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03-26-2013, 12:40 AM
  #451
Bernie Parent 1974
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
More than likely maybe even better. He was a game breaker in net all year last year.
5-6 more wins, roughly ?

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03-26-2013, 12:43 AM
  #452
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you do keep saying that don't you? its funny too cause i here a lot of them saying he HAS NOT been the problem this year. I hear it a lot on the nhl channel on sirius xm and on hockey night in canada radio. none of those guys seem to blame him for this season.
the only announcer i've heard dump on Bryz has been Milbury. Everyone else says he's not the issue

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03-26-2013, 12:49 AM
  #453
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
the only announcer i've heard dump on Bryz has been Milbury. Everyone else says he's not the issue
there you go. so nobody said anything.

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03-26-2013, 12:59 AM
  #454
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it IS a retarded argument we all have about this. I'm still pissed we got rid of biron. then we get a guy like bobrovsky and act like he's garbage. like they were oblivious to the fact that he was a kid playin out of his mind the second he got here. oh no. of course theres no potential there. why would WE need a goalie like him when we can have a second round pick? then we put all this money into bryzgalov, and i'm sorry but it seemed obvious enough to me that if he was uncomfortable playing here whether it was the system or other factors and we know he was a good goalie before we got him is it that farfetched to try and protect this investment by maybe hiring a better goalie coach? does jeff reese have pictures of homer blowing a goat? maybe i need to rethink being a flyers fan cause this team is run by retards. i just can't defend this stuff anymore. maybe we can hire another general manager with brain damage. jody shelly will be retiring soon. unless he gets a 5 year extension.
i think Biron would of resigned if his agent had not lost his mind and thought Biron deserved 5 million a year. If he had asked for around 3 he likely would of been back and who knows maybe hes still here.
I have had it with Jeff Reese. Why is he still here for God sakes. He preferred Leighton over Bobrovsky. I mean why on earth would you bring back Leighton AFTER he lied about his health and he needed surgery. how many games has he played for the Flyers in the last few seasons including this one? Its ****ing ridiculous that he was resigned after that fiasco.
If the Flyers no longer wanted Bobrovsky fine. Whatever. But did they have to replace him with Leighton? then they brought back Boucher as well? comical.

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03-26-2013, 02:27 AM
  #455
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
the only announcer i've heard dump on Bryz has been Milbury. Everyone else says he's not the issue
Perhaps you just haven't seen enough games from other teams. Random announcers have ragged on him. Just about every opposition announcer has labelled him as a weak link as well.

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03-26-2013, 02:32 AM
  #456
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Originally Posted by funghoul View Post
it IS a retarded argument we all have about this. I'm still pissed we got rid of biron. then we get a guy like bobrovsky and act like he's garbage. like they were oblivious to the fact that he was a kid playin out of his mind the second he got here. oh no. of course theres no potential there. why would WE need a goalie like him when we can have a second round pick? then we put all this money into bryzgalov, and i'm sorry but it seemed obvious enough to me that if he was uncomfortable playing here whether it was the system or other factors and we know he was a good goalie before we got him is it that farfetched to try and protect this investment by maybe hiring a better goalie coach? does jeff reese have pictures of homer blowing a goat? maybe i need to rethink being a flyers fan cause this team is run by retards. i just can't defend this stuff anymore. maybe we can hire another general manager with brain damage. jody shelly will be retiring soon. unless he gets a 5 year extension.
Biron wasn't terrible, but he wasn't awesome. Unfortunately he wanted to be paid like he was awesome. I think the Flyers ended up making the right move by not giving him lots of money for however long he wanted it. I blame his agent for that.

