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2013 Draft Discussion (Mar. 29 article, post #976)

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03-29-2013, 10:06 AM
  #976
MiamiScreamingEagles
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Article: Flyers scout for the future

http://www.courierpostonline.com/art...for-the-future

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PHILADELPHIA — The draft board that Flyers director of hockey operations Chris Pryor keeps in his Wells Fargo Center office is updated every week based on meetings with his scouting staff. More so than most years, he's been zeroing in on names at the very top of his rankings, which list 150 or so of the top players eligible for the 2013 NHL Draft.

That's the bittersweet reward Pryor could get if the Flyers don't finish the season strong and end up where they are now - near the bottom of the league standings.

"Right now is such a hard time to be excited because we're all in this to win and we're going through a little bit of a tough time," Pryor said. "But on a whole separate side there's a group of players in this draft that you get excited about and if we happen to be picking in a certain place, we're high on a small group of players."

This year's seven-round draft, which will be held from start to finish June 30 in Newark, includes at least three players scouts are drooling over - near-consensus No. 1 Seth Jones, a big do-it-all Western Hockey League defenseman for the Portland Winterhawks; and two high-scoring linemates for the Halifax Mooseheads in the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League, center Nathan MacKinnon and left wing Jonathan Drouin.

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03-29-2013, 10:13 AM
  #977
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MiamiScreamingEagles View Post
From what I can read from him (obviously things change easily) but if we cant get the big three, the #4 pick might be Barkov or Nurse.

Im glad to read that. Was really hoping they didnt go all "Duncan Siemens" with taking a lesser player higher like they almost did.

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03-29-2013, 10:15 AM
  #978
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Originally Posted by RoDu View Post
got a better idea, get Jones with first, hold on to the Schenns and Coutts, let our prospects develop and not ship them out
That's just crazy talk! We must act NOW!!!

Seriously, though, I think now is when the Flyers scouts really need to earn their salaries and, besides doing their homework on the draft-eligibles all the way through the 7 rounds, also have extensive notes on some of the potential breakout defensemen with other clubs. Lesser deals that wouldn't involve the Flyers' top young talent but that would return a more NHL-ready Dman with significant upside would be an important strategy.

Holmgren has a good young potential power forward in McGinn (for example) and Cousins is high projected as a scoring, agitating forward. What if he turned one/both of them into equivalent-talent defensemen?

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03-29-2013, 10:18 AM
  #979
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Originally Posted by Codith View Post
Still would rather have 2 of jones/Mac/Drouin over couts
That's great but no one will trade one of the top three picks for Couturier.

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03-29-2013, 10:21 AM
  #980
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
From what I can read from him (obviously things change easily) but if we cant get the big three, the #4 pick might be Barkov or Nurse.

Im glad to read that. Was really hoping they didnt go all "Duncan Siemens" with taking a lesser player higher like they almost did.
This is from 2010 but be prepared for the McNabb references in every associated article if Nurse is the pick.

http://www.thehockeynews.com/article...ell-Nurse.html

Quote:
He’s No. 25 on the Flyers, he’s a big blueliner who can skate and lord help you if you get near his goaltender. Chris Pronger? Not quite. Not yet, at least.

But defenseman Darnell Nurse of the Don Mills Flyers does study Philly’s Nastiest whenever he can. At nearly 6-foot-4 and 176 pounds, Nurse isn’t quite Pronger’s size, but give the kid some time: he’s only 15.

“He’s a pretty imposing guy, with his size and the way he moves on the ice,” said Don Mills coach Bob Marshall.

A top prospect for this year’s Ontario League draft, Nurse comes from an impressively athletic family. His father, Richard, was a wide receiver for the Canadian Football League’s Hamilton Tiger-Cats in the 1990s, while older sister Tamika played NCAA basketball at Oregon and Bowling Green. So why hockey instead of football?

