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The NorthWest division has the top 5 goaltenders in the League.

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Old
08-13-2006, 04:11 AM
  #51
abracanada
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
A couple of differences, besides the obvious one about the position they play.
Horcoff has progressed offensively each year he has played in the NHL and is seriously out pointing Huselius at approx the same point in his career. He is about 15 lbs heavier than Huselius and plays a much more physical game. Horcoff is also a much better defensive player and plays his minutes (very successfully I might add) against the top players in the league.
Virtually the same amount of time spent in the NHL for each player (they are the same age) and there is no question about which player has progressed further.
Horcoff simply brings much more to his team.
Well, Huselius is superior to Horcoff offensively, and has proven it a couple of times. As a rookie, Huselius was third runner up for rookie of the year, and his 45 points were more than Horcoff had ever posted in the NHL, prior to last year. His second year in the NHL, he also scored more than Horcoff had, until last year. Huselius played in the SEL as did Horcoff, and Huselius outperformed him substantially in that venue. Huselius came to the Flames after another terrible start in Florida. He played quite well for the Flames in spite of adjusting to a new team. Huselius has a huge offensive upside. You might have noticed that in his play against your Oilers this year. It was obvious with his five goals and 3 assists in his 5 games against your team.
Now Horcoff played well against the Flames and had as many points in 7 games.
At 14 minutes per game, he performed pretty damned well once he arrived in Calgary, and he was suddenly a plus player. Before we take Horcoff's career year and compare it with a Huselius year that has included playing on a team where the management hated his guts, was moved to a new team, and his ice time once he arrived in Calgary, was limited. He has outperformed Horcoff offensively, several times. The way Huselius is considered now, is considerably different than it was before. You may need a bigger sample before you go making proclamations.

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08-13-2006, 09:09 AM
  #52
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I guess that guys named Martin from NJD is a hasbeen

that guy named Marty from Dallas is wash out

Cam Ward got a ring last year

Loungo from Vancouver is top 5

Kipper kept the flames in a lot of games

But Rolo is good--but not top 5

Theo in Col--top 5? not even top 20

and the Manny in minny is maybe top 15

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08-13-2006, 01:25 PM
  #53
guymez
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
Well, Huselius is superior to Horcoff offensively, and has proven it a couple of times. As a rookie, Huselius was third runner up for rookie of the year, and his 45 points were more than Horcoff had ever posted in the NHL, prior to last year. His second year in the NHL, he also scored more than Horcoff had, until last year. Huselius played in the SEL as did Horcoff, and Huselius outperformed him substantially in that venue. Huselius came to the Flames after another terrible start in Florida. He played quite well for the Flames in spite of adjusting to a new team. Huselius has a huge offensive upside. You might have noticed that in his play against your Oilers this year. It was obvious with his five goals and 3 assists in his 5 games against your team.
Now Horcoff played well against the Flames and had as many points in 7 games.
At 14 minutes per game, he performed pretty damned well once he arrived in Calgary, and he was suddenly a plus player. Before we take Horcoff's career year and compare it with a Huselius year that has included playing on a team where the management hated his guts, was moved to a new team, and his ice time once he arrived in Calgary, was limited. He has outperformed Horcoff offensively, several times. The way Huselius is considered now, is considerably different than it was before. You may need a bigger sample before you go making proclamations.
I can only use the NHL data thats available....the SEL is irrelevant.
That data tells me that in the NHL Horcoff is a superior player offensively and defensively. Horcoff is a far more valuable player for his team and would garner much more interest on the open market. If you want to go on potential for a soon to be 28 year old player....then that speaks for itself.

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08-13-2006, 01:43 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
I can only use the NHL data thats available....the SEL is irrelevant.
That data tells me that in the NHL Horcoff is a superior player offensively and defensively. Horcoff is a far more valuable player for his team and would garner much more interest on the open market. If you want to go on potential for a soon to be 28 year old player....then that speaks for itself.

As was stated earlier, Horcoff didn't hit his stride till he was 28. And as has been mentioned elsewhere here, Andy McDonald didn't develop his game until he was 30.

This comes down to the same thing time after time. The Oilers fans believe everything will go right for the Oilers, and everything will go wrong for the Flames. Flames fans, think the opposite. The truth, is usually somewhere in between.