I just couldn't trust Biron to be dependable though.
I felt you never knew if he'd be awesome or sucky. So I guess he's Boosh 2.0 in that regard. So I guess we can also expect to see him back someday

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03-26-2013, 06:32 AM
  #457
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it's baffling to see people here to say "our goalie isn't good enough", then give reasons why the team shouldn't play a more defense oriented system

HUH ??

so, we should mostly concentrate on O, and not try to tighten up defensively with a 'poor goalie' in net ?

teams like NYR & BOS tighten up defensively with the King & the 2nd best save % goalie in the league

did anybody else notice that we held PITT to 1 even strength goal [and even that was 4 on 4] ?
this team sure looked better defensively to me. as they did last March.

oh, and by the way, Bryz looked great last march & great last night.

seeing a pattern here ?

NO reason we cant tighten up defensively. saying we don't have the personnel of BOS & NYR makes no sense.

they sure were good defensively vs PITT. they CAN do it. i watched it.
Yep, I sure am seeing a pattern.

I first noticed the pattern in the 1st All Purpose Goaltending / Bryz thread... other posters look at Bryz's performance in 100% of the games he's played, while you seem to have some obsession with the month of March and any other game where Bryz looked halfway decent.

Bryz isn't good.

That's not to say the team's play in front of him has been rock solid or anything close, but Bryz has been a part of the problem. And if you don't think that's the case, you're out to lunch. Likewise, if you think Bryz's inconsistency on the back-end and the pressure from management to tighten up the defense hasn't affected the offense, then again you're out to lunch.

This year is a classic example of what happens when a coach has to alter his style to try and fit a square peg into a round hole. Or in the Flyers' case several square pegs into a round hole. Bryz is a horrible fit for this team, but Lavi has had to try to adapt to shelter him. Likewise, Lavi has had to try and fit a few immobile defensive defensemen into his scheme and he has one legit puckmover (Timonen) and even that one guy has shown age quite a few times this year.

When a team tries to play like something it's not and you've got a bunch of up-tempo explosive offensive players trying to play Rangers hockey, it's going to hurt your team... especially when you've had all of ~1 week of training camp to try and make these changes.

And for those of you who say the team isn't playing differently this year, I'd like you to specifically focus on the aggressiveness of the defensemen on pinches. Throw on a game tape from last year or 09-10 or 10-11 and you'll see a team that forechecked with no fear, whose defensemen pinched with aggression constantly. Compare it to this year, where our defensemen are constantly blowing the zone early. Part of that is because our defensemen are slower than they were on average in the past, but another large part of it is a conscious effort to change our system. The forwards are also retreating a lot sooner than they used to.


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03-26-2013, 07:17 AM
  #458
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
Perhaps you just haven't seen enough games from other teams. Random announcers have ragged on him. Just about every opposition announcer has labelled him as a weak link as well.
Many, many announcers, even national announcers have said consistently "It's hard to completely blame Bryzgalov for a lot of these goals, but he still has to be better."

I tend to agree with that statement. The team has had awful turnovers in front of him and generally been poor in controling the front of the net, but that doesn't excuse Bryzgalov's completely pedestrian performance for the last 2 months.

Regardless of good or bad Bryz though, there simply is nothing to justify the contract. It was bad the day it was signed, it got worse with his rollercoaster first season here, and now with a reduced cap and two compliance buyouts.... it's a no brainer.

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03-26-2013, 07:41 AM
  #459
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
The goalie is certainly making things worse. When you have to hang back to protect the guy who's been inconsistent as hell since early Feb, it's going to make an already struggling offense struggle more. When the team has to start changing how they play to help cover for the goaltending, it's generally going to hurt their performance.
The team had to start changing how it played because they were giving up more odd man rushes and more power plays than any team in the league. That's a recipe for disaster no matter who's in goal.

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03-26-2013, 07:56 AM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Many, many announcers, even national announcers have said consistently "It's hard to completely blame Bryzgalov for a lot of these goals, but he still has to be better."
thats word for word Milbury from last week. i have not heard any other announcer say that. Milburuy also thinks Bryz is the head case / media problem from last year, which is incorrect. I suspect he just looks at the stats & doesn't watch the games besides the ones NBC / NBCSN air

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03-26-2013, 08:03 AM
  #461
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Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
you've got a bunch of up-tempo explosive offensive players
who are not scoring. and have not been all year, save a handful of games [NYI / FLA / CAR / WPG /PITT]

play better defense like they did vs PITT. they held them to 1 even strength [and 4 on 4, at that] goal.

