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Oilers lose 3-0 ...Game Over

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03-24-2013, 12:44 AM
  #326
syz
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Maybe the fans were just booing Hitchcock.

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03-24-2013, 12:45 AM
  #327
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Originally Posted by KarmaPolice View Post
Maybe. Maybe not. The only point I'm trying to make (and have made) is that elite goal tending is not ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY to win a SC. It's been done many times before. It helps your chances, yes, but it can be overcome with good enough defensemen and systems in place (see: Osgood again, for the 4th time).

If you can't see this obvious point, then this is a waste of time.
And what defensemen are out there that have been rumored to be traded are good enough to overcome our atrocious goaltending?

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03-24-2013, 12:45 AM
  #328
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Having the best defenseman of our generation play on his team didn't help him at all. Think about how many cups the Red Wings would have won if they had traded for Roy instead of the Avalanche. Also do you think the Avalanche win both their Stanley Cups with Thibault instead of Roy?
If Thibault happened to get red hot, sure, why not? It's completely theoretically possible. But then again, almost anything is. This type of dialog really goes nowhere fast, but thanks for coming out.

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03-24-2013, 12:46 AM
  #329
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There's been plenty of dull games. Even when they have a lead they play scared hockey as dictated by Krueger (thanks Ralph).

That whole sales pitch of the "high flying Oilers!" has been a joke. Everyone expected losses.
I agree a little but you look at what the West has become. Defensive trapping teams everywhere. If we played even one game against the East this year you'd likely see a 6-4 game or thereabouts. Not the 2-1, 3-0 games we're seeing. Teams know how to shut us down.

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03-24-2013, 12:46 AM
  #330
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Originally Posted by raab View Post
And what defensemen are out there that have been rumored to be traded are good enough to overcome our atrocious goaltending?
Now you're putting words in my mouth, because I never said that there even were any.

Ughhhhhhhhhhhh...good night.

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03-24-2013, 12:46 AM
  #331
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And do you think he's that good of a goalie or more of a product of his defensemen and the team's systems?
He played lights-out that year. That team's system and style is conducive to low GAA, high wins, but low save percentage.

Why? They usually limit their opponent to <20 shots a game, and give a higher proportion of high-quality shots than other teams because opposition shots mostly only come off of Detroit turnovers, making for higher-quality opportunities.

That's why Jimmy Howard posting 0.920+ save percentages in year past have earned him credit as a top-10 goalie in the league.

Meanwhile, Mike Smith posts a 0.930 in Phoenix and gets no such credit.

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03-24-2013, 12:47 AM
  #332
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Maybe the fans were just booing Hitchcock.

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03-24-2013, 12:49 AM
  #333
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Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
He played lights-out that year. That team's system and style is conducive to low GAA, high wins, but low save percentage.

Why? They usually limit their opponent to <20 shots a game, and give a higher proportion of high-quality shots than other teams because opposition shots mostly only come off of Detroit turnovers, making for higher-quality opportunities.

That's why Jimmy Howard posting 0.920+ save percentages in year past have earned him credit as a top-10 goalie in the league.

Meanwhile, Mike Smith posts a 0.930 in Phoenix and gets no such credit.
Hence, he was a product of their system. Thank you.

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03-24-2013, 12:49 AM
  #334
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I agree a little but you look at what the West has become. Defensive trapping teams everywhere. If we played even one game against the East this year you'd likely see a 6-4 game or thereabouts. Not the 2-1, 3-0 games we're seeing. Teams know how to shut us down.
That and our coaching hire has been giant sized bust. Lets be honest he was hired on the promise of that Calgary win last year where they played free wheeling hockey and dominated and because of his "communication skills" and not much else.

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03-24-2013, 12:49 AM
  #335
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Desperation to win = Dumb trades.

See Kunitz for Whitney.

