HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Alain Vigneault/Coaching Discussion Repository - Part V

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-26-2013, 02:17 AM
  #51
Bleach Clean
Moderator
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 18,915
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Tripper View Post
i'd love babcock too, the problem is you'd probably have to luck into hiring him...he'd be out of a job for about as long as bruce boudreau was
I realize. Have just hope it comes to pass. My thinking is that DET is going to ride it out with him this season. Same as the Canucks with AV. Then afterwards both teams will evaluate. If Babcock is fired, it will be in the offseason. Which should give the Canucks a chance to make their pitch.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 04:27 AM
  #52
vanuck
#Gaunce4GM
 
vanuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 14,112
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
Stupid Yzerman took perhaps the best potential name off the market. Cooper would have been amazing here.

Oh, and for this fan, fire AV will always be on the front burner. Losing streak, winning streak, or otherwise. It how the team plays that is the issue with him, not their results, which have toggled on a razor thin margin.

I'd be fine with Babcock or Boucher.
I don't know if Cooper will do that much better than Boucher given what he has to work with, but alas, that ship has already sailed nonetheless.

vanuck is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 04:33 AM
  #53
604
Registered User
 
604's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,393
vCash: 50
Can we have a discussion about Boucher and Ruff's strengths and weaknesses?

I don't really know much about either but I know Ruff is on Team Canada's coaching staff for both the Vancouver and likely the Sochi Olympics while AV isn't really in consideration. Isn't that a sign about what the general hockey community thinks about the two?

604 is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 04:38 AM
  #54
Christina Woloski
#FIREBENNING
 
Christina Woloski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Narnia
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,954
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Well, I think you will find most people agree that he's finally done what everyone wanted him to do:

1) Put Garrison back on the point on the PP,
2) put Schroeder in with skilled linemates, particularly Raymond, and
3) put Garrison on the RS...he did it and it seems our RHD/LHD problem is solved.


I fully agree. I just said a couple games ago to my buddy; "Oh, weird. We suddenly start winning when the obvious moves in the line-up are made."

I think AV needs to start keeping the winning lines together and having more patience with them when they're not working. Just keep Raymond - Schroeder - Hansen set.

Christina Woloski is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 04:47 AM
  #55
Lawzy
Registered User
 
Lawzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,816
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by LetsBeReality View Post
I fully agree. I just said a couple games ago to my buddy; "Oh, weird. We suddenly start winning when the obvious moves in the line-up are made."

I think AV needs to start keeping the winning lines together and having more patience with them when they're not working. Just keep Raymond - Schroeder - Hansen set.
One could just as easily say we started winning due to a weaker schedule.

6 wins in the last 8 games may look good on paper but we're aren't exactly knocking off wins against the Chicago's and Anaheim's.


Furthermore I could spin it this way: You say (or I suppose your friend) AV finally came to his senses and moved Schroeder up in the lineup? I say Schroeder started playing better because he was sent down to the minors, motivating him to step it up.

The PP has obviously been better as of late but it is still abysmal considering how electric it was just a few years ago. The team is all around under performing this season and I fail to see how someone can put the full blame on AV.

Lawzy is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 05:02 AM
  #56
RobertKron
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 9,302
vCash: 500
Part of it also is that the injuries and whatnot have put the team in a situation where if the players don't bear down and pull their heads out of their *****, they're going to get absolutely embarrassed.

RobertKron is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 05:27 AM
  #57
wunderpanda
cooly cough
 
wunderpanda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 4,166
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Can we have a discussion about Boucher and Ruff's strengths and weaknesses?

I don't really know much about either but I know Ruff is on Team Canada's coaching staff for both the Vancouver and likely the Sochi Olympics while AV isn't really in consideration. Isn't that a sign about what the general hockey community thinks about the two?
I can give you a disgruntled Sabre fan synopsis on Ruff

-when he was first named Sabres coach, he took over a team and prospect pool put together by Muckler and featured Hasek in goal. By 2001 most of those guys were gone with no goalie ready to step in for Hasek... they missed the playoffs until after the lockout

-since that lockout, the team had some success with Miller in goal, for all the talk of Ruff being a defensive coach, the last 10 years have seen Miller near the top of the league in saves and the Sabres near the top in shots allowed.

-personal assumption of why Ruff lasted as long as he did... the unstable ownership. An owner indicted, a league take over followed by disinterested owner. He lasted only 2 years with Pegula, almost to the day actually.

