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The Process of Trading Jarome Iginla Has Begun - Part 2

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Old
03-21-2013, 12:23 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by nwpensfan View Post
What in Flames fans opinion is driving this rumor about a list of 5 teams, if true? Is it GMJF or is it Iginla himself wanting a chance at cup? I almost hate to see him play for anyone else.
I think its just the fact the if Iggy is moved they are going to send him to an obvious contender. Which limits the list to playoff teams, and then limits it again to teams who have a good shot at winning.

I think there is a list of teams Iginla has indicated he would like to go to, but I think the team is still looking at offers from anyone.

Roger Millions *tried to ask Iginla about the trade rumors and Iginla more or less answered with body language, that he was upset about it.

I don't think its Iginla wanting out, I think its him and management realizing that its best for the future of the club, and hes taking it very hard right now.

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03-21-2013, 12:27 PM
  #127
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Not sure how much Calgary would get from a Contender.

They wouldn't want to create a hole on their roster unless Iggy was plugging that hole.

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03-21-2013, 12:28 PM
  #128
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That was my bad ... you said Granlund.

I'm not mad. Just trying to state that Iggy isn't a big need in Pittsburgh. We have other holes to shore up and sending a first in a deep draft, a D prospect and possibly a roster player for a rental is absurd, especially when you need to upgrade on the third line (a guy like Stempy or GlenX could give you flexibility in which they could play either 2nd or third) and a top four D prospect which assuredly would cost a first round pick for starters.

I get it. Calgary fans want to net the most it can for the face of the franchise. Problem is, this should have been done two years ago when he wasn't a rental; he was younger and his value was higher.

The constant selling job by Calgary fans to Pittsburgh fans on why Iggy would be a great fit. Sure, he improves Pittsburgh in areas that the Pens are already strong. I think people would love to have him, but not at the cost that is being speculated. However Pens fans know that Iggy would be a luxury to have, but isn't a big need.
Speak for yourself. I know that I and several other Pens fans here are perfectly comfortable giving up 1st+Maatta+Kennedy for him.

But then I agree with the sentiment expressed by a few people here that if Iginla is moved he would be amenable to signing an extension. He's obviously looking to win so if he is traded to a team he thinks has a shot to win on for the next few years I'm sure he would look to stay a few years. Can't see him going back to Calgary unless he wins the Cup, in my opinion.

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03-21-2013, 01:05 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by nwpensfan View Post
What in Flames fans opinion is driving this rumor about a list of 5 teams, if true? Is it GMJF or is it Iginla himself wanting a chance at cup? I almost hate to see him play for anyone else.
Pure speculation on behalf of Bob McKenzie, nothing more.

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03-21-2013, 01:33 PM
  #130
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I know this sounds weird at first, but who's to say Iginla even re-signs in Calgary over the off-season? I know it would seem sacrilege, and even less likely after the Doan/Brodeur bluffs over the last offseason, but how bad does Iginla want to win a cup?

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03-21-2013, 02:22 PM
  #131
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Kennedy

Okay, I keep seeing Kennedy being thrown into these proposals. Don't get me wrong, I have him in my keeper league (wish I didn't). Isn't it widely known that he basically has a negative value right now? Or is that the point of him being included?

If I was Calgary, I would want nothing to do with TK, at least not in a trade for Iginla. Wouldn't Calgary waaaaay rather have a 2nd to TK?
I'm sure Calgary has some plug they can put in there instead of trading for one.

Is TK addition by subtraction for the Pens?

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03-21-2013, 02:25 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by nally View Post
Okay, I keep seeing Kennedy being thrown into these proposals. Don't get me wrong, I have him in my keeper league (wish I didn't). Isn't it widely known that he basically has a negative value right now? Or is that the point of him being included?

If I was Calgary, I would want nothing to do with TK, at least not in a trade for Iginla. Wouldn't Calgary waaaaay rather have a 2nd to TK?
I'm sure Calgary has some plug they can put in there instead of trading for one.

Is TK addition by subtraction for the Pens?
TK is basically free, if he isn't in it then the offer is just 1st + Maatta but with him Calgary gets a guy who could return to his 30-40 point form.

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03-21-2013, 02:30 PM
  #133
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Iginla is the heart and soul of the Flames and I don't blame the fan base for wanting top-notch talent in return for him. However, as history has shown time and time again, when a player has a NMC and a small list of teams he'll go to, the value in return is usually disappointing for the home team.

Jerome is a UFA at seasons end and he hasn't signed an extension with his team. Whether Calgary has made him an offer or not we just don't know. The only thing we all know is that he's still unsigned and he's coming up on UFA status.

