HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Central Division > St. Louis Blues
Notices

Blues Trade Proposals - Part 5

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-28-2013, 10:49 PM
  #351
Bluesman91
Registered User
 
Bluesman91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,610
vCash: 2357
Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Players will be moving at the draft. Kerber said Chase Perron was yelled at by at least 4 players on the bench for not doing something.

Move picks and prospects for the defenseman, and package Perron and Berglund for the center. Maybe we could put something together for Backstrom. Honestly, none of the forwards besides Tarasenko and Schwartz should be off limits. I'm not saying blow it up, but we need to actually get a top forward and we need to add that defenseman.
This is what I said during the Blues first losing stretch. This core is not enough. We cannot keep playing moneyball running a bunch of lines with 2-4th line players. This core has not worked for some time now. It's time to see one of Perron, Berglund, or Oshie to go.

Bluesman91 is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 10:51 PM
  #352
bleedblue1223
OMAHA!!!
 
bleedblue1223's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 19,820
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman91 View Post
This is what I said during the Blues first losing stretch. This core is not enough. We cannot keep playing moneyball running a bunch of lines with 2-4th line players. This core has not worked for some time now. It's time to see one of Perron, Berglund, or Oshie to go.
I wouldn't be surprised if more than one go. None of them are at where we need them to be.

bleedblue1223 is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 10:58 PM
  #353
superblues
I'm being sarcastic.
 
superblues's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,627
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if more than one go. None of them are at where we need them to be.
As long as they go east or wherever they can do the least amount of damage to us in the new realignment.

superblues is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:01 PM
  #354
TheOrganist
Don't Call Him Alex
 
TheOrganist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,872
vCash: 500
Chase hates Perron. I was at the game and that line was the best by a mile.

TheOrganist is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:06 PM
  #355
bleedblue1223
OMAHA!!!
 
bleedblue1223's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 19,820
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOrganist View Post
Chase hates Perron. I was at the game and that line was the best by a mile.
I was there too and none of the lines were that great. It's just an example of the little things.

bleedblue1223 is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:09 PM
  #356
TheOrganist
Don't Call Him Alex
 
TheOrganist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
I was there too and none of the lines were that great. It's just an example of the little things.
Yes, "great" is relative but they created. I didn't see anything noticeably absent in Perron's game as far as details of the game are concerned.

TheOrganist is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:15 PM
  #357
BlueDream
Registered User
 
BlueDream's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 6,705
vCash: 500
It was probably that idiotic penalty he took once again.

I agree he was fine tonight but I think his trade value is why his name keeps coming up around here. I'd much rather see McDonald go but he's an old pending UFA with injury concerns.

BlueDream is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:41 PM
  #358
stlblues9
Registered User
 
stlblues9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,664
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman91 View Post
This is what I said during the Blues first losing stretch. This core is not enough. We cannot keep playing moneyball running a bunch of lines with 2-4th line players. This core has not worked for some time now. It's time to see one of Perron, Berglund, or Oshie to go.
Name one team that has won a cup with a core thats as young as the Blues currently have.

stlblues9 is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:44 PM
  #359
ExJbeck
Registered User
 
ExJbeck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,386
vCash: 50
From Chip McCleary @ hockeybuzz

Quote:
If there was any belief still out there that maybe this team could get it together and contend for a Cup this season, the Kings did a fine job of showing how high the bar is going to be set to come play - and the Blues showed they're miles away from that point. Trading for the playoffs this season? Please ... this team has a lot of stuff to fix internally first; there's no sense wasting resources on a playoff run this year. Tonight was playoff hockey, and the Blues at times looked every bit like the 2009 team that was quickly swept out by Vancouver.
Pretty interesting decisions looming for DA. I still believe this team has the potential to win the cup. But do I think this team will play to its potential? I wish I was confident enough to say yes. Trading is definitely going to me more costly now than in the off-season, but we can't ignore that this team can play better and there is still time left in the season. Man this sucks.

ExJbeck is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:48 PM
  #360
Bluesman91
Registered User
 
Bluesman91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,610
vCash: 2357
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
Name one team that has won a cup with a core thats as young as the Blues currently have.
LA Kings. They are/were at 26 years old just as us.

Forgot to add the Bruins as well with

Krejci: 24
Bergeron: 25
Marchand: 22
Horton: 25
Lucic: 22
Seguin: 19
Chara: 34
Seidenberg: 29


Last edited by Bluesman91: 03-28-2013 at 11:55 PM.
Bluesman91 is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:51 PM
  #361
BadgersandBlues
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 602
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
Name one team that has won a cup with a core that's as young as the Blues currently have.
Pitt in 09 probably. Not really a fair example though, since they had two of the best players in the world, which is not what we have.

For funsies:

Crosby 21
Malkin 22
Letang 21
Fleury 24
Goligoski 23
Staal 20
Talbot 24
Orpik 28

BadgersandBlues is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:55 PM
  #362
Boromir Jagr*
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Country: Canada
Posts: 199
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
Name one team that has won a cup with a core thats as young as the Blues currently have.


even younger!

