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Biggest problem

View Poll Results: What is the MAIN reason for the Rangers struggling this year?
Rich and Gabs 97 43.50%
Cally's a loser and/or bad cpt 1 0.45%
Lundqvist 2 0.90%
The D 5 2.24%
Optional practices 0 0%
Torts 70 31.39%
FA losses and inadquate FA/prospect replacements (mostly 3rd/4thline) 30 13.45%
Nash Trade 6 2.69%
Other 12 5.38%
Voters: 223. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
03-31-2013, 02:02 AM
  #51
Holocene
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All of it. Nothing is going right. This should be a multiple choice poll lol.

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Old
03-31-2013, 05:01 AM
  #52
Esa 10
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Voted for Other since there's oddly no category for Glen Sather. He's responsible for:

1. Horrendous Pro Scouting which led to yet another awful summer of UFA activity that produced

2. A gutted bottom 6 up front.

3. No D with a hard shot from the point who can hit the net. It's been almost 10 years since Leetch was traded. A blind monkey should luck out in finding one through UFA, trades, draft over all this time. Obviously not one on Brian's overall level. Other teams have 3rd pairing guys with that skillset. Not in NY.

4. Mediocre Amateur Scouting. This team has no NHL ready guys on ELC who can fill in on 3/4th lines. The last one this team produced was lost on waivers. What's going on in rounds 3-7? This is without even getting into the major 1st round blunders throughout his tenure.

5. Retaining a coaching staff whose tactics were solved by last year's play-offs and have nothing new to offer this season. The PP has never worked under Torts, regardless of personnel, yet they won't hire a PP coach. 20-25 games into a season should've been long enough to see what's happening.

6. No general plan of action in close to 15 years.

Sure, a misfiring one-dimensional 1st line sniper (put in an unfamiliar position by a stubborn coach) and a bumbling out-of-shape 1st line C who may be losing it are going to put pressure on any team. Others though overcome adversity like losing a real star Center and a Norris D for the season through intelligent coaching and organizational depth. Neither are here because of Sather.

Since you can't fire an owner, the buck should stop with President/GM.

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Old
03-31-2013, 06:20 AM
  #53
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Too many "JAM" posts.

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Old
03-31-2013, 06:26 AM
  #54
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Torts. It's on him for changing Gabby from RW to LW, which is the reason why he's been under performing imo. And it's him that keep on playing Richards on the PP even though he is ****ing killing it.

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Old
03-31-2013, 06:30 AM
  #55
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Watched the players on the bench last night. Time for a new coach...

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Old
03-31-2013, 06:48 AM
  #56
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Rich and Gabs is the obvious answer - we can't score, and these two are the biggest underachievers.

It was probably a bad call by management to expect Richards to be a number one guy at this point in his career.

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Old
03-31-2013, 06:55 AM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
Voted for Other since there's oddly no category for Glen Sather. He's responsible for:

1. Horrendous Pro Scouting which led to yet another awful summer of UFA activity that produced

2. A gutted bottom 6 up front.

3. No D with a hard shot from the point who can hit the net. It's been almost 10 years since Leetch was traded. A blind monkey should luck out in finding one through UFA, trades, draft over all this time. Obviously not one on Brian's overall level. Other teams have 3rd pairing guys with that skillset. Not in NY.

4. Mediocre Amateur Scouting. This team has no NHL ready guys on ELC who can fill in on 3/4th lines. The last one this team produced was lost on waivers. What's going on in rounds 3-7? This is without even getting into the major 1st round blunders throughout his tenure.

5. Retaining a coaching staff whose tactics were solved by last year's play-offs and have nothing new to offer this season. The PP has never worked under Torts, regardless of personnel, yet they won't hire a PP coach. 20-25 games into a season should've been long enough to see what's happening.

6. No general plan of action in close to 15 years.

Sure, a misfiring one-dimensional 1st line sniper (put in an unfamiliar position by a stubborn coach) and a bumbling out-of-shape 1st line C who may be losing it are going to put pressure on any team. Others though overcome adversity like losing a real star Center and a Norris D for the season through intelligent coaching and organizational depth. Neither are here because of Sather.

