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Old
03-25-2013, 01:29 PM
  #776
hototogisu
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Do we need a stay at home crease clearing DMan who will protect Price and stand up for his forwards on the ice?

I have been hearing that all season, especially from those who do not want an enforcer on this team.

We dont need any more offensive DMen. We are loaded with talent there. We are sorely lacking in what Murray brings to a team.
Yes, we could use one. However, your question doesn't exist in the bubble you want it to. Your question should really be, "are we ready to justify trading 2 2nd's for a UFA-to-be to fill that role"? My answer would be no. If you think we are, then that's your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, I think it's a very shortsighted one.

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03-25-2013, 01:32 PM
  #777
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
No. Not serious.

The games won really were lost. The third most goals in the East is a mirage. The 21 goal differential is an accounting error.

Surrender!!!! We are in 2nd place and we have no chance, no chance at all to win. Tank.

You really have never seen a Cup winning Habs team, have you? Losing is so engrained in your subconscious that you do not have a clue understanding that this team is very good and has just as good of a chance at winning a Cup............if we add a couple of players to fill a couple of glaring needs.
Because that's obviously the only other option to "Serious Cup Contender".

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:32 PM
  #778
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
Yes, we could use one. However, your question doesn't exist in the bubble you want it to. Your question should really be, "are we ready to justify trading 2 2nd's for a UFA-to-be to fill that role"? My answer would be no. If you think we are, then that's your opinion. Like I said in my previous post, I think it's a very shortsighted one.
Gauthier spent his entire career as a GM stockpiling 2nd round picks.

We should honor his effort by cashing in one or two for a Cup run.

Who do you suggest we get on the backend at the deadline? Or would you just stand pat?

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:33 PM
  #779
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he will be more effective in the play-offs when the refs allow more clutch and grab...

although I would have liked Murray, I am glad we didn't pay that price.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:33 PM
  #780
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
You are stating the Edmonton plan. Full of prospects. Empty of results.

We have a team that is clicking right now. If we were in 8th place, then I agree with you. Stand pat. But we are not that team.

It is irrelevant what we were last season. That is history.

Carpe diem. Too bad that is Latin. I guess it doesnt translate well.
No, I'm not saying to trade everyone and get 1st overall picks for the next half decade.

You can't just ignore a key fact. We have a team that has been clicking for 31 games after finishing last in the conference last season. Is this a good sign? Definitely. Guaranteed contenders that the team can change philosophy from using this draft to build up the organizational depth that was depleted? Not quite.

As you saw yesterday, prospects can be used in due time to acquire players (Morrow) when the time comes. Habs don't have the depth in their organization to make such trades. Penguins built up a lot.

Habs' top scorers are all homegrown. Have a little faith in the plan. If you are so confident in this season's success there's no reason to doubt the team's plan to build through the draft (something Bergevin said many times).

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:36 PM
  #781
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post
The problem is you're trying to go from zero to a hundred. We were a lottery team last year, and you genuinely believe we're ready to compete for the Cup this year? Come on man.

We're probably not as bad as our record showed last year, and we're probably not as good as our record is showing this year. PIT has had the core of a SC winning/contending team in place for several years, they're at a point where moves like this make sense. We're a year away from battling Edmonton and Columbus for worst in the league. Teams just don't go from that to winning the Cup, and it would very shortsighted of Bergevin to deviate from his plan to try to cash in all our chips this year just because we've played great for 30 games.

If this team is for real, we will have plenty more opportunities to "go for it". People are still *****ing about Gainey giving up a 1st for Tanguay and a 2nd for Lang when our team looked like much more of a contender than what we have now...I can only imagine the aftermath if Bergevin paid the prices PIT did and the team fell short.
Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Montreal has been one of the most conservative franchises in the NHL over the last two decades.

What do we have to show for those conservative moves? Nothing.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:45 PM
  #782
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How many of you cheering for the leafs tonight?

It is either the leafs or bruins. There is no third choice. We all know you like first place...so.....

GO LEAFS GO!

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:45 PM
  #783
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If the Habs are top 3 in the East and healthy at the trade deadline and Bergevin does nothing when will be the right time to make a playoff push ? Does the Habs must win all 82 games before being consider a Stanley cup contender ?