Or the Erik Johnson trade.
Put what I was talking about in perspective. I am talking about Tambellini and Burke. One has done absolutely nothing productive over a good many years whereas the other changes the faces of franchises. The biggest mistake Burke ever made was trading Kessel for draft picks that ended up being much better than even Burke's critics could've imagined. Besides that he has done very well as far as trades go, and I don't blame him for rolling the dice.

Also it's funny that you bring up Kunitz for Whitney simply looking where the two players are now. Not saying that the trade was an ideal move gms should imitate, but Whitney was at that time still a valuable asset even though everyone knew about his chronic foot injury. Sure enough Whitney lost all of his value whatsoever and Kunitz is exactly what Pittsburgh needed.

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03-24-2013, 12:49 AM
  #336
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If the playoffs are indeed out of the picture;

Pull the injured players from the line-up so they can heal and get away from the losing, call up some farm hands, and tank the season. Get the best pick we can this year, sign some servicable vets, and try to improve next year.

Preferably without Steve Tambellini as GM.

And for go$h $akes, don't go to the rink for the re$t of the year. That'$ the only language Katz under$tand$.

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03-24-2013, 12:49 AM
  #337
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Originally Posted by KarmaPolice View Post
Hence, he was a product of their system. Thank you.
Did you just completely neglect what I said about their system being conducive to low save percentages?

He went from a career <0.910 save percentage player into one with a 0.930 save percentage over the course of a playoff series. He became a top-5 goaltender for that 25-30 game stretch and won them the cup.

The next year, he posts a 0.926 and takes them to the finals.

They were getting elite-level goaltending from him in the playoffs those 2 years - there's a reason he was getting Conn Smythe consideration in both of those playoff years.

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03-24-2013, 12:53 AM
  #338
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So its better to open it up in this game and lose 6-1. Because its what would have likely happened.

Soon as we did open it up STL was burning us alive and Khabi was getting shellshocked.
Opening it up is the only way that the Oilers can win any game let alone, a game against St. Louis. If they lose, so be it but at least they will go down running and gunning so to speak. It's why they were successful against the Hawks and played well against the Wings for 2 periods.

The Oilers are simply not good enough to play at the other teams' pace and when they try chip and chase against a much bigger and stronger opponent, they might as well fold the tent and go home by the end of the 1st.

Until Tambellini adds some balance to the roster to the point that they can play multiple styles and succeed, they absolutely must play the only style that caters to the strength which is an up tempo, aggressive style. Trying to play tight checking, sit back and try to hope for a turnover hockey against a team like St. Louis is playing into their hands. They can simply just impose their will and play in the Oilers zone all night.
They might as well play aggressive, loosen the reigns and let the skilled guys make skilled plays and if they have some odd man breaks the other way, so be it. Try to dictate at their pace. The problem is that the Oilers play as if they're scared to make a mistake and that's a recipe for disaster with a roster like this.

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03-24-2013, 12:53 AM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Did you just completely neglect what I said about their system being conducive to low save percentages?

He went from a career <0.910 save percentage player into one with a 0.930 save percentage over the course of a playoff series. He became a top-5 goaltender for that 25-30 game stretch and won them the cup.

The next year, he posts a 0.926 and takes them to the finals.

They were getting elite-level goaltending from him in the playoffs those 2 years.
Indeed, it was an epic last hurrah from him.

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03-24-2013, 12:53 AM
  #340
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Put what I was talking about in perspective. I am talking about Tambellini and Burke. One has done absolutely nothing productive over a good many years whereas the other changes the faces of franchises. The biggest mistake Burke ever made was trading Kessel for draft picks that ended up being much better than even Burke's critics could've imagined. Besides that he has done very well as far as trades go, and I don't blame him for rolling the dice.

Also it's funny that you bring up Kunitz for Whitney simply looking where the two players are now. Not saying that the trade was an ideal move gms should imitate, but Whitney was at that time still a valuable asset even though everyone knew about his chronic foot injury. Sure enough Whitney lost all of his value whatsoever and Kunitz is exactly what Pittsburgh needed.
A bad trade is still a bad trade. Everyone talks about Getzlaf and Perry and Ryan in Anaheim but Kunitz was the driving force. Even if it looked decent at the time, it's still a bad trade.

