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2013 Leafs Trades/Proposals/Signings XI - Winter... I mean...Deadline approaching

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:53 PM
  #851
Faltorvo
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Originally Posted by Pinto View Post
What pending UFA's do we have that would fetch a first?

I'd rather have playoffs than an extra 2nd round pick.
If Morrow can land a 1rst, then i have little doubt Mac or Boz would.

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03-25-2013, 01:54 PM
  #852
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those assets you speak of might become Bozak and Mac in the future. Yee hah!

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03-25-2013, 01:55 PM
  #853
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Originally Posted by Kbs View Post
THANK YOU. People on this board underrate playoff experience so much. Yes, we could sell off UFAs for picks because we aren't Cup contenders, but you can't expect to go from a non-playoff team to a cup contender in one swoop.

You need continual progress and playoff experience for our current roster is just as valuable (if not more valuable) than the picks we get for our upcoming UFAs.
Very well said.

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03-25-2013, 01:55 PM
  #854
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
So what your saying indirectly is that Pitt sent out those future pieces for players that are not getting the job done?

Ones that they want to take into a deep war, a cup run .

HAH! nonsense.

Those teams traded away those players because they are pending UFAs and they see the reality that they are not a team poised for a serious cup run.
Both Bozak and Macarthur are 27 years old, and will be able to contribute to this team for the foreseeable future. If we plan on contending within the next 2 - 5 years, these players can still be useful pieces for us.

Morrow is 34, Murray is 33. These guys don't fit into a team that doesn't plan on competing for the cup within the next season or two, but players like Bozak and Macarthur can.

If we can resign them to a reasonable deal I would be glad to keep them (especially Bozak, who I think can be a fantastic third line C). That being said, with the value being tossed around for players like Murray and Morrow I'd have to wonder what type of value a guy like Macarthur could fetch for us (probably a late first round pick from a contender with the way the market is shaping up).

I'd still prefer for us to essentially stand pat at this deadline and try and keep our guys. I really, really want to see some maple leafs playoff hockey.

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03-25-2013, 01:56 PM
  #855
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
So what your saying indirectly is that Pitt sent out those future pieces for players that are not getting the job done?

Ones that they want to take into a deep war, a cup run .

HAH! nonsense.

Those teams traded away those players because they are pending UFAs and they see the reality that they are not a team poised for a serious cup run.
I was talking about Brendan Morrow and Murray being expendable pieces. Neither was a big part of their teams. What teams trade UFAs that are contributing to their team and also in a playoff position? Not much. If you can't see that, you really are clueless.

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03-25-2013, 01:57 PM
  #856
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Originally Posted by SpeakerForTheDead View Post
I agree completely. These are the moves a contender makes to give them a better chance at winning.

And the Pens have the prospect depth that they won't miss Morrow or 2 2nd rounders.
How do teams that challenge for the Cup every year and draft at the bottom of each draft continue to find propects, that every team covets.

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03-25-2013, 01:57 PM
  #857
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Originally Posted by Kbs View Post
THANK YOU. People on this board underrate playoff experience so much. Yes, we could sell off UFAs for picks because we aren't Cup contenders, but you can't expect to go from a non-playoff team to a cup contender in one swoop.

You need continual progress and playoff experience for our current roster is just as valuable (if not more valuable) than the picks we get for our upcoming UFAs.
What people? All we've seen is a Bruin fan and one other.

Takes a special insight to think the Team will sell while in 6th and not having seen the playoffs in almost a decade.

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:57 PM
  #858
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
SJS fans are happy hes gone. At this point in his career he is not as much of an impact player as Bozak and Mac.
Not as happy as Leaf fans if Bozak gets moved!! I would LOVE Bozak to be traded now!!!

Kadri
Grabo
McClement
Colborne

We will be better NOW and on draft day!

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Old
03-25-2013, 01:58 PM
  #859
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
Theres a better chance a 2nd round pick/ B prospect isnt as good ever as Mac/Bozak.
Increases the odds of finding a legitimate franchise player. If a team has two 1st round picks and three 2nd round picks vs a team that has one 1st round pick and one 2nd round pick, which team do you think has the better odds of drafting a non-lottery top talent such as Giroux, Weber, Letang, Bergeron, Kopitar, Neal, Couture, etc type of player?

Any single pick doesn't have great odds, but having multiple 1sts and multiple 2nds increases your odds quite a bit. I'm also quite confident that both Bozak/MacArthur won't be missed at all a year from now. It really isn't all that difficult to add players of that calibre, they come along all the time from free agency and from internal development.

As for going for the playoffs? IF we had a legitimate core, I would say definitely hold onto our pending UFAs, and hope for our guys to get some good playoff experience. The problem is that we don't really have any legitimate franchise players that real SC contenders tend to have 2-3 of, so until we get those pieces, we'll just be spinning our tires. Right now Kadri/Rielly are our best chances for becoming that calibre of talent.

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03-25-2013, 01:58 PM
  #860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
If Morrow can land a 1rst, then i have little doubt Mac or Boz would.
With their vast playoff experience and warrior-like game, they would be an indispensable asset to any contending team!

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03-25-2013, 02:00 PM
  #861
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Originally Posted by SpeakerForTheDead View Post
Only 25% of 2nd rounders ever play 1 game in the NHL.
10% of 2nds between 2002 and 2010 turned into Allstars or well above average players.

You really should take a look at the 2nd rounders being found in this new eara of hockey.

Times have changed speaker.