Boromir Jagr* is offline  
Old
03-28-2013, 11:59 PM
  #363
Bluesman91
Registered User
 
Bluesman91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,610
vCash: 2357
So basically the past 4 cup winners.

Bluesman91 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:02 AM
  #364
BlueDream
Registered User
 
BlueDream's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 6,705
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman91 View Post
So basically the past 4 cup winners.
Pretty much.

BlueDream is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:04 AM
  #365
BadgersandBlues
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 602
vCash: 500
Wow I feel worse now lol.

BadgersandBlues is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:47 AM
  #366
PocketNines
Only a 2 year window
 
PocketNines's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Crested Butte, CO
Posts: 9,298
vCash: 50
Armstrong should trade McDonald for whatever he can get. If it's a 4th rounder so be it. This isn't a contending year in any way shape or form, this is a one-and done year. Moves should not be rental moves. They should be core moves or nothing.

Berglund's AAV needs to be around 3.5M, and Stewart's no higher than 4.2M. Petro's no higher than 6M, Shattenkirk's no higher than 4.5M.

PocketNines is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:50 AM
  #367
Bluesman91
Registered User
 
Bluesman91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,610
vCash: 2357
Berglund honestly shouldn't get anything more than 2.5

Bluesman91 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 12:59 AM
  #368
2 Minute Minor
Hi Keeba!
 
2 Minute Minor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Temple, Texas
Country: United States
Posts: 7,140
vCash: 714
I think Armstrong has to make a move of some kind, even if its not an ideal trade. Even a mediocre rental on D. SOMETHING to shake the team up a bit and give them a sense that there is support.

I saw effort tonight, but I also saw a team that doesn't look to have a higher gear to get to.

I'd be pretty happy if they got Regehr, as long as the price isn't high, and its not because I think Regehr is going to be some miracle cure. As a fan right now, I need some kind of token move to show that they're trying to make this team better.

2 Minute Minor is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 01:51 AM
  #369
Multimoodia
Sicker Than Usual
 
Multimoodia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: The Range
Posts: 1,784
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by bleedblue1223 View Post
Players will be moving at the draft. Kerber said Chase Perron was yelled at by at least 4 players on the bench for not doing something.
I suspect it was the penalty.

That said: Chase is an utter moron who I am surprised can understand any type of speech. He spends all his time away from announcing pissing about several players because they do not hit, fight, etc. thus sounding like St. Louis' own version on Don Cherry.
Anything he says vis a vis for Perron, Schwartz, etc. I take with an entire container of salt.

Quote:
Move picks and prospects for the defenseman, and package Perron and Berglund for the center. Maybe we could put something together for Backstrom. Honestly, none of the forwards besides Tarasenko and Schwartz should be off limits. I'm not saying blow it up, but we need to actually get a top forward and we need to add that defenseman.
Honestly?
At this point I see no reason to do so. The Blues are not a #1 forward and a #2 left defenseman away. They are further than that and thus moving said players at the deadline would mean overpaying.

They're not going anywhere in the playoffs. They might not even make the playoffs.

Armstrong is going to have some awfully, awfully difficult decisions to make this offseason.

Multimoodia is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:14 AM
  #370
stlblues9
Registered User
 
stlblues9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,664
vCash: 50
Over the age of 25, St. Louis currently has
Backes-28
Mcdonald-35
Oshie-26
Sobotka -25
Steen-29
Stewart-25
Nichol-30
Jackman-32
Polak-26
Russel-25
Halak-27
1 top 4 d, 5 top 9 forwards, 2 players with finals experience, 1 Cup winner, 1 with Olympic finals experience

LA
Brown-27
Carter-27
Gagne-31
Penner-29
Richards-26
Stoll-29
Williams-30
Greene-28
Mitchell-34
Scuderi-33
Quick-26
2 top 4 d, 7 top 9 forwards, 4 Olympic finals experience(Doughty included), 9 players with Stanley Cup finals experience, 4 players with Cup rings

Boston
Bergeron-25
Horton-25
Kelly-30
Peverly-28
Recchi-42
Ryder-30
Campbell-27
Chara-33
Ference-31
Siedenberg-29
Kaberle-32
Boychuk-27
Stuart-26
4 top 4 d (1 Norris winner), 5 top 9 forwards, 1 Olympic finals, 3 cup finals, 2 with rings

Chicago
Hossa-31
Kopecky-27
Madden-36
Sharp-28
Campbell-30
Kieth-26
Sopel-33
Niemi-26
1 top 2 d (Norris winner), 3 top 9 forwards, 4 Olympic finals (Toews, Kane, Seabrook included) 4 Cup finals, 2 players with rings

Pittsburgh
Cooke-30
Dupuis-29
Guerin-38
Kunitz-29
Satan-34
Fedetenko-30
Sykora-32
Eaton-31
Gonchar-34
Orpik-28
Scuderi-30
Sydor-36
3 top 4, 4 or 5 top 9, Pittsburgh had gone to the Cup finals the year before so pretty much the whole team had finals experience, 3 Cup winners, plus 2 players that were top 3 players in the world at the time

