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The 2013 NHL Entry Draft

View Poll Results: What type of player should we draft?
Powerforward [Centre/Winger] 10 5.92%
Two-Way Forward 1 0.59%
Playmaking Centre 8 4.73%
Goalscoring Winger 64 37.87%
Defensive-Defenseman 16 9.47%
Offensive-Defenseman 10 5.92%
Two-Way Defenseman 47 27.81%
Goaler 0 0%
Trade our 1st for an upgrade 4 2.37%
Other [Smallish Character Centres] 9 5.33%
Voters: 169. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-27-2013, 09:47 AM
  #876
AslanRH
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Originally Posted by Av-merican View Post
In a more restrictive cap era where people are still apparently spending like morons, you have to get value out of good, cheap talent. Trading for a guy like Kulikov means you gotta pay him that much sooner.

If this team were very close to contending, sure, I could see it. But not when the team is still rebuilding, the salary cap becomes an issue as early as 2014, and the prospect base is weak. I want to see a GOOD year out of this team before they start taking shortcuts.

I'd be willing to bet you 9 times out of 10 any time a team has traded a high first-rounder for a player, they soon regretted it.
You'll be paying the top 3 pick 3-3.775/yr already. Kulikov will most likely garner similar to EJ on his next RFA deal. probably 4-4.5m is my guess depending on the term. not a ton of savings between either option.

Again, I see the team much closer to the end of a rebuild than most apparently.

I'm not advocating trading the 1st for 1 player unless that player is Elite. I'm advocating adding multiple pieces, 1 of which for sure fills a glaring need while the others either fill a need as well, or add to bulking up the base of young cheaper talent/prospects.

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Old
03-27-2013, 09:54 AM
  #877
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Originally Posted by perry2perry View Post
No way. Have you seen him play? Playing him on the wing is like having Backstrom or Giroux on the wing. He has never played on the wing before this season and he played center at the WJC. He will play center next season with Jarnkrok gone.
IMO Giroux was absolutely great on the wing a couple years ago. I have seen Lindholm play only 4 or 5 times, not a lot so my opinion may not be worth much, but I see his skills working better as a wing at a NHL level. The team that drafts him will probably try him at center first to see if he can handle it, and wing second as wing is less valuable than center.

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03-27-2013, 09:59 AM
  #878
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Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
You'll be paying the top 3 pick 3-3.775/yr already. Kulikov will most likely garner similar to EJ on his next RFA deal. probably 4-4.5m is my guess depending on the term. not a ton of savings between either option.

Again, I see the team much closer to the end of a rebuild than most apparently.

I'm not advocating trading the 1st for 1 player unless that player is Elite. I'm advocating adding multiple pieces, 1 of which for sure fills a glaring need while the others either fill a need as well, or add to bulking up the base of young cheaper talent/prospects.
Again, rebuild done or not, the "cubbard" is almost bare again. We're loaded with a bunch of two-way players and longshots, with a couple potential top-4 defensive prospects sprinkled in. Once Barrie becomes a full-time NHLer, the prospect base is looking very weak.

I'd rather see them trade some of the extraneous pieces on the roster or in the system before they decide to deal valuable picks, even though those won't yield nearly as good a return.

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Old
03-27-2013, 10:01 AM
  #879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
-trading a 1st for another piece (pieces most likely) with a little more established history. Kulikov, Sekera, Nikitin, etc as just quick examples.
I get that those are quick examples but if that's who we're looking at as the main piece, then that's horrible. Kulikov has been wildly inconsistent and is now having issues staying healthy the past two years. Sekera is a steady yet unspectacular #3 guy and Nikitin is going to be 27 and doesn't appear close to repeating his hot streak to end last year.

No team will give up a top flight young defenseman for a high pick. Instead, we'll be stuck taking on someone who we're hoping turns their career around, ala Kulikov. That's just as risky as an unproven prospect.

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Old
03-27-2013, 10:40 AM
  #880
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Anyone who saw Kulikov play during his NHL career would never consider moving a top 3 pick for him.

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Old
03-27-2013, 10:46 AM
  #881
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
You'll be paying the top 3 pick 3-3.775/yr already. Kulikov will most likely garner similar to EJ on his next RFA deal. probably 4-4.5m is my guess depending on the term. not a ton of savings between either option.

Again, I see the team much closer to the end of a rebuild than most apparently.

I'm not advocating trading the 1st for 1 player unless that player is Elite. I'm advocating adding multiple pieces, 1 of which for sure fills a glaring need while the others either fill a need as well, or add to bulking up the base of young cheaper talent/prospects.
Sorry but I think multiple pieces is a very bad idea.
Quantity for quality never works for the team giving up quality.
We are a very bad team right now. A new coach may or may not fix that. But if you think we belong into the playoffs next year, I think you would be wrong.

