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Julien Shakes It UP

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Old
03-25-2013, 05:59 AM
  #101
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Originally Posted by cursednumber6 View Post
Bergeron isn't exactly thrilled about it either. To quote Bergie off of Csnne.com. ...You do what is best for the team...that is all I can say about it.

I think the new lines could work but when Bergeron is not happy that is more than a little bit of a red flag.
And where do you get he`s upset about it out of his comments? This is why these boards infuriate me at times. Your taking Bergy`s comments, and twisting them into something I highly doubt are remotely true.

You had to know that at some point, with Looch and Horty both struggling badly, changes would come, and when you have two wingers like Marchand and Seguin, who have played well, there was most likely going to come a time when Julien had to address the problem and try to get either one of those guys jump started by inserting a Segs or Marchand with Krejci

Anyone who`s followed this game knows this will not be a permanent move, but I`ll say this, regardless if Paille doesn`t have the hands of either Segs or Marchand, he won`t cheat you in the effort dept and he`ll be fine on that 2nd for a short time

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03-25-2013, 06:06 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by LancelotLink View Post
I don't think it should be looked at as punishing. The goal is to wake the whole team up, I think.
Unfortunately you are right, Lucic will probably have an outstanding game,get put back on the first line then disappear for another 5 to 7 games again.

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03-25-2013, 06:17 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by hemispheres View Post
Unfortunately you are right, Lucic will probably have an outstanding game,get put back on the first line then disappear for another 5 to 7 games again.
There`s a much better chance that Horty, not Looch does this. At least with Looch, for the most part, he`s still playing physical (outside of his 1 hit Saturday night)

Two things he needs to do, shoot more and forget about trying to pass to his buddy on the right side

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03-25-2013, 06:26 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by ODAAT View Post
There`s a much better chance that Horty, not Looch does this. At least with Looch, for the most part, he`s still playing physical (outside of his 1 hit Saturday night)

Two things he needs to do, shoot more and forget about trying to pass to his buddy on the right side
I think he needs to realize how he got where he is. Definitly needs to shoot, but he needs to play with some controlled rage, in the past it almost made him unstopable.

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03-25-2013, 06:58 AM
  #105
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Originally Posted by ODAAT View Post
There`s a much better chance that Horty, not Looch does this. At least with Looch, for the most part, he`s still playing physical (outside of his 1 hit Saturday night)

Two things he needs to do, shoot more and forget about trying to pass to his buddy on the right side
Lucic had far more then 1 hit Saturday night. I can give you times and players he hit, thought I was going crazy when I saw that stat so had to check

The way they record that stat makes it completely and totally useless as anything more then a barometer for physical play over a longer period.

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03-25-2013, 07:13 AM
  #106
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Originally Posted by cursednumber6 View Post
Bergeron isn't exactly thrilled about it either. To quote Bergie off of Csnne.com. ...You do what is best for the team...that is all I can say about it.

I think the new lines could work but when Bergeron is not happy that is more than a little bit of a red flag.
Pretty low to twist Bergeron's words around to make it look like there is dissection in the locker room, I don't buy any of what is implied.

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03-25-2013, 07:21 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
Lucic had far more then 1 hit Saturday night. I can give you times and players he hit, thought I was going crazy when I saw that stat so had to check

The way they record that stat makes it completely and totally useless as anything more then a barometer for physical play over a longer period.
A complete stat watch on that too for me, truthfully, although I did see him hit others, I haven`t a clue what constitutes a hit these days, much like I haven`t a clue what is suspendable

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03-25-2013, 07:25 AM
  #108
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Others have hit the nail on the head early in the thread; replace Pandolfo with MacDermaid. This team is not playing physical enough, and is getting outmuscled. Whether the guy as a real heavyweight or not; he is a physical guy who won't hurt you and can give you an element that Pandolfo can not.