Since you can't fire an owner, the buck should stop with President/GM.
There you go!

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Old
03-31-2013, 07:19 AM
  #58
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I have a question is Brenden Gallagher that much better than Christian Thomas ? He seems built about the same . Candiens line up is not big or filled with JAM , yet they hound the puck and all can shoot the puck well .

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Old
03-31-2013, 07:32 AM
  #59
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
I have a question is Brenden Gallagher that much better than Christian Thomas ? He seems built about the same . Candiens line up is not big or filled with JAM , yet they hound the puck and all can shoot the puck well .
He was a big goal scorer/point producer in juniors, and was OK in the AHL this year. He almost made the Habs out of camp last year (one of the last cuts), and was regarded as one of their top prospects. I think what separates him from Thomas, from what I have seen, is that the kid plays his ass off EVERY shift and as you mention, is like a dog on a bone every thime he's out on the ice.

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03-31-2013, 07:34 AM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Out East View Post
Watched the players on the bench last night. Time for a new coach...
I noticed that as well. The bench seems DEAD. No talking or encouraging each other, just blank stares

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Old
03-31-2013, 07:40 AM
  #61
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I see problematic :
Center depth / production
Wings who can score
D men who can shoot / and move the puck
Overall the team concept and make up pretty much is not working .
How I'd fix .
Play all of prospects who play with hunger and energy . ( say what you want about Miller he makes turnovers but also steals , hits , gets chances wins face offs moves his feet ) te NYR need more energetic players and more players who can shoot . They also should re consider their Defense . No shooters or real playmakers .

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03-31-2013, 07:43 AM
  #62
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Since I live in Montreal, I get to watch the Habs quite often, not as much as the Rangers, but many of their games. What I notice about them is that ALL their players can skate, unlike our team. Richards has regressed tremendously in this aspect of his game, and I really think its affecting his overall game.

The Habs have 3 guys (PK, Markov and Diaz-injured and did not play yesterday)that have absolute bombs from the point, and make them very dangerous on the PP.

I really don't think this team is better than ours, but overall they have more skill in the lineup, are faster and have a much better PP than we do (ya I know, who doesn't)

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Old
03-31-2013, 08:18 AM
  #63
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Torts

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Old
03-31-2013, 08:39 AM
  #64
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Dolan
Sather
Torts
Free Agents


That's my order from the chicken neck down.

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Old
03-31-2013, 08:40 AM
  #65
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IMO it's a combination of things. Not enough depth tops the bill and this team is not tough and other teams know it. Those are two main things. Last year's team could roll 4 lines and build off the momentum--this year's team the bottom two lines almost never get a good forecheck going and almost never get good chances. The toughness thing is dismissed by too many people. I've watched this team since 71-72 and we've never ever had a good team that wasn't tough--didn't have guys who would drop the gloves and we're not going to in the future either. If your tough guys can't cut it as players--you have to get others that can. And it's funny your scorers tend to start scoring more when they know there's someone that has their back--not to mention the fact that there's nothing like an early fight in a game to get the team's adrenaline going--witness last year when Prust was doing it all the time. This year's team is just lame.

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Old
03-31-2013, 08:46 AM
  #66
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Acquire Lucic
Acquire Ryan
Acquire Karlson
Acquire Erskine

Move Gaborik before he's a Ufa and get a top 6 fwd and a 1st rounder

FIRE TORTS!!

problems solved .

Now realistically,I say acquire Ryan,B and acquire a puck moving D Man and a nasty big defenseman,I'd like Erskine. Fire torts. Move Gaborik before he's a Ufa and get a top 6 fwd and a 1st rounder

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Old
03-31-2013, 09:17 AM
  #67
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Richards and Gabby for me, but I think it correlates a lot with not having capable players who can chip in every now and then in the bottom 6.