& Bryz was great.

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03-26-2013, 10:22 AM
  #462
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
who are not scoring. and have not been all year, save a handful of games [NYI / FLA / CAR / WPG /PITT]

play better defense like they did vs PITT. they held them to 1 even strength [and 4 on 4, at that] goal.

& Bryz was great.
And they lost.

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03-26-2013, 10:24 AM
  #463
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dude. that is called defense. when teams don't do that they lose
i do not buy the argument that our players do not know how to play good D. or lack the skill to play good defense.

"square peg into a round hole" ???
really ??

i will not accept that we have NHL players on the Flyers who can't stick man to man, be smarter on breakout passes, take fewer chances on the forecheck and do the other things needed to be more responsible defensively.

how funny is it to see people say "Bryz can't stop a breakaway", "Bryz can't pokecheck" etc etc etc ...... and then see the same people casually accept "well, our players aren't well suited to playing strong D like BOS & NYR, so why bother trying to tighten up defensively, Bryz simply has to step up"

what ??

and the best part of that, is that they will then tell us how good the overall Team D has been this year

yea, OK.

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03-26-2013, 10:25 AM
  #464
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
The team had to start changing how it played because they were giving up more odd man rushes and more power plays than any team in the league. That's a recipe for disaster no matter who's in goal.
It wouldn't be as much of a problem if Bryz was semi-capable of stopping those chances more than once in a blue moon, if a Dman can't get back in time.

That's on Homer for plugging a bunch of slow defensemen into a system that needs them to contribute offensively. So now we stifle our forward corps' strengths and hobble an already dismal offense to help mask the deficiency, because the goaltender has done nearly nothing to help them.

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03-26-2013, 10:29 AM
  #465
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i do not buy the argument that our players do not know how to play good D. or lack the skill to play good defense.

"square peg into a round hole" ???
really ??

i will not accept that we have NHL players on the Flyers who can't stick man to man, be smarter on breakout passes, take fewer chances on the forecheck and do the other things needed to be more responsible defensively.

how funny is it to see people say "Bryz can't stop a breakaway", "Bryz can't pokecheck" etc etc etc ...... and then see the same people casually accept "well, our players aren't well suited to playing strong D like BOS & NYR, so why bother trying to tighten up defensively, Bryz simply has to step up"

what ??

and the best part of that, is that they will then tell us how good the overall Team D has been this year

yea, OK.
Nothing about the system prevents good defense. The defense was very, very good under Lavi for about 2 years. They don't have as much defensive skill as they once did, that's just all there is to it.

Also, the defense has been passable overall. It just looks worse because every mistake has a high chance of going in the net. That isn't the case with most other NHL teams.

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03-26-2013, 10:29 AM
  #466
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
who are not scoring. and have not been all year, save a handful of games [NYI / FLA / CAR / WPG /PITT]
A large part of them not scoring at even-strength has to do with our defensemen blowing the zone so quickly. We used to have no problem getting the puck into the offensive zone and then we'd cycle for days when we got in there. Now we have a difficult time getting out of our end and navigating the neutral zone (both problems due to some personnel changes and our defensive-minded approach this year) and when we get into the offensive zone, at the slightest hint of trouble our defenders abandon the zone, because many of them are poor skaters / are slow and because we're trying to be more defensively conscious and avoid a breakaway which has a 90% chance of turning into a goal when Bryz is in net.

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play better defense like they did vs PITT. they held them to 1 even strength [and 4 on 4, at that] goal.
It's not just that easy. You don't just say "play better defense" waive a magic wand, and Poof! you only give up 1 even strength goal per game. That's not how it works.