Can you really create a bidding war between five teams? Or how about three teams? In my opinion you just can't. Hypotheticals aside, teams that are in the hunt for Iginla know that he can test the free agent market at seasons end. Do you give up a blue chip prospect for that uncertainty? Do you give up a young, proven NHL talent for that? Does aquiring Iginla put those particular teams over the top and make them locks for the Cup?


Last edited by SpooKy: 03-21-2013 at 02:31 PM. Reason: spell check
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03-21-2013, 02:35 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by nally View Post
Okay, I keep seeing Kennedy being thrown into these proposals. Don't get me wrong, I have him in my keeper league (wish I didn't). Isn't it widely known that he basically has a negative value right now? Or is that the point of him being included?

If I was Calgary, I would want nothing to do with TK, at least not in a trade for Iginla. Wouldn't Calgary waaaaay rather have a 2nd to TK?
I'm sure Calgary has some plug they can put in there instead of trading for one.

Is TK addition by subtraction for the Pens?
I don't think he has negative value. He is a overpaid, but to the tune of 2m (of which the majority would be paid by the deadline) and is an RFA in the summer, so if you have trouble with the decreasing cap, he comes off the books like that.
He doesn't absolutely have to go for the Pens, so if it's a dealbreaker just leave him off.

It would help getting his roster spot cleared and I don't see why Calgary would refuse a warm body back, especially if the plan to deal Stempniak as well, but if Calgary considers him negative value, I'd be fine with just keeping him for depth scoring. Waive Glass and be done with it. Wouldn't really add anything in lieu of TK though. Maybe Jeffrey or a 4th or something. Or, well, you can gave Glass.

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03-21-2013, 02:39 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Stewie Griffin View Post
Pure speculation on behalf of Bob McKenzie, nothing more.
Actually, McKenzie said he'd heard people talking about a list, but he was never able to confirm this.

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03-21-2013, 02:51 PM
  #136
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Honest question: Is there a feeling that the Flames org has to have a F prospect to make a deal work or is this something that ran away from Flames fans here? Because looking at their prospect pool on paper, the really need both, maybe even D more.
I think our defense prospects are better than many think. Plus it's not a position we need right now in the NHL. Of the NHL regulars Wideman is the oldest and just turned 30 yesterday, Giordano and Bouwmeester are 29 and then Butler is 26 and Brodie 22. Breen is probably the only legit prospect on the farm team but I believe he is NHL ready as well. However I do believe Wotherspoon, Seiloff, Ramage, Kulak and Culkin as there is a good mix of shutdown, physical and puck moving defensemen (4 of whom could be full-time AHLers next year) make a good base for the system, of course none have #1 potential, but I think with the ages of the NHLers we have we can keep that search going for longer. Where as the forward need IMO is more glaring and more immediate, especially at center.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nwpensfan View Post
What in Flames fans opinion is driving this rumor about a list of 5 teams, if true? Is it GMJF or is it Iginla himself wanting a chance at cup? I almost hate to see him play for anyone else.
What is with this GMJF or GMRS stuff? Are people really so lazy they can't type Shero or Feaster? The extra character or 3 isn't going to break your fingers.

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03-21-2013, 02:52 PM
  #137
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He's a rental. No one will give up top notch talent for a rental. Even if it is Iginla.

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03-21-2013, 03:01 PM
  #138
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Exactly! What players/prospects do the Canucks have that would even equal that and a package worth it? Let alone the thought of Naslund raising the cup in Calgary.
Could not care less. Saku Koivu is still my favorite player and he could win the cup with Toronto or Boston and I would be absolutely elated to see it happen. Way I see it, if we're Iginla's best shot at a cup, Flames should be happy for him and relish a chance to forever tell us "you only won a cup cause we helped you."

Suppose it's just me but that is when I put the rivalries aside. My favorite player winning it all means more.

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03-21-2013, 03:02 PM
  #139
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I'd love to see Iginla playing with Pittsburgh, but only if he can keep playing with the white flaming C jersey
That men deserve a Cup, I feel sorry it couldn't be with Calgary.

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03-21-2013, 03:04 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Abbotsford Heat View Post
I think our defense prospects are better than many think. Plus it's not a position we need right now in the NHL. Of the NHL regulars Wideman is the oldest and just turned 30 yesterday, Giordano and Bouwmeester are 29 and then Butler is 26 and Brodie 22. Breen is probably the only legit prospect on the farm team but I believe he is NHL ready as well. However I do believe Wotherspoon, Seiloff, Ramage, Kulak and Culkin as there is a good mix of shutdown, physical and puck moving defensemen (4 of whom could be full-time AHLers next year) make a good base for the system, of course none have #1 potential, but I think with the ages of the NHLers we have we can keep that search going for longer. Where as the forward need IMO is more glaring and more immediate, especially at center.

