continuously motivate his players, has shown the ability to develop players, has shown the ability to get the most out of veterans. On top of that, makes Detroit play the sort of game that we want to play ourselves.

The guy to me is a top coach in the league, I'd streak in the snow if he was available. He's an amazing coach.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:09 PM
  #262
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Outstanding, seriously

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:10 PM
  #263
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If Babcock was ever available, I'd ditch Ralph so quickly to grab him. The guy is a terrific coach. Knows how to run systems, can continuously motivate his players, has shown the ability to develop players, has shown the ability to get the most out of veterans. On top of that, makes Detroit play the sort of game that we want to play ourselves.

The guy to me is a top coach in the league, I'd streak in the snow if he was available. He's an amazing coach.
He'd get 29 "associate coach" offers immediately after his removal in Detroit.

He'd be a welcome addition to our collection of clowns behind the bench.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:23 PM
  #264
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I think that fixes it. Great, too bad the Sabres couldn't track him down for the VO

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:27 PM
  #265
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One could argue that the Oil might be able to use a couple guys off of this list, but there hasen't been any earth shattering moves or anything involving anyone that would really solve any of the Oilers problems right now.

There are too many teams that still think they're "in it" and the players just aren't moving right now. Once a few teams start to drop off in the next week we may see more moves start to happen.

And as Dan Rosen quoted Tambellini at the GM meetings, it sounds like if he can pick something up to help the team moving forward he will do it.

There's just nothing out there right now.
It's not that there isn't anything out there... NHL GM's are just incompetent and don't know how to operate within a salary cap. Trades happened almost weekly prior to the cap. GM's want to make trades, they just don't know how to get it done under this system.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:29 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by Oilbleeder View Post
If Babcock was ever available, I'd ditch Ralph so quickly to grab him. The guy is a terrific coach. Knows how to run systems, can continuously motivate his players, has shown the ability to develop players, has shown the ability to get the most out of veterans. On top of that, makes Detroit play the sort of game that we want to play ourselves.

The guy to me is a top coach in the league, I'd streak in the snow if he was available. He's an amazing coach.
He's ability to develop is because he's GM doesn't force him to play rookies in key roles too early.

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Old
03-21-2013, 01:36 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
It's not that there isn't anything out there... NHL GM's are just incompetent and don't know how to operate within a salary cap. Trades happened almost weekly prior to the cap. GM's want to make trades, they just don't know how to get it done under this system.
Could be that, or it could just be harder then it seems. I wonder if the issue is treating the players like people instead of things that the organization controls.


I worry you're starting to not like hockey much.

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03-21-2013, 01:38 PM
  #268
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It's not that there isn't anything out there... NHL GM's are just incompetent and don't know how to operate within a salary cap. Trades happened almost weekly prior to the cap. GM's want to make trades, they just don't know how to get it done under this system.
So is every GM incompetent or is the system broken?

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03-21-2013, 01:45 PM
  #269
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Could be that, or it could just be harder then it seems. I wonder if the issue is treating the players like people instead of things that the organization controls.


I worry you're starting to not like hockey much.
While on that, um, topic, I think that no-trade clauses have become somewhat of a disease. The cap has already crippled GM's and their ability to make trades and yet they've been handing out NTC's like candy since 05/06.

I won't deny the last sentence. The Oil Kings have reignited my enjoyment of the sport but on an NHL level, yeah, it's become a bad habit. A vice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29
So is every GM incompetent or is the system broken?
A little from column A, a little from column B.

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03-21-2013, 01:47 PM
  #270
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So now we're not considering Babcock as a replacement coach because he had Lidstrom? He's won a Cup, gone to 2 other finals, won Olympic gold.
I hate to break it to you, but whether "we" consider Babcock or "we" don't, means very little. The organization/team doesn't operate on the finicky, fickle, and all-too-often bi-polar, opinions its fans. Imagine if it did... perhaps they should erect a polling station outside of Rexall, and the majority rules. If better than 50% of the people polled decide to move a player or replace a coach or the GM, it happens. It would be fun, but utter chaos.