This draft is very strong. Arguably one of the strongest in the last few years. The way we play right now, we will have a top 5 pick. Maybe even TOP 3. Look at our recent history. Would you have been happy if we traded Duchene for "multiple pieces"?
What about Landeskog? Drouin, Mac and especially Jones are on par or even better prospects than those guys.
I would be so mad if we give up a shot at such a player only to make this team a little better next year.
Sekera, Kulikov and those kind of players are not worth our 1st. Not even close. If you want to trade Stastny or maybe even ROR(if PL gets his way) for them (they would have to add like crazy), maybe we could talk. But our 1st with us being the 2nd worst team right now?
No. Never. Next.

The only way to get a franchise players is through the draft. And the chance this year is particularly high. If we can not keep all of ROR/Stazz/Duchene longterm, deal one of Stazz or ROR for defensive help. But never ever give up a potential Top5 pick in a draft like this. It could haunt you for decades (so could trading ROR but he would only go because of PL)

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Old
03-27-2013, 10:48 AM
  #882
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan13 View Post
Anyone who saw Kulikov play during his NHL career would never consider moving a top 3 pick for him.
This. Kuli is a great target to go after, but he is by no means without warts. If our pick was in the 8-13 range I would look at a Kuli + deal for the pick, but top 7 there is no way I would consider it.

Honestly the best option for getting the top 4 LD that we need is trading one of ROR or Stastny. ROR can't be traded for a while and will still have at least a few RFA years, so you trade Stastny at the draft or deadline this year for a top 4 LD + pick. A #3 center will be easier to find than a young top 4 LD, we might even have one now with Mitchell or if we are running 3 scoring lines again, Sgarbossa.

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Old
03-27-2013, 10:58 AM
  #883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
I get the love and hype of draft picks on HF like an Unopened Christmas present, but

Where is the difference in risk vs benefit between trading and drafting?

-trading a 1st for another piece (pieces most likely) with a little more established history. Kulikov, Sekera, Nikitin, etc as just quick examples.

and

-taking 1 player who may or may not fit a need or have a more immediate impact that has yet to play a pro game

Either option carries certain risks.
Any player drafted could wind up being Hishon 2.0, or Hickey, or could be Kane or Hedman.

I doubt a trade happens, but the argument that we should all consider/accept that a top 5 pick as untradeable makes no sense to me as long as the value coming back is appropriate.

If GMs value top 5 picks as much as HF, a very good package should be easy to obtain.
I generally agree that hf overvalues picks by a good bit, but I don't think it applies to the top five pick well likely be getting. Sure we don't know that the guy we draft will become elite, but we'd be much more confident than if we're banking on kulikov becoming elite.

Trading for one of the names you mentioned is just a hedge. It's a safe play. You can be a middle of the pack/playoff contender that way, but you won't win championships.

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Old
03-27-2013, 11:40 AM
  #884
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Originally Posted by Pierce Hawthorne View Post
Hell, to expand on that, a potential Top 9 down the road that includes:

McGinn - Sgarbossa - Downie

would be nasty.

And then we could move Stastny for a Dman.
hense why I think we should draft Drouin, since Stastny is more likely on the way out for a top 4 dman.

Wingers aren't that available anymore with Perry and Semin signed. Unless Bobby Ryan is available, maybe even Marian Gaborik.

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Old
03-27-2013, 12:06 PM
  #885
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skip2mybordeleau View Post
yeah how about henrik samuelsson ? that was the first oil kings game i saw this year, and lazar looked much better than samuelsson, whom i thought might have looked better at center.
Not a big fan of Samuelsson, he has improved since the last two seasons, but he still a very one dimensional player.

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Old
03-27-2013, 12:07 PM
  #886
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avsfan89 View Post
hense why I think we should draft Drouin, since Stastny is more likely on the way out for a top 4 dman.

Wingers aren't that available anymore with Perry and Semin signed. Unless Bobby Ryan is available, maybe even Marian Gaborik.
You don't draft based on need, but on BPA. If Drouin is the best player available, sure, take him, but if its a center, I'd hope they take him too.

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03-27-2013, 12:10 PM
  #887
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Originally Posted by The Mars Volchenkov View Post
You don't draft based on need, but on BPA. If Drouin is the best player available, sure, take him, but if its a center, I'd hope they take him too.
since they all play different positions, its always going to be up for debate who is the bpa between mac, drouin and jones anyways.

Drouin is the BPA at his pos, same with the others.

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03-27-2013, 12:11 PM
  #888
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The absolute worst case with drafting a center top 5/7 is that they don't begin playing with the Avs until 14-15. So if we keep Duchene, Stastny, and ROR for 13-14 on of Mac, Lindholm, Barkov, and Monahan can all play another year in juniors/Europe if the Avs haven't made room for them yet. So draft BPA regardless of position. If we get a top 2 pick, the BPA just happens to fill an immediate need.

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03-27-2013, 12:41 PM
  #889
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i just don't see a player worth dealing a top 3-5 pick for that warrants moving it. this is a insanely deep draft and our system needs refueling.
the draft pick would cure some ills on the club and give us another young guy to pair up with the youngster we already have and build on with the right coach.

even if we make two moves for nice players that doesn't end the rebuild any quicker. we're still not a top 4-5 team and that's where we need to end up after the rebuild.