What is with this GMJF or GMRS stuff? Are people really so lazy they can't type Shero or Feaster? The extra character or 3 isn't going to break your fingers.
Thank you for the answer. I probably saw all those D prospects besides Wotherspoon (and Brodie who isn't a prospect anymore) differently, but it makes sense then to prefer Boston. PIT really has no top center prospects to give.

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03-21-2013, 03:10 PM
  #141
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Actually, McKenzie said he'd heard people talking about a list, but he was never able to confirm this.
And then stated that it was complete speculation on his part as to which teams (and how many) were on this list.

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03-21-2013, 03:19 PM
  #142
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Could not care less. Saku Koivu is still my favorite player and he could win the cup with Toronto or Boston and I would be absolutely elated to see it happen. Way I see it, if we're Iginla's best shot at a cup, Flames should be happy for him and relish a chance to forever tell us "you only won a cup cause we helped you."

Suppose it's just me but that is when I put the rivalries aside. My favorite player winning it all means more.
If for some reason Iginla thought Vancouver would be his best shot at the cup, then fine but I do not see it this year. It would still be odd to see Iginla in any other jersey, let alone a Canuck jersey. A deal with the Canucks would have to be done very carefully as to make sure the Calgary fans do not completely give up on management. The deal would HAVE to make Canuck fans feel upset about losing certain prospects for me to be alright with it. I get Kassian is off limits, but believe they would have to add something significantly more to make the deal happen.

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03-21-2013, 03:25 PM
  #143
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The deal would HAVE to make Canuck fans feel upset about losing certain prospects for me to be alright with it. I get Kassian is off limits, but believe they would have to add something significantly more to make the deal happen.
Fine, but just don't touch Prab Rai. Or Yann Sauve. Take anyone else, but those would hurt too much.

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03-21-2013, 03:31 PM
  #144
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If for some reason Iginla thought Vancouver would be his best shot at the cup, then fine but I do not see it this year. It would still be odd to see Iginla in any other jersey, let alone a Canuck jersey. A deal with the Canucks would have to be done very carefully as to make sure the Calgary fans do not completely give up on management. The deal would HAVE to make Canuck fans feel upset about losing certain prospects for me to be alright with it. I get Kassian is off limits, but believe they would have to add something significantly more to make the deal happen.
I personally don't believe that Iginla would ever be dealt to the Canucks. His value in a trade is limited by the fact that he's a rental, and not a young one at that, and his game is clearly on the downside. Given that value, I can't believe that you could get a significantly better deal from the Canucks than you would from another team, and that's why I don't see him going to Vancouver.

But I think Flames fans need to give up the notion they'll get a significant asset for Iginla from any team. Just never happens with rental players. From the Canucks the best asset they'd give up IMO is Gaunce - and that's an asset that other teams can easily match, making it very unlikely the Flames would ship him to Vancouver. I don't think that guys like Kassian or Hansen would ever be considered in a deal for a rental... I doubt even Jensen would be included in such a deal.

Just look at the comparable deals for rental players. That's what Iginla is likely to return.

My guess is that if he's dealt (a huge if), it's to an Eastern team. Pittsburgh would be my guess... assets like Maata and a 1st seem logical here. The Pens have a solid cupboard of talented defense prospects and I could easily see them shipping one out for a guy like Iginla. Bennett however is a pipedream IMO.

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03-21-2013, 03:40 PM
  #145
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I personally don't believe that Iginla would ever be dealt to the Canucks. His value in a trade is limited by the fact that he's a rental, and not a young one at that, and his game is clearly on the downside. Given that value, I can't believe that you could get a significantly better deal from the Canucks than you would from another team, and that's why I don't see him going to Vancouver.

But I think Flames fans need to give up the notion they'll get a significant asset for Iginla from any team. Just never happens with rental players. From the Canucks the best asset they'd give up IMO is Gaunce - and that's an asset that other teams can easily match, making it very unlikely the Flames would ship him to Vancouver. I don't think that guys like Kassian or Hansen would ever be considered in a deal for a rental... I doubt even Jensen would be included in such a deal.

Just look at the comparable deals for rental players. That's what Iginla is likely to return.

