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If Not Now, When?

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:49 PM
  #1
BJG
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If Not Now, When?

The consensus here seems to be 'Don't mortgage the future for the present'. I understand that we want to be perennial contenders. But what I don't agree with is the idea that in a year or two everything will fall into place and at that time MB should make a big move.

There are a couple of fundamental problems with this philosophy. First, as we know, there are no guarantees in the future. Sure, our young guys could continue to develop, but what if they don't? And even if they do, some of our current vets will certainly be shadows of their current selves. We have a great mix of rookies, mid-career players and vets right now.

Second problem is essentially the flip-side of the first: There are no guarantees. Here, I mean that even if we do develop into the team that we all hope for with a dominant defensive corps, three high-scoring lines, and size throughout the line-up, we could still face a first- or second-round exit. We've Halaked others and have been Halaked ourselves.

So my question again: If not now, when? When do we make a big move? When we are on the verge of winning the president's cup? When we lead the league in both goals for and against?

If we are a top-5 team in the league, and I think most here will agree we are, then now is as good a time as ever. 'But we would have to get through Boston and Pittsburgh and Chicago', you say. Well only one team wins the cup and if we're within striking distance, we have as a good a shot as anyone.

I suppose the more difficult question would be what move to make. We are almost victims of our own success. We have so much balance that there isn't a gaping need.

Still, if we could grab a Jagr or another impact player (particularly on D, with Diaz' health still a question and where our size could hurt over a long PO run), why not pull the trigger, even if we have to overpay some? Everyone seems obsessed with picks, but I'd rather maximize my chances of winning a cup (yes, now AND in the future), then increase the number of posts praising TT's drafting genius.


Last edited by BJG: 03-28-2013 at 12:28 AM.
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Old
03-27-2013, 11:51 PM
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habsfan88
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I normally don't want to trade any future, but I feel like we were so gifted with Gally and Chuck that we can afford to take that chance this time around. I think our time is veryyy soon boys and girls

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03-27-2013, 11:52 PM
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I've said it before, but to me, it will be when this team has a legit point per game #1 C on the roster.

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03-27-2013, 11:53 PM
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You make a run for it with this team.

Next season, you adjust based on their playoff performance. You add at the deadline to fill in any gaps.

Season three, you should have a perfect idea of what's needed. You might have already won a Cup along the way too.

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03-27-2013, 11:54 PM
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SouthernHab
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You dont need to mortgage the future. Just a little equity loan would do.

One or two moves and that's it.

We need one player for improvement on D. And one player for improvement on the Wing.

And neither has to be a superstar or a player like Iginla.

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:54 PM
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Marc Bergervin isn't trading the future for a quick fix. In Chicago he helped build the team through draft. Don't forget Bergervin might do Lars Eller, 1st, 3x 2nd and 2x 3rds for a top 5 pick.

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:57 PM
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Coming soon. Next year and the years after. We do not have the D to go far in a playoff environment. We still need to be that we have the goaltending to do well. We need some tweaking up front and become bigger. This upcoming draft will turn this franchise around. I know...most of those players will only be there in 2-3 years, yet, we have others who are already there.

With the approrpriate changes, I say that we become real strong contenders for years to come in 2 years from now. I would not mortage the future based on a fake season like we're having right now.

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:58 PM
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The habs imo will be even better next year. Moen and Armstrong are liabilities which we could improve but we shouldn't aim for anything else.

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:02 AM
  #9
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We can't get gready don't forget that teams like Pittsburgh and Boston built strong cores before adding pieces, we have a good core not yet great.

Be patient guys imagine in 3 years when chuckie is 22, gally is 24, Eller is 26, patches is 27, pk is 26 and Carey is 28 they will be a great core to rival with any other add to that the prospects we have now and the incredible 6 top 90 prospects we will add this year that is when you sell picks and a few prospects to go for broke not yet

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:12 AM
  #10
SouthernHab
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfannick View Post
We can't get gready don't forget that teams like Pittsburgh and Boston built strong cores before adding pieces, we have a good core not yet great.

Be patient guys imagine in 3 years when chuckie is 22, gally is 24, Eller is 26, patches is 27, pk is 26 and Carey is 28 they will be a great core to rival with any other add to that the prospects we have now and the incredible 6 top 90 prospects we will add this year that is when you sell picks and a few prospects to go for broke not yet
And Plekanec is getting older, Markov is gone, one of the above could have a season ending injury etc and so on.

Prospects look good on paper and you never know how they will play in the NHL or if they struggle in the AHL like Leblanc.

This season is perfect to take a shot by adding just a couple of players to a very dynamic team.

Go for it Bergevin.

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03-28-2013, 12:14 AM
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" SOON "


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03-28-2013, 12:21 AM
  #12
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One thing that I am confident of is if the habs do trade for a rental... there will be a very good chance that the player resigns with the habs. Marc Bergevin is known to be charming and persuasive. And with the Canadiens becoming an up and coming cup contender, Bergy will have a lot of bargaining chips.

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03-28-2013, 12:21 AM
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Alexdaman
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Originally Posted by McSorleyStick View Post
" SOON "

I'm not sure what you are trying to say, Gainey was a big fan of trading at the deadline for players with PO experience that ended up costing more than the results they brought.

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03-28-2013, 12:27 AM
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SouthernHab
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Smid on the backend.

Clowe at wing.

Let's make a run for it.

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03-28-2013, 12:28 AM
  #15
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Smid on the backend.

Clowe at wing.