I'd also like to see Looch moved to the third line:

Marchand-Bergeron-Seguin
Paille-Krejci-Horton
Lucic-Peverley-Caron
MacD-Campbell-Thornton

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03-25-2013, 07:37 AM
  #109
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Originally Posted by ODAAT View Post
A complete stat watch on that too for me, truthfully, although I did see him hit others, I haven`t a clue what constitutes a hit these days, much like I haven`t a clue what is suspendable
I know I've said this before the last couple of days, but if you watch even that 1st period over again Lucic throws 3 rather significant hits. 1 on Franson where he absolutely runs him at around the 7 minute mark. Another on Kulemin on the right hand wall at around the 13 minute mark, and another on Fraser around the 7 minute mark.

Hits and turnovers are two stats that if you track yourself through the game are wayyyy off. Believe they're both recorded by the in house staff so it's often dependent on the arena you're playing in.

If Lucic stops hitting, this team literally has no one else that will or can hit consistently. The next best hitter becomes a guy like Paille... scary stuff.

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03-25-2013, 08:34 AM
  #110
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Im a huge julien supporter but outside of removing jay from the top 3 lines and hopefully the 4th as well i dont really like the new lines. I wouldve kept bergy and march together and put looch with tyler . Outside of those two switches I wouldnt really care who went where.

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03-25-2013, 08:57 AM
  #111
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Originally Posted by NastyNate17 View Post
Awesome!!! Can't wait to see paille getting top 6 mins he deserves a promotion.. Maybe he'll show more of a scoring touch w a couple playmakers on his line
Me too. Love to see Paille being rewarded for his effort and production.

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03-25-2013, 10:26 AM
  #112
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Originally Posted by bigcat188 View Post
Next stop for Lucic will be parts unknown jf he don't turn in around quick he has trade value.
Were stuck with Horton I think he has a no trade...who would want him anyway?
Interesting to see so much **** is being thrown on the person who scored the game-winning-goal in TWO game 7 playoff games. Without either of those goals, there is no Cup Finals, never mind an actual Cup.

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03-25-2013, 10:52 AM
  #113
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Originally Posted by Cronuss View Post
Interesting to see so much **** is being thrown on the person who scored the game-winning-goal in TWO game 7 playoff games. Without either of those goals, there is no Cup Finals, never mind an actual Cup.
Now Cronuss you know we live in a "what have you done for me lately?" world

That said, I am disappointed with Lucic's performance this season. I don't know what the problem might be but he's not playing like the Looch you mentioned in your post.

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03-25-2013, 11:01 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by BMC View Post
Now Cronuss you know we live in a "what have you done for me lately?" world

That said, I am disappointed with Lucic's performance this season. I don't know what the problem might be but he's not playing like the Looch you mentioned in your post.
Other than 5 or 6 guys, I think the same could be said for most of the team. Looch is clearly a problem right now, but he's far from the only one.

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03-25-2013, 11:01 AM
  #115
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Originally Posted by Cronuss View Post
Interesting to see so much **** is being thrown on the person who scored the game-winning-goal in TWO game 7 playoff games. Without either of those goals, there is no Cup Finals, never mind an actual Cup.
David Krejci led the playoffs in scoring, goals and game winning goals, he gets traded everyday on this board.

If you don't think Nathan Horton has been rubbish this year I don't know what too tell you.

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03-25-2013, 11:07 AM
  #116
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Honestly, Lucic really needs to just beat the **** out of someone. He doesn't have that anger, edge or intimidation. No one fears him right now, gloves on or off.

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03-25-2013, 11:17 AM
  #117
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I love Bergeron, but if he's not happy with the lines being juggled thats tough luck.

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03-25-2013, 11:18 AM
  #118
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
I know I've said this before the last couple of days, but if you watch even that 1st period over again Lucic throws 3 rather significant hits. 1 on Franson where he absolutely runs him at around the 7 minute mark. Another on Kulemin on the right hand wall at around the 13 minute mark, and another on Fraser around the 7 minute mark.

Hits and turnovers are two stats that if you track yourself through the game are wayyyy off. Believe they're both recorded by the in house staff so it's often dependent on the arena you're playing in.

If Lucic stops hitting, this team literally has no one else that will or can hit consistently. The next best hitter becomes a guy like Paille... scary stuff.
Yep, SOG too is rarely a reliable stat

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03-25-2013, 11:20 AM
  #119
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Originally Posted by hopkinsj31 View Post
Honestly, Lucic really needs to just beat the **** out of someone. He doesn't have that anger, edge or intimidation. No one fears him right now, gloves on or off.
Really? I don`t see a ton of guys lined up to drop them with him, and in spite of his pitiful offensive numbers, he`s still far more valuable on the ice than in the box, especially when this team is struggling to find it`s offense.

