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2013 Leafs Trades/Proposals/Signings XI - Winter... I mean...Deadline approaching

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Old
03-23-2013, 12:56 PM
  #276
DirtyDion03
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03-23-2013, 01:00 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by Ricky Bobby View Post
The picks give Nonis extra organizational to use at the draft to put towards a difference maker something Bozak isn't.

To acquire a difference maker to give us a real shot at winning the cup it'll take top prospects, cheap young players and picks in the top 2 rounds.

The Leafs are on an upward trend and this is the last year we'll have a chance at grabbing extra picks-prospects to stockpile more depth assets over the other teams in the playoff hunt.
The Leafs are drafting difference makers and trading for them too.

Kessel, JvR, Gardiner, Kadri, Rielly. These are all difference makers that were drafted/traded for.

Seems like none of these guys were picked outside of the top 20.

Go even further and you get guys like Lupul, Phaneuf.

The Leafs have like 5-6 players that are under 30 and were drafted top 10 by the Leafs or another team.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:02 PM
  #278
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
The Leafs are drafting difference makers and trading for them too.

Kessel, JvR, Gardiner, Kadri, Rielly. These are all difference makers that were drafted/traded for.

Seems like none of these guys were picked outside of the top 20.

Go even further and you get guys like Lupul, Phaneuf.

The Leafs have like 5-6 players that are under 30 and were drafted top 10 by the Leafs or another team.
Agreed HFboards in general value prospect and picks a lot more than actual capable NHL players. Which doesn't apply at all in the real world.

Out of the players you listed, we have few who already have quite a bit of a respected/clutch performers come playoff time. Kessel, JVR, Lupul and Kadri (albeit in the Juniors, was phenomenal). People forget that and still want them gone.

Edit: I think Frattin was also well known for bring his game up when Playoffs came by.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:04 PM
  #279
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Not a chemistry issue here..

Struggling Grabovski just goes for a lap in the offensive zone, throws a weak shot at the net or passes to his wingers in a bad position.

Believe it or not, right now Bozak is the best center available for Kessel. I think the Leafs will give Colborne a chance next year because he has greatly improved his play and is a beast along the boards.

JvR-Colborne-Kessel could be a great line.
Well he probably doesn't have much confidence right now. I'd like to see Grabo put in a situation where he can succeed instead of on the third line in a shutdown role. We all know what he is capable of (he has a wicked shot, can take about anything you throw at him, is solid both ways), it'd certainly help our team if we pushed him a little more.

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03-23-2013, 01:06 PM
  #280
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Originally Posted by Leaf Rocket View Post
Agreed HFboards in general value prospect and picks a lot more than actual capable NHL players. Which doesn't apply at all in the real world.

Out of the players you listed, we have few who already have quite a bit of a respected/clutch performers come playoff time. Kessel, JVR, Lupul and Kadri (albeit in the Juniors, was phenomenal). People forget that and still want them gone.

Edit: I think Frattin was also well known for bring his game up when Playoffs came by.
Dion went PPG in one playoff series in Calgary, I'm sure he will have another gear if we make it.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:17 PM
  #281
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This place is unbearable.

People will complain if we trade Bozak and they will complain if we don't trade him.
Yep. I pretty much lost whatever faith I had left in this board when we won a game against NJ and the PGT was brimming with complaints that the team didn't look good enough getting the two points, and that we'd doubtlessly lose the next game.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:19 PM
  #282
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Pretty much.

Everyone around here is an Arm Chair GM and could manage this team better than Nonis himself.
Ya well my chair doesn't have arms

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03-23-2013, 01:38 PM
  #283
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Originally Posted by Leaf Rocket View Post
Agreed HFboards in general value prospect and picks a lot more than actual capable NHL players. Which doesn't apply at all in the real world.

Out of the players you listed, we have few who already have quite a bit of a respected/clutch performers come playoff time. Kessel, JVR, Lupul and Kadri (albeit in the Juniors, was phenomenal). People forget that and still want them gone.

Edit: I think Frattin was also well known for bring his game up when Playoffs came by.
Capable NHL players that have nothing to do with our future have no place on my roster. In the real world.

Either get the UFAs signed before the TD or ship them out, plain and simple.

We have the depth in the AHL to fill their spots.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:40 PM
  #284
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Originally Posted by ChuckWoods View Post
Pretty much.

Everyone around here is an Arm Chair GM and could manage this team better than Nonis himself.
Hey chuck, did you happen to notice the thread we are in?

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03-23-2013, 01:54 PM
  #285
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Hey chuck, did you happen to notice the thread we are in?
Haha I did.

It was in response to the person that was questioning Leaf Nation Logic. lol

As for recent "gossip", there really isn't much to grasp at.