The Flyers have been trying to be a more defensively conscious team all season, as I said the defenders aren't pinching near as much as they used to and the forwards are quick to abandon the offensive zone to try and get back and help too. Very few of the breakaways and odd man rushes and quality scoring chances for the opponent have come as a result of us being too aggressive in the o-zone. The majority of the turnovers and subsequent quality scoring chances have occurred in our own zone and/or in the neutral zone off a poor breakout pass.

The breakdowns in our own zone & the netural zone aren't because we're a reckless offensive-minded team, they occur because a lot of our players just aren't that good in their own zone. That's why we brought Bryz in... he was supposed to be the stopper, the guy who would make up for those deficiencies. Sadly, he's fallen short. Way short.

The game 2 nights ago wasn't some defensive revelation from the Flyers, it wasn't the result of them altering their strategy drastically to be more defensive; they were playing the same way they have for the majority of the year. It just so happened that they made less mistakes last night. Unfortunately, that's not something you can rely on going forward as we've proven to be quite prone to mistakes.

Playing sheltered hockey isn't the answer for this team. You play to your team's strengths. We are an aggressive forechecking and pinching team and we need to get back to that, regardless of who is in net, otherwise we'll continue to lose games.

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& Bryz was great.
& they lost.

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03-26-2013, 10:34 AM
  #467
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Think about how many times the Flyers, last year and this year, have gotten odd man rushes or breakaways, or good scoring chances off opposition mistakes. Now consider how often it resulted in goals for the Flyers, compared to how often the same play would end up in our net.

If you go back and watch the games, and pay special attention to that during our games now, you'll find they other goalie makes those saves a lot more often than Bryz.

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03-26-2013, 11:01 AM
  #468
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If you watch the games this year you would know the Flyers give up far more odd man rushes than they create. This is why they are so bad 5 on 5. But they are still good on the PK, and some of that is due to the goalie.

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Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Playing sheltered hockey isn't the answer for this team. You play to your team's strengths. We are an aggressive forechecking and pinching team and we need to get back to that, regardless of who is in net, otherwise we'll continue to lose games.
They were losing games because of over aggressive forechecking and bad pinches and terrible turnovers. Like the last game in New Jersey when Bryz stopped a 2 on 1 in the first couple of minutes after Grossmann made a terrible decision to pinch and the team's defense was shredded by Milbury during intermission.

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03-26-2013, 11:22 AM
  #469
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Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Playing sheltered hockey isn't the answer for this team.

solid defense is essential for every team.

you think our goalie is not good, then say we shouldn't try to play better D, then say how good the team D is & it's Bryz's fault.

OK. whatever. i get you loud and clear.

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03-26-2013, 12:33 PM
  #470
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If you watch the games this year you would know the Flyers give up far more odd man rushes than they create. This is why they are so bad 5 on 5. But they are still good on the PK, and some of that is due to the goalie.



They were losing games because of over aggressive forechecking and bad pinches and terrible turnovers. Like the last game in New Jersey when Bryz stopped a 2 on 1 in the first couple of minutes after Grossmann made a terrible decision to pinch and the team's defense was shredded by Milbury during intermission.
it's useless. they're just gonna contradict themselves

1. the goalie is bad
2. our players aren't suited to play solid D
3. Bryz has to 'step up'
4. our defense is good, it's Bryz's fault we stink


yea, other teams play tight defense in front of Henrik & Raask - our goalie isn't as good as those goalies, but we shouldn't try to play tighter D

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03-26-2013, 12:50 PM
  #471
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
it's useless. they're just gonna contradict themselves