Having another teams goon line up against him and wanting to drop the mitts to me isn`t a sign of other teams not fearing him. He`s long established his ability and willingness to drop the mitts, ya know, there was a time when a guy wearing #8 didn`t HAVE to fight as much, he earned his space and he was able to focus on offence, he also earned the respect from opponents who didn`t want to leave the ice with an icebag to their heads. I still see countless defenseman making poor plays with Looch on the forecheck, problem is, there`s a right winger who`s forecheck is non existent and it becomes all meaningless

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03-25-2013, 11:56 AM
  #120
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Originally Posted by Kaoz View Post
I know I've said this before the last couple of days, but if you watch even that 1st period over again Lucic throws 3 rather significant hits. 1 on Franson where he absolutely runs him at around the 7 minute mark. Another on Kulemin on the right hand wall at around the 13 minute mark, and another on Fraser around the 7 minute mark.

Hits and turnovers are two stats that if you track yourself through the game are wayyyy off. Believe they're both recorded by the in house staff so it's often dependent on the arena you're playing in.

If Lucic stops hitting, this team literally has no one else that will or can hit consistently. The next best hitter becomes a guy like Paille... scary stuff.
Hits are an inconsistent stat anyway, but the hit I noticed from Looch was the one he failed to take and may have stopped (the 2nd goal I believe) from developing.

But in general hit counts aren't even always a good indication of how physical a team is playing since in general the team without the puck is going to generate more hits trying to get the puck.

The eyeball test is generally the best indication for how physical and how well a team is playing-not particularly hit counts.

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03-25-2013, 12:03 PM
  #121
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Originally Posted by ODAAT View Post
Really? I don`t see a ton of guys lined up to drop them with him, and in spite of his pitiful offensive numbers, he`s still far more valuable on the ice than in the box, especially when this team is struggling to find it`s offense.

Having another teams goon line up against him and wanting to drop the mitts to me isn`t a sign of other teams not fearing him. He`s long established his ability and willingness to drop the mitts, ya know, there was a time when a guy wearing #8 didn`t HAVE to fight as much, he earned his space and he was able to focus on offence, he also earned the respect from opponents who didn`t want to leave the ice with an icebag to their heads. I still see countless defenseman making poor plays with Looch on the forecheck, problem is, there`s a right winger who`s forecheck is non existent and it becomes all meaningless
He's turned down a ton of offers to go over the last month. It's 5 minutes in the box, This team may not have survived Z in the box for 17 minutes, but they surely can survive Looch being locked up for 5 minutes. He's down on the 3rd line now, what is he gonna miss? one shift. This argument has never held any water with me tbh.

He's just not into it, he doesn't have that Edge or Killer instinct. When he used to pummel people and skate to the box going ballistic, himself, the team, and the fans fed off of it.

Like you said, there was a time when a guy that wore #8 didn't have to fight has much. That was 25 years ago when there was no instigator. Times have changed. It's much more "What have you done lately" then it was done then. The guy wearing #8 also scored 50 in 44, If Lucic had 10% of his scoring ability, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

I'm not hating on Lucic for the sake of it like most other people. I absolutely love the guy, he has been my favorite Bruin since his rookie season. But he needs to get the lead out of his ass and get back to the basics of what made him the player he is.

When's the last time you seen him punch someone in the face after a whistle just because **** you. Or make someone fight him because **** you. Or run you or your goalie over because **** you. He just needs to get back to the fck you part of his game and the rest will come.

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03-25-2013, 12:03 PM
  #122
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Sorry Odaat but I did not twist the comments even with the elipsis. When somebody says "that is all I can say about it"....They can't be too happy even if they just mean there is no more to say. I take it as Mr Bergeron not being happy about something unavoidable
Him not being happy with how the boys are playing, and him being upset/angry that he is losing a linemate and he`s being replaced are two different things.