Allegedy, there have certainly been discussions around the league that Paul Stastny is very available, along with the likes of Derek Roy and Jaroslav Halak despite recent reports of denial by Armstrong.

Both Dan Boyle and Ryan Clowe have been garnering plenty of interest, but it seems despite San Jose's desire to shake the culture up a bit, they arn't going to be selling these guys short with the current position they are in.

Calgary continues to shop Iggy, but rumor is really the only potential suitors at this point continue to be Boston and Pittsburgh. With Calgary's recent slide they'll also be near officially declaring themselves "sellers" and be more receptive to selling off Bouwmeester.

Another name being tossed around in terms of selling is Marcel Goc, who could certainly bolster plenty of playoff teams Bottom 6.

If Pheonix continues to slide, they'll see themselves enter sellers mode and put the likes of a Derek Morris on the block.

There is absolutely A LOT of discussions going on with the deadline looming, and it sounds as if Toronto wants to make their move before April 3rd.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:54 PM
  #286
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Is that why they are 6th in the Eastern Conference?

Yep "0 winnin for MacKinnon"

Edmonton gets Taylor Hall: What a player! Watch this team break out next year...
Edmonton gets RNH: Wow what a playmaker, greatest vision since Gretzky, dynasty in the making...playoffs next year.
Edmonton gets Yakupov: Wow! He reminds of Bure and Ovie-lite...amazing talent, future PPG player...this team is going to breakout next year.

Edmonton gets ______ (top prospect): Reminds me of _____, great player, Edmonton will make the playoffs next year.

The Oilers have the DUMBEST management EVER.

None of their stars are good at defense. Nazem Kadri plays better defense than any of the Oilers young forwards. Oilers are building a fantasy team, the Leafs are building a real team.

Have patience..don't sell players when they are in the playoffs.

Best thing for the Leafs: Not a buyer or a seller. If we trade for players...it will be guys that fit the big picture.

Acquiring late firsts does NOTHING to help the Leafs in the immediate future.

Stuart Percy and Biggs were drafted in 2011 and are still at least 2 years away from making any impact.

Tired of this: Lets trade BOZAK for picks, Lets trade ____ for picks.
Talk to me at the end of the season, see where we are. I'm very willing to bet we're at our usual 9th or 10th place.

Also, newsflash, Oilers are 3 points out of a playoff spot, same amount as we are to being out of it.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:55 PM
  #287
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Capable NHL players that have nothing to do with our future have no place on my roster. In the real world.

Either get the UFAs signed before the TD or ship them out, plain and simple.

We have the depth in the AHL to fill their spots.
Agreed. If you are a cup contender you keep the UFA's and the payoff is a good playoff run or stanley cup. We are not in that position yet. As much as playoffs would be a great experience, we cannot afford to let players like Bozak and McArthur walk away for nothing. These guys shouldhave some value at the deadline and even if its a prospect and 2nd rounder, I would move them.

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Old
03-23-2013, 01:59 PM
  #288
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Originally Posted by ChuckWoods View Post
Haha I did.

It was in response to the person that was questioning Leaf Nation Logic. lol

As for recent "gossip", there really isn't much to grasp at.

Allegedy, there have certainly been discussions around the league that Paul Stastny is very available, along with the likes of Derek Roy and Jaroslav Halak despite recent reports of denial by Armstrong.

Both Dan Boyle and Ryan Clowe have been garnering plenty of interest, but it seems despite San Jose's desire to shake the culture up a bit, they arn't going to be selling these guys short with the current position they are in.

Calgary continues to shop Iggy, but rumor is really the only potential suitors at this point continue to be Boston and Pittsburgh. With Calgary's recent slide they'll also be near officially declaring themselves "sellers" and be more receptive to selling off Bouwmeester.

Another name being tossed around in terms of selling is Marcel Goc, who could certainly bolster plenty of playoff teams Bottom 6.

If Pheonix continues to slide, they'll see themselves enter sellers mode and put the likes of a Derek Morris on the block.

There is absolutely A LOT of discussions going on with the deadline looming, and it sounds as if Toronto wants to make their move before April 3rd.
Did you post Stastnys name just to make my day?

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Old
03-23-2013, 02:04 PM
  #289
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Did you post Stastnys name just to make my day?
Haha no!

But he isn't exactly seen as a "long term" fit in Colorado.

Many of the fans want a change in that area and feel as if whoever plays with him generally ends up slumping.

Avs ownership certainly is receptive to dumping that contract and could find themselves pushing to go that direction.

As a fan, I would be open to Stastny coming into Toronto and becoming this teams 1B type of Center that could help Kessel. Paul Stastny has always provided solid two-way play and stability on the faceoff dot, so we wouldn't see a huge regression in that department if it were Bozak going in the opposite direction.

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Old
03-23-2013, 02:09 PM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
Capable NHL players that have nothing to do with our future have no place on my roster. In the real world.