Let's make a run for it.
I'd give up futures for those two

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03-28-2013, 12:35 AM
  #16
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
Coming soon. Next year and the years after. We do not have the D to go far in a playoff environment. We still need to be that we have the goaltending to do well. We need some tweaking up front and become bigger. This upcoming draft will turn this franchise around. I know...most of those players will only be there in 2-3 years, yet, we have others who are already there.

With the approrpriate changes, I say that we become real strong contenders for years to come in 2 years from now. I would not mortage the future based on a fake season like we're having right now.
"Fake Season"... hahah.

We're playing with the so-called "contenders" of our conference. The Bruins look like they just got Iginla, so they're the favorites, and we just beat them in a comeback character win. Anything can happen in the playoffs.. We have the picks to spare this year, unlike next year, so why not pick up a guy like Clowe and at least say we tried?

Your goal for every season should be to win the Stanley Cup.. nothing more, nothing less. If you just say "Meh, fake season" or "Next year" you're failing.

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:36 AM
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We were 15th last year.

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03-28-2013, 12:37 AM
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I'd give up futures for those two
Just friggen hand out prospects we know that have low chances of cracking up the lineup.. it's not hard. Now I say this and right away I think of McDonah lol.. The irony..

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03-28-2013, 12:37 AM
  #19
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Originally Posted by Saundies View Post
"Fake Season"... hahah.

We're playing with the so-called "contenders" of our conference. The Bruins look like they just got Iginla, so they're the favorites, and we just beat them in a comeback character win. Anything can happen in the playoffs.. We have the picks to spare this year, unlike next year, so why not pick up a guy like Clowe and at least say we tried?

Your goal for every season should be to win the Stanley Cup.. nothing more, nothing less. If you just say "Meh, fake season" or "Next year" you're failing.
And that mentality is what screwed us in the gainey years... Brought in guys like kaberle and Gomez we aren't in a position to win a cup I'm sorry, yeah okay **** happens but I'm not willing to bet our future years of contending on it

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03-28-2013, 12:39 AM
  #20
Ghetto Sangria
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Just friggen hand out prospects we know that have low chances of cracking up the lineup.. it's not hard. Now I say this and right away I think of McDonah lol.. The irony..
haha well it's not an exact science... but I stand by what I said. I think any rental player the habs get could easily get resigned with Bergy in charge.

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03-28-2013, 12:41 AM
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JohnLennon
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If we have such a bright future, why would we trade future assets for players who might not even make our team better today? Clowe is having an awful season, and he's 30 years old. If we give up more than a second round pick to obtain him, I'll be very upset.

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03-28-2013, 12:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Habsfannick View Post
And that mentality is what screwed us in the gainey years... Brought in guys like kaberle and Gomez we aren't in a position to win a cup I'm sorry, yeah okay **** happens but I'm not willing to bet our future years of contending on it
I don't know what you're talking about with this... Gomez was brought in, along with half of a team pretty much (cammy, gio, etc) after a brutal centennial year and even worse playoff series, and Kaberle traded for Spacek (not a future guy) to try to patch up our powerplay in another year where we weren't even close for a cup. Doesn't really apply for what I'm saying at all.

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:41 AM
  #23
Lafleurs Guy
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Originally Posted by BJG View Post
The consensus here seems to be 'Don't mortgage the future for the present'. I understand that we want to be perennial contenders. But what I don't agree with is the idea that in a year or two everything will fall into place and at that time MB should make a big move.

There are a couple of fundamental problems with this philosophy. First, as we know, there are no guarantees in the future. Sure, our young guys could continue to develop, but what if they don't? And even if they do, some of our current vets will certainly be shadows of their current selves. We have a great mix of rookies, mid-career players and vets right now.

Second problem is essentially the flip-side of the first: There are no guarantees. Here, I mean that even if we do develop into the team that we all hope for with a dominant defensive corps, three high-scoring lines, and size throughout the line-up, we could still face a first- or second-round exit. We've Halaked others and have been Halaked ourselves.

So my question again: If not now, when? When do we make a big move? When we are on the verge of winning the president's cup? When we lead the league in both goals for and against?

If we are a top-5 team in the league, and I think most here will agree we are, then now is as good a time as ever. 'But we would have to get through Boston and Pittsburgh and Chicago', you say. Well only one team wins the cup and if we're within striking distance, we have as a good a shot as anyone.

I suppose the more difficult question would be what move to make. We are almost victims of our own success. We have so much balance that there isn't a gaping need.

Still, if we could grab a Jagr or another impact player (particularly on D, with Diaz' health still a question and where our size could hurt over a long PO run), why not pull the trigger, even if we have to overpay some? Everyone seems obsessed with picks, but I'd rather maximize my chances of winning a cup (yes, now AND in the future), then increase the number of posts praising TT's drafting genius.
I'd rather we just stand pat. The team has developed a hell of a lot faster than we expected but we still have to remember that 30 games isn't a long time to really evaluate. We've played well, no point in messing with the chemistry. This isn't the year to blow a bunch of prospects for a run. Just leave it as is and hope for the best. If we're still great next year we can think about it then. Besides, this is supposed to be a crazy deep draft.

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:43 AM
  #24
SouthernHab
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Originally Posted by Habsfannick View Post
And that mentality is what screwed us in the gainey years... Brought in guys like kaberle and Gomez we aren't in a position to win a cup I'm sorry, yeah okay **** happens but I'm not willing to bet our future years of contending on it
Not to be a stickler but Gauthier brought in Kaberle and we were not even making a playoff run.

Gomez was acquired via trade during the offseason.

Totally different scenarios.

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Old
03-28-2013, 12:43 AM
  #25
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probably in the next 3 years

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