Sorry, Bergy`s no rookie, everyone here has been anticipating/demanding a shakeup like this in the lineup for weeks, but you don`t think the players have seen it coming? You think that they anticipated Claude would just allow this mediocre play continue without attempting to change?

Maybe the Claude of year 1 and 2 but....

we`ll have to agree to disagree, if Patrice, IMO, is upset, it isn`t over the coaches decisions, it`s that he`s upset with how the team in general is playing which is always the terms Bergy speaks about things, as a team

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03-25-2013, 12:04 PM
  #123
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Originally Posted by hopkinsj31 View Post
He's turned down a ton of offers to go over the last month. It's 5 minutes in the box, This team may not have survived Z in the box for 17 minutes, but they surely can survive Looch being locked up for 5 minutes. He's down on the 3rd line now, what is he gonna miss? one shift. This argument has never held any water with me tbh.

He's just not into it, he doesn't have that Edge or Killer instinct. When he used to pummel people and skate to the box going ballistic, himself, the team, and the fans fed off of it.

Like you said, there was a time when a guy that wore #8 didn't have to fight has much. That was 25 years ago when there was no instigator. Times have changed. It's much more "What have you done lately" then it was done then. The guy wearing #8 also scored 50 in 44, If Lucic had 10% of his scoring ability, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

I'm not hating on Lucic for the sake of it like most other people. I absolutely love the guy, he has been my favorite Bruin since his rookie season. But he needs to get the lead out of his ass and get back to the basics of what made him the player he is.

When's the last time you seen him punch someone in the face after a whistle just because **** you. Or make someone fight him because **** you. Or run you or your goalie over because **** you. He just needs to get back to the fck you part of his game and the rest will come.
Well, your definition of a ton and mine are different I suppose, to think, expect or imagine that his exhuberance and willingness were always going to be maintained over his career just isn`t reasonable.

The moment he began to show he could score, while mixing in scraps here and there, things changed, and how many guys do you think have, and still do turn down scraps at Looch`s request. While lining up for a faceoff, I`ll wager there`s, on a game by game basis, about a half dozen fight requests that get turned down, I`ll also wager, Looch has offered to go on more than a few of those

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03-25-2013, 12:21 PM
  #124
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Originally Posted by hopkinsj31 View Post
He's turned down a ton of offers to go over the last month. It's 5 minutes in the box, This team may not have survived Z in the box for 17 minutes, but they surely can survive Looch being locked up for 5 minutes. He's down on the 3rd line now, what is he gonna miss? one shift. This argument has never held any water with me tbh.

He's just not into it, he doesn't have that Edge or Killer instinct. When he used to pummel people and skate to the box going ballistic, himself, the team, and the fans fed off of it.

Like you said, there was a time when a guy that wore #8 didn't have to fight has much. That was 25 years ago when there was no instigator. Times have changed. It's much more "What have you done lately" then it was done then. The guy wearing #8 also scored 50 in 44, If Lucic had 10% of his scoring ability, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.

I'm not hating on Lucic for the sake of it like most other people. I absolutely love the guy, he has been my favorite Bruin since his rookie season. But he needs to get the lead out of his ass and get back to the basics of what made him the player he is.

When's the last time you seen him punch someone in the face after a whistle just because **** you. Or make someone fight him because **** you. Or run you or your goalie over because **** you. He just needs to get back to the fck you part of his game and the rest will come.
All the stuff you stated in the last paragraph are the things Lucic can't do this year, in a shortened season and with the refs being told to call things, such as that.

He runs a goalie and you will see him get suspended for 5 games. He starts scrapping in front of the net like you want and he could get 4 minutes in minors and a 10 to follow that.

No one is engaging Lucic because they know he fights better when angry and also they know he is sleeping right now and it's best to let a sleeping giant sleep.

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03-25-2013, 12:31 PM
  #125
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Originally Posted by Therick67 View Post
Other than 5 or 6 guys, I think the same could be said for most of the team. Looch is clearly a problem right now, but he's far from the only one.
I agree with you but since Looch is the one being demoted from the top line I get the impression that Claude Julien thinks he's the main issue. Otherwise he'd have demoted Horton instead.

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