Ruff also the the genius ideas of using Afinogenov and Satan as grinders, he even tried using Grigorenko in that role this year. He can't coach skilled players.

wunderpanda is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 10:04 AM
  #58
racerjoe
Registered User
 
racerjoe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 4,713
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawzy View Post
One could just as easily say we started winning due to a weaker schedule.

6 wins in the last 8 games may look good on paper but we're aren't exactly knocking off wins against the Chicago's and Anaheim's.


Furthermore I could spin it this way: You say (or I suppose your friend) AV finally came to his senses and moved Schroeder up in the lineup? I say Schroeder started playing better because he was sent down to the minors, motivating him to step it up.

The PP has obviously been better as of late but it is still abysmal considering how electric it was just a few years ago. The team is all around under performing this season and I fail to see how someone can put the full blame on AV.
Would have to look at the rest of the schedule, but two of those wins came against LA and STL, two teams that at the time were a head of us in the standings, and the STL one was on the back half of a back to back.

We also beat (can't believe I am about to say this)) CBJ, who was at the time the hottest team in the NHL.

I think we can agree what has happened here, Cory caught fire.

racerjoe is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 04:00 PM
  #59
mossey3535
Registered User
 
mossey3535's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,758
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Verviticus View Post
i think the conclusion that you can draw is:

coaches coach teams that sometimes win cups, and sometimes dont. replacing a coach because of an arbitrary number of years is at its very best ignoring the team, players, management and dressing room in favour of a magic bullet, and at its worst direct sabotage of the team
When palefire says you can't draw any meaningful conclusions, it also means you can't come to the opposite conclusion.

mossey3535 is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 07:17 PM
  #60
luongo321
Registered User
 
luongo321's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 12,171
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
Can we have a discussion about Boucher and Ruff's strengths and weaknesses?

I don't really know much about either but I know Ruff is on Team Canada's coaching staff for both the Vancouver and likely the Sochi Olympics while AV isn't really in consideration. Isn't that a sign about what the general hockey community thinks about the two?
Meh, World Juniors hired Steve Spott as head coach and that guy is 10000 times worse than AV so I don't think having Ruff on Team Canada's coaching staff says too much.

luongo321 is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 07:53 PM
  #61
604
Registered User
 
604's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,393
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by luongo321 View Post
Meh, World Juniors hired Steve Spott as head coach and that guy is 10000 times worse than AV so I don't think having Ruff on Team Canada's coaching staff says too much.
There's a big difference between the World Juniors and the Olympics.

None/almost none of the best coaches in the world are available for the World Juniors, all are available for the Olympics.

604 is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 08:16 PM
  #62
TheDiver*
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Pacific Northwest
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,567
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJOpus View Post
There's a big difference between the World Juniors and the Olympics.

None/almost none of the best coaches in the world are available for the World Juniors, all are available for the Olympics.
But we all know that the Olympic coaches shouldn't be given credit because they had Roberto Luongo in net and a great roster.

Isn't that the rationale that AV haters have had for years as to why this "terrible" coach who doesn't know anything about hockey has had so much success?

TheDiver* is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 08:19 PM
  #63
Stories Tales Lies
and Exaggerations
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,955
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moses View Post
But we all know that the Olympic coaches shouldn't be given credit because they had Roberto Luongo in net and a great roster.

Isn't that the rationale that AV haters have had for years as to why this "terrible" coach who doesn't know anything about hockey has had so much success?
Some one needs to get credit, cause other fan bases don't give it to Louongo

Stories Tales Lies is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 08:27 PM
  #64
opendoor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,669
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawzy View Post
One could just as easily say we started winning due to a weaker schedule.

6 wins in the last 8 games may look good on paper but we're aren't exactly knocking off wins against the Chicago's and Anaheim's.
About 90% of their games this season are against teams other than those two, so you could say that about pretty much any good stretch.

Their last 4 game losing streak was against CGY, SJS, CBJ, and MIN and their current 4 game winning streak has been against STL, PHX, LAK, and COL. I don't see any difference in the level of competition between those two groups.

opendoor is offline  
Old
03-26-2013, 09:38 PM
  #65
Verviticus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 10,839
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by opendoor View Post
About 90% of their games this season are against teams other than those two, so you could say that about pretty much any good stretch.

Their last 4 game losing streak was against CGY, SJS, CBJ, and MIN and their current 4 game winning streak has been against STL, PHX, LAK, and COL. I don't see any difference in the level of competition between those two groups.
the second group is a stronger group of 4 teams if you were to just sum them or whatever

Verviticus is offline  
Old
03-27-2013, 12:38 PM
  #66
604
Registered User
 
604's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 5,393
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moses View Post
But we all know that the Olympic coaches shouldn't be given credit because they had Roberto Luongo in net and a great roster.