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03-29-2013, 10:40 AM
  #981
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we all have an opinion on what the correct way to fix this team is... my dream scenario is for the whole front office (ed snider as well) and coaching to be canned and for something different with new vision to come in and build this team a different way with a different strategy... not that any of that will happen but if it did i wouldn't be close to getting mad about dealing anyone on this team. Schenn/Schenn/Couturier etc... Flyer fans and especially flyers fans on the HF board feel ashamed/embarrassed with the crazy moves holmgren has made and thats why there is a certain sensitivity regarding the new young guys and dealing them. You fix your mistakes and do whatever you can do to get better and if that means we turn around and trade a promising player like schenn/couturier you do it... I'm not attached to the schenns or couturier... i feel there is 4 guys in this draft that have more talent/skill and fill the flyers needs long term better... is couturier a poor skater? does he lack a strong physical game? i would say yes on both... while it's true that early on in his young career he's shown flashes of a good shot and the ability to play up to guys that are over his skill level, it's not enough for me to be sold on him.... just the way i see it

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03-29-2013, 11:03 AM
  #982
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
That's great but no one will trade one of the top three picks for Couturier.
I know this that is why I said we would have to add

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03-29-2013, 11:22 AM
  #983
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good article

one error, nurse from the whl. think they were still referring to jones in the dub. anyways, i would love jones,mac or drouin. the thing with jones is he would allow our new coach to set up an effective system that we could roll with develop it based upon what we have as a roster. big strong dmen schenn,grossmann,lauridson then the guys who can skate coburn,kimmo for this year anyways. and in a few years, ghost. then we have to part with mez, i like the guy, but he is made of glass. so add a guy to replace him. so either jones or nurse is exactly what we need on the back end. and forwards if we add mac or drouin, then the coach can figure out the system. but if we do add one of these two and bring up laughton we just have increased our speed up front. and 5 on 5 i would put drouin or mac on the 2nd line, not the giroux line. so in general we are pretty rich, and gonna get richer after the draft,off season. things are not that bad people, really. and we are still pretty darn young.

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03-29-2013, 12:00 PM
  #984
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Originally Posted by Snotbubbles View Post
I'm just as intrigued with the possibility of landing MacKinnon or Drouin and then using one of B. Schenn or S. Couturier in a package for a potential #1 type guy further along in their developement.
But if you get Drouin or MacKinnon, are they ready this year? Hell no, they might make a small splash, but you're better off bringing up Couturier/Laughton/MacKinnon etc together... no need to move schenn or couturier... people are freaking out about their games, but the reality is this is what should have happened last year and since we did so well everyone thinks this year would be better... these kids are young, give them time!

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03-29-2013, 12:24 PM
  #985
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Originally Posted by Brozgalov View Post
But if you get Drouin or MacKinnon, are they ready this year? Hell no, they might make a small splash, but you're better off bringing up Couturier/Laughton/MacKinnon etc together... no need to move schenn or couturier... people are freaking out about their games, but the reality is this is what should have happened last year and since we did so well everyone thinks this year would be better... these kids are young, give them time!
Patrick Kane put up 72 points as a 19 year old rookie. I think Drouin or MacKinnon could do the same in the right circumstances.

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03-29-2013, 12:49 PM
  #986
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
Patrick Kane put up 72 points as a 19 year old rookie. I think Drouin or MacKinnon could do the same in the right circumstances.
Patrick Kane was the consensus #1 overall for over a year prior to his draft. Which of Drouin and MacKinnon can say the same? Both are fantastic prospects but to compare either one to Kane is a bit much IMO. For MacK, Taylor Hall isn't a bad comparison and for Drouin I think the Giroux comparisons are fitting.

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03-29-2013, 12:55 PM
  #987
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Patrick Kane was the consensus #1 overall for over a year prior to his draft. Which of Drouin and MacKinnon can say the same? Both are fantastic prospects but to compare either one to Kane is a bit much IMO. For MacK, Taylor Hall isn't a bad comparison and for Drouin I think the Giroux comparisons are fitting.
Not really. The draft was noted how there was no real stand out star prospect, and Kane/JvR/Turris were considered really, really close.

Kane only slightly took over as the draft neared.

I think Jones and MacKinnon are better prospects than Kane, and Drouin is on the same level.

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03-29-2013, 12:58 PM
  #988
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Kane wasn't even a lock to make the NHL his rookie year. Many thought Chicago would send him back to London for another year.

