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The Rumours and Speculation Thread Part 2 (Post #693: Rumor -- Clowe to the Flyers)

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Old
03-26-2013, 03:36 PM
  #176
Stizzle
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Originally Posted by kings11 View Post
Kings fan coming in peace any interest in Bernier, martinez/muzzin for Schenn , read??

you guys get a franchise caliber goalie and a young offensive dman.
No thank you.

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Old
03-26-2013, 04:14 PM
  #177
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Originally Posted by GoneFullHolmgren View Post
Flyers cant buy out Pronger. So none of this works. I would of thought that everyone would of understood that by now.
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You can't buyout Pronger.
Say if im wrong but can we mark him not LTIR in summer and then byuout? I know the rule that if player is injured you cannot byuout. Lets give Pronger good job in organisation and clause it to agree to be healthy for buyout. Ponger gets his money and nice job what he want in hockey.

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As to the other points, I'm not sure. Where do you see spending that money? There aren't many defenseman available better than Mezsaros (when healthy--granted, that's rare lately).

Also, I'm not certain you can find a better goalie UFA--though certainly you could find a cheaper one. You can look to acquire a young backup via trade, but I'm not sure that makes the team better in the short-term (what evidence is there that Bishop is any better than Bryzgalov?).
Spending that money, umm, cap is going down? And there is few RFA next summer like Pietrangelo, Bogosian, Rundblad, McDonagh, Shattenkirk, Alzner, Leddy. In summer of 2014 Ufas are nice too Bouwmeester, Phaneuf, Pitkänen, Letang, Girardi and RFAs J.Schultz, Gubranson, Subban, Del Zotto, Kulikov, Gardiner. No, i dont think they all will be free or even RFA in the summers but some might be.

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Yeah man let's continue to ignore our defense.
Yes, or no actually. We dont really have elements to strenght our defensive right now. So we have to go the long way by drafting and scouting and so on. With Lavi i really like to have good offensive to do 5 or more goals per game cause we dont have that kind of def in few years what it needs to win with Lavi and offensive tactic.

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03-26-2013, 04:20 PM
  #178
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Spending that money, umm, cap is going down? And there is few RFA next summer like Pietrangelo, Bogosian, Rundblad, McDonagh, Shattenkirk, Alzner, Leddy. In summer of 2014 Ufas are nice too Bouwmeester, Phaneuf, Pitkänen, Letang, Girardi and RFAs J.Schultz, Gubranson, Subban, Del Zotto, Kulikov, Gardiner. No, i dont think they all will be free or even RFA in the summers but some might be.
You're line-up already included the $64.3 cap for next year, so we have $15+ free under the reduced cap. That's what I was asking about.

For all intents and purposes, you can only make one major RFA offer at a time (the compensation can't overlap), so I don't see a need to keep more than $8 million free (and really, are any of the guys you've listed worth 4 1sts (other than Pietrangelo, who won't get away).)

Rundblad might be an RFA target. Maybe Leddy, since the Hawks need to keep some space free to re-sign Toews and Kane the year that follows (IIRC). A guy like Ben Bishop or Bernier could be possible targets. But I don't think we need quite that much cap space free--and we know that the organization won't allow it.

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03-26-2013, 04:48 PM
  #179
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I'm also wondering if Pronger can be bought out in the summer when LTIR isn't in play. Not that I would do it if I were the Flyers because I'd rather see Briere be bought out and then save the second one for Bryz if need be.

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03-26-2013, 04:48 PM
  #180
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I was talking to prongo earlier on twitter

If we can't get jones, trade down with someone like CBJ to get 2 1sts from them so we can pick up nurse/zadorov/pulock and someone like Mantha/Gauthier/Zykov/Morrissey
No way Jose. If we can get Jones we need to try and move our first for a franchise type dman or a potential one. Or draft one of the forwards and move Couturier/Read/etc for a dman. It will be very nice drafting in the top 10 (if we do) and I dont think we should move down.

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03-26-2013, 04:53 PM
  #181
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Originally Posted by Schenn Bros Pizza View Post
No way Jose. If we can get Jones we need to try and move our first for a franchise type dman or a potential one. Or draft one of the forwards and move Couturier/Read/etc for a dman. It will be very nice drafting in the top 10 (if we do) and I dont think we should move down.
I agree with this. If we do miss out on Seth Jones and pick within the top 5, we have to take one of those young top end elite talents. Mac, Barkov, and Drouin are all supposedly extremely special players, we shouldn't miss our chance at grabbing one when we are drafting. Flyers have always drafted BPA, so I really don't see us changing it up this year, regardless of team needs.


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03-26-2013, 05:27 PM
  #182
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Drouin and Mac will be on par with Giroux in terms of top production and value.

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03-26-2013, 05:39 PM
  #183
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I agree with this. If we do miss out on Seth Jones and pick within the top 5, we have to take one of those young top end elite talents. Mac, Barkov, and Drouin are all supposedly extremely special players, we shouldn't miss our chance at grabbing one when we are drafting. Flyers have always drafted BPA, so I really don't see us changing it up this year, regardless of team needs.
If we land the 5th pick and those guys are off the board then I'm going to go with Nurse. I wouldn't trade up or trade back. He's the BPA and just so happens to fit a need.

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03-26-2013, 05:46 PM
  #184
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
If we land the 5th pick and those guys are off the board then I'm going to go with Nurse. I wouldn't trade up or trade back. He's the BPA and just so happens to fit a need.
Agreed

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03-26-2013, 05:47 PM
  #185
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Originally Posted by JayB View Post
Say if im wrong but can we mark him not LTIR in summer and then byuout? I know the rule that if player is injured you cannot byuout. Lets give Pronger good job in organisation and clause it to agree to be healthy for buyout. Ponger gets his money and nice job what he want in hockey.