And I am including myself in these "fans"; and while it probably appears that I am being critical of people on this board, I am not really... its merely an observation, not a criticism. Heck, if I were to write a definition of a true fan, I would probably include such adjectives as fickle, finicky, and bi-polar.

The players seem to like Krueger, as does the organization. I doubt Krueger is going anywhere unless there is something happening behind the scenes that we don't know of.

Should 'our' organization/GM be considering Babcock? They would be negligent if they didn't at least consider the idea... would it be a wise move to replace a coach already? As good as Babcock is, I am not sure it would be. Changing the bench boss this early into his tenure would, in my ever-so-humble opinion, be a huge mistake for a great many reasons.

Babcock as a GM... now that might be an idea.

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03-21-2013, 02:02 PM
  #271
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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
While on that, um, topic, I think that no-trade clauses have become somewhat of a disease. The cap has already crippled GM's and their ability to make trades and yet they've been handing out NTC's like candy since 05/06.

I won't deny the last sentence. The Oil Kings have reignited my enjoyment of the sport but on an NHL level, yeah, it's become a bad habit. A vice.


A little from column A, a little from column B.
I think it's more B. I don't like how a gm like Feaster hands NTC out like candy, but a team like CBJ with Nash or more recently ANA with Perry and Getzlaf had little options.

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03-21-2013, 02:06 PM
  #272
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That Steckel trade annoys me. We have had pathetic centre depth all season long. And a big body quick draw machine can be had for peanuts when we could have really used him and he goes instead to a serious Stanley Cup contender. Oh well, we can just throw Smyth and Petrell out there and pray.

Last nights lineup just kicked our centre depth issue right in the junk. Its inexcusable at this level.

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03-21-2013, 02:11 PM
  #273
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That just made my week

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Old
03-21-2013, 02:12 PM
  #274
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That Steckel trade annoys me. We have had pathetic centre depth all season long. And a big body quick draw machine can be had for peanuts when we could have really used him and he goes instead to a serious Stanley Cup contender. Oh well, we can just throw Smyth and Petrell out there and pray.

Last nights lineup just kicked our centre depth issue right in the junk. Its inexcusable at this level.
Steckel/Hall.

I will say this I wanted to see Petrell at center because he played there during the lockout. Not saying he is the answer, but playing him there instead of Smyth while we had 3 healthy centers is what I would've liked to see. Knowing that Petrell could fill in as a center would be valuable information. We just don't really know as he's thrown in there now when things are tough.

Again and probably the 15th time this year. Get more centers on this team. 5 that are in the lineup when healthy and maybe even a 6th as a HS.

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03-21-2013, 02:42 PM
  #275
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That Steckel trade annoys me. We have had pathetic centre depth all season long. And a big body quick draw machine can be had for peanuts when we could have really used him and he goes instead to a serious Stanley Cup contender. Oh well, we can just throw Smyth and Petrell out there and pray.

Last nights lineup just kicked our centre depth issue right in the junk. Its inexcusable at this level.
Given our situation at centre, that seems like the one trade that Tambellini may have missed out on considering the price, but so did 27 other GM's.

I'm not going to vilify him for that one though.

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Originally Posted by Moonlapse Vertigo View Post
While on that, um, topic, I think that no-trade clauses have become somewhat of a disease. The cap has already crippled GM's and their ability to make trades and yet they've been handing out NTC's like candy since 05/06.

I won't deny the last sentence. The Oil Kings have reignited my enjoyment of the sport but on an NHL level, yeah, it's become a bad habit. A vice.


A little from column A, a little from column B.
It's hard to argue that point.

GM's do hand these NTC's out like they're going out of style that's for sure, and I really believe this is the biggest reason we see so little trades involving bigger names happening. They all have NTC's

I think you'd see WAY more moves taking place if there weren't so many of them. It really limits the market.

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