This ain't the 70 and 80s anymore, the kids are being groomed with nutrition and fitness training at very early ages compared to the olden days.

They are also chasing the golden carrot where even a 4th liner, back up tender ,bottom pairing D man can become a millionaire.

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03-25-2013, 02:01 PM
  #862
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
So what your saying indirectly is that Pitt sent out those future pieces for players that are not getting the job done?

Ones that they want to take into a deep war, a cup run .

HAH! nonsense.

Those teams traded away those players because they are pending UFAs and they see the reality that they are not a team poised for a serious cup run.
All you have to do is get in, and anything can happen..we've seen some 6th-8th seeds make the finals before.

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:02 PM
  #863
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Originally Posted by Rockinz View Post
Not as happy as Leaf fans if Bozak gets moved!! I would LOVE Bozak to be traded now!!!

Kadri
Grabo
McClement
Colborne

We will be better NOW and on draft day!
Speak for yourself. I'd only want Bozak gone if the return is right. Perfectly fine with keeping him otherwise.

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03-25-2013, 02:02 PM
  #864
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Originally Posted by FreeBird View Post
How do teams that challenge for the Cup every year and draft at the bottom of each draft continue to find propects, that every team covets.
Chicago did it by focusing on the draft. They've drafted 37 times since the 2009 draft, including 13 picks in the first two rounds.

By comparison, the Toronto Maple Leafs, a team that was in REBUILD mode, drafted 29 times in that same span, with only 8 picks in the first two rounds. That's 1 pick more than what we would have drafted by default (4 X 7) and the equivalent number of picks in the first two rounds we would have drafted by default (4 X 2).

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03-25-2013, 02:03 PM
  #865
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
You lads should be doing an article on the great debate.

Are the Leafs as an organization in an position to be letting UFAs like Mac and Bozak walk for nothing.

I always though that was only done by cash strapped teams and ones that had a real shot at the cup.

Dallas who really could use the PO money just moved their Captain, a pending UFA.

SJ a team who's time as a contender is ticking away, just moved a UFA.

Neither team brought back anything that can help them now.

And arguments as to why we should not move ours, could easily be applied to those two teams also.
Nonis said the Leafs may be a a little bit of both, buyers and sellers this year. In a perfect world Bozak is sold and an upgrade is bought in a separate deal.

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03-25-2013, 02:03 PM
  #866
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
No, im saying that hes a GM whos not going to shoot himself in the foot and trade established NHLers for futures when his team is on pace for it playoff spot in almost a decade.
But he will shoot himself in the foot when he lets them walk for nothing?

Got it, the same kind of self serving GM decision making we saw in years past.

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:03 PM
  #867
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Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
Increases the odds of finding a legitimate franchise player. If a team has two 1st round picks and three 2nd round picks vs a team that has one 1st round pick and one 2nd round pick, which team do you think has the better odds of drafting a non-lottery top talent such as Giroux, Weber, Letang, Bergeron, Kopitar, Neal, Couture, etc type of player?
I'll take depth in the playoffs over a 0.01% shot at a franchise player in the 2nd round.

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:05 PM
  #868
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Originally Posted by Faltorvo View Post
But he will shoot himself in the foot when he lets them walk for nothing?

Got it, the same kind of self serving GM decision making we saw in years past.
Whos going to fault him? Ownership certainly wont. Maybe 10% of fans? If that?

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Old
03-25-2013, 02:08 PM
  #869
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Originally Posted by Kbs View Post
THANK YOU. People on this board underrate playoff experience so much. Yes, we could sell off UFAs for picks because we aren't Cup contenders, but you can't expect to go from a non-playoff team to a cup contender in one swoop.

You need continual progress and playoff experience for our current roster is just as valuable (if not more valuable) than the picks we get for our upcoming UFAs.
You value the PO experience, well guess what so do i.

Where we differ is that i would rather guys that will be still on the team after this season like Colb,Ashton,D'Amigo get it over guys that are walking away for no return in Mac and Boz.

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03-25-2013, 02:08 PM
  #870
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picks at least prolong the ownership of an asset past the time the contracts expire. In a cap world having additional picks to sweeten a deal or trade up in the draft are very useful.

IMO Bozak and/or Mac don't really affect the probability of this team making the playoffs this year. Carlyle likes to lean on his top players and we should start to see that more and more as the season wraps up.

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03-25-2013, 02:10 PM
  #871
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Originally Posted by blasted_Sabre View Post
Theres a better chance a 2nd round pick/ B prospect isnt as good ever as Mac/Bozak.
They will hold a lot more value and a better chance ,to the organization after they both walk away.

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03-25-2013, 02:11 PM
  #872
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Probably not as much as a gritty veteran and a giant defenseman.
Probably a hell of a lot more then those two old players.

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03-25-2013, 02:11 PM
  #873
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Chance of being one year wonder

Go for a playoff berth and finish 14th, and sit back at the draft while teams that are superior to us draft the future franchise players. Sell, Sell, Sell, why don't we try it just once and see how we make out in the future.

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03-25-2013, 02:11 PM
  #874
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They will hold a lot more value and a better chance ,to the organization after they both walk away.
I doubt that keeps Nonis up at night.

Wondering if we will miss the playoffs if he trades them probably does, missing the playoff because he traded them definitely will.

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03-25-2013, 02:12 PM
  #875
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those assets you speak of might become Bozak and Mac in the future. Yee hah!
A better chance of helping the future after Mac and Boz walk ,yeeeeeHAAAAA!!!!!

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