Let me elaborate: Let's look at some of the Eastern Conferences D-pairings, example Montreal: Subban, Markov, Gorges, Emelin, Diaz, one of Weber/Bouillion/Beaulieu; Boston: Chara, Seidenberg, Hamilton, Boychuk, Ference, McQuaid; Pens: Letang, Orpik, Martin, Despres, Niskanen/ Engelland/Murray; Jets: Bogo, Buff, Enstrom, Stuart, Clitsome/Hainsey/Postma; Leafs: Phaneuf, Gunnarson, Franson, Liles, 2 of Fraser/Holzer/Kostka/Gardiner.

The point is, if you can only rely on 2 lines to score, the opposition can match up much more easily. Nash and Stepan on the ice? MTL will counter with Gorges and Emelin, PIT with Martin and Orpik, BOS with Chara or Seidenberg. You get the idea.

However, IMO, the drop-off in quality from the 2nd to the 3rd pairing is significantly bigger than from the 1st pairing to the 2nd: Subban-Gorges provide a similar level as Markov-Emelin defensively. Boullion/Diaz/Weber/Beaulieu do not. Same for PIT and WPG, not as bad for the Bruins, worse for TOR IMO.

If you have 3 lines able to score, at some point, the opposition will have to send out their 3rd pairing. That's crucial. Otherwise you play them 10-12 minutes against a piss poor bottom 6.

I know there are teams that have 3 solid pairings, and none that stands out, but I think that's the exception. In the EC, f ex, I can only think of the Devils. I'm not including poor defensive teams a la BUF, PHI or TB here. They're not the standard we should be playing to.

To bring a bit of positivity into this place, I think MZA could really help getting our 3d line going. If he doesn't do it by himself, he at at least gives us the possibility that a competent player can be put in the bottom 6. Kreider-Miller-Callahan is not a bad 3rd line, for example.

LGR. Time to start a push for the playoffs.

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Old
03-31-2013, 09:37 AM
  #68
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The point of the Nash trade was to sacrifice some depth to have 3 first line players who can carry whatever line they're on.

It was to finally give Gabby a chance to "really shine" against 2nd pair Ds. It was to provide Richards with the kind of winger who can carry the pill, freeing him up to find open ice and make plays.

For whatever reason, both have been absolutely miserable. The Rangers, again, have only one elite skater.

Its unacceptable. It's the number one issue with the team. And it's what happen when your "elite talents" are acquired in UFA. Always aging. Always left unsigned by their previous teams for a reason.

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03-31-2013, 09:39 AM
  #69
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Also number two is team toughness and overall chemistry.

The Rangers last year were a family. We got a bunch of country club ****heads this year.

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03-31-2013, 09:51 AM
  #70
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Richards and Gaborik playing poorly isn't the cause of Kreider being benched during his best game of the season, Powe being scratched for seemingly no reason, Boyle getting tons of undeserved ice time at critical moments, everyone dumping and (not) chasing, the bottom six having what, three goals between them(?), and every other problem this team has.

And really, "Ghost?" For the guy who's scored more than a hundred goals in his four seasons as a Rangers in SPITE of Tortorella's system and constant lunatic raving criticism and petulent public outbursts? The coach whose response EVERY single time the team plays so poorly so regularly that people can actually predict outcomes of games without even watching is "I don't know what's wrong."

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03-31-2013, 10:28 AM
  #71
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I wonder if torts was being serious when he said they don't practice offense or the powerplay. Could go a long way in explaining why they telegraph all their passes, have no transition game, little offensive creativity, terrible powerplay, etc. If you want to get better at something, you got to practice it, I don't care if you're a 12 yr old with a violin or a multi million dollar athlete. Trying to fix these things in-game constantly worried that you'll be demoted if you make a mistake is a terrible way to learn.

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03-31-2013, 10:38 AM
  #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
Also number two is team toughness and overall chemistry.

The Rangers last year were a family. We got a bunch of country club ****heads this year.
In respect to that I'm already sick and tired of hearing what a great group of guys they are and how much they do care. Hearing this constantly coming out of the coaches mouths and seconded by the broadcast crews sounds to me like laying the foundation for a summer full of excuses. I don't know what the **** happened to Boyle. Pyatt hasn't scored in about 3 months. I mean WTF! He's supposedly a 3rd liner? I'd rather have his brother.