But that doesn't stop Oiler fans from coming onto the Flames board and dissing the Flames, and try to convince us their team is filled with all stars and ours is filled with pluggers. I don't know if you have noticed or not, but the type of player the Flames have added recently, are not pluggers with grit. Now you can delude yourself into thinking the team isn't changing, or you can open your mind and consider the possibility that the Flames are going to improve offensively. You folks don't seem to lack optimism when you talk about the Oiler's ability to cover up for losing a franchise player. I may be guilty of overstating at times, in defence of my team, but I don't go onto other boards and dis their players.

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08-13-2006, 01:58 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
As was stated earlier, Horcoff didn't hit his stride till he was 28. And as has been mentioned elsewhere here, Andy McDonald didn't develop his game until he was 30.

This comes down to the same thing time after time. The Oilers fans believe everything will go right for the Oilers, and everything will go wrong for the Flames. Flames fans, think the opposite. The truth, is usually somewhere in between.

But that doesn't stop Oiler fans from coming onto the Flames board and dissing the Flames, and try to convince us their team is filled with all stars and ours is filled with pluggers. I don't know if you have noticed or not, but the type of player the Flames have added recently, are not pluggers with grit. Now you can delude yourself into thinking the team isn't changing, or you can open your mind and consider the possibility that the Flames are going to improve offensively. You folks don't seem to lack optimism when you talk about the Oiler's ability to cover up for losing a franchise player. I may be guilty of overstating at times, in defence of my team, but I don't go onto other boards and dis their players.
What are you smoking? Horcoff did not hit his stride at 28...he's still 27. Andy MacDonald didn't develop his game at 30...he was 27 just last season.
You think that by saying Huselius is not the player that Hocoff is I am dissing Huselius (or the Flames for that matter)? How does that work?
I am just stating the obvious.
If you think it is just Oiler fans that think Horcoff brings much more to his team than Huselius, try posting a poll on the NHL board.
I think your going to be dissappointed with the results.
Also...where did I say anything about the Flames not improving offensively?
If you want to get into a discussion at least get your facts straight and stop making things up as you go.

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08-13-2006, 02:04 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by thebigstubbs View Post
I guess that guys named Martin from NJD is a hasbeen

that guy named Marty from Dallas is wash out

Cam Ward got a ring last year

Loungo from Vancouver is top 5

Kipper kept the flames in a lot of games

But Rolo is good--but not top 5

Theo in Col--top 5? not even top 20

and the Manny in minny is maybe top 15

I think the original poster was more or less trying to say that the NW division has the strongest goaltending of all the divisions. Although Kipper and Luogo are probably top 5 goalies in the league the other 3 obviously aren't.

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Old
08-13-2006, 02:15 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
What are you smoking? Horcoff did not hit his stride at 28...he's still 27. Andy MacDonald didn't develop his game at 30...he was 27 just last season.
You think that by saying Huselius is not the player that Hocoff is I am dissing Huselius (or the Flames for that matter)? How does that work?
I am just stating the obvious.
If you think it is just Oiler fans that think Horcoff brings much more to his team than Huselius, try posting a poll on the NHL board.
I think your going to be dissappointed with the results.
Also...where did I say anything about the Flames not improving offensively?
If you want to get into a discussion at least get your facts straight and stop making things up as you go.
McDonald is 29 this month. My bad. He is one guy that hit his stride at 28. Okay pal? Horcoff is older than Huselius by a month or so. He had a big year, Huselius got off to a rough start. Get over it. By the way, his 20 minutes of ice time per game may not have contributed to his numbers could they? I like how you conveniently dismiss Huselius' performance when he played in the same league as Horcoff. I guess performance in a different league has nothing to do with ability. (Poof) There goes all those high falutin dreams for Schremp. If you apply those standards to all of your prognostications regarding the Flames, you better bite the bullet when you have you little wet dreams about Schremp.

