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All Encompassing Tortorella Thread Pt. II

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Old
03-25-2013, 07:37 PM
  #301
Vidic15
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Originally Posted by ImIdaho View Post
I think us finishing 1st is the anomaly. Since he's taken over the reigns we have finished 8th, 7th, missed the playoffs, and we're currently in 8th, so this season isn't out of the ordinary, really.
This.

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03-25-2013, 07:43 PM
  #302
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
This is complete and utter ********. Tell me what makes you say this.
What makes him say it is it fits with his agenda. He's been making **** up to hate on Torts for a long time now. He has been the Fox News, the Sean Hannity, of the Torts discussion thread.

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03-25-2013, 07:46 PM
  #303
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
What makes him say it is it fits with his agenda. He's been making **** up to hate on Torts for a long time now. He's the Fox News, the Sean Hannity, of the Torts discussion thread.
That would make me an oracle then because everything I said last year even while we were winning is bearing fruit . And I'm not alone

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03-25-2013, 07:54 PM
  #304
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Originally Posted by ImIdaho View Post
I think us finishing 1st is the anomaly. Since he's taken over the reigns we have finished 8th, 7th, missed the playoffs, and we're currently in 8th, so this season isn't out of the ordinary, really.


How someone can not realize that last season was a fluke is beyond me.

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03-25-2013, 07:57 PM
  #305
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
That would make me an oracle then because everything I said last year even while we were winning is bearing fruit . And I'm not alone
Now you're sounding more like Glenn Beck.

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03-25-2013, 07:59 PM
  #306
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Haha well played
Although I'm no conservative . Maybe the reason I hate Torts he is and so is his style of play . I rather lose trading chances and seeing some fast paced hockey than glorified " Rod hockey " along the wall behind the net pray for a tip in the slot .

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03-25-2013, 08:57 PM
  #307
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Originally Posted by Grind Jam Grind View Post
And?

What, Richards couldn't board a plane and go play in Europe? Oh right, he decided to go to those ******** CBA negotiations instead. I'm sorry, but a veteran player should know what he has to do to prepare for the season. Another excuse. Wonderful. Anymore that are worth sharing?
And that's why lack of training camp is a big deal for some players. That was the point we were discussing. The guys who kept themselves in shape during the lockout look best right now. If it were a normal season, everyone would have had to have kept themselves in shape, including Richards, because the offseason is short, camp starts early and it's long and full of condition drills. Yeah, Richards should have kept himself in shape anyway throughout the lockout, but he obviously didn't.

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03-25-2013, 09:07 PM
  #308
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post

I know this might seem crazy to a Torts hater at first, blame the players for their own lack of production? But yes, that is what I'm proposing. Good or bad, players should be given the bunt of the credit/blame.
I'm happy to place a lot of blame on Mr. Richards ... but by the same token the coach keeps playing him high minutes & key situations, as if he were a top-performing player, which he isn't this year.

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03-25-2013, 09:11 PM
  #309
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Originally Posted by mandiblesofdoom View Post
I'm happy to place a lot of blame on Mr. Richards ... but by the same token the coach keeps playing him high minutes & key situations, as if he were a top-performing player, which he isn't this year.
It is absolutely vital to this team that he return to form. We added Richards and went from an 8th seed to a 1st seed (in addition to other complimentary players)

He makes that much of a difference.

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03-25-2013, 09:35 PM
  #310
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Originally Posted by mandiblesofdoom View Post
I'm happy to place a lot of blame on Mr. Richards ... but by the same token the coach keeps playing him high minutes & key situations, as if he were a top-performing player, which he isn't this year.
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
It is absolutely vital to this team that he return to form. We added Richards and went from an 8th seed to a 1st seed (in addition to other complimentary players)

He makes that much of a difference.
Yeah, I think it's important to recognize that for us to go anywhere in the playoffs we're going to need Richy to be a part of it. So, while right now to give ourselves a better chance to win it would make sense to limit Richy, I think that would actually be counterproductive in the long run. As a coach you don't run your team like every game is game 7 of a playoff series, you can't. If you did that would mean never playing your backup goalie and barely playing your bottom line/pairing (yeah sometimes we kind of do that anyway, but in a game seven situation you do it even moreso. who can forget McD playing like 58 minutes to Bickels like 3 and change in that OT game). So, point is that what's best for the long term isn't what's best in the short term when it comes to where and how much to play Richy. We have to get him to play his way out of it, hard as that is to watch.