Either get the UFAs signed before the TD or ship them out, plain and simple.

We have the depth in the AHL to fill their spots.
glad your not the GM... In a cap world having expiring contracts isn't a bad thing in letting these particular type of depth players walk at the years end while enjoying the depth they give you for the remainder of the year especially with playoffs in sight.

What are you going to get in return for Bozak and MacArthur that will improve or be part of your future anyway trading them for futures? 2nd - 3rd round picks that chances are wont turn into anything that will be part of the teams future or prospects that like you've eluded to is already with the Marlies. Doesn't sound like to me is worth the risk weakening the team when this team is in a playoff spot.

I have no problem what's of ever letting these 2 go for nothing at season end. You gain the cap space that will go to re-signing Kadri and clear 2 roster spots for that AHL depth to be promoted at the beginning of next year rather than throwing them into the fire of battling for a playoff spot that would be setting them up to fail.

There's really only 2 ways the Leafs should trade either of these 2 cause expiring contracts HAVE VALUE in a cap world rather you see it or not.

#1) a team over pays
#2) they're part of a trade that up grades the team NOW
... and it's as simple as that.

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Old
03-23-2013, 02:10 PM
  #291
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Originally Posted by Dark Passenger View Post
Agreed. If you are a cup contender you keep the UFA's and the payoff is a good playoff run or stanley cup. We are not in that position yet. As much as playoffs would be a great experience, we cannot afford to let players like Bozak and McArthur walk away for nothing. These guys shouldhave some value at the deadline and even if its a prospect and 2nd rounder, I would move them.
Well thats the rub right?

You get those here all in a knot because they fear the payback drop off from the likes that we could call up and rep them with.

A) that tells me this team is to fragile and is not ready to be leaving assets on the table.

B) They are knowingly or not ,acknowledging that our AHL pool is so shallow that they are not even good enough to rep out guys we are ready to let walk as UFAs. How sad is that?

Draft years between 2002 and 2010, the 2nd round has produced star(ie,Weber,Keith,Lucic)/well about average talent(ie, Hjarlm,Kuli,Pave,Howard) at a 10% clip.

Given the scouting staff we have and our dev team, i would love to hand them another 2 picks in the 2nd rnd to work with for 2 UFAs.

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Old
03-23-2013, 02:12 PM
  #292
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Originally Posted by Pi View Post
The Leafs are drafting difference makers and trading for them too.

Kessel, JvR, Gardiner, Kadri, Rielly. These are all difference makers that were drafted/traded for.

Seems like none of these guys were picked outside of the top 20.

Go even further and you get guys like Lupul, Phaneuf.

The Leafs have like 5-6 players that are under 30 and were drafted top 10 by the Leafs or another team.
Kessel took a lot of assets to acquire.

Phaneuf and Lupul were overpaid reclamation projects which is how we got them so cheap. As we've got closer to the cap it's unlikely we can take a risk on a high cap player who wasn't coming close to earning his cap hit or has health concerns anymore (or more unlikely than before).

Gardiner no one expected to be this good.

We won't be picking top 10 anytime soon so how do we get a prospect as good as Rielly? Or a dman with the potential upside of Schenn that a team would trade us a JVR?

Neither Bozak or CMac are core players and this is still not a contending team.

I believe it's important to acquire assets for them that will allow us to package up to acquire another difference maker or at least lessen the blow of dealing assets like our own 1st or prospects like Finn, Colborne, etx.

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Old
03-23-2013, 02:18 PM
  #293
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glad your not the GM... In a cap world having expiring contracts isn't a bad thing in letting these particular type of depth players walk at the years end while enjoying the depth they give you for the remainder of the year especially with playoffs in sight.

What are you going to get in return for Bozak and MacArthur that will improve or be part of your future anyway trading them for futures? 2nd - 3rd round picks that chances are wont turn into anything that will be part of the teams future or prospects that like you've eluded to is already with the Marlies. Doesn't sound like to me is worth the risk weakening the team when this team is in a playoff spot.

I have no problem what's of ever letting these 2 go for nothing at season end. You gain the cap space that will go to re-signing Kadri and clear 2 roster spots for that AHL depth to be promoted at the beginning of next year rather than throwing them into the fire of battling for a playoff spot that would be setting them up to fail.

There's really only 2 ways the Leafs should trade either of these 2 cause expiring contracts HAVE VALUE in a cap world rather you see it or not.

#1) a team over pays
#2) they're part of a trade that up grades the team NOW
... and it's as simple as that.
Actually it's not as simple as that.

You want the POs for what? your own entertainment , for player developement or is ownership needing the money?

If it's for player dev, then i argue, lets get that dev to players who are going to be with us after this season ,like ohhhh i don't know ,Colb,Ashton,D'Amigo,Scott.