1. the goalie is bad
2. our players aren't suited to play solid D
3. Bryz has to 'step up'
4. our defense is good, it's Bryz's fault we stink


yea, other teams play tight defense in front of Henrik & Raask - our goalie isn't as good as those goalies, but we shouldn't try to play tighter D
right. thats why this argument has gone in circles for a year and a half. lets just get back down to the previous sparks of this argument, cause thats what i think it boils down to. some people hate and i mean HATE our goalie and some don't. thats all it is. its fine to hate him. i don't but i don't have a problem with it but don't ignore that this team is a large part of what prevents him from playing this with this "consistency" everyone talks about. the team in front is not consistent why would our goalies numbers be? there's no stick in the goalie to cover the warts. its gotta be a fluid machine of two way play with offense being dictated by the creativity and skill, and hustle of our forwards. don't gimme this crap that their gun shy because their afraid of what our goalie is gonna do back there. again, he hasn't been spectacular but he's been good enough to win. i've seen him play two questionable games all year. 1 against florida and 1 against toronto. the rest he played average to good. but its a young team. its all a patience thing. not a goalie thing.

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03-26-2013, 12:54 PM
  #472
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I never said our defense is good. It's passable. It certainly isn't good enough for playoff hockey. But for regular season play, it's nowhere close to being as horrible as some in this thread make it out to be. It just seems worse than it actually is because their mistakes are more likely to end in goals.

He's inventing contradictions that don't actually exist, often using statements nobody has even made.

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03-26-2013, 01:00 PM
  #473
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Originally Posted by Beef Invictus View Post
I never said our defense is good. It's passable. It certainly isn't good enough for playoff hockey. But for regular season play, it's nowhere close to being as horrible as some in this thread make it out to be. It just seems worse than it actually is because their mistakes are more likely to end in goals.

He's inventing contradictions that don't actually exist, often using statements nobody has even made.
thats fine but forget bryzgalov. how do you explain what you saw against pittsburgh? why are they able to get up for a game against certain teams but not others? is it the different styles clashing? and pittsburgh is more of an even match against what we do? do we just have a healthier hatred for them? or is it a coaching thing. i think its probably a coaching thing but if its not its crazy to watch and not know what your gonna see. and i know we lost that game but it was a level up in play regardless.

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03-26-2013, 01:00 PM
  #474
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thats what i think it boils down to. some people hate and i mean HATE our goalie and some don't. thats all it is. its fine to hate him.


i've seen him play two questionable games all year. 1 against florida and 1 against toronto. the rest he played average to good. but its a young team. its all a patience thing. not a goalie thing.
i think you are completely right. it's OK to hate Bryz & hate his contract & hate his accent or aloofness.

but to see some here contradict themselves with :

"our D is good enough"
"our players are not suited to play tight D"
"Bryz has to step up to cover for the mistakes of the team"
"sure, BOS & NYR play tight D in front of Raask & Hank, but that's not what we should do [even though our goalie isn't nearly as good as those goalies]"

huh ???

just makes it look like they are chasing their tails to not admit that no matter who was in net [Anderson / Raask / Hank whoever], this team MUST play better team defense & eliminate the frequent "going through the motions" effort that's plagued them 2 years running ......

they just want to focus on the goalie for the 23rd year in a row, in my view ....

it's not a goalie thing.

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03-26-2013, 01:05 PM
  #475
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Originally Posted by Bernie Parent 1974 View Post
i think you are completely right. it's OK to hate Bryz & hate his contract & hate his accent or aloofness.

but to see some here contradict themselves with :

"our D is good enough"
"our players are not suited to play tight D"
"Bryz has to step up to cover for the mistakes of the team"
"sure, BOS & NYR play tight D in front of Raask & Hank, but that's not what we should do [even though our goalie isn't nearly as good as those goalies]"

huh ???

just makes it look like they are chasing their tails to not admit that no matter who was in net [Anderson / Raask / Hank whoever], this team MUST play better team defense & eliminate the frequent "going through the motions" effort that's plagued them 2 years running ......

they just want to focus on the goalie for the 23rd year in a row, in my view ....

it's not a goalie thing.
right. but ha. nobody's admitting that. thats why this thread is the funnest thread.

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