- Markov, Gionta and Ryder are healthy and they will not get younger and better
- Pacioretty, Eller, Gally, Galchenyuk and Plekanec are ready to perform and will be in the top 9 for a long time.
- Emelin, Subban, Diaz and Eller will have a big pay raise soon

- Dumont, White, Moen, Desharnais, Leblanc, Pateryn, Kristo, the first round pick and the secound round picks are good assets that Bergevin could use to add a great top 6 froward like Igilna, Clarkson, Erickson, Pominville or Vanek.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:46 PM
  #784
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Gauthier spent his entire career as a GM stockpiling 2nd round picks.

We should honor his effort by cashing in one or two for a Cup run.

Who do you suggest we get on the backend at the deadline? Or would you just stand pat?
Must have loved Gauthier/Gainey last few years. They traded away so many picks.

James Wisniewski
for
2011 2nd round pick (#50-Johan Sundstrom)
2013 4th round pick

Dominic Moore
for
2011 2nd round pick (#47-Matt Nieto)

Mathieu Schneider
for
2009 2nd round pick (#45-Jeremy Morin)
2010 3rd round pick (#87-Julian Melchiori)

Robert Lang
for
2010 2nd round pick (#32-Jared Knight)

Alex Tanguay
2008 5th round pick (#138-Maxim Trunev)
for
2008 1st round pick (#25-Greg Nemisz)
2009 2nd round pick (#49-Stefan Elliott)

Paul Mara
for
2012 5th round pick

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:46 PM
  #785
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I'm not cheering for the Leafs, I'm cheering against the Bruins.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:46 PM
  #786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Gauthier spent his entire career as a GM stockpiling 2nd round picks.

We should honor his effort by cashing in one or two for a Cup run.

Who do you suggest we get on the backend at the deadline? Or would you just stand pat?
I don't know, I haven't thought too much about names that are out there. I would have liked Murray, I'm not saying he was a bad pick up by any means. But I wouldn't have liked the Habs to make that move at that price.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Montreal has been one of the most conservative franchises in the NHL over the last two decades.

What do we have to show for those conservative moves? Nothing.
Well that's not entirely true. As I stated earlier, we have made some gambles that plainly didn't work out (Tanguay & Lang) and some gambles that proved disastrous (Gomez).

There's a time to be conservative and a time to go for it, but I think we're in the middle now. If the price is right for a player that would help us, I'd like Bergevin to go for it. But considering the prices paid so far, I'm fine with him playing it safe for the time being. I don't feel like we've missed out on anybody that really would've put us over the top for a Cup run.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:48 PM
  #787
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I hate the Bruins with every fibre of my being but actually I think I want Boston to win this one. I get the division implications but I think the Leafs need to get knocked down a peg right now, just no 3 point game please.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:49 PM
  #788
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusBouillon View Post
I'm not cheering for the Leafs, I'm cheering against the Bruins.
exactly!

Well played, sir. Well played

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:49 PM
  #789
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Montreal has been one of the most conservative franchises in the NHL over the last two decades.

What do we have to show for those conservative moves? Nothing.
Remember this beauty conservative move?

Scott Gomez
Tom Pyatt
Michael Busto

for

Ryan McDonagh
Christopher Higgins
Pavel Valentenko
Doug Janik

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:51 PM
  #790
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mario Lemieux fan 66 View Post
If the Habs are top 3 in the East and healthy at the trade deadline and Bergevin does nothing when will be the right time to make a playoff push ? Does the Habs must win all 82 games before being consider a Stanley cup contender ?

- Markov, Gionta and Ryder are healthy and they will not get younger and better
- Pacioretty, Eller, Gally, Galchenyuk and Plekanec are ready to perform and will be in the top 9 for a long time.
- Emelin, Subban, Diaz and Eller will have a big pay raise soon

- Dumont, White, Moen, Desharnais, Leblanc, Pateryn, Kristo, the first round pick and the secound round picks are good assets that Bergevin could use to add a great top 6 froward like Igilna, Clarkson, Erickson, Pominville or Vanek.
Exactly.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:52 PM
  #791
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Remember this beauty conservative move?

Scott Gomez
Tom Pyatt
Michael Busto

for

Ryan McDonagh
Christopher Higgins
Pavel Valentenko
Doug Janik
Not even relevant. We need a big stay at home Dman.

Not an idiotic multi-player trade.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:54 PM
  #792
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For me hate Leaf fans, don't mind Leafs players, hate the Bruins players, don't care about their fans. Heck before the Chara/Pacioretty thing, I respected the Bruins a lot, kinda understood why the hated the Habs so much, the Habs robbed them so many chances to win the cup. I remember Don Cherry admitted once I remember that his dislike for the Habs was because they were the team he could never beat.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:54 PM
  #793
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Originally Posted by hototogisu View Post

Well that's not entirely true. As I stated earlier, we have made some gambles that plainly didn't work out (Tanguay & Lang) and some gambles that proved disastrous (Gomez).