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Old
08-13-2006, 02:24 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
McDonald is 29 this month. My bad. He is one guy that hit his stride at 28. Okay pal? Horcoff is older than Huselius by a month or so. He had a big year, Huselius got off to a rough start. Get over it. By the way, his 20 minutes of ice time per game may not have contributed to his numbers could they? I like how you conveniently dismiss Huselius' performance when he played in the same league as Horcoff. I guess performance in a different league has nothing to do with ability. (Poof) There goes all those high falutin dreams for Schremp. If you apply those standards to all of your prognostications regarding the Flames, you better bite the bullet when you have you little wet dreams about Schremp.
Come back when you have a solid foundation on which to base a discussion.
Your disregard for facts and your penchant for making things up and going off on irrelevant tangents are a little troubling.

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08-13-2006, 02:42 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by guymez View Post
Come back when you have a solid foundation on which to base a discussion.
Your disregard for facts and your penchant for making things up and going off on irrelevant tangents are a little troubling.
Typical - run away when things get a bit hot!!! Tell me, what was Schremps numbers like in juniors?

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Old
08-13-2006, 04:10 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by AFIAFI View Post
Dont get carried away. Luongo & Kiprusoff are world class. But Theodore, Roloson, and Fernandez are just solid No.1's, not world class.

I actually can see that whole division making the playoffs. Each team made great improvements over the summer. The Central division isnt that great, Nashville and Detroit are the only competetive teams. The Pacific is good but those teams havent improved as much as the Northwest. Lets just say that this will be an interesting division next season.

its insulting when you lump kipper in the same class as loungo - for the last time goalies who take there team to the finals, get nominated for hart and vezina and win one of them and holds an nhl modern day record, dont get lumped in with a goalie who all hype at the moment.

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Old
08-13-2006, 06:42 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Shaynsaw View Post
Is this the same Cam Ward who has only played 28 regular season games in the NHL with a 3.68GAA? Huet also has not had a 40 game season in the NHL. Better wait and give them one more year to put them on your list. I don't think Roli should be in the top ten right now either I am just questioning your reasoning for putting Ward on the list when Roli did pretty much the same thing last year. Played a small amount of games during the year then took over in the playoffs and played well. I would even argue that Roli played more consistent in the playoffs than Ward. Ward was pulled from games mutiple times in the playoffs, Roli never let a game get out of hand to the point he had to be pulled.
you know what, your right, i knew when i was writing the list i shouldnt, but i did anyways, i was just trying to prove a point and should have never bothered with the list

and now iam going to further defend my mistake. i was saying i think those goalies are better goalies, dont like ward and huet, lets throw in giguere and fernandez who i also think are better then roloson. i didnt mean to get into a debate about who had the better season and so forth.

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Old
08-13-2006, 06:43 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Navdeep Gill View Post
The Northwest division will not only be the hardest division but it will have world class Goalies. Calgary Flames have Miikka Kiprusoff, the Vancouver Canucks have Roberto Luongo, The Colorado Avalanche with Jose Theodore and the wild gave the Edmonton Oilers their starting guy in Dwayne Roloson, but the Minnesota Wild still have Manny Fernandez. With these 5 guys it will be mighty hard to score. Will they all make the playoffs?
Theo not a top 5 since 2002... Fern never been and will never be, even if I like him so much. Neither Roloson.

Maybe if they transfer the Devils to Edmonton, the Habs to Minnesota (yes i know homer) and Sabres to Colorado.

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08-14-2006, 09:24 AM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Gbeav View Post
Best 5 is a stretch. But it will be very difficult to score in the division. Offense will be a premium.

I would be really scared of Calgary if you guy picked up sykora or dumont. I really think you guys are 1 forward away from greatness.
Not one forward, but one top Center.

And it is hard to include Lundqvist in this topic as he played a single season in the NHL. He has something to prove as well.

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08-14-2006, 07:18 PM
  #64
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The Atlantic will have a strong goaltending in a few seasons. Dipietro, Lundqvist, Fleury, plus Brodeur already.

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08-14-2006, 07:33 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by abracanada View Post
Hey man, you just described Horcoff last year.
Except for the fact that Horcoff wasn't able to see any top 6 ice time and 0 powerplay time before the lockout. And was never regarded as a offensive specialist.

Huselius has been known for his offense since the day he was drafted only he's never quite been able to produce to the expectation's the panther's had of him.

Two very different situations.

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