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03-25-2013, 09:39 PM
  #311
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
And that's why lack of training camp is a big deal for some players. That was the point we were discussing. The guys who kept themselves in shape during the lockout look best right now. If it were a normal season, everyone would have had to have kept themselves in shape, including Richards, because the offseason is short, camp starts early and it's long and full of condition drills. Yeah, Richards should have kept himself in shape anyway throughout the lockout, but he obviously didn't.
I won't derail this into another Richards thread, but again, I hate these excuses. Why does the entire team look so awful then? Training camp can't be an excuse anymore. We are too far into the season for that.

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03-25-2013, 09:40 PM
  #312
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Originally Posted by Kel Varnsen View Post
Yeah, I think it's important to recognize that for us to go anywhere in the playoffs we're going to need Richy to be a part of it. So, while right now to give ourselves a better chance to win it would make sense to limit Richy, I think that would actually be counterproductive in the long run. As a coach you don't run your team like every game is game 7 of a playoff series, you can't. If you did that would mean never playing your backup goalie and barely playing your bottom line/pairing (yeah sometimes we kind of do that anyway, but in a game seven situation you do it even moreso. who can forget McD playing like 58 minutes to Bickels like 3 and change in that OT game). So, point is that what's best for the long term isn't what's best in the short term when it comes to where and how much to play Richy. We have to get him to play his way out of it, hard as that is to watch.
PRECISELY.

Nobody wants to watch a loss. But if you bench Richards, or to another point, Gaborik, you have less of a chance of getting those players back on track.

If they return to form, Torts will deserve a ton of credit for recognizing that getting 2/3 of your top skaters back on track is more important than making the fans happy.

We can talk all day about buying out Richards next summer, but until I see a better option, I don't see the point. Without a top-flight center, which, make no mistake, Brad Richards is, this team isn't going anywhere.

Blame Torts all you want, he's trying to get the most out of our best center. You can't just play the hot-hand for the entire season.

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03-25-2013, 09:45 PM
  #313
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Originally Posted by Grind Jam Grind View Post
I won't derail this into another Richards thread, but again, I hate these excuses. Why does the entire team look so awful then? Training camp can't be an excuse anymore. We are too far into the season for that.
I wouldn't say the entire team looks awful.


Training camp is important less for conditioning, and more for the style and system we play. We have ALOT of new blood, much of which came from outside the system. We should have had 3 weeks for everyone to learn, get used to, and prepare to excel with that system. Now we've had everyone trying to learn it on the fly. Our team last year was almost entirely returning players, or call ups. Richards struggled at first, but dominated the second half of the season.

Look at the best teams in the east. Boston has much of the same, solid roster. Pittsburgh, well, ****. That's obvious. They have the best forwards in the world. Even Ottowa, despite their injures, have filled spots with players FROM THEIR OWN SYSTEM.

Most of this team isn't a team, it's a collection of players wearing the same jersey.

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03-25-2013, 10:18 PM
  #314
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Dave Maloney is quietly calling out the system. Made mention in The post game recently.

Also tweeted...

Nothing for nothing, you have to love the way Chicago plays. Tha would be fun!

Against Phi- Territorial advantage to no avail. Bit of a Grind-fest period.

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03-25-2013, 10:20 PM
  #315
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
I wouldn't say the entire team looks awful.


Training camp is important less for conditioning, and more for the style and system we play. We have ALOT of new blood, much of which came from outside the system. We should have had 3 weeks for everyone to learn, get used to, and prepare to excel with that system. Now we've had everyone trying to learn it on the fly. Our team last year was almost entirely returning players, or call ups. Richards struggled at first, but dominated the second half of the season.

Look at the best teams in the east. Boston has much of the same, solid roster. Pittsburgh, well, ****. That's obvious. They have the best forwards in the world. Even Ottowa, despite their injures, have filled spots with players FROM THEIR OWN SYSTEM.

Most of this team isn't a team, it's a collection of players wearing the same jersey.
We've had 8-9 weeks for the players to figure their **** out. Excuses, excuses.

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03-25-2013, 10:23 PM
  #316
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Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
Dave Maloney is quietly calling out the system. Made mention in The post game recently.