There's a time to be conservative and a time to go for it, but I think we're in the middle now. If the price is right for a player that would help us, I'd like Bergevin to go for it. But considering the prices paid so far, I'm fine with him playing it safe for the time being. I don't feel like we've missed out on anybody that really would've put us over the top for a Cup run.
Lang had a freak injury and Tanguay could have been a decent move if they had sign him long term instead of losing him for nothing.

I am against trading assets just to try to make the playoff but when the Habs are top 3 of the East, healthy with a good prospect depth and a lot of pick i see little reason to not go for it.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:55 PM
  #794
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Remember this beauty conservative move?

Scott Gomez
Tom Pyatt
Michael Busto

for

Ryan McDonagh
Christopher Higgins
Pavel Valentenko
Doug Janik
I remember how mad most of us were when we thought it was Gomez straight up for Higgins. We were LIVID and thought it was a joke when we learned it included McDonagh.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:56 PM
  #795
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Not even relevant. We need a big stay at home Dman.

Not an idiotic multi-player trade.
it is relevant.

when prices are crazy like this year, it's much smarter to stay conservative.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:57 PM
  #796
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Let's remember that 2x 2nd round picks might get you a late 1st rounder at the draft. Talk about overpayment.
word has it that the second 2nd is contingent on him resigning. if he stinks and the pens wash their hands of him a second round pick for a crease clearing defenseman during a cup run, might be a slight overpayment but it is not ridiculous.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:59 PM
  #797
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More Clowe rumours:

http://www.rds.ca/vid%C3%A9os/le-coi...clowe-1.602231

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:00 PM
  #798
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I don't know, I haven't thought too much about names that are out there. I would have liked Murray, I'm not saying he was a bad pick up by any means. But I wouldn't have liked the Habs to make that move at that price.



Well that's not entirely true. As I stated earlier, we have made some gambles that plainly didn't work out (Tanguay & Lang) and some gambles that proved disastrous (Gomez).

There's a time to be conservative and a time to go for it, but I think we're in the middle now. If the price is right for a player that would help us, I'd like Bergevin to go for it. But considering the prices paid so far, I'm fine with him playing it safe for the time being. I don't feel like we've missed out on anybody that really would've put us over the top for a Cup run.
Just imagine if tampa pulled the trigger on the lecavalier deal. One could argue that would have been more disastrous than gomez. This team doesn't need a bold move. Its a team based on 3 lines that can score. It just needs parts that can fit that mould, if its a forward. Moreso, the team needs to get another d-man, preferably a physical d-man who can protect Price. Tinordi has done okay as a 3rd pairing guy, but he makes mistakes, and I certainly don't feel like he's ready for the playoffs.

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:04 PM
  #799
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mario Lemieux fan 66 View Post
If the Habs are top 3 in the East and healthy at the trade deadline and Bergevin does nothing when will be the right time to make a playoff push ? Does the Habs must win all 82 games before being consider a Stanley cup contender ?

- Markov, Gionta and Ryder are healthy and they will not get younger and better
- Pacioretty, Eller, Gally, Galchenyuk and Plekanec are ready to perform and will be in the top 9 for a long time.
- Emelin, Subban, Diaz and Eller will have a big pay raise soon

- Dumont, White, Moen, Desharnais, Leblanc, Pateryn, Kristo, the first round pick and the secound round picks are good assets that Bergevin could use to add a great top 6 froward like Igilna, Clarkson, Erickson, Pominville or Vanek.
What you are forgetting is this team is young and the players you want to give up on, could be a difference maker in the future. No one knows what the asking price is for those 5 players you mentioned and I could only assume that their respective teams will be looking for something significant. You mentioned 3 players as getting older, out of a 23 man roster. Maybe those players will be replaced by younger guys and our team gets better.

Murray for 2 2nd round picks? NO! Murray for a 3rd pick, yes.

I think this team will be better in the coming years and selling would not be in our best interest.

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:09 PM
  #800
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Our last 2nd round picks are PK Subban, Danny Kristo, Sebastian Collberg and Dalton Thrower with 3 years in there where we traded them away.

Id rather not trade them for depth players when Timmins can turn them into these players.

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