We need to take risks, I absolutely agree, but I don't want our GM, whomever it may be, to throw caution to the wind. Making panic trades is a recipe for even bigger failure. the Erik Johnson trade was a panic trade and it cost the Avalanche very, very dearly.

Another example would be the Phaneuf trade. Nobody thinks that goof is more overrated than me but it spelled the beginning of the end of Sutter in Calgary and set them on the current course they're on.

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03-24-2013, 12:56 AM
  #341
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Gotta love all the post game interviews:

"Well we played really good in the other games before this one. Yeah, we did lose them though. But we were playing well. Before this game."

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03-24-2013, 12:57 AM
  #342
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Hahahaha this lady on CBC speaking over the highlights of the game is TERRIBLE.

I don't even think she watches hockey.

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03-24-2013, 12:57 AM
  #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Did you just completely neglect what I said about their system being conducive to low save percentages?

He went from a career <0.910 save percentage player into one with a 0.930 save percentage over the course of a playoff series. He became a top-5 goaltender for that 25-30 game stretch and won them the cup.

The next year, he posts a 0.926 and takes them to the finals.

They were getting elite-level goaltending from him in the playoffs those 2 years - there's a reason he was getting Conn Smythe consideration in both of those playoff years.
No, that's exactly my point. His numbers were a product of what you point out. Does that make him special or 'elite'?

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03-24-2013, 12:58 AM
  #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlowlyOilersfan View Post
Indeed, it was an epic last hurrah from him.
What's your stance on the issue? Why don't you come out and make your voice heard, instead of throwing cheap shots.

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03-24-2013, 12:58 AM
  #345
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Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Hahahaha this lady on CBC speaking over the highlights of the game is TERRIBLE.

I don't even think she watches hockey.
She seems like a bigger March Madness fan.

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03-24-2013, 12:59 AM
  #346
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No, that's exactly my point. His numbers were a product of what you point out. Does that make him special or 'elite'?
Not at all, but it makes his performances in those playoff series "out of character" and elite.

He performed at an elite level - a level he wasn't performing at for a long time under the same system.

They got elite-level goaltending from a non-elite goaltender - giving us hope for someone like Dubnyk.

Meanwhile, you have teams like CHI/PIT that were so deep top-to-bottom at F and D that they won in spite of their goaltenders (<0.910 save percentage).

Maybe we can be that team

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03-24-2013, 01:00 AM
  #347
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Originally Posted by AlowlyOilersfan View Post
She seems like a bigger March Madness fan.
She keeps talking about players having a "connection".

"Belanger showing no connection here getting stripped of the puck for a St. Louis chance"

"early in the 3rd period, STL shows the connection as they make it 2-0"

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03-24-2013, 01:01 AM
  #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hemsky_83 View Post
Not at all, but it makes his performances in those playoff series "out of character" and elite.

He performed at an elite level - a level he wasn't performing at for a long time under the same system.

They got elite-level goaltending from a non-elite goaltender - giving us hope for someone like Dubnyk.

Meanwhile, you have teams like CHI/PIT that were so deep top-to-bottom at F and D that they won in spite of their goaltenders (<0.910 save percentage).

Maybe we can be that team
That's exactly what I've been saying! Thank God, we've come to a consensus.

Lots of changes are needed for us to become 'that' team. Klefbom looks to be the real deal, so that's one good thing coming... But it's not gonna be enough.

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03-24-2013, 01:01 AM
  #349
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Hey Tencer
Have you realized that the fans you are blaming are the ones who support your career? Such a *******

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03-24-2013, 01:02 AM
  #350
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Unbelievable trade. They give up a defenseman who turns out to be better than EJ (Shattenkirk is a top-pairing defenseman), and one of the top-5 power forwards in the game.


And the pick who turned into Rattie. That kid is really good

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