Also tweeted...

Nothing for nothing, you have to love the way Chicago plays. Tha would be fun!

Against Phi- Territorial advantage to no avail. Bit of a Grind-fest period.
Mike Keenan, Duguay and now Dave Maloney. Getting to be interesting.

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Old
03-25-2013, 10:33 PM
  #317
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Originally Posted by M0rbid View Post
Mike Keenan, Duguay and now Dave Maloney. Getting to be interesting.
Yes it is...

Renney went 2-7-3 before he was termed.
Torts Rangers are 3-5-2 in the last 9 games.

Very close to the Renney slump.

When Renney was termed he said something along the lines of "Democracy failed here"

Is Tortorellas dictatorship also failing? Tick-Tock!

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03-25-2013, 10:36 PM
  #318
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Originally Posted by Lion Hound View Post
Yes it is...

Renney went 2-7-3 before he was termed.
Torts Rangers are 3-5-2 in the last 9 games.

Very close to the Renney slump.

When Renney was termed he said something along the lines of "Democracy failed here"

Is Tortorellas dictatorship also failing? Tick-Tock!
Ohhhhhh boyyyyyyy.

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Old
03-25-2013, 10:38 PM
  #319
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Anyone else Lindy Ruff turned down the Bolts in hopes of coaching us...?

Completely based on loose speculation and nothing substantial. Seems like he was the obvious choice for them and he just didn't do it. You don't usually turn down the opportunity to play with the likes of Stamkos, Lecavier, and St. Louis for nothin.

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03-25-2013, 10:41 PM
  #320
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Originally Posted by Grind Jam Grind View Post
We've had 8-9 weeks for the players to figure their **** out. Excuses, excuses.
Explanations aren't excuses.

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Old
03-25-2013, 10:46 PM
  #321
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
Anyone else Lindy Ruff turned down the Bolts in hopes of coaching us...?

Completely based on loose speculation and nothing substantial. Seems like he was the obvious choice for them and he just didn't do it. You don't usually turn down the opportunity to play with the likes of Stamkos, Lecavier, and St. Louis for nothin.
Eh...he seems pretty similar to Tortorella. No thanks.

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03-25-2013, 10:50 PM
  #322
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
Explanations aren't excuses.
Fine. You keep being overly optimistic about this current group of players, who can't score more than 2 goals if their lives depended on it. As long as we have the "short camp" excuse, we'll be fine though.

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03-25-2013, 11:03 PM
  #323
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Originally Posted by Grind Jam Grind View Post
Fine. You keep being overly optimistic about this current group of players, who can't score more than 2 goals if their lives depended on it. As long as we have the "short camp" excuse, we'll be fine though.
I don't feel I'm being overly optimistic. I have a different theory on the cause of our struggles. I think that Richards and Gaborik, our two primary point producers, slumping, a bottom six that we have never even SEEN before, and have never played in this system, and key injuries are the reason for our problems.

Take away any team's top two forwards and see how they do. We need to get that fixed. Our bottom six has been all but useless. They're mostly just a collection of random pieces. This team is not a cohesive unit yet. That's what supposed to happen in a training camp.

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03-25-2013, 11:05 PM
  #324
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Eh...he seems pretty similar to Tortorella. No thanks.
Time to pull out all the stops. Scotty Bowman its time to unretire.

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Old
03-25-2013, 11:07 PM
  #325
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Originally Posted by Callagraves View Post
I don't feel I'm being overly optimistic. I have a different theory on the result of our struggles. I think that Richards and Gaborik, our two primary point producers, slumping, a bottom six that we have never even SEEN before, and have never played in this system, and key injuries are the reason for our problems.

Take away any team's top two forwards and see how they do. We need to get that fixed. Our bottom six has been all but useless. They're mostly just a collection of random pieces. This team is not a cohesive unit yet. That's what supposed to happen in a training camp.
That's also what is supposed to happen after 30+ games played together. It's Richards' fault he didn't prepare for the season. Can't pin that on Torts, since he wasn't allowed to be in contact with the players during the lockout. Gaborik? Seems to be another down year for him. Agree with the bottom 6, but I feel like that part of the roster is turned over every year. Short training camp or not, this group of players should not be 28th in GPG.

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