Isn't that the rationale that AV haters have had for years as to why this "terrible" coach who doesn't know anything about hockey has had so much success?
I would discredit the coach if team Canada was unprepared and outplayed every game but won because they're goalie played amazing (i.e. if the US won).

That being said, the Canucks outplayed the opposition badly the last two games and unlike the first three games of the win streak, AV deserves credit here for having the team ready to go.

604 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:14 AM
  #67
jigsaw99
Registered User
 
jigsaw99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,965
vCash: 500
Ok didn't watch the game today but how the **** did Andrew Ebbet get 17:15 min of ice time? That's the same as henrik. Schroeder gets 10 min dispite being the hotter player? It blows my mind. Even pinnozotto got 15 min?

jigsaw99 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:21 AM
  #68
aandbreatheme
Registered User
 
aandbreatheme's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,250
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jigsaw99 View Post
Ok didn't watch the game today but how the **** did Andrew Ebbet get 17:15 min of ice time? That's the same as henrik. Schroeder gets 10 min dispite being the hotter player? It blows my mind. Even pinnozotto got 15 min?
It honestly felt like the 3rd/4th lines were out there 24/7 (especially in the third)... and you knew when the Sedins were on the ice, as the puck was in the offensive zone.

aandbreatheme is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 07:23 AM
  #69
Southern Mail
Harbard
 
Southern Mail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Cascadia
Country: Canada
Posts: 40
vCash: 500
I did not watch the second period of the Avalanche game, so I need help with this question: what did Schroeder do to get bumped down to the fourth line (apart from the whole AV-has-no-patience-with-rookies thing)?

Southern Mail is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:21 PM
  #70
cc
Registered User
 
cc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7,307
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Mail View Post
I did not watch the second period of the Avalanche game, so I need help with this question: what did Schroeder do to get bumped down to the fourth line (apart from the whole AV-has-no-patience-with-rookies thing)?
I think he got outmuscled for the puck... other than that, I'm not sure.

cc is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:32 PM
  #71
Bourne Endeavor
Moderator
HFBoards: Night's Watch
 
Bourne Endeavor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Country: Canada
Posts: 33,148
vCash: 178
Quote:
Originally Posted by jigsaw99 View Post
Ok didn't watch the game today but how the **** did Andrew Ebbet get 17:15 min of ice time? That's the same as henrik. Schroeder gets 10 min dispite being the hotter player? It blows my mind. Even pinnozotto got 15 min?
AV predictable shifted Lapierre with Raymond and Hansen for a while in the third. Not surprisingly, they were invisible until Schroeder was moved back. Ebbett was his usual, lackluster self, although better than he's been. Either way, it boggles the mind how poorly AV determines play time beyond the established.

Bourne Endeavor is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:36 PM
  #72
Tiranis
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Toronto, ON
Country: Czech_ Republic
Posts: 23,072
vCash: 500
I thought Schroeder was poor, but Raymond was quite possibly even worse. The last two games his decision-making has gone completely down the gutter. He's getting a bit of the one-man army mentality that Kesler has. Frustrating how much these two seem to let success go to their heads.

Tiranis is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 01:11 PM
  #73
Scurr
Bear G
 
Scurr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Whalley
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,671
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiranis View Post
I thought Schroeder was poor, but Raymond was quite possibly even worse. The last two games his decision-making has gone completely down the gutter. He's getting a bit of the one-man army mentality that Kesler has. Frustrating how much these two seem to let success go to their heads.
Raymond may have been making some poor decisions with the puck but he wasn't losing his man and losing puck battles the way Schroeder was. That's one of the worst games he's played here imo.

Scurr is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 01:28 PM
  #74
The Bob Cole
Ohhhh Baby.
 
The Bob Cole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Centre Ice
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,688
vCash: 500
Schroeder had a pretty weak game (literally and figuratively). He deserved be putting on to the 4th line. That spark there the past week was gone this past game.

The Bob Cole is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 04:22 PM
  #75
Southern Mail
Harbard
 
Southern Mail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Cascadia
Country: Canada
Posts: 40
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Stovepipe Cup View Post
Schroeder had a pretty weak game (literally and figuratively). He deserved putting on to the 4th line. That spark there the past week was gone this past game.
Copy that, thanks.

Southern Mail is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:23 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2016 All Rights Reserved.