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03-23-2013, 02:23 PM
  #294
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Is that why they are 6th in the Eastern Conference?

Yep "0 winnin for MacKinnon"

Edmonton gets Taylor Hall: What a player! Watch this team break out next year...
Edmonton gets RNH: Wow what a playmaker, greatest vision since Gretzky, dynasty in the making...playoffs next year.
Edmonton gets Yakupov: Wow! He reminds of Bure and Ovie-lite...amazing talent, future PPG player...this team is going to breakout next year.

Edmonton gets ______ (top prospect): Reminds me of _____, great player, Edmonton will make the playoffs next year.

The Oilers have the DUMBEST management EVER.

None of their stars are good at defense. Nazem Kadri plays better defense than any of the Oilers young forwards. Oilers are building a fantasy team, the Leafs are building a real team.

Have patience..don't sell players when they are in the playoffs.

Best thing for the Leafs: Not a buyer or a seller. If we trade for players...it will be guys that fit the big picture.

Acquiring late firsts does NOTHING to help the Leafs in the immediate future.

Stuart Percy and Biggs were drafted in 2011 and are still at least 2 years away from making any impact.

Tired of this: Lets trade BOZAK for picks, Lets trade ____ for picks.
You'd have to be a lot more patient to trade players (for futures) while you're situated in a playoff spot.

Isn't the ultimate goal to win the cup? If you're concerned that this team may not make the playoffs because they traded away two players the caliber of MacArthur or Bozak, then I'm not sure we're in a position to be turning down first-round picks or prospects, assuming the ultimate goal is to win Lord Stanley.


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Old
03-23-2013, 02:25 PM
  #295
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Haha no!

But he isn't exactly seen as a "long term" fit in Colorado.

Many of the fans want a change in that area and feel as if whoever plays with him generally ends up slumping.

Avs ownership certainly is receptive to dumping that contract and could find themselves pushing to go that direction.

As a fan, I would be open to Stastny coming into Toronto and becoming this teams 1B type of Center that could help Kessel. Paul Stastny has always provided solid two-way play and stability on the faceoff dot, so we wouldn't see a huge regression in that department if it were Bozak going in the opposite direction.
I would also be open to seeing Stastny in Toronto if Bozak goes the other way (I'd assume something else would be added to Bozak, but nothing major.

However if we somehow acquire Stastny, don't you see that spelling the end for Grabo in Toronto? I mean we certainly can't run with Grabo 5.5mil, Stastny 6.5mil and Kadri getting a raise in the 4.5-5mil range...

If something like this happens, how would something like this look going into next year.

JVR - Stastny - Kessel (Line Amurca)
Lupul - Kadri - Frattin
MacArthur - Colborne - Kulemin
Komarov - McClemment - Orr
McLaren

IMO that's a great forward corps.

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03-23-2013, 02:25 PM
  #296
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Hopefully the brass realize this team isn't a playoff team.
my thoughts exactly, please focus on the rebuild, if assets aren't going to be kept, they should be traded for fair value, zero chance of winning a cup, little to no chance of winning a playoff round, iffy even to make the playoffs. With odds like that, the rebuild has to be the main priority.

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03-23-2013, 02:28 PM
  #297
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I wonder if there is ANY way we could pry Gudbranson away from Florida...

He's a big RIGHT d-man with a RHS and would fit Carlyle's system perfectly with Phanuef.

FLA: Gardiner
TOR: Gudbranson

I think it is fair value.

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03-23-2013, 02:31 PM
  #298
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my thoughts exactly, please focus on the rebuild, if assets aren't going to be kept, they should be traded for fair value, zero chance of winning a cup, little to no chance of winning a playoff round, iffy even to make the playoffs. With odds like that, the rebuild has to be the main priority.
I argue this.

If this set up is sooo fragile that replacing Bozak for Colb and Mac for Ashton, is make it or break it, then WTF are we talking about here? What does just making the PO really matter? Selfish gratification?

If they are that important get them signed.

If Colb,Asht are not good enough?, well we need more depth and that takes picks.

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03-23-2013, 02:31 PM
  #299
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I wonder if there is ANY way we could pry Gudbranson away from Florida...

He's a big RIGHT d-man with a RHS and would fit Carlyle's system perfectly with Phanuef.

FLA: Gardiner
TOR: Gudbranson

I think it is fair value.
I just threw up

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03-23-2013, 02:32 PM
  #300
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Originally Posted by Rockinz View Post
I wonder if there is ANY way we could pry Gudbranson away from Florida...

He's a big RIGHT d-man with a RHS and would fit Carlyle's system perfectly with Phanuef.

FLA: Gardiner
TOR: Gudbranson

I think it is fair value.
I don't want Gudbranson. I honestly don't see much in him.

Much rather keep Gardiner, has higher upside

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