St. Louis doesn't have this mix of youth and experience yet. Last year they had players like Arnott, Langenbrunner and Huskins and look how well they did. Now those weren't their top players but you can't underestimate the leadership they brought to the dressing room. St. Louis' top 2 D are both still very young and 2 of their expected impact players are still rookies. I just personally think it's stupid to trade some of the core until you know exactly which players are going to fit and which ones aren't. Wait a couple years until Tarasenko and Schwartz get to where Perron, Oshie and Berglund are. By then we should have Jaskin ready to jump in, Rattie should be ready, we know which current prospects are going to be able to make the jump. It allows you to make a more informed decision of which ones to trade for those key veteran pieces.

stlblues9 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:19 AM
  #371
Bluesman91
Registered User
 
Bluesman91's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,610
vCash: 2357
The problem is most of those players on those teams aren't part of their cores but ours are.

Bluesman91 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:30 AM
  #372
stlblues9
Registered User
 
stlblues9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,664
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman91 View Post
The problem is most of those players on those teams aren't part of their cores but ours are.
I would say most of LA and Boston is but that's my point. Wait until we know exactly what the core is going to be. Wait until we know whether Jaskin and Rattie are going to take someones spot. These players are still young, they aren't going to just fall apart and completely lose their game. In a couple years a package of Perron + Rattie + first could bring back a very good player. St. Louis isn't going to be able to keep everyone on their current roster, plus the players that are expected to come in so don't force a trade now. Time is on our side. St. Louis has the ability to wait a few years until the core hits their prime. Then, when the Blues have an overabundance of NHL quality players, ship a package for an all-star instead of just a regular first liner.

stlblues9 is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 02:32 AM
  #373
Blue Goose
"Hockey Transplant"
 
Blue Goose's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 374
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PocketNines View Post
Armstrong should trade McDonald for whatever he can get. If it's a 4th rounder so be it. This isn't a contending year in any way shape or form, this is a one-and done year. Moves should not be rental moves. They should be core moves or nothing.
I agree. Not to come off like a biased homer, but I think we can get more than a 4th for Andy. I do think that moving him should be a serious consideration at this point, and I even made a thread in the main room: http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/sh....php?t=1387587

Everyone seems to think that Andy is going to walk. Yes, I know how he would help our chances in the playoffs, but his production can be replaced. Also, his past playoff performances should help garner some interest in him at the deadline.

Many people seem to think that Andy will return to Anaheim as a UFA, but that they might want him now to play with Selanne for this Cup run (in case Teemu retires). Therefore, even if they are in our conference, I think they would likely offer the best package - the Eastern teams who may kick the tires (Bruins, Rangers, Hurricanes - just guesses on my part) would likely only view him as a rental and offer picks, whereas Anaheim may see him as a Duck long-term and could offer a solid prospect.

The Ducks have great center depth, so I chose Chris Wagner - since it seemed like Holland, Rakell and Cramarossa are off-limits, and those three (along with Getzlaf's contract, etc.) could keep Wagner from ever really cementing a decent roster spot at Center with that team. A couple of the Ducks fans seemed okay with the trade proposal, so I thought I might have been on to something with my line of thinking.

Here's a good write-up on Wagner, in which he's referred to as a playmaker who's strong defensively and good in the faceoff circle (even the fans in the Comments section say that he could be expendable):

http://www.anaheimcalling.com/2012/9...t-chris-wagner


Last edited by Blue Goose: 03-29-2013 at 03:01 AM.
Blue Goose is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 08:45 AM
  #374
Multimoodia
Sicker Than Usual
 
Multimoodia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: The Range
Posts: 1,784
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by stlblues9 View Post
I just personally think it's stupid to trade some of the core until you know exactly which players are going to fit and which ones aren't. Wait a couple years until Tarasenko and Schwartz get to where Perron, Oshie and Berglund are. By then we should have Jaskin ready to jump in, Rattie should be ready, we know which current prospects are going to be able to make the jump. It allows you to make a more informed decision of which ones to trade for those key veteran pieces.
The problem with this is that the Blues may not be able to financially wait that long...Likely cannot really.


The vicious part of me wants to ask "What makes you think year 6 will be any different than year 5 for the core" but I also know that's the cynical part that refers to the Blues as the Cubs of the NHL...

Multimoodia is offline  
Old
03-29-2013, 09:05 AM
  #375
Alklha
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 7,204
vCash: 50
I don't understand the basis of blowing it up after 30-odd games. If we miss the playoffs? Sure. If we get our ass handed to us in the playoffs? Sure.

In the summer, it might be best to trade multiple parts of the "core", but we don't know that yet. What we do know with 100% certainly is that 1 player needs to go. That is one of Perron, Oshie, Backes and Berglund.

Alklha is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:56 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.