My guess is that if he's dealt (a huge if), it's to an Eastern team. Pittsburgh would be my guess... assets like Maata and a 1st seem logical here. The Pens have a solid cupboard of talented defense prospects and I could easily see them shipping one out for a guy like Iginla. Bennett however is a pipedream IMO.
This is what I am trying to say.... I get not wanting to give up certain prospects for him. I would personally be fine with Maata+1st+Kennedy (or other roster player to move salary if needed). I am not asking for the moon, but if he went to Canucks it would have to equal that package and another good prospect. Even then I am doubting he would get traded to the Canucks... I am wondering if the Canucks are on the list just to try to drive up the price more so than anything.

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03-21-2013, 03:48 PM
  #146
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This is what I am trying to say.... I get not wanting to give up certain prospects for him. I would personally be fine with Maata+1st+Kennedy (or other roster player to move salary if needed). I am not asking for the moon, but if he went to Canucks it would have to equal that package and another good prospect. Even then I am doubting he would get traded to the Canucks... I am wondering if the Canucks are on the list just to try to drive up the price more so than anything.
That's a bit of a mystery. Outside of the rivalry, it makes perfect sense for him to include Vancouver on his list - he has a home in BC. But you'd think he'd be a bit more conscious of his legacy in Calgary. It isn't Johnny Damon on the Yankees bad, but I imagine folks in Calgary wouldn't care for it.

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03-21-2013, 03:52 PM
  #147
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That's a bit of a mystery. Outside of the rivalry, it makes perfect sense for him to include Vancouver on his list - he has a home in BC. But you'd think he'd be a bit more conscious of his legacy in Calgary. It isn't Johnny Damon on the Yankees bad, but I imagine folks in Calgary wouldn't care for it.
Exactly! Iginla seems like the type of individual who does not want to ruin his reputation to the Flames fans who have supported him thoughout all these years. This is what really makes me think that if the Canucks are on the list, then it would seem to be to help the Flames get the best possible return for him.

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03-21-2013, 04:39 PM
  #148
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Exactly! Iginla seems like the type of individual who does not want to ruin his reputation to the Flames fans who have supported him thoughout all these years. This is what really makes me think that if the Canucks are on the list, then it would seem to be to help the Flames get the best possible return for him.
I would look at it as Iggy upset that he's been asked to give a list of teams and as a shot to the Flames management

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03-21-2013, 05:14 PM
  #149
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That's a bit of a mystery. Outside of the rivalry, it makes perfect sense for him to include Vancouver on his list - he has a home in BC. But you'd think he'd be a bit more conscious of his legacy in Calgary. It isn't Johnny Damon on the Yankees bad, but I imagine folks in Calgary wouldn't care for it.
No, it's worse. It would only be worse-worse if he was traded to the Oilers.

That said, some of the more mature fans would realize that its better to lose Iginla for something, than to risk losing him for nothing. If the best "something" comes from the Canucks, then so be it. Sure, a lot of us won't be actively cheering for Vancouver to win, but many of us would likely be pleased to see Iginla win a Stanley Cup regardless of who he is traded to. Even if it is with the Canucks - causing us to die a little inside.

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03-21-2013, 06:25 PM
  #150
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A couple of comments. The Bruins gve up Joe Colborne, a first-round draft pick in 2011 and a conditional draft pick in 2012 for a 33 year T. Kaberle, who was basically for insurance as a point man on the PP.

The Bruins have shown their commitment to winning and will pay dearly for players they think can get them over the hump and help them win the Cup. And with Kaberle it paid off.

If Chiarelli feels that Iggy would be a critical player to give the Bs their best shot at a Cup and Pittsburgh is not interested in competing with the Bruins for his services, they not only give up whatever Iggy could have brought to the Pens, but also allowed a team they could be fighting it out with to have the 'Iggy advantage'.

So you just aren't losing out on the player, you are also allowing him to go to a rival. That swing could make the difference in who wins the Conference. That imo, should be enough to prod Pitt into digging fairly deep, if they indeed feel Iggy could have that kind of impact.

Obviously you can't give up your entire future for a rental, but if you win with the player you traded for, the assets given up will soon be forgotten. No one in Bos. cares that the Kaberle deal was an overpayment.

Pitt is built to win now, and it is tough to keep your entire future and win the Cup as well. Especially when other teams are willing to risk more.

To Vancouver fans. Despite CS rankings, in retrospect Brendan Gaunce was a questionable 1st round pick. I doubt he has much upside beyond a checking center at the NHL level unless something changes.

Gaunce's game has taken a step backward this season and in a recent re-evaluation of the 2012 draft by NHL scouts, he didn't receive one vote that would put him in the top 50 picks of the draft. That puts him in the late 2nd or even third round if the draft was done over. He is Mark McNeill light.

Not the type of 1st round prospect Calgary needs more of. We already have Greg Nemisz.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...NHL-draft.html

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