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03-29-2013, 01:00 PM
  #989
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
Kane wasn't even a lock to make the NHL his rookie year. Many thought Chicago would send him back to London for another year.
What Kane did as a 18-19 year old is truly remarkable and a sign of the "new" nhl. Can you imagine a kid that size playing against men in the early 90's?

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03-29-2013, 01:02 PM
  #990
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Patrick Kane was the consensus #1 overall for over a year prior to his draft. Which of Drouin and MacKinnon can say the same? Both are fantastic prospects but to compare either one to Kane is a bit much IMO. For MacK, Taylor Hall isn't a bad comparison and for Drouin I think the Giroux comparisons are fitting.
The Kane draft was one of the worst drafts in a long time, he had no one to compete with. This year 4 guys legitimately could be #1. Drouin and Mac both make a splash next year so long as they aren't stuck on a terrible team like the Flames. Both are too good to go back to junior.

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03-29-2013, 01:13 PM
  #991
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What Kane did as a 18-19 year old is truly remarkable and a sign of the "new" nhl. Can you imagine a kid that size playing against men in the early 90's?
Yeah obviously people were wrong there. I honestly think Drouin would be better suited for the AHL for next year but with the agreement he can only play in Juniors if not the NHL. So you'll see him in the NHL more than likely next year because he's not getting challenged in Juniors.

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03-29-2013, 01:19 PM
  #992
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Patrick Kane was the consensus #1 overall for over a year prior to his draft. Which of Drouin and MacKinnon can say the same? Both are fantastic prospects but to compare either one to Kane is a bit much IMO. For MacK, Taylor Hall isn't a bad comparison and for Drouin I think the Giroux comparisons are fitting.
Kane was the consensus #1 overall in a terrible draft. There is no consensus #1 in this draft because it's loaded with talent.

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03-29-2013, 01:28 PM
  #993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Codith View Post
The Kane draft was one of the worst drafts in a long time, he had no one to compete with. This year 4 guys legitimately could be #1. Drouin and Mac both make a splash next year so long as they aren't stuck on a terrible team like the Flames. Both are too good to go back to junior.
Umm... Patrick Kane scored 62 goals and 145 points in 58 games in the OHL during his draft year. Please, tell me which prospect in this draft is comparable to that?

Drouin was literally outside the top 5 going into this year. Heck, he was 10th in the first ISS rankings of the year. To say he's going to make a significant contribution in his first year is absolutely silly, as is saying he's a guaranteed star. He has a ton of potential, but worth trading away multiple assets for? Absolutely not. I'd be happy to take him or MacK with our pick if Jones is off the board, but trading Couturier++ for him? Heck no.

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03-29-2013, 01:54 PM
  #994
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Patrick Kane was the consensus #1 overall for over a year prior to his draft. Which of Drouin and MacKinnon can say the same? Both are fantastic prospects but to compare either one to Kane is a bit much IMO. For MacK, Taylor Hall isn't a bad comparison and for Drouin I think the Giroux comparisons are fitting.
I don't really remember it that way. Chicago made it clear early on that they wanted Kane but otherwise I remember some discussion about who could go number 1. Some late pre-draft rankings:

ISS had our very own Jake at #1, Kane #2: http://oilers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=429906

NHL Central Scouting had Turris #1, Kane #2, JVR #3: http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=prospects

Leading up to the draft I don't recall anyone being as clear the top pick as Jones is now.

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03-29-2013, 01:55 PM
  #995
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Wasn't there an article on espn earlier this year saying how Philly would be a great fit for Seth Jones?

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03-30-2013, 12:27 AM
  #996
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Originally Posted by BillyShoe1721 View Post
Kane was the consensus #1 overall in a terrible draft. There is no consensus #1 in this draft because it's loaded with talent.
Flyers got so hosed in that draft.....what a terrible year to suck. Hopefully this draft is like the 2003 draft class..