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Originally Posted by MsWoof View Post
I'm also wondering if Pronger can be bought out in the summer when LTIR isn't in play. Not that I would do it if I were the Flyers because I'd rather see Briere be bought out and then save the second one for Bryz if need be.
For Pronger to come off of LTIR he'd have to be cleared medically to play by team doctors.

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03-26-2013, 06:16 PM
  #186
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Originally Posted by Broad St Cyberbully View Post
For Pronger to come off of LTIR he'd have to be cleared medically to play by team doctors.
I can't imagine that it would be a problem if they did decide they wanted to buy out Pronger. Similar to MLB rules stating you can't trade a player on the DL, yet it's done. Pronger will be wink "cleared" and the Flyers will buy him out if that's what they want to do and assuming Pronger is agreeable.

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03-26-2013, 06:30 PM
  #187
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I'm not saying I think it's impossible, but baseball doesn't have a hard cap and the NHL does have a history of punishing teams who they feel circumvented their salary cap. The Ilya Kovalchuk deal comes to mind.

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03-26-2013, 06:33 PM
  #188
Jack de la Hoya
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
If we land the 5th pick and those guys are off the board then I'm going to go with Nurse. I wouldn't trade up or trade back. He's the BPA and just so happens to fit a need.
I think most of us agree with this.

The issue is if we end up 6th or 7th somehow--the top of that second tier of players. That's the only scenario where it might be worth thinking about moving the pick--either to trade back, or swap it for a defenseman a few years into his development (Gormley)

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Old
03-26-2013, 08:29 PM
  #189
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This lose almost guarantees we will be out of the hunt. Trade speculation will now begin to run rampant. Coburn, Mez, Briere(if healthy), Couts all will be in the rumor mill most likely.

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03-26-2013, 08:38 PM
  #190
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Why Couturier? I don't get it. Even Coburn. Moving either does not make much sense. The names that should come up during trade talks are Hartnell, Meszaros, and Fedotenko. This team needs a new coach and more patient management.

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03-26-2013, 08:39 PM
  #191
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Originally Posted by Broad St Cyberbully View Post
For Pronger to come off of LTIR he'd have to be cleared medically to play by team doctors.
The LTIR rules don't make sense to me. If a player isnt able to play physically, then he can't play. Why should a team be handcuffed during the offseason with his contract counting against the cap?

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03-26-2013, 08:41 PM
  #192
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Why Couturier? I don't get it. Even Coburn. Moving either does not make much sense. The names that should come up during trade talks are Hartnell, Meszaros, and Fedotenko. This team needs a new coach and more patient management.
Because he's very valuable. that's why.

I don't want them to trade him either though. agreed

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03-26-2013, 08:42 PM
  #193
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The LTIR rules don't make sense to me. If a player isnt able to play physically, then he can't play. Why should a team be handcuffed during the offseason with his contract counting against the cap?
Because then teams would do as the flyers planned and circumvent the cap signing OLD players to massive deals like this, thats the point. Also protects the player so they dont lose out on money either

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03-26-2013, 08:42 PM
  #194
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The LTIR rules don't make sense to me. If a player isnt able to play physically, then he can't play. Why should a team be handcuffed during the offseason with his contract counting against the cap?
Basically, there are not LTIR rules during the offseason. For cap purposes, every player is presumed able to play at the start of the next season, thus the 10 percent cushion. Otherwise, how do you distinguish between a guy who finished the year on LTIR but projects to be ready for the start of the next season, and a guy who will never play again.

They need to figure out a way to allow compliance buyouts of injured players--perhaps 100 percent of salary instead of 2/3, but full removal of the cap hit.

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Old
03-26-2013, 08:48 PM
  #195
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Because he's very valuable. that's why.

I don't want them to trade him either though. agreed
Is he a more valuable trade asset than Hartnell?

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03-26-2013, 08:49 PM
  #196
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Is he a more valuable trade asset than Hartnell?
Center, two-way play, 20 years old and so on and has a lot more to grow into, yeah, he is worth a lot.

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03-26-2013, 08:56 PM
  #197
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If Bobby Ryan is worth Couturier+, then Hartnell is worth Couturier, maybe a little less.

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03-26-2013, 08:57 PM
  #198
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I'd like to know why it's taking Holmgren so long to blow this mess up. Leave your list of untouchables (Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds, B.Schenn, Couturier, L.Schenn, N.Grossmann) and sell the others off to the highest bidder. Enough is enough of this. Get a head start on the rebuild/retool/whatever anyone wants to call it. And while he's at it, he needs to fire Laviolette. The same uninspired play is enough. It's time to send shockwaves through the roster.

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03-26-2013, 09:01 PM
  #199
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I'd like to know why it's taking Holmgren so long to blow this mess up. Leave your list of untouchables (Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds, B.Schenn, Couturier, L.Schenn, N.Grossmann) and sell the others off to the highest bidder. Enough is enough of this. Get a head start on the rebuild/retool/whatever anyone wants to call it. And while he's at it, he needs to fire Laviolette. The same uninspired play is enough. It's time to send shockwaves through the roster.
So dramatic. This team could be a system change away from being a serious contender.

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03-26-2013, 09:04 PM
  #200
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I'd like to know why it's taking Holmgren so long to blow this mess up. Leave your list of untouchables (Giroux, Voracek, Simmonds, B.Schenn, Couturier, L.Schenn, N.Grossmann) and sell the others off to the highest bidder. Enough is enough of this. Get a head start on the rebuild/retool/whatever anyone wants to call it. And while he's at it, he needs to fire Laviolette. The same uninspired play is enough. It's time to send shockwaves through the roster.
I would love to see lavy gone. But we should keep him til the end of the year to ensure a top 3 pick. Lol

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