And it sometimes happens that as a player gets older he declines but depending on whether he's a go to guy or he can be slotted in lower he rebounds. Richards and Gaborik have been looking putrid but maybe all they need is a change of scenery where a bit less is expected of them. Off Gaborik goes to Detroit and he no longer is a 40 goal guy but he consistently hits for 30-35 tweening back and forth between the first and second lines--for the next 4 or 5 years.

The situation is deteriorating here.

I will reiterate though. I've been following this team since the early 70's. We've never had a worthwhile team that didn't play physical and that includes getting into numerous scraps. When that element is missing our team always sucks. We don't have the guys right now that can both play and defend their teammates--we're going to have to find some.

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Old
03-31-2013, 10:44 AM
  #73
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If everyone was playing well, I'd just go with Richards and Gaborik, but the lack of production, aside from a few, from top to bottom is on Torts.

He's had to adapt to the newer players brought in, and he just doesn't. When you have the talent the Rangers have, being bottom of the league in offense is unacceptable.

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03-31-2013, 10:54 AM
  #74
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I feel that they don't want to play for Torts anymore. Too much talent to be shut out 2 games in a row.

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03-31-2013, 10:55 AM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Esa 10 View Post
Voted for Other since there's oddly no category for Glen Sather. He's responsible for:

1. Horrendous Pro Scouting which led to yet another awful summer of UFA activity that produced

2. A gutted bottom 6 up front.

3. No D with a hard shot from the point who can hit the net. It's been almost 10 years since Leetch was traded. A blind monkey should luck out in finding one through UFA, trades, draft over all this time. Obviously not one on Brian's overall level. Other teams have 3rd pairing guys with that skillset. Not in NY.

4. Mediocre Amateur Scouting. This team has no NHL ready guys on ELC who can fill in on 3/4th lines. The last one this team produced was lost on waivers. What's going on in rounds 3-7? This is without even getting into the major 1st round blunders throughout his tenure.

5. Retaining a coaching staff whose tactics were solved by last year's play-offs and have nothing new to offer this season. The PP has never worked under Torts, regardless of personnel, yet they won't hire a PP coach. 20-25 games into a season should've been long enough to see what's happening.

6. No general plan of action in close to 15 years.

Sure, a misfiring one-dimensional 1st line sniper (put in an unfamiliar position by a stubborn coach) and a bumbling out-of-shape 1st line C who may be losing it are going to put pressure on any team. Others though overcome adversity like losing a real star Center and a Norris D for the season through intelligent coaching and organizational depth. Neither are here because of Sather.

Since you can't fire an owner, the buck should stop with President/GM.
everything you said is great.. but no general plan? i wouldnt go that far... we def have that in place when we made this youth movement.. we deff have a young core of guys.. we missed the boat by relaying to heavily on our top 6 this year and since sather didnt do or have good pro scouting like you said.. however if gabs and richards we're playing halfway better, we would be having more success..we got screwed by gutting our bottom 6, sather ****ed us on this.. we trade a 25 a 24 and didnt resign 2 28yr olds(bc slats ego was put forth and didnt give raises for players who deserved them, but played hardball and let them walk).. and instead signed a 34yr jouryman, 37yr old center and a 31yr old fwd (what are we the yankees now)I knew by making that trade it would hurt us but i never thought this much.... also i think staals injury hurt this teams success right now.. we we're playing great hockey just before his injury.. now we have fallen off the face of the earth.. staals our rock, think it hurt us alot..

no worries.. i dont want any drastic moves by trading MDZ, Staal, Girardi miller kreider etc.. stay pat with the young guys.. be patient.. get richards bought out, trade gaborik at the draft or this deadline if the value is there.. get pyatt, asham, powe, stralman, hams off this ****en team and bring in players that are hungry and motivated.. by heart, gritt and have some skill to compliment the pieces we already have.. LGR!!!

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