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03-27-2013, 02:06 PM
  #890
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For our 2nd rounder, I am curious about whom we grab. 32nd to 34th who shows up there if we grab Drouin first round. Klimchuk, heatherington, de La rose,....

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03-27-2013, 02:07 PM
  #891
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.... Aaaand Barkov injured. Wrist or shoulder. Fell into the boards after hit that was clean.

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03-28-2013, 07:41 AM
  #892
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Top three pick is within our grasps!

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Old
03-28-2013, 08:55 AM
  #893
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AslanRH View Post
Where is the difference in risk vs benefit between trading and drafting?

-trading a 1st for another piece (pieces most likely) with a little more established history. Kulikov, Sekera, Nikitin, etc as just quick examples.

and

-taking 1 player who may or may not fit a need or have a more immediate impact that has yet to play a pro game

Either option carries certain risks.
Any player drafted could wind up being Hishon 2.0, or Hickey, or could be Kane or Hedman.
If there's a chance you can draft next Kane, you draft the next Kane. Someone with quality like Kane is a game changer, a guy who can help you win the Cup few years down the line.

Trading for Kulikov or Sekera wont win us anything, except maybe a top 10 pick next year..

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03-28-2013, 08:59 AM
  #894
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Originally Posted by henchman24 View Post
Honestly the best option for getting the top 4 LD that we need is trading one of ROR or Stastny. ROR can't be traded for a while and will still have at least a few RFA years, so you trade Stastny at the draft or deadline this year for a top 4 LD + pick. A #3 center will be easier to find than a young top 4 LD, we might even have one now with Mitchell or if we are running 3 scoring lines again, Sgarbossa.
I agree with this. And if it's between O'Reilly and Stastny, it wont be O'Reilly who'd leave right now. Radar 13 games this year, 13 points.

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03-28-2013, 01:59 PM
  #895
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Have to wonder how interested we would be in a guy like Elias Lindholm. Arguably the 2nd most dynamic player in the draft along with Drouin. Has a history of playing both W and C. Is a Swede too, which I love. Wouldn't be shocked if he was actually top 3 on many teams lists. Highlights from his rookie SEL season below:


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03-28-2013, 02:06 PM
  #896
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Originally Posted by Renegade Stylings View Post
Have to wonder how interested we would be in a guy like Elias Lindholm. Arguably the 2nd most dynamic player in the draft along with Drouin. Has a history of playing both W and C. Is a Swede too, which I love. Wouldn't be shocked if he was actually top 3 on many teams lists. Highlights from his rookie SEL season below:

The top 5-7 in this draft is absolutely loaded with talent.

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03-28-2013, 02:07 PM
  #897
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Originally Posted by Renegade Stylings View Post
Have to wonder how interested we would be in a guy like Elias Lindholm. Arguably the 2nd most dynamic player in the draft along with Drouin. Has a history of playing both W and C. Is a Swede too, which I love. Wouldn't be shocked if he was actually top 3 on many teams lists. Highlights from his rookie SEL season below:

Damn.... First time really watching any of Lindholm and I am impressed. I see a lot of Forsberg in the way he plays.

Was just watching a Drouin highlight reel, and then watched this one. Personally, Lindholm actually looked better to me. Lindholms game looks like it would transfer to the NHL level a lot easier then Drouin.


But at the same time, after watching this:



it seems like destiny that the Avs are the ones who draft this kid.

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Old
03-28-2013, 02:19 PM
  #898
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I thought someone said he was an Avs fan? Looks like a Blackhawks fan.

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03-28-2013, 02:28 PM
  #899
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Originally Posted by Bubba Thudd View Post
I thought someone said he was an Avs fan? Looks like a Blackhawks fan.
I hope you are being sarcastic . The dude plays for the Portland Winterhawks. They have the same jerseys as the Blackhawks for some reason.

I think Seth has some love for the Dallas Stars, the Avs and I believe I heard something about the Deadwings.

He certainly is not as much of a fan as Duchene was. So in the end it is a nice "feel-good" story but I don't think for a second that this would lead to taking any discount later on or whatsoever.

Unfortunately I even believe that Duchene is or will start seeing this as a business rather sooner than later. Sure you like to play for a great organisation in a great city (preferably one you have ties to or know some people). But we are so far from a great organisation that it really will not matter.

We won't get hometown discounts under the Kroenke/PL regime.

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03-28-2013, 02:30 PM
  #900
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Lindholm definitely has a lot to like but a lot of those highlights make me wary that with less time and space in the NHL, he might hold on to the puck too long in the corner and behind the net and would get closed off fairly easily. Some of those dipsy doodle moves at the blueline are barely working in the SEL too, and that scares me in terms of knee or concussion type injuries in the NHL.

He could vary well adjust, but it was just something that caught my attention a little more than with other prospects.

As much as Drouin likes to make dipsy doodle fancy plays too, he seems to be much more aware of his surroundings, and is more elusive. Also makes a lot of quick heads up little passes in tight.

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