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03-30-2013, 07:12 AM
  #997
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Originally Posted by OccupySouthBroadSt View Post
Flyers got so hosed in that draft.....what a terrible year to suck. Hopefully this draft is like the 2003 draft class..
Maybe Bettman has a little David Stern in him and will help the Flyers in this draft. I wonder how the league views Seth Jones. If they view him as a potential mainstream media darling that could make inroads with the African American community (not likely IMO), where would they want him to end up? Not Canada for one. I would think a major U.S. city at least and preferably on the east coast where there are major media markets. Current bottom four of the Draft: Florida, Colorado, Philadelphia, Calgary. Colorado would be a decent choice except its Mountain time and those two hours later would hurt Jones exposure with the national media stationed in the East. I could see the league hoping for Jones to end up in Philly, since its in the east coast megalopolis and has a huge national following. Its just a matter if hope leads to action.

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03-30-2013, 07:22 AM
  #998
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackStraw View Post
I don't really remember it that way. Chicago made it clear early on that they wanted Kane but otherwise I remember some discussion about who could go number 1. Some late pre-draft rankings:

ISS had our very own Jake at #1, Kane #2: http://oilers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=429906

NHL Central Scouting had Turris #1, Kane #2, JVR #3: http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slug=prospects

Leading up to the draft I don't recall anyone being as clear the top pick as Jones is now.
Thank you for tracking down this info. I remember that year and reading about the prospects and I knew Kane was NOT the consensus #1 pick for a year leading up to the draft but was too lazy to look it up. I wish people would stop making statements like this.

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03-30-2013, 07:34 AM
  #999
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Originally Posted by Psuhockey View Post
Maybe Bettman has a little David Stern in him and will help the Flyers in this draft. I wonder how the league views Seth Jones. If they view him as a potential mainstream media darling that could make inroads with the African American community (not likely IMO), where would they want him to end up? Not Canada for one. I would think a major U.S. city at least and preferably on the east coast where there are major media markets. Current bottom four of the Draft: Florida, Colorado, Philadelphia, Calgary. Colorado would be a decent choice except its Mountain time and those two hours later would hurt Jones exposure with the national media stationed in the East. I could see the league hoping for Jones to end up in Philly, since its in the east coast megalopolis and has a huge national following. Its just a matter if hope leads to action.
When has Bettman or NHL officials ever cared about the Flyers? I must be missing something here because I thought we are hated by most.

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03-30-2013, 07:37 AM
  #1000
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Originally Posted by WeekendAtBernies View Post
Umm... Patrick Kane scored 62 goals and 145 points in 58 games in the OHL during his draft year. Please, tell me which prospect in this draft is comparable to that?
You're trying to prove you know what you're talking about, and you're not doing a very good job of it.

Kane wasn't even thought to be the best player on his team, at the start of his draft year. Scouts had Gagner rated higher. Then, Kane started to get a little exposure, as well as Voracek, and the hype machine started gaining momentum for players like JVR and Turris, who were billed as the next Nash, and Yzerman, respectively.

Quote:
GAGNER TOPS CENTRAL SCOUTING LIST:

The National Hockey League's preliminary ranking of players eligible for the 2007 NHL draft has been released and the top three OHL players are not surprising.

London Knights rookies Sam Gagner and Patrick Kane are ranked first and third while Ottawa 67's forward Logan Couture is sandwiched in between.

All three players have had strong seasons, though Couture has struggled a bit of late after battling through a bout of mono early on in the season. Gagner and Kane have surprised some people as the two are among the league's scoring leaders.
link

Quote:
Preliminary discussions with NHL scouts indicate that this year's first-round draft crop looks like one of the weakest in the past decade.

"I'm not really excited about this draft right now after seeing Ontario (the past few weeks)...the OHL is brutal prospect-wise this season," noted one scout, who is off to Halifax to concentrate on the Quebec league standouts for a couple of weeks, including Jakub Voracek of the Halifax Mooseheads, rated first overall in McKeen's preliminary rankings for the 2007 draft.

The scout is not alone in being a little less enthusiastic about this year's group of forwards than recent draft classes that yielded the likes of the Staals, Johnsons, Malkin, Ovechkin and Crosby.

"There just aren't a lot of guys jumping out at you, a lot of top end forwards like last year and the years before that," admitted another scout. "But it's early on...there's lots of hockey to be played yet."
link

There should be a policy for